Integrity28 Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I love the Hill pick, but Hill's coaching staff can say all they want, the fact is they run a junk offense and had a mediocre QB running the show. He wasn't asked to do a whole lot but go deep (which he did very well. Just look at his ypc average) Agreed. He's obviously gifted though, it'll be awesome to see what he does in Sporano's offense. I think it'll be great having him, especially by year 2-3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jets Voice of Reason Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Agreed. He's obviously gifted though, it'll be awesome to see what he does in Sporano's offense. I think it'll be great having him, especially by year 2-3 We haven't had a home run pick since 2007 in any round of the draft. We swung for the fences twice. I can appreciate that. It takes balls to do that with the kind of pressure Mike T is under to produce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GimmeShelter Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I love the Hill pick, but Hill's coaching staff can say all they want, the fact is they run a junk offense and had a mediocre QB running the show. He wasn't asked to do a whole lot but go deep (which he did very well. Just look at his ypc average) That's like saying Denver WR's did not know how to or run all the required pro routes because they ran a junk offense w/ a mediocre QB. Anytime you are a strictly run first offense, the occassional shots down field will result in a high YPC average. I just find the thought process that running WR routes is rocket science as insane. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSage Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Granted I never watched an Arkansas State game, but from the one non-highlight reel clip I could find on youtube of their game with N. Illinois it looks like he has real nice closing speed, but can get washed out pretty badly on plays, presumably cause he's undersized. Not saying this is what he is as a player, but that's just what happened in that game. His measureables make him a 3rd round pick more than anything since he's speedy as ****. Maybin + Davis would be some crazy speed to throw at a QB at the same time. Wish there were more clips on him, but I mean, he did play at Arkansas State. U beat me to it-impressive closing speed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I've stopped psychotically rocking back and forth. I'm OK with the drafting of Coples. I'm actually ok with the drafting of Hill. What's killing me is the drafting of Coples AND Hill. Given that the first two rounds are 50/50 propositions in the best of circumstances, the f*cking Jets drafted two guys who are--what--30/70 bust potential guys? They're betting the entire immediate future of this regime that Coples will all-of-a-sudden learn to give a sh*t about football after they hand him a check for $15 mil, and they're outright guessing that Hill will learn how to play WR in an offense that's not going to pass while working with two QB's who suck. IF a newly-minted Coples wakes the f*ck up and IF Hill is secretly a self-taught latent-genius who can immediately figure out how to play WR in the NFL, then it's a good draft, but the chances of both (either?) of those things happening are pretty f*cking remote and the fallout will be that the Jets are poised for a 6-10/7-9 season after which the whole regime gets flushed and we get to start all over again. Jet mother****in' life, baby. Shane settle down man we had a very good draft so far. I was a bit surprised with Davis in the third really didnt see much on him but after looking at some film (which I hate doing) this kid is really fast and thats what we need on defense at the LB position. Since he is in the 235 range in weight it makes me think they go to more 4-3 sets as I said in a previous thread I made on the subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 That's like saying Denver WR's did not know how to or run all the required pro routes because they ran a junk offense w/ a mediocre QB. Anytime you are a strictly run first offense, the occassional shots down field will result in a high YPC average. I just find the thought process that running WR routes is rocket science as insane. Agreed when you have the ability of a Stephen Hill I think route running will come rather easy. He will definetely put in the work and thats all it really takes is work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Mixed feelings on this pick. This is a pick made so that the JETS can cover the big NE tight ends, If the JETS had a 4th or 5th i would feel better. But with no 4th and 5th this pick makes me think could we have drafted some other position like the O-Line. Good news is if he pans out this is the end of Bart Scott on this team by next season if we cannot find a way to move him now. This pick is about persuit from sideline to sideline with speed in mind at the LB position something we have not had in a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Hill has already been working privately with Terrence Mathis to polish his route running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Granted I never watched an Arkansas State game, but from the one non-highlight reel clip I could find on youtube of their game with N. Illinois it looks like he has real nice closing speed, but can get washed out pretty badly on plays, presumably cause he's undersized. Not saying this is what he is as a player, but that's just what happened in that game. His measureables make him a 3rd round