Report: GM Mike Tannenbaum FIRED (MERGED)

[Integrity28]

Yeah. I wish we had a pass rush and not these corners. Then we could have a great pass defense for cheaper. Like the Giants.

Technically speaking, the Giants didn't have a good pass rush this year at all. Especially down the stretch, which is why their secondary got lit up.

The better example of the model I prefer is in Pittsburgh and Baltimore where they've routinely had great pass rushing from the front 7 and good players at cornder, not top 5 CBs with top 5 CB salaries. It enables both teams to keep money tied up in QB, and OL and DL, where the spending belongs for sustained success.

What did having 2 top 5 CBs do for the Jets the past 2 seasons?

[Scott Dierking]

Yeah, as previously discussed, the Jets were the only team in the league to face lesser competition this year, and losing Revis for the season is completely insignificant.

Jets were actually in dead middle of the pack in terms of strength of schedule (2012 records) this year-so NO, not every team faces the same schedule.

Using Yards allowed as a determiner of where a defense ranks is a pretty subjective statistic. In the Jets case, it does not account for

-Teams not needing to get into scoring matches with the Jets. Teams could take the air out of the ball, waiting for the Jets to make a mistake (which they always did). Teams knew they would not be in a shootout against a pop-gun offense.

-Since the Jets turned the ball over so much, and since their special teams gave up so many points, the Jets defense did not often have to give up many yards for a score

Conversely, the Jets 3 and out offense put their defense on the field more.

You know a major factor that I consider when looking at defensive prowess? Turnovers created and points allowed specifically by the defense.

In both of those areas, the Jets were at or close to middle of the pack.

Is the Jets defense terrible? Of course not. It is a good defense, not great. They dominated the weaklings of the league on offense, and they got throttled by the better qb's and offenses.

Just don't buy the hype that Rex says this is an elite defense.

[#27TheDominator]

Technically speaking, the Giants didn't have a good pass rush this year at all. Especially down the stretch, which is why their secondary got lit up.

The better example of the model I prefer is in Pittsburgh and Baltimore where they've routinely had great pass rushing from the front 7 and good players at cornder, not top 5 CBs with top 5 CB salaries. It enables both teams to keep money tied up in QB, and OL and DL, where the spending belongs for sustained success.

What did having 2 top 5 CBs do for the Jets the past 2 seasons?

Technically speaking, the Giants spent their money and draft picks at DE and DT and pass rushers. Their D blows.

[Integrity28]

Technically speaking, the Giants spent their money and draft picks at DE and DT and pass rushers. Their D blows.

Nevermind the rest of my post or the history of the league. Just stick to the one example you can think of where the model I support failed (for one season).

[#27TheDominator]

Nevermind the rest of my post or the history of the league. Just stick to the one example you can think of where the model I support failed (for one season).

That has nothing to do with it. You are asking to change something that has been working to try another model. One that does not always work, contrary to what you believe. The Giants have tried to use pass rush to save their sh*tty back four for years. They have won 2 super bowls, but their D has been okay at best. The Jets D has more in common with the Steelers and Ravens than the Giants.

There are enough things to fix on this team. Gutting the thing that works is moronic. Yes, if Revis has insane demands they should move him. No, it shouldn't be something they actively try to do. As Slats said, they should try to gauge his numbers ASAP so they can be prepared and make a decision off of that. They shouldn't be hoping he has outrageous demands so they can move him.

[NJ]

If you trade him, you get a couple high picks, and an extra $12-15M or so in money to use in free agency. So whether that money is used for a franchise QB, or LaRon Landry & friends, it's money they can use for talent they need.

And at this point it's looking like this could be a good move if Cro gets locked into place.

[Integrity28]

That has nothing to do with it. You are asking to change something that has been working to try another model. One that does not always work, contrary to what you believe. The Giants have tried to use pass rush to save their sh*tty back four for years. They have won 2 super bowls, but their D has been okay at best. There are enough things to fix on this team. Gutting the thing that works is moronic. Yes, if Revis has insane demands they should move him. No, it shouldn't be something they actively try to do. As Slats said, they should try to gauge his numbers ASAP so they can be prepared and make a decision off of that. They shouldn't be hoping he has outrageous demands so they can move him.

