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jetfan718

Alex Smith or Mike Vick?

136 posts in this topic

Got it. But if McElroy shows signs this week and next I do hope he is really given a faior shot to lead this team. I hope we make some moves for a WR, Big TE and another RB. In addition to an OLB.

As long as he looks even half decent, I don't think there's any particular reason to not let McElroy be part of the picture next season, even if only for TC. That said, I still think that no matter how good he looks these next two weeks, you cannot rely solely on him and still need to bring in some other options at the position.

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News flash (as though you didn't know this already): they aren't winning a superbowl in 2013. Too many holes (either from under-performers or 2013 team FAs) with too little cap space to fill those holes. We're rebuiling next year. Or we should be, anyway.

It's why Tannenbaum has to go. To try and save himself he'll screw our relatively clean slates for 2014 and beyond to hopefully squeak out another 7 to 8 win season instead of a 3 to 6 win season. All to be more "competitive" in 2-3 more ultimately inconsequential games? No thanks.

It might be, but under your theory you cant keep Sanchez and expect to be competitive either. If they cut ways with Sanchez, I can definitely see them signing a cheap FA hold the fort vet assuming McElroy sucks as bad as I think he does.

If they fire Tannenbaum and the new GM (god bless him) comes in, I could see them cutting Sanchez (and firing Rex). And starting clean slate in 2014 when hopefully a better QB crop will be available.

That said, wouldn't it be funny if they brought back Stanton next season. :)

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If they fire Tannenbaum and the new GM (god bless him) comes in, I could see them cutting Sanchez (and firing Rex). And starting clean slate in 2014 when hopefully a better QB crop will be available.

That said, wouldn't it be funny if they brought back Stanton next season. :)

I would pick a different word to describe that situation, should it materialize.

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That said, wouldn't it be funny if they brought back Stanton next season. :)

That goes to show just how bad of a decision maker Tannenbaum actually is. They signed Stanton and then couldn't help themselves in their quest for headlines with the Tebow acquisition. WTF?

If Stanton is on the team this season the Jets are probably in the playoffs.

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That goes to show just how bad of a decision maker Tannenbaum actually is. They signed Stanton and then couldn't help themselves in their quest for headlines with the Tebow acquisition. WTF?

If Stanton is on the team this season the Jets are probably in the playoffs.

Doubtful. The only difference probably would have been that it would have been Stanton who led the late victory against Arizona and who would now be starting this week. I'm sure little else would have been any different.

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I have this little bit of hope that the Jets will be able to work out a trade of Sanchez for Matt Flynn. Basically a larger scale Wayne Hunter for Jason Smith deal. Two teams unloading bad choices. Not that I see Flynn as any sort of savior, just that getting Sanchez off the roster would be a huge move in the right direction.

Barring that, a Campbell or a Moore would be fine as a short term move. I'd also be looking at "all the tools" type QB projects in the middle rounds. Guys who look like they should be first rounders on paper, but fell for whatever reason. A GM who knows how to hold onto and/or collect draft picks can pick one of those guys every other year. It's a nice way to build some stability at the position.

Unfortunately, this is the scenario that makes the least sense. You take a cap hit on trading a high contract player only if you get a low cap number in return. You can't swap bad contract for bad contract in the NFL, because the cap hit both teams get actually makes their situations even worse. This isn't baseball.

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Unfortunately, this is the scenario that makes the least sense. You take a cap hit on trading a high contract player only if you get a low cap number in return. You can't swap bad contract for bad contract in the NFL, because the cap hit both teams get actually makes their situations even worse. This isn't baseball.

Money can be negotiated into any trade, like the way the Jets inexplicably paid $2.5M in the trade to acquire Tebow. If Pete Carroll doesn't like Flynn, and feels he can rehabilitate Sanchez, he just may be willing to do a deal that doesn't cost the Jets any more than the $8.25M guarantee Sanchez has coming to him next year.

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Agreed. I like these ideas. Plus, there is a small part of me that thinks Moore could actually develop into a slightly above average starter. He reminds me a lot of Matt Schaub.

Shuab, as we saw against NE is also limited as a starter due to his lack of arm strength.