pick more than anything since he's speedy as ****. Maybin + Davis would be some crazy speed to throw at a QB at the same time. Wish there were more clips on him, but I mean, he did play at Arkansas State. Add that to coples on the inside rush and we may get some pressure on QB's this year. EXCITING> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Hill's coaching staff is on record as stating that this nonsense is complete BS and that their WR's ran every pro route. The team did not throw the ball. Suggesting that Hill need to learn how to play WR is overkill. As to Coples, if the staff and defensive Vets on this team cannot ensure that his motor is running on every play then this team was doomed to begin with. Many pre draft analysts had BOTH of these guys ranked among the top two at their position. The route tree consists of nine different patterns. Ostensibly, if you can put one foot in front of the other, you can "run a route tree." The fact is that Hill hasn't shown that he can produce as a WR at any level, much less the NFL. He is, by any standard, a project, and it's probably fair to label him a workout warrior as well, considering it was his Combine performance that shot him up the boards by about two full rounds. So, the Jets get to try and turn him into a WR, under Sparano, with Sanchez and Tebow throwing at him, and he'll have to do it in practice while getting bitch-slapped all over the field by Revis and Cromartie. All told, I'm done bitching about this pick. It's now up to Rex and Sparano to turn Coples and Hill into players. Given both of their track records in player development, I don't see any reason to be particularly hopeful in any case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonehands Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Will be a speedy inside backer in a 3-4 similar to what Farrior was with the Steelers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Sporano made Nate Gardner a starter on the OL IIRC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khesanh Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I suppose I can understand the pick but with players like Massie, Lamar miller, Sanu left I just don't know why you go for a project. Well said sir i agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khesanh Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 he was in my top 100, i had him as a solid 3rd. that 38" vert is elite at any position. this player was a late addition to Senior Bowl (like John Conner last year) and he showed up hitting. This pick is Rex Ryan's style. He's an aggressive, explosive inside blitzer and all around tackling machine. As always thank you for your insite!!!!!! Looking for tape on this guy as we speak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Granted I never watched an Arkansas State game, but from the one non-highlight reel clip I could find on youtube of their game with N. Illinois it looks like he has real nice closing speed, but can get washed out pretty badly on plays, presumably cause he's undersized. Not saying this is what he is as a player, but that's just what happened in that game. His measureables make him a 3rd round pick more than anything since he's speedy as ****. Maybin + Davis would be some crazy speed to throw at a QB at the same time. Wish there were more clips on him, but I mean, he did play at Arkansas State. What he's got that I like is the ability to play sideline to sideline and cover the TE's. He'll be a sub package guy if Scott still cant play all 3 downs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 The route tree consists of nine different patterns. Ostensibly, if you can put one foot in front of the other, you can "run a route tree." The fact is that Hill hasn't shown that he can produce as a WR at any level, much less the NFL. He is, by any standard, a project, and it's probably fair to label him a workout warrior as well, considering it was his Combine performance that shot him up the boards by about two full rounds. So, the Jets get to try and turn him into a WR, under Sparano, with Sanchez and Tebow throwing at him, and he'll have to do it in practice while getting bitch-slapped all over the field by Revis and Cromartie. All told, I'm done bitching about this pick. It's now up to Rex and Sparano to turn Coples and Hill into players. Given both of their track records in player development, I don't see any reason to be particularly hopeful in any case. Say what you want about Hill, but the fact that you're trying to question Rex's track record with DL is really not helping your case here even slightly. I mean, you've got to be kidding me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khesanh Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Steal of the draft. He is going to be beastly. Great attitude, great discipline, excellent athlete, plays hard every play. LOVE this pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 He's got that I like is the ability to play sideline to sideline and cover the TE's. He'll be a sub package guy if Scott still cant play all 3 downs. Yeah, I agree, that's my guess how he'll start off this year. He'll probably end up stealing a lot of the reps Mauga got as the one pushing Scott off of the field on passing downs, while Scott will still be the starter and playing all of the running downs. If he plays up to his potential, Davis likely has Scott's starting job come next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Say what you want about Hill, but the fact that you're trying to question Rex's track record with DL is really not helping your