Rex's model doesn't work either. Good QBs, the type we'd have to get past in the playoffs, eat his blitzing and nickel/dime coverage alive.

There's no perfect, BUT from the standpoint of how to build a competitive team WHICH WE ARE NOT under the salary cap, it makes no sense to spend large on 2 top 5 CBs when you have ZERO QBs on the roster, a deteriorating OL and a prehistoric LB corps that can't get to the QB without the blitzes that the league has obviously figured out.

Rex's pass defense benefited this year from the fact that the D sucked vs. the run and we faced a LOT of garbage QBs down the stretch. Sure, it works a lot of the time, but it is NOT sustainable without a pass rush. PLUS you have 2 top 5 CBs in lieu of having a competitive team.

I'm not suggesting we "gut" anything. I'm suggesting we redistribute how we invest in building the team. If you think 6-10, and whatever our record was last year is a good example of "what works" then you are delusional.

I'll take a top 20 pass defense and 10 wins a year from a complete team EVERY DAY over 6 wins and a top 3 pass defense. The assertion that the half a football team we have right now "works" is laughable.

I root for wins. Not statistical rankings.

[#27TheDominator]

Rex's model doesn't work either. Good QBs, the type we'd have to get past in the playoffs, eat his blitzing and nickel/dime coverage alive.

There's no perfect, BUT from the standpoint of how to build a competitive team WHICH WE ARE NOT under the salary cap, it makes no sense to spend large on 2 top 5 CBs when you have ZERO QBs on the roster, a deteriorating OL and a prehistoric LB corps that can't get to the QB without the blitzes that the league has obviously figured out.

Rex's pass defense benefited this year from the fact that the D sucked vs. the run and we faced a LOT of garbage QBs down the stretch. Sure, it works a lot of the time, but it is NOT sustainable without a pass rush. PLUS you have 2 top 5 CBs in lieu of having a competitive team.

I'm not suggesting we "gut" anything. I'm suggesting we redistribute how we invest in building the team. If you think 6-10, and whatever our record was last year is a good example of "what works" then you are delusional.

I'll take a top 20 pass defense and 10 wins a year from a complete team EVERY DAY over 6 wins and a top 3 pass defense. The assertion that the half a football team we have right now "works" is laughable.

I root for wins. Not statistical rankings.

Lol. The guy is 4-2 in the playoffs with wins over Manning and Brady and one of his two losses was to Roethlisberer and the vaunted Steelers passing attack. The whole post is a ****ing joke. The team was in the AFC Championship 2 years ago. There are plenty of pieces there. Getting rid of all of them for draft picks is moronic, but don't let that stop you. You don't want Rex? Fair enough. You don't want to overpay? Believe me, I want high dollar players less than you. You want to move Revis automatically because "corners don't win games" ? Stupid premise.

[HessStation]

I would totally trade Revis for a 1st in 2014 and a 3rd in 2013. I would then trade back from #9 this year, into the late 20's for another 1st in 2014 and a 3rd in 2013.

That would be (3) 1st round picks in 2014 and you still have a 1st (late 20's) and a total of (3) 3rd round picks along with the rest of the draft in 2013.

Go 2-14 in 2013 and get Clowney AND a QB in 2014....Super Bowl in 2017!!!!!! Yeah.

[Matt39]

A first for Revis in 2014...that's enticing. Sucking for Clowney is worth it tbh too...guy is the next LT

[Integrity28]

Lol. The guy is 4-2 in the playoffs with wins over Manning and Brady and one of his two losses was to Roethlisberer and the vaunted Steelers passing attack. The whole post is a ****ing joke. The team was in the AFC Championship 2 years ago. There are plenty of pieces there. Getting rid of all of them for draft picks is moronic, but don't let that stop you. You don't want Rex? Fair enough. You don't want to overpay? Believe me, I want high dollar players less than you. You want to move Revis automatically because "corners don't win games" ? Stupid premise.