Whoever we get for next year is a stopgap until what will hopefully be a decent QB draft in 2014.

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I should say Vick or McElroy and rebuild.

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I want no part of Vick. But when I look at Alex Smith--I am not sure why--I see Richard Todd.

Smith will get at least the contract Matt Flynn got. He's not worth it. Smith as a long term QB is a recipe for mediocrity. Edited by unbanmadmike1
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News flash (as though you didn't know this already): they aren't winning a superbowl in 2013. Too many holes (either from under-performers or 2013 team FAs) with too little cap space to fill those holes. We're rebuiling next year. Or we should be, anyway.

It's why Tannenbaum has to go. To try and save himself he'll screw our relatively clean slates for 2014 and beyond to hopefully squeak out another 7 to 8 win season instead of a 3 to 6 win season. All to be more "competitive" in 2-3 more ultimately inconsequential games? No thanks.

I've been in this camp too Sperm but it's actually not impossible if....a strong if...they can get some of these big salary guys (Harris, Holmes, Revis, Cro, Brick, Mangold) to renegotiate (not all but if you could get some) and cutting a few players like Pace, Scott, Tebow and Pouha while/if a few young guys could step up...I think they could have just enough space to resign of few guys along with Vick. If...a strong if again, they have a good draft they could potentially have, at least, a competitive team....or at least a pretty decent starting line up. But again there's a lot of ifs, I get it, but god forbid they landed on with their draft picks, a couple young guys step up and guys stayed healthy... there could be something there...possibly?

QB: Vick,

WR: Holmes, Edwards (resigned), Hill, Kerely

TE: Keller (resigned), Reuland/5th round draft pick

RB: Powell/2nd round pick, McKnight

OT: D'Brick

OG: Slauson (resigned)

OC: Mangold

OG: Ducasse/4th round pick

OT: Howard (resigned)/6th round pick

DE: Wilkerson

NT: Ellis

DE Coples, DeVito

OLB: McIntyre, 1st round pick

ILB: Harris, Davis

CB: Revis, Cro, Wilson

S: Landry (resigned), Bush/3rd round pick

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So what if Mo and Coples continue to become monsters, Davis upgrades, Ellis stays healthy, they actually land right with a bigtime 34 OLB pass rusher in the 1st, figure Matt Elam or the Honey Badger in the 3rd, and Ducasse is finally ready.

Edited by HessStation
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Really guys it's tough in the fog of War, but its down to some of the worst QB I've ever seen consistently. You can't have your Q.B turn the ball over Five feckin time in one game and actually Win!

The games have been so hard to watch this year, it's like watching a car crash in slow motion. Mark is just Horrible, the main problem is we missed our Window, and Sanchez as gone back so fast you'd need a Delorean with a new flux capacitor to catch him. I'm down with the cheap Matt Moore option, next year is a clear out and building through the Draft. It's about getting us in a posistion to bee looking good Cap wise and roster wise for 2014.

Besides without Sanchez at the helm, the new look Jets no matter how bad will look like a Bill Walsh 49ers team of the late 80's compaired the just explosion of Sh@t we've seen in 2012.

I think Rex is safe for one more year, Tanny is goneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. Tony Sparano Goneeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee. The world will be a much better place, beside I'm a Jets fan so it's all about the Combine and Draft, this Plays off's and Superbowl Stuff is for those other suckers,,,,

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So what if Mo and Coples continue to become monsters, Davis upgrades, Ellis stays healthy, they actually land right with a bigtime 34 OLB pass rusher in the 1st, figure Matt Elam or the Honey Badger in the 3rd, and Ducasse is finally ready.

I want nothing to do with the Honey Badger, especially in the 3rd round. He's a midget mentally and physically.

Also, I'm not really into giving Ducasse a shot at starting. We should spend a high round (but not 1st) on someone for the right side of the offensive line.

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Shuab, as we saw against NE is also limited as a starter due to his lack of arm strength.

Whoever we get for next year is a stopgap until what will hopefully be a decent QB draft in 2014.

We shut down Schaub too for the most part. My point was, I think Moore can be a similar type QB - a game manager with limited abilities. A good hold the fort guy.

