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Sanchez's stats with and without Holmes.


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#1 Jetfan13

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 09:49 AM

With Holmes:
63 of 128, 49%, 813 yds, 5 TD's, 4 Int's

Without Holmes:
53 of 90, 59%, 640 yds, 4 TD's, 3 Int's

Just saying
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#2 The Crusher

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:32 AM

Problem you have is the time without Keller overlaps and makes this pointless.
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#3 bitonti

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:36 AM

also looking at the numbers, he has more TD INT and yards with holmes. higher comp % without. More TD and yards is a good thing. the math isn't all that overpowering.
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#4 T0mShane

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:37 AM

CANCERNIO
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#5 Jet27

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:37 AM

Problem you have is the time without Keller overlaps and makes this pointless.


Exactly
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#6 SMC

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:46 AM

With Holmes:
63 of 128, 49%, 813 yds, 5 TD's, 4 Int's

Without Holmes:
53 of 90, 59%, 640 yds, 4 TD's, 3 Int's

Just saying


Passer rating of 69.5 with Holmes and 81.7 without him, still low, but demonstrably better.
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#7 SMC

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:50 AM

also looking at the numbers, he has more TD INT and yards with holmes. higher comp % without. More TD and yards is a good thing. the math isn't all that overpowering.


But couldn't that be because there are 38 more attempts with Holmes than without?

In other words, with 38 fewer attempts he has 1 less TD (but also 1 less INT) and 173 fewer yards. With Holmes Sanchez is 6.35 yards per attempt but without him he is 7.1 yards per attempt. With the same yards per attempt that would be 269 extra yards. Even with the lower attempt average, that 241 extra yards.
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#8 JiF

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:52 AM

*
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Mark isn't about stats. He's about wins. The Jets have 1 win without Holmes.
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#9 THE ILK

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:53 AM

sucks >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sucks
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#10 Joe Jets fan

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 10:55 AM

It's also about the defenses he played with or without.
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#11 whodeawhodat

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 11:02 AM

I just dont get the feeling that we are struggling on offense without holmes. Last year it felt like 1st and 10 was ten miles long. Now, I am pretty confident that we wont go 3 and out unless we get lucky. Then again we dont have dipsh*t #1 and dipsh*t #2 committing holding penalties on every drive. So it may or may not be because of holmes BUT we definately arent worse off without him.
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#12 pointman

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 11:12 AM

Numbers are just that. Obviously they don't show the intangibles like how satisfying warm chocolate chips cookies are and how bad Sanchez sucks.
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#13 #27TheDominator

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 11:15 AM

I just dont get the feeling that we are struggling on offense without holmes. Last year it felt like 1st and 10 was ten miles long. Now, I am pretty confident that we wont go 3 and out unless we get lucky. Then again we dont have dipsh*t #1 and dipsh*t #2 committing holding penalties on every drive. So it may or may not be because of holmes BUT we definately arent worse off without him.


That's funny. I am not ready to kill Sparano yet, but against Pittsburgh and San Francisco I have felt as bad about this offense as I ever have. OTOH, I guess those were both with Santonio.
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#14 slats

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 11:56 AM

And in the fourth year of Sanchez, the Jets are finally developing young WRs. Kerley looks like the real deal.
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#15 Smashmouth

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:08 PM

Problem you have is the time without Keller overlaps and makes this pointless.


The problem you have is anything that shows a positive effect on Sanchez is not worth discussing. Now hear me out...

If the Jets dump Holmes (if in any way possible) in the offseason and bring in a guy like Greg Jennings (possible Free Agent) to go with Kerly and Stephen Hill and add a Solid RB in the draft this team would improve ten fold on Offense. If at that point Sanchez can not perform up to expectations then we move him and draft a QB in the 2014 Draft. At the very least the new QB coming in will have some talent around him to work with and grow with Since Kerley and Hill are very young and seem to have promising futures and Jennings would bring stability.

Since Sanchez is already guaranteed the money for next year this is the only scenario that makes any sense. But Unlike the Jets the Packers are not stupid and they will probably not let Aaron Rodgers best Receiver just move on without a fight. If its a true money issue, they may have to let Jennings go because they do have some holes that need to be Addressed and they can probably bring in a Rookie Receiver and be just fine with Rodgers at QB and an already very established offense.
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#16 JetsFanInDenver

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:14 PM

Thruoughout his career Holmes has only caught 55% of throws he is targeted on. Not some of that could be great play by DB's but dropsies also are part of that equation.

What you see is the completion percentage goes up significantly higher when Holmes and his drops are not part of the equation.

But the TD/INT ration did not change much.
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#17 Jetfan13

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:18 PM

Problem you have is the time without Keller overlaps and makes this pointless.


So in other words when Holmes is playing without Keller Sanchez plays worse then when Keller plays without Holmes....thanx for making my point.
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#18 The Crusher

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:20 PM

The problem you have is anything that shows a positive effect on Sanchez is not worth discussing. Now hear me out...

If the Jets dump Holmes (if in any way possible) in the offseason and bring in a guy like Greg Jennings (possible Free Agent) to go with Kerly and Stephen Hill and add a Solid RB in the draft this team would improve ten fold on Offense. If at that point Sanchez can not perform up to expectations then we move him and draft a QB in the 2014 Draft. At the very least the new QB coming in will have some talent around him to work with and grow with Since Kerley and Hill are very young and seem to have promising futures and Jennings would bring stability.

