Jet27 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The Jets are a good team. They took a step back this season. Not a shock. I think all this blow sh*t up talk is ******* ridiculous. The O needs some work. If it weren't for this Holmes bullsh*t, I'd be pretty happy going back with the same basic group plus an RT. They need improvement, but only the QB and RT were super bad. The D needs to add a safety or two. The team was 8-8 and they lost some games they had no business losing. I think blowing it up and cursing the GM and coach is way overboard. Of course, that is the way these places work, but still... Does anybody think this team isn't more talented than 2005, 6, or 7? I think they are better than 2008 too, but the better QB balances that out. 2009 is probably a push and they are slightly worse than last year. Big ******* deal. The team has been getting better and had a sh*t year. Big deal. Luck worked the other way and they need to work on the penalties. I don't think that kind of discipline was a problem with Ryan's teams before this one, so I think they can turn that around. I think they will bounce back the rest of this place thinks they will go 2-14 if they don't fire Schottenheimer and get Peyton Manning. We'll see how it plays out, but IMO Holmes and Hunter are the only two that have signed their own death warrants. I get what your saying....and agree with most. However, we don;t need a 300+ pound cheerleader cheerleading a bunch of malcontents on the sidelines, but a HC that does a good job leading, building and adjusting a team to compete each and every week on a high level. And when something is not working you do the tough things that you were paid to do as the HC to right the ship. No blow smoke up everyones a$$. Yes two AFCCG....Yes I get it but did we win them NO. So we are suppossed to be happy with just getting to the AFCCG and then losing? WTF...We sh*t the bed against the Raiders, The Pats twice, the Broncos, the Eagles, the Giants and the Dalphags...Come On man.......oh and I do believe if Favre was healthy the entire 2008 season we would have been a force in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 defense neither confuses nor scares anyone anymore. http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef Might not be confusing, might not be scary, but it's definitely still great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 http://footballoutsi...m/stats/teamdef Might not be confusing, might not be scary, but it's definitely still great. The defense was not helped by so many 3 and outs. But they weren't great. And you can use all the stats you want. A "great" defense doesn't allow Tebow to go 95 yards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afosomf Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The defense was not helped by so many 3 and outs. But they weren't great. And you can use all the stats you want. A "great" defense doesn't allow Tebow to go 95 yards. 21 play drive phins had should say it all, the eye test tells u this is a middle of pack D not top 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The defense was not helped by so many 3 and outs. But they weren't great. And you can use all the stats you want. A "great" defense doesn't allow Tebow to go 95 yards. Fine. It's not 'great.' It's #2 against the pass, #4 against the run, #1 and #2 against 1/2 wideouts, respectively (Cromartie's great, too, which ought to infuriate the number-haters to no end), and it once had a bad drive against Tebow. And whoever you're using the purportedly not great defense as a scapegoat for is probably terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 21 play drive phins had should say it all, the eye test tells u this is a middle of pack D not top 10. In the land of the blind, the eye test is about as effective as predicting the weather with bird entrails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 http://footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef Might not be confusing, might not be scary, but it's definitely still great. Math is my arch-nemesis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afosomf Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 In the land of the blind, the eye test is about as effective as predicting the weather with bird entrails. Ya they fooled my blind a$$, No pass rush, slow LBs and the worst safeties in NFL outside of Pats. They are studly my error Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Fine. It's not 'great.' It's #2 against the pass, #4 against the run, #1 and #2 against 1/2 wideouts, respectively (Cromartie's great, too, which ought to infuriate the number-haters to no end), and it once had a bad drive against Tebow. And whoever you're using the purportedly not great defense as a scapegoat for is probably terrible. Making them the scapegoat as opposed to one of several goes too far. They found themselves on the field way too much because the offense utterly sucked(and is Ryan still crowing about red zone effectiveness? talk about grasping at freaking straws). But they cannot cover a TE if their lives depended on it. They generate no pass rush at all. Spare Cro and Revis they are S L O W . And they have become way too reliant relying on Revis to take away the opposition's top WR. Talent-wise you have Revis, Harris, Cro and some good DL rotation guys. The rest of it...uh....the talent isn't there. And guys like Scott and pace were paid to be like the former in contributions. When Maybin can come in and be you best pass rusher off the street, doesn't speak well of your talent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Fine. It's not 'great.' It's #2 against the pass, #4 against the run, #1 and #2 against 1/2 wideouts, respectively (Cromartie's great, too, which ought to infuriate the number-haters to no end), and it once had a bad drive against Tebow. And whoever you're using the purportedly not great defense as a scapegoat for is probably terrible. The defense is also 20th in points allowed/points per game, since stats other than the team's 8-8 record are so important to you. When Matt Moore takes the D for a 12 minute walk, there are serious problems. The 95 yard choke job against Denver was both telling and EPIC. Now you can go make a pathetic reference to 2 AFC Championship games. Get over it, the defense is mediocre overall, and sucks a$$ in crunch time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afosomf Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The defense is also 20th in points allowed/points per game, since stats other than the team's 8-8 record are so important to you. When Matt Moore takes the D for a 12 minute walk, there are serious problems. The 95 yard choke job against Denver was both telling and EPIC. Now you can go make a pathetic reference to 2 AFC Championship games. Get over it, the defense is mediocre overall, and sucks a$$ in crunch time. Right on, i thought i was going blind lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
