40 replies to this topic

[Lego My Lageman]

no just stop

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Tannenbaum has done nothing but mortgage our future to pay for today. Don't see that changing anytime soon considering his job is on the line.

[Gastineau Lives]

If it were actually possible to get Romo or Rivers next year I'd keep the core, don't trade anyone and take one more shot with Rex and Co. If not, starting dumping salaries and getting younger...

Yeah, but how young can you possibly get when you're talking about Antonio Cromartie, who is 28 years old? I don't see any fetuses playing cornerback on the cheap any time soon.


And yes, I'm aware of the irony of talking about fetuses in the same sentence as our very virile cornerback.

Edited by Gastineau Lives, 01 November 2012 - 07:06 PM.

[KINGDIRK]

It is a popular opinion with some fans that when a team stinks you trade away the good guys and try and get a ton of stuff back instead of trying to do other things to add pieces to the guys you have that are good. The fact is there is only one Herschel Walker trade in history. Trading Cro would net a draft pick (probably more like a third, but for argument's sake let's say a second) which we would use and if we made the perfect pick would have another younger version of Cro. It really doesn't make much sense to do that.

I just don't see the Jets being legit SB contenders in the next 2 years. I dont expect a Hershel Walker type trade but if we arent real contenders in the near term, why not add an additional pick. Like I said, Vontae Davis went for a 2nd rounder - cant see why someone might not pony up the same for Cro (contract notwithstanding).

[KINGDIRK]

Who do you want to draft with that pick? Please be specific. I know you're not even sure what round it would be or to which team, but go ahead and take a shot since you're trading away one of the best players on the team.

Oh, I am not going to sit here and pretend to be an NFL scout. Your request to hear who I want to draft with an extra 2nd round pick is ridiculous. Here what I am thinking. We are NOWHERE CLOSE to being SB contenders. I don't care how many AFC Title games we lost recently. That being said, trading a guy like Cro for an additional pick makes total sense.

NFL organizations that are run very well build thru the draft. So yes, I think adding additional picks for a guy who wont be around when we are real contenders again makes total sense. Perhaps you can tell me why that would not be sound strategy. Or better yet, tell me what you would suggest? Keep one of our best players for another 2 years while we struggle to be a .500 team and then end up getting nothing for him?

[KINGDIRK]

There's one very important, and perhaps hard to admit, reason not to trade Cromartie now. Because it's very possible at some point in the next 9 or so months, the Jets will find themselves in a situation where it's going to be Revis who makes the most sense for them to trade, in that case they're going to really want to have Cromartie still around. The truth is, Revis' injury makes an already difficult situation all that much worse. He's coming off a serious injury, will be entering the last year of his deal, is going to be looking for a big time contract and the Jets won't be able to franchise him after the 2013 season. It's very possible if they don't get him extended this coming offseason, he'll be walking in 2014 with the Jets getting absolutely nothing in return, and in that case, trading him is going to become a serious consideration.

Revis is going to be an unrestricted free agent. Its an easy call. The Jets wont sign him to big money deal until he proves hes healthy. How long will it take for the Jets to know that? Maybe half a season? So you think Revis - 8 games away from unrestricted free agency is going to sign with the Jets. No fukin way. This dudes ego is too big for that. He plays out the season, and some dumbass owner throws Mario Williams $$$ at him - something the Jets cant afford to do.

[Sperm Edwards]

It is a popular opinion with some fans that when a team stinks you trade away the good guys and try and get a ton of stuff back instead of trying to do other things to add pieces to the guys you have that are good. The fact is there is only one Herschel Walker trade in history. Trading Cro would net a draft pick (probably more like a third, but for argument's sake let's say a second) which we would use and if we made the perfect pick would have another younger version of Cro. It really doesn't make much sense to do that.

It also nets $9.5M off the cap for each of the next 2 seasons. The "sense" is if we want to rebuild with some other veterans (to lock up for longer than the 2 years we have Cro for) it would add flexibility to do that. Before you know it he's going to lose a step. He's 28 now and we have him locked up through age 30. We're not going to want him past that (unless, by some miracle, he wants to sign 1 year deals with us until he sucks). We have so many FAs next year that we won't be able to re-sign, and with not enough younger guys ready to take their place, an 8-figure per season CB for 2 more years may be an unnecessary luxury. Face it, we are not winning a superbowl next year. So we'd be holding onto Cromartie in case we are (hopefully) contenders in 2014 for the last year of his current deal.