This team is nowhere close to what it was 2 years ago. The offense needs to be rebuilt, completely. The linebacking corps needs to be rebuilt, completely. What I'm saying is that a 6-10 team has no business tying up 2 top 5 CBs (one of the highest paid positions in football) under a salary cap, with as talent-depleted they are everywhere else. Trading either Cro or Revis at their peak is the smart move to make in order to improve other areas of the team, that are MUCH more fundamental to WINNING. Improving the pass rush can and will keep us from falling off too much in our pass defense, but the reality is, pass defense doesn't win games. Obviously. We just went 6-10. Pass defense and 2 top 5 corners made almost NO impact for us.

Money should be spent on offense. The game is designed with a distinct advantage for a passing offense, and we have NONE.

Revis and Cromartie together are a luxury if you've built a stud offense from the draft, under the cap. We haven't. We are in a cap mess, and need talent. You don't get a large influx of talent in one offseason without trimming the fat from somewhere else.

Call it stupid all you want. It's logical and pretty much common sense... you just don't get it.

[Matt39]

Honestly if trading Revis would help this offense to become watchable again Im down for it. Watching the Jets is just boring and has been for some time. Its amazing ppl pay those season tix prices without anything to cheer for.

Fans dont cheer for press coverage they cheer for TD's

[#27TheDominator]

This team is nowhere close to what it was 2 years ago. The offense needs to be rebuilt, completely. The linebacking corps needs to be rebuilt, completely. What I'm saying is that a 6-10 team has no business tying up 2 top 5 CBs (one of the highest paid positions in football) under a salary cap, with as talent-depleted they are everywhere else. Trading either Cro or Revis at their peak is the smart move to make in order to improve other areas of the team, that are MUCH more fundamental to WINNING. Improving the pass rush can and will keep us from falling off too much in our pass defense, but the reality is, pass defense doesn't win games. Obviously. We just went 6-10. Pass defense and 2 top 5 corners made almost NO impact for us.

Money should be spent on offense. The game is designed with a distinct advantage for a passing offense, and we have NONE.

Revis and Cromartie together are a luxury if you've built a stud offense from the draft, under the cap. We haven't. We are in a cap mess, and need talent. You don't get a large influx of talent in one offseason without trimming the fat from somewhere else.

Call it stupid all you want. It's logical and pretty much common sense... you just don't get it.

1. Pass rush costs more than corners.

2. The passing offense having an advantage is exactly the reason to invest in the pass defense.

3. Claiming the team was 6-10 is proof that having Revis doesn't help is stupid (logic? stupid logic maybe) seeing as we didn't have Revis all year.

4. I agree that it is a bunch of money in corners, but that doesn't mean we should move them. Look into it? Fine with me, but if you think trading the two guys that are worth their contracts is the way to improve, I disagree.

5. Money should be spent on the offense. Much more importantly IMO, picks should be spent on the offense. I believe they are spending plenty of money on the O. It's just not being spent wisely. The two QBs and Holmes are getting played plenty. They just suck.

You can call it common sense all you want, but redistributing the wealth from the D to the O is okay, but making the D go from good to sh*t so the O can go from horrendous to terrible isn't so great. They should be looking to improve everywhere and dumping Revis and/or Cro isn't necessarily the way to go. If they change coaches and the guy doesn't want to rely on CBs, fine, but if Rex is here this D works well enough to win with a modestly successful offense.

[ECURB]

The bolded makes zero sense.

Teams don't get into "cap hell" because of great players.

They get into cap hell for paying sucky players as if they're great players and then having to eat the salary when the team gets rid of them.

So Revis doesn't cause cap hell?

[Sperm Edwards]

i don't think it's a slam dunk either way on the question of trading Revis.

If you keep him, you get a HoF -possibly GOAT- CB for the next however many years at franchise QB-like money.