faba Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 the defense is slow as a whole and generates no pass rush- this was not a good defense this year but the offense did not help with so many turnovers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aten Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Dumb fan check-in thread > real fan check-in thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Anyone else find it odd the way they keep mentioning this? Like they know he is getting the job or something? yeah, i thought the same, maybe the old boys network has leaked some information that he's the favorite for the job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CTM Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 still agree this defense is very good, looking only at pts allowed is shallow especially when considering the amount of turnovers, opposition def TD's and 3 and outs.. Even in 2009 we had some last minute drives, Miami I believe was one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 The defense is also 20th in points allowed/points per game, since stats other than the team's 8-8 record are so important to you. When Matt Moore takes the D for a 12 minute walk, there are serious problems. The 95 yard choke job against Denver was both telling and EPIC. Now you can go make a pathetic reference to 2 AFC Championship games. Get over it, the defense is mediocre overall, and sucks a$$ in crunch time. In the stats world, crunch time doesn't exist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Mostro Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 still agree this defense is very good... The D-line, David Harris and Revis are indeed very good. Collectively, the rest are mediocre, at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leonwash29 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Wait wait I'd like to make a few points, according to PFT Tannenbaum said a few things, MS play “isn’t where it needs to be” and “No, he didn’t play well.” which is undeniable. He then says, "The thing that I am thrilled about Mark is his intangibles, and his work ethic, and his character,” This is so irrelevant, his work ethic has nothing to do with anything because clearly it does not translate to the field. If you study for a final exam for 12 straight hours before the test and still fail it, what good is that? Also his character sucks, film shows he's sitting alone on the bench in front of a fan by himself, you would never see Brady in that situation even while he was playing backup to DB. MS is always tries to project a calm and collected image which masks a lot of how he really feels inside. Has anyone ever seen him fired up, being loud and enthusiastic and pumping the guys up? Sure he can say the right words in interviews and all that but if you buy that he is a leader then your kidding yourself. He also says, "I know we have the right person, I know he is made for this market." Yeah he is good for GQ, commercials and other sponsorships that come with the market, I'm not too sure about football. "He plays better in big games, and we have to cut down on his turnovers, and improve his footwork and decision-making and all the other fundamentals. But he’s the right guy, and I know we’ll see a better Mark out there next year.” He plays better in big games? Were the last 3 games of the season not big games? What good is playing good in playoff games if you don't make the playoffs!! It's better off he didn't play decent enough to make the playoffs or else we'd be stuck with our OC and that would extend his own tenure here. He sure does need to improve on his entire game especially decision-making, I've never seen someone throw into triple coverage/throw directly at the defender as if he was a receiver in my entire life. (including Favre) He should have had at least 25 INT. It's clear this guy has no clue what he's doing out there, last year proved how clearly inept he is. Mr T., people make mistakes, don't drag this on any further, find a real quarterback. The number 5 pick in the draft should at least know what he's doing by his third year. AFC championship first 2 years, not that difficult for an NFL quarterback to manage an offense behind an amazing run game and top 3 defense. Imagine if we had a real quarterback those two years? A quarterback who played like the number 5 pick in the draft should play!!?? Bradford, Stafford, Ryan would have followed through. Just my thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 On the flip side, this is a team that couldn't beat anyone with a winning record, who didn't compete with the Patriots, and whose defense neither confuses nor scares anyone anymore. It's a team with significant amounts of money tied up in players who simply don't deserve it--your Mark Sanchezes and Calvin Paces, Holmes, Cromartie, etc--leaving it little flexibility to make the drastic and necessary changes it needs. Your GM, six years into the job, has tried to fill two of the four core positions on the team with Mark Sanchez, Kellen Clemens and Vernon Gholston. While I appreciate your optimism, I think your faith is misguided if you think that Tannenbaum is somehow going to magically whip up the 10 