I don't think it's a no-brainer to have moved him, and it would suck for us to part with one of the only guys who's still playing at an elite level (which he is), but I can more than see the sense in it.

We paid a (conditional) 2nd for him when he had I think 1 year left on his rookie contract and hadn't been very good since his first year. He now has a deal in place for the remainder of this year plus 2 more full seasons with no new up-front bonus money required from his new team, and is playing like a star CB again. We could recoup a damn good pick (or two) plus a boatload of cap space.

[Gastineau Lives]

Oh, I am not going to sit here and pretend to be an NFL scout. Your request to hear who I want to draft with an extra 2nd round pick is ridiculous. Here what I am thinking. We are NOWHERE CLOSE to being SB contenders. I don't care how many AFC Title games we lost recently. That being said, trading a guy like Cro for an additional pick makes total sense.

NFL organizations that are run very well build thru the draft. So yes, I think adding additional picks for a guy who wont be around when we are real contenders again makes total sense. Perhaps you can tell me why that would not be sound strategy. Or better yet, tell me what you would suggest? Keep one of our best players for another 2 years while we struggle to be a .500 team and then end up getting nothing for him?

First of all, you can't run an organization on the assumption that you will not contend. You don't trade all your best players because you're not a "Super Bowl contender". Two years is a long time. Just ask Mike Tannenbaum and show him a picture of Mark Sanchez signing his extension.

[KINGDIRK]

First of all, you can't run an organization on the assumption that you will not contend. You don't trade all your best players because you're not a "Super Bowl contender". Two years is a long time. Just ask Mike Tannenbaum and show him a picture of Mark Sanchez signing his extension.

If an organization cannot see clearly that the personnel you have in place is MILES away from being a Super Bowl contender - than that organization is fuked (for lack of a better term).

Two years is a long time. But this team has SO MANY needs that it would be arrogant of you or Jets brass to think this team is anywhere close to contending for real.

If you have an asset, like a 28 year old Cro who is at peak value, it would be irresponsible for the Jets to not even entertain the idea of dealing him for the right price.

Edited by KINGDIRK, 01 November 2012 - 07:47 PM.

[bitonti]

the Jets have been firing people for 40 years

If I were the owner, Rex Ryan can coach here as long as he wants.

he's clearly the best HC they've had since Parcells.

[Matt39]

the Jets have been firing people for 40 years

If I were the owner, Rex Ryan can coach here as long as he wants.

he's clearly the best HC they've had since Parcells.

none of the ppl the Jets have fired have gone onto success somewhere else.

[bitonti]

none of the ppl the Jets have fired have gone onto success somewhere else.

That might have something to do with the quality of the hire's in the first place. Even if there was a Parcells-like coach out there, he wouldn't necessarily pick this job.

NY is a crazy place to coach with few football lifers from the area. Guys like DBrick who grew up on Long Island and Rex who was a ball boy briefly for the Namath era Jets, are huge minorities. It used to be that Vince Lombardi would go from football hotbed of Brooklyn to Green Bay, now the league is basically staffed with a combination of good ole boys and hicks. Neither of which really want to live in New York.

the Jets got lucky with Rex, firing him would be like Pitt firing Cowher in year 4. the dude can have a decade for all I care. He's a defensive mastermind. even this defense is still the best part of the team by far.

[Bleedin Green]

Revis is going to be an unrestricted free agent. Its an easy call. The Jets wont sign him to big money deal until he proves hes healthy. How long will it take for the Jets to know that? Maybe half a season? So you think Revis - 8 games away from unrestricted free agency is going to sign with the Jets. No fukin way. This dudes ego is too big for that. He plays out the season, and some dumbass owner throws Mario Williams $$$ at him - something the Jets cant afford to do.

I actually agree with you, which is my whole point. If the Jets think there's a good chance Revis will walk after next season, they're going to have at least consider the possibility of trading him. After all, they'd be much better served getting something in return than letting him walk for something If that's potentially the case, I don't see how you could consider trading Cromartie.

[Bleedin Green]

i saw it the other way. Revis was never hurt (or anything but awesome) before this season. This injury gives the Jets a little bit of leverage, both sides can work out a rational deal. If Revis had another AllPro year he could have asked for the moon and the stars.