case here even slightly. I mean, you've got to be kidding me. Rex is good with scrappy overachievers (Gregg, Pouha, Devito). Not so good with indifferent me-firsters (Gholston, Holmes, Plax, Rhodes). For whatever reason, his style doesn't seem to get the best out of guys who just don't want it. Even his prodigal son Bart Scott suggested that he didn't buy into what the coaches were selling last year. I think Rex thinks he can get absolutely anyone to buy into his system, no matter what their pre-existing psychosis is. I don't see that as being the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Yeah, I agree, that's my guess how he'll start off this year. He'll probably end up stealing a lot of the reps Mauga got as the one pushing Scott off of the field on passing downs, while Scott will still be the starter and playing all of the running downs. If he plays up to his potential, Davis likely has Scott's starting job come next season. Davis is my favorite pick by far. He seems like the coachable, over-eager guy that, when put in the right spots, will excel. Lord knows we need speed at LB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Rex is good with scrappy overachievers (Gregg, Pouha, Devito). Not so good with indifferent me-firsters (Gholston, Holmes, Plax, Rhodes). I know this wasn't meant to have any racial undertones at all. And it probably doesn't if you know the players. But this is still pretty hilarious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I know this wasn't meant to have any racial undertones at all. And it probably doesn't if you know the players. But this is still pretty hilarious. Oh sh*t. I'D ALSO LIKE TO POINT TO JEREMY KERLEY AS A SCRAPPY OVERACHIEVER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 ERIC SMITH= THUG TURD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jets Voice of Reason Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Rex is good with scrappy overachievers (Gregg, Pouha, Devito). Not so good with indifferent me-firsters (Gholston, Holmes, Plax, Rhodes). For whatever reason, his style doesn't seem to get the best out of guys who just don't want it. Even his prodigal son Bart Scott suggested that he didn't buy into what the coaches were selling last year. I think Rex thinks he can get absolutely anyone to buy into his system, no matter what their pre-existing psychosis is. I don't see that as being the case. Need to add Marcus Dixon and Pito to the list that our staff transformed into solid contributors. Gholston wasn't a guy Rex brought in, he was a guy that was already here. A dud is a dud, it's not like Gholston became a rock star anywhere else, he's out of the league. Gholston doesn't have it in him to be an NFL player. Purely talking defense and d-line, I would not want anyone other than Rex as a person running the show. Whether you like his personality or his laissez-faire attitude with the offense or not, he's one of the best defensive coaches in the game who happens to specialize in d-line play. That's pretty much indisputable. He sh*ts out top defenses wherever he goes. Coples has premium measurables, but he's extremely raw technically. I can't speak to how motivated he is to play football, but he has Rex and he has the former Minnesota Vikings D-line coach (Dunbar I think) to work with. If this doesn't work out, it's totally because Coples can't or won't learn technique. We're good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Rex is good with scrappy overachievers (Gregg, Pouha, Devito). Not so good with indifferent me-firsters (Gholston, Holmes, Plax, Rhodes). For whatever reason, his style doesn't seem to get the best out of guys who just don't want it. Even his prodigal son Bart Scott suggested that he didn't buy into what the coaches were selling last year. I think Rex thinks he can get absolutely anyone to buy into his system, no matter what their pre-existing psychosis is. I don't see that as being the case. I hear what you're saying, and I'm not trying to make the point that Rex can make all-stars out of anyone, as there's obviously been a number of failures in that department in his time here, but the guy has a hell of a track record when it comes to the DL. I think it makes a difference that Coples, unlike Gholston, was a guy he helped pick. Let's not forget, when Gholston came out, Rex was on record for how awful he thought Gholston was going to be. He tried his best to do something with him and it certainly didn't work, but there's only so much a coach can do. I could certainly be wrong about this, but if there's any position I'm willing to give Rex the benefit of the doubt on with a guy he helped pick and will be coaching, it's got to be the DL. Between him and Dunbar, if Coples has what it takes, he's sure as hell going to have the coaching to make it happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Need to add Marcus Dixon and Pito to the list that our staff transformed into solid contributors. Gholston wasn't a guy Rex brought in, he was a guy that was already here. A dud is a dud, it's not like Gholston became a rock star anywhere else, he's out of the league. Gholston doesn't have it in him to be an NFL player. Purely talking defense and d-line, I would not want anyone other than Rex as a person running the show. Whether you like his personality or his laissez-faire attitude with the offense or not, he's one of the best defensive coaches in the game who happens to specialize in d-line play. That's pretty much indisputable. He sh*ts out top defenses wherever he goes. Coples has premium measurables, but he's extremely raw