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So what if Mo and Coples continue to become monsters, Davis upgrades, Ellis stays healthy, they actually land right with a bigtime 34 OLB pass rusher in the 1st, figure Matt Elam or the Honey Badger in the 3rd, and Ducasse is finally ready.

Matt Elam's not falling to the 3rd. Some rumors floating around UF that he wasnt to stay another season too...

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Money can be negotiated into any trade, like the way the Jets inexplicably paid $2.5M in the trade to acquire Tebow. If Pete Carroll doesn't like Flynn, and feels he can rehabilitate Sanchez, he just may be willing to do a deal that doesn't cost the Jets any more than the $8.25M guarantee Sanchez has coming to him next year.

You're missing my point. It isn't just about actual money, it is also about cap hit. Trading a player accelerates some monies still owed on the contract immediately to your cap figure. You can make up for that by acquiring a lower cost player in return, but it makes no sense to exchange for an equally high contract.

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I want nothing to do with the Honey Badger, especially in the 3rd round. He's a midget mentally and physically.

Also, I'm not really into giving Ducasse a shot at starting. We should spend a high round (but not 1st) on someone for the right side of the offensive line.

yep. Matt Elam would be my first choice in the 3rd and I threw in an OG in the 4th above. Something like that. Honey badger will boom or bust, where he's drafted could end up anywhere after an early second IMO. Vontaze Burfict of 2013.
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Matt Elam's not falling to the 3rd. Some rumors floating around UF that he wasnt to stay another season too...

where do u think he's going u homer.
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where do u think he's going u homer.

Not 100% sure. Plus, he might return to school.

I'd say that if Harrison Smith was a top 30 pick, Elam will at the very latest be taken in the 2nd round. He's the best SS in the draft, hands down. I think he probably goes between 30-45 overall, which is part of the reason he might return. A great Senior season could project him into a sure fire 1st rounder.

I'm not a homer. I'm a honest Gators fan. The only player I think I ever ranked higher than he should be coming out was Derrick Harvey. I liked him over Gholston for the Jets. lulz. I'll tell it like it is. Like that one Tebow homer that told me I was crazy for saying Jeff Demps will never play a down in a regular season game.

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You're missing my point. It isn't just about actual money, it is also about cap hit. Trading a player accelerates some monies still owed on the contract immediately to your cap figure. You can make up for that by acquiring a lower cost player in return, but it makes no sense to exchange for an equally high contract.

I understand all of that.

If the Jets can get a trading partner to take on some of Mark's salary, that money would come off of their cap. They're screwed capwise next year no matter what, but being able to get Sanchez off the books would be addition by subtraction - even if it costs a little against the cap. It's probably a pipe dream, but if Seattle liked Sanchez and wanted to rid themselves of Flynn, they might be willing to do something on the money to help alleviate the Jets' cap hit.

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yep. Matt Elam would be my first choice in the 3rd and I threw in an OG in the 4th above. Something like that. Honey badger will boom or bust, where he's drafted could end up anywhere after an early second IMO. Vontaze Burfict of 2013.

I would take a flier on him in the 6th or 7th. Anything earlier and you're playing with fire.

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Neither. Get me 1 of these, in order from most wanted to least:

1. Colin K

2. Cousins

3. [Draft 1st round]

4. Flynn

5. Moore

Edited by stoicsentry
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I understand all of that.

If the Jets can get a trading partner to take on some of Mark's salary, that money would come off of their cap. They're screwed capwise next year no matter what, but being able to get Sanchez off the books would be addition by subtraction - even if it costs a little against the cap. It's probably a pipe dream, but if Seattle liked Sanchez and wanted to rid themselves of Flynn, they might be willing to do something on the money to help alleviate the Jets' cap hit.

The Coach who said Sanchez wasn't ready for the NFL would suddenly want him at some inflated price tag? And after proving him right beyond all doubt? Pete has made some stupid QB moves (Whitehurst? Flynn ?), but he's got a potential ROY in Wilson, and they are on path to make the playoffs. They also have an up and coming defense that makes plays. Why would they trade for Sanchez? Why would they screw with Wilson at this point? Bringing on a Sanchez does nothing for them at all. Except make fans pissed. Make teammates pissed. ANd probably make Wilson pissed. This is a Jets fans dream trade, not a realistic one.