I do agree tho that trading Cro doesn't really help anything. they can get another 2nd round. Oohh like Stephen Hill? Great... it helps the 2016 Jets it doesn't do much in the near term.

You could certainly be right, my only worry would be that Revis is the kind of guy who clearly has a lot of confidence in himself, so I could see him not being interested in taking a reduced amount when he sees himself being only one year away from getting to hit the UFA jackpot, which as we all know, carries an even bigger dollar amount along with it. So if that is the case, and the Jets are too worried about his health to lock him up for the kind of money he wants, there could be too big of a gap to close and I honestly think once next season starts, the only shot Revis will give the Jets at keeping him is by being his highest bidder on the UFA market. I'd love to be wrong about that, and you could certainly be on the mark with what you're saying, but that potential scenario is the only reason I could see a trade of Revis being a possible consideration.

[Gastineau Lives]

If an organization cannot see clearly that the personnel you have in place is MILES away from being a Super Bowl contender - than that organization is fuked (for lack of a better term).

Two years is a long time. But this team has SO MANY needs that it would be arrogant of you or Jets brass to think this team is anywhere close to contending for real.

If you have an asset, like a 28 year old Cro who is at peak value, it would be irresponsible for the Jets to not even entertain the idea of dealing him for the right price.

Unless that number two pick is going to get us a franchise quarterback, undo Darrelle Revis' knee injury and Santonio Holmes' foot injury...

If we had a good quarterback and those two injuries don't happen, we wouldn't BE miles from contending. Who the hell in this conference is that good? We almost had the Texans and we should have beaten the Pats. Without our best player on defense and our best player on offense.

Not miles, just the length of the quarterbacks arm.

[#27TheDominator]

I love these threads. Somebody proposes a trade and then we hear - "You can't trade him!" and/or "You live in fantasy land! We can never get that much for him!" The fact is, everybody has a price. Based on contract and ability and character/injury issues you determine the value and take it if it's more. If somebody offered a 2nd for Cromartie I'd certainly consider it. I sure wouldn't trade him for a 4th.

[KINGDIRK]

I actually agree with you, which is my whole point. If the Jets think there's a good chance Revis will walk after next season, they're going to have at least consider the possibility of trading him. After all, they'd be much better served getting something in return than letting him walk for something If that's potentially the case, I don't see how you could consider trading Cromartie.

Because a year from now, when that scenario unfolds Cro will be 29 years old headed into the final year of his contract. As great as he's played let another team give a 30 year old Cro a big contract.

[KINGDIRK]

You could certainly be right, my only worry would be that Revis is the kind of guy who clearly has a lot of confidence in himself, so I could see him not being interested in taking a reduced amount when he sees himself being only one year away from getting to hit the UFA jackpot, which as we all know, carries an even bigger dollar amount along with it. So if that is the case, and the Jets are too worried about his health to lock him up for the kind of money he wants, there could be too big of a gap to close and I honestly think once next season starts, the only shot Revis will give the Jets at keeping him is by being his highest bidder on the UFA market. I'd love to be wrong about that, and you could certainly be on the mark with what you're saying, but that potential scenario is the only reason I could see a trade of Revis being a possible consideration.

If the Jets are not contenders next year, know Revis won't resign at their terms, they have to trade him. You cannot let a guy like Revis get to UFA - and end up getting nothing for him.

[KINGDIRK]

Unless that number two pick is going to get us a franchise quarterback, undo Darrelle Revis' knee injury and Santonio Holmes' foot injury...

If we had a good quarterback and those two injuries don't happen, we wouldn't BE miles from contending. Who the hell in this conference is that good? We almost had the Texans and we should have beaten the Pats. Without our best player on defense and our best player on offense.

Not miles, just the length of the quarterbacks arm.

Your right about us having a good QB. Maybe I feel like we are miles from having a good QB, lol. I don't want to reach for a QB this draft. Dont just take a QB for the sake of it. But if they felt strongly about some (i.e. Geno Smith), make a move.

As far as Cro - perhaps an extra 2nd rounder could help us move up in the draft in order to land a franchise QB??

[TheShow]

the only way I'd trade Cro was if we could throw in Sanchez and get a good QB. Dallas Loves them some Corners! Romo anyone? lol