or so new players that this team needs to compete at the highest levels. You missed your window while the Pats reloaded, Rex's defensive scheme isn't going to get to play against Tyler Palko and Blaine Gabbert every week, and bringing back Sanchez and Schottenheimer guarantees you another year of dead offense. Bottom line is, without significant changes, this is a .500 team next year, hovering in limbo waiting for yet another regime change. Regarding the bolded, the sad part is that Cromartie is probably the most deserving of his money by a pretty wide margin. As much as he was (deservedly) trashed earlier in the season for his up and down play, he's actually had a pretty damn good second half of the season. Considering he's making about half as much as his starting counterpart (which isn't even accounting for the fact that Cro's contract is heavily back-loaded, and he'll probably never see the end of it), he seems like a bargain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 To clarify my original point in light of the evidence against, I was comparing this year's defense to the 2009 defense which seemed significantly better and opportunistic, and expressing my concern for what that portends. If Aten produces more stats that disprove that, I will re-clarify/completely deny my point later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Regarding the bolded, the sad part is that Cromartie is probably the most deserving of his money by a pretty wide margin. As much as he was (deservedly) trashed earlier in the season for his up and down play, he's actually had a pretty damn good second half of the season. Considering he's making about half as much as his starting counterpart (which isn't even accounting for the fact that Cro's contract is heavily back-loaded, and he'll probably never see the end of it), he seems like a bargain. Cromartie is a good cover guy. But he had several absurdly boneheaded plays this season...his football IQ is awful. Plus he cant tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Cromartie is a good cover guy. But he had several absurdly boneheaded plays this season...his football IQ is awful. Plus he cant tackle. That's true, but it seems like that was drastically reduced in the second half of the season. And while there's one very obvious exception to this that I won't even mention, I will say I've noticed as horrible looking and pussified as his tackling is, more often than not he does actually get his hands on the guy and bring him down, unlike his turf-eating safety counterparts. Don't get me wrong, he's by no means great, but for a guy who's making $8 mil/year in a heavily backloaded contract he's earning his salary far more than a large number of his teammates. Considering the amount of hatred he was generating earlier this season, that's a scary thought. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Bottom line is, without significant changes, this is a .500 team next year, hovering in limbo waiting for yet another regime change. This team was 8-5 untill their QB starting playing like he's never seen a Football field before. They had opportunities to take the division and they controlled their own destiny with WC. They should have won at least 2 of the last 3 games of the season, finished 11-5/10-6 at worst and gone on the road to beat the Texans. Its not nearly as bad as everyone is making it. Problem is, where they are the worst just happens to be the the place where it matters the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Wait wait I'd like to make a few points, according to PFT Tannenbaum said a few things, MS play “isn’t where it needs to be” and “No, he didn’t play well.” which is undeniable. He then says, "The thing that I am thrilled about Mark is his intangibles, and his work ethic, and his character,” This is so irrelevant, his work ethic has nothing to do with anything because clearly it does not translate to the field. If you study for a final exam for 12 straight hours before the test and still fail it, what good is that? Also his character sucks, film shows he's sitting alone on the bench in front of a fan by himself, you would never see Brady in that situation even while he was playing backup to DB. MS is always tries to project a calm and collected image which masks a lot of how he really feels inside. Has anyone ever seen him fired up, being loud and enthusiastic and pumping the guys up? Sure he can say the right words in interviews and all that but if you buy that he is a leader then your kidding yourself. He also says, "I know we have the right person, I know he is made for this market." Yeah he is good for GQ, commercials and other sponsorships that come with the market, I'm not too sure about football. "He plays better in big games, and we have to cut down on his turnovers, and improve his footwork and decision-making and all the other fundamentals. But he’s the right guy, and I know we’ll see a better Mark out there next year.” He plays better in big games? Were the last 3 games of the season not big games? What good is playing good in playoff games if you don't make the playoffs!! It's better off he didn't play decent enough to make the playoffs or else we'd be stuck with our OC and that would extend his own tenure here. He sure does need to improve on his entire game especially decision-making, I've never seen someone throw into triple coverage/throw directly at the defender as if he was a receiver in my entire life. (including Favre) He should have had at least 25 INT. It's clear this guy has no clue what he's doing out there, last year proved how clearly inept he is. Mr T., people make mistakes, don't drag this on any further, find a real quarterback. The number 5 pick in the draft should at least know what he's doing by his third year. AFC championship first 2 years, not that difficult for an NFL quarterback to manage an offense behind an amazing run game and top 3 defense. Imagine if we had a real quarterback those two years? A quarterback who played like the number 5 pick in the draft should play!!?? Bradford, Stafford, Ryan would have followed