Yes, the Seahawks have made some questionable moves over the years, but they've really never made a move to put people in the seats. At this point who would trade picks and players and give Sanchez that money? Especially for a backup role? That's a pipe dream.

The only teams who might even dream of trading for Sanchez would be Arizona, Jacksonville, Buffalo and the Raiders. Kansas City already spent way too much on bad QBs so I just don't see a new regime coming in and thinking they can change Sanchez or wanting anything to do with him.. Sanchez's last game probably killed half the potential trades, if there ever were any. Yes he was bad, but when the last image anybody has of him is 5 bad turnovers on MNF against a bad team and the viral video of a butt fumble, nobody in their right mind is going to give up much for the kid and take on salary.

So Arizona as a trade partner for Sanchez. I'm sure they will have some kind of new regime. Kolb hasn't been terrible, he's just always hurt. So where do they go from here? They might actually have the worst QB situation I've ever seen. That's how bad their QBs have been. Sanchez stinks, but the Arizona QBs might not even be ready for pop warner. So everybody knows Kolb is an injury liability, therefore a new regime would come in and want to draft their future QB. THey aren't going to take on 8.5 Million for a backup or a short term solution. People say the Jets should take on Matt Moore cause he'd be cheap and a short term solution. Don't you think other bad teams are thinking the same thing? I just don't see the Cardinals with a new coach and regime wanting anything to do with Sanchez. He costs too much money for what he is at this point. So unless the Cardinals give up a 6th round draft pick for sanchez and the Jets take on most of the salary, it's not going to happen.

Jacksonville... They would take Tebow over Sanchez in a heartbeat. ANd at this point, who would trade anything for Tebow knowing the Jets don't even think of him as a backup QB? The Jets made dumb moves all the way around. They suited up an injured Tebow but never planned on using him. When they finally bench Sanchez, they don't make the backup the starter, they make the guy who hasn't suited up in 13 out of 14 games. It's one of the dumbest moves I've ever seen. It's not about who is better, who wins, it's been a decision based on never wanting to make Sanchez look like a joke. But in the meantime it made the Jets and their staff look like morons. Tebow has to be released because nobody in their right mind would trade anything for him at this point. They don't think Tebow is a QB in the NFL, but they must not have thought too much about McElroy considering he never even suited up all year long. So that's the situation they put themselves in. They would rather start a kid who they never thought could even be a backup, a kid who they never thought should even suit up all year over their assumed backup QB? Yeah talk about forcing their own hands. So Tebow gets released and Jacksonville signs him. They need the fans.

Buffalo? They gave Fitzpatrick too much money, do you really think they are going to trade with the Jets for a guy who is worth less than Fitzpatrick but paid more? I doubt it.

Where does that leave us? Oakland. Who knows. It's no longer Al Davis, but the Raiders are the strong arm long ball kind of philosophy. And they are stuck with Palmer. Sanchez is too expensive and he doesn't throw the long ball.

The truth is, Sanchez is looked at as damaged goods. He costs way too much money. And the lasting image of him at this point is 5 bad turnovers and being bashed by everybody on MNF, and that butt fumble. And there really are no great games to remember him by. People like to say he took the Jets to two AFC Championship games. But beating San Diego 17-14 in a game everybody remembers Greene running over Cromartie isn't exactly that 'defining' game. He's never really had moments. Young QBs make mistakes. The good ones have great games thrown into the mix though. Sanchez has never had games like RG3 or Luck or Wilson. And he's gotten worse year after year, not better. No team in their right mind would give anything up for him. And they sure won't be spending 8.5 million on him.

We really need to face the reality the Sanchez will most likely be here next season. He might be a backup and not a happy backup, but who else would be stupid to take him? Unless of course Ryan gets fired and that man love they have translates to Rex going to Philly, bringing Sanchez along and the Jets winding up with somebody else. I highly doubt that'll happen though.

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