Since Sanchez is already guaranteed the money for next year this is the only scenario that makes any sense. But Unlike the Jets the Packers are not stupid and they will probably not let Aaron Rodgers best Receiver just move on without a fight. If its a true money issue, they may have to let Jennings go because they do have some holes that need to be Addressed and they can probably bring in a Rookie Receiver and be just fine with Rodgers at QB and an already very established offense.


Yeah and when he still sucks we will be told it's because of a lack of continuity among his receivers. We are stuck another year with him. STUCK STUCK STUCK
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#19 The Crusher

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:21 PM

So in other words when Holmes is playing without Keller Sanchez plays worse then when Keller plays without Holmes....thanx for making my point.


My point is it's another variable that will effect the outcome. But I'm happy if your happy.
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#20 Klecko73isGod

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:23 PM

The problem you have is anything that shows a positive effect on Sanchez is not worth discussing. Now hear me out...

If the Jets dump Holmes (if in any way possible) in the offseason and bring in a guy like Greg Jennings (possible Free Agent) to go with Kerly and Stephen Hill and add a Solid RB in the draft this team would improve ten fold on Offense. If at that point Sanchez can not perform up to expectations then we move him and draft a QB in the 2014 Draft. At the very least the new QB coming in will have some talent around him to work with and grow with Since Kerley and Hill are very young and seem to have promising futures and Jennings would bring stability.

Since Sanchez is already guaranteed the money for next year this is the only scenario that makes any sense. But Unlike the Jets the Packers are not stupid and they will probably not let Aaron Rodgers best Receiver just move on without a fight. If its a true money issue, they may have to let Jennings go because they do have some holes that need to be Addressed and they can probably bring in a Rookie Receiver and be just fine with Rodgers at QB and an already very established offense.


Since I think Sanchez's contract status likely means he will be the starter through at least next year I am rooting for him to succeed (as my happiness level on Sunday is attached directly to this.) However, if he plays poorly I will be critical of his performance.

I actually felt bad for Sanchez on Sunday because other than two backbreaking plays, he had a very good game. Its just we need to not see those backbreaking plays. They need to stop. They are beyond old at this point.
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#21 Smashmouth

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:26 PM

Since I think Sanchez's contract status likely means he will be the starter through at least next year I am rooting for him to succeed (as my happiness level on Sunday is attached directly to this.) However, if he plays poorly I will be critical of his performance.

I actually felt bad for Sanchez on Sunday because other than two backbreaking plays, he had a very good game. Its just we need to not see those backbreaking plays. They need to stop. They are beyond old at this point.


I agree the biggest problem Sanchez has is protecting the football. Interceptions happen but not getting rid of the football and fumbling as much as Mark Does trying to extend plays is just really poor judgement on his part. Rather than trying to constantly back out of pressure he needs to roll out more to extend plays and possibly even run a bit more as well
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#22 jetsjetsjetss

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:32 PM

math doesnt really add up. Improvements in some areas slips in others. Id call that a no correlation
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#23 The Crusher

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:35 PM

Since I think Sanchez's contract status likely means he will be the starter through at least next year I am rooting for him to succeed (as my happiness level on Sunday is attached directly to this.) However, if he plays poorly I will be critical of his performance.

I actually felt bad for Sanchez on Sunday because other than two backbreaking plays, he had a very good game. Its just we need to not see those backbreaking plays. They need to stop. They are beyond old at this point.


LOL
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#24 Bleedin Green

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:36 PM

The problem you have is anything that shows a positive effect on Sanchez is not worth discussing. Now hear me out...

If the Jets dump Holmes (if in any way possible) in the offseason and bring in a guy like Greg Jennings (possible Free Agent) to go with Kerly and Stephen Hill and add a Solid RB in the draft this team would improve ten fold on Offense. If at that point Sanchez can not perform up to expectations then we move him and draft a QB in the 2014 Draft. At the very least the new QB coming in will have some talent around him to work with and grow with Since Kerley and Hill are very young and seem to have promising futures and Jennings would bring stability.

Since Sanchez is already guaranteed the money for next year this is the only scenario that makes any sense. But Unlike the Jets the Packers are not stupid and they will probably not let Aaron Rodgers best Receiver just move on without a fight. If its a true money issue, they may have to let Jennings go because they do have some holes that need to be Addressed and they can probably bring in a Rookie Receiver and be just fine with Rodgers at QB and an already very established offense.


Even if they go with that plan, there's absolutely no way the Jets can justify waiting another year to draft a QB. They already should have drafted one this past year and they absolutely have to draft one this coming year, even if it's just to sit him while Sanchez gets the start at the beginning of the season. You can't sit here and wait until you've finally cut your last QB to go and draft the next one, starting this process all over with a rookie at QB once again. With that kind of logic, we'll be sitting around while people like you want to give the new guy his 5 years to prove himself, even if he sucks. The Jets need to keep continually looking, and cannot stop, until they've found their answer. Giving the same one guy a chance over and over again with no competition or alternatives when there's little to no evidence that he'll ever be the answer is not going to get you anywhere.
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#25 JohnnyHector

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Posted 25 October 2012 - 12:47 PM

there's absolutely no way the Jets can justify waiting another year to draft a QB. They already should have drafted one this past year and they absolutely have to draft one this coming year, even if it's just to sit him while Sanchez gets the start at the beginning of the season. You can't sit here and wait until you've finally cut your last QB to go and draft the next one, starting this process all over with a rookie at QB once again.


And predictably, if he struggles, Smash will be complaining that said rookie QB was thrown to the lions and didn't have the proper coaching to succeed.
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