through. Just my thoughts. Even in big games he didn't light it up, simply played reasonably well. He didn't throw for 300+ every playoff game, if ever. And he still is prone to catasptrophic turnovers regularly like before half vs. the Steelers last year. He did that 8 times this regular season, along with the back-breaking INTs. And his INTs are not the Vinny Testaverde, 30 yards upfield good as a punt type, but usually one right at or near the LOS. One more reason you need to pass effectively and upfield. I don't begrudge any young guy chasing all the ___ you can. But for Godsakes, do it in the offseason. He isn't a student of the game, but not sure it would help anyway. Either get an OC that can make him a player or get a real QB. But as noted, all these Scott/Pace/Sanchez/holmes/Cro contracts might preclude the latter anyway. Mike Tannebaum-NFLPA man of the Year for the 6th consecutive year.; funding the retirement of old players forever. Thanks, Mike! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 This team was 8-5 untill their QB starting playing like he's never seen a Football field before. They had opportunities to take the division and they controlled their own destiny with WC. They should have won at least 2 of the last 3 games of the season, finished 11-5/10-6 at worst and gone on the road to beat the Texans. Its not nearly as bad as everyone is making it. Problem is, where they are the worst just happens to be the the place where it matters the most. We have the single most reactionary fanbase in all of sports. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 We have the single most reactionary fanbase in all of sports. 43 years of your nose pressed up against the glass will do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afosomf Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 We have the single most reactionary fanbase in all of sports. Please tell me when was the last time this team beat a good team? 8-8 with a very EZ schedule, and at least 1 gifted game by Pokes at home no less Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 still agree this defense is very good, looking only at pts allowed is shallow especially when considering the amount of turnovers, opposition def TD's and 3 and outs.. O RLY????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Math is my arch-nemesis. I REFUSE TO ACKNOWLEDGE WHAT CHARTS SAY ABOUT DAVID HARRIS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Please tell me when was the last time this team beat a good team? 8-8 with a very EZ schedule, and at least 1 gifted game by Pokes at home no less Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 We have the single most reactionary fanbase in all of sports. I dont post on Mets boards, or Gators boards (cant imagine the circle jerk there) or Knicks boards and obviously dont post on other teams boards in the NFL - so I cant accurately guage how ridiculous our fanbase is...but it defnitely seems this way. Rightfully so I guess, we havent won sh*t in 40 something years...but I just dont get the reactions. Same people that want Rex to stfu to the media and reduce his bravado are the same people that want him and Mikey T. to come out and rip the entire team and coaching staff a new one in a press conference or interview. These are the same people mad that the team is airing the dirty laundry. Same people that love Mark Sanchez and believe in his future, rip Mikey T. for being an awful GM. Same people that rip our WR's wish we still had BE who was recently cut from the 2 seed in the NFC. Same people that rip Mikey T. for handing out big contract to everyone are curious why he didnt resign Brad F'ing Smith at 5mill per year or Ellis or T-Rich or anyone that wasnt worth their value. We're fans, I get it. I understand many think I'm an idiot too (rightfully so) but sometimes you honestly have to just scratch your head and say, really? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afosomf Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 i guess you cant answer ??? when? maybe vs pats in jan, during 2010 season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Klecko73isGod Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 i guess you cant answer ??? when? maybe vs pats in jan, during 2010 season! Which was a whole one year ago by a team with mostly the same personnel. The Jets took a step back this year. It happens. Its not the end of the world and it can be fixed. The Packers missed the playoffs in 2009 and barely made the playoffs last year. They didn't have all the drama as we did and obviously have a better QB but they still needed to address some issues that caused them to miss the postseason that year. I guess I would be more upset if I didn't see it coming but I just didn't see this team winning anything this year anyway. Might as well get the better draft pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I dont post on Mets boards, or Gators boards (cant imagine the circle jerk there) or Knicks boards and obviously dont post on other teams boards in the NFL - so I cant accurately guage how ridiculous our fanbase is... Still wallowing in misery but hopeful about the crop of stud pitching prospects, Broncos derp, most reasonable fanbase of any team in any sport in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Still wallowing in misery but hopeful about the crop of stud pitching prospects, Broncos derp, most reasonable fanbase of any team in any sport in the world. I forget sometimes that there are other miserable pricks out there that suffer the same fate as me when it comes to professional sports. BTW - that Rutgers vs. Gators BBall game was sick last week. Obviously didnt get the results I was hoping for as we squandered away a 8 pt lead with 1:30 to go...but what a game. Those freshman you have were hitting everything. Big shot after big shot. Looks like a solid squad for you guys and that was a HUGE win but did it really deserve rushing the court? Gators we're only 10th in the country at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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