technically. I can't speak to how motivated he is to play football, but he has Rex and he has the former Minnesota Vikings D-line coach (Dunbar I think) to work with. If this doesn't work out, it's totally because Coples can't or won't learn technique. We're good. From your fingers to God's ears. If Coples brings the reputed entitled primadonna sh*t to Florham Park, Rex has to deal with it immediately, which is something Rex hasn't been willing to do yet (see: Holmes, 2011-2012). Coples will go one way or the other when (if?) that happens. My anxiety is high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleedin Green Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Need to add Marcus Dixon and Pito to the list that our staff transformed into solid contributors. Gholston wasn't a guy Rex brought in, he was a guy that was already here. A dud is a dud, it's not like Gholston became a rock star anywhere else, he's out of the league. Gholston doesn't have it in him to be an NFL player. Purely talking defense and d-line, I would not want anyone other than Rex as a person running the show. Whether you like his personality or his laissez-faire attitude with the offense or not, he's one of the best defensive coaches in the game who happens to specialize in d-line play. That's pretty much indisputable. He sh*ts out top defenses wherever he goes. Coples has premium measurables, but he's extremely raw technically. I can't speak to how motivated he is to play football, but he has Rex and he has the former Minnesota Vikings D-line coach (Dunbar I think) to work with. If this doesn't work out, it's totally because Coples can't or won't learn technique. We're good. Yeah... this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Rex is good with scrappy overachievers (Gregg, Pouha, Devito). Not so good with indifferent me-firsters (Gholston, Holmes, Plax, Rhodes). For whatever reason, his style doesn't seem to get the best out of guys who just don't want it. Even his prodigal son Bart Scott suggested that he didn't buy into what the coaches were selling last year. I think Rex thinks he can get absolutely anyone to buy into his system, no matter what their pre-existing psychosis is. I don't see that as being the case. Who's style does? You me-firster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I hear what you're saying, and I'm not trying to make the point that Rex can make all-stars out of anyone, as there's obviously been a number of failures in that department in his time here, but the guy has a hell of a track record when it comes to the DL. I think it makes a difference that Coples, unlike Gholston, was a guy he helped pick. Let's not forget, when Gholston came out, Rex was on record for how awful he thought Gholston was going to be. He tried his best to do something with him and it certainly didn't work, but there's only so much a coach can do. I could certainly be wrong about this, but if there's any position I'm willing to give Rex the benefit of the doubt on with a guy he helped pick and will be coaching, it's got to be the DL. Between him and Dunbar, if Coples has what it takes, he's sure as hell going to have the coaching to make it happen. I'm with that. My hope is that all of Coples' issues stem from everything around the UNC program going to absolute sh*t around him and he got caught up in the negativity. The problem is, it's not like the Jets locker room has shown itself to be a calm harbor of serenity, either. My overarching fear here is that Rex has overplayed the antiestablishment/maverick hand and it's set to come back and kill him. Coples certainly fits the mold of the very guy we shouldn't be adding. But, who knows, maybe he figures it out. Pac brought up a good point last night--Coples' position group is full of good dudes who work hard. Maybe that rubs off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 The problem is, it's not like the Jets locker room has shown itself to be a calm harbor of serenity, either. Offensively, yes. The defense still balled out last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Who's style does? You me-firster. You are the ultimate uncoachable thugturd me-firster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Offensively, yes. The defense still balled out last year. True. Rex will be aware if Coples starts hanging his head. Jody Mac on ESPN1050 just got finished saying that he talked to Pettine yesterday and Pettine made it sound like he stamped the pick personally. I'm sure they'll be on Coples' neck from Day One to avoid getting burned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lego My Lageman Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Wilk, Devito, Ellis, Pouha, Coples Scott, Harris, Pace Revis, Landry, Cro Thats one hell of a 46 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afosomf Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 What he's got that I like is the ability to play sideline to sideline and cover the TE's. He'll be a sub package guy if Scott still cant play all 3 downs. with all that speed a 2 star recruit playin in a sh1t conf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetlag Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 Davis is my favorite pick by far. He seems like the coachable, over-eager guy that, when put in the right spots, will excel. Lord knows we need speed at LB. This pick was as much for Mike Westhoff as it was Rex Ryan. 1st Round: Defense 2nd Round: Offense 3rd Round: Defense/ST 4th Round: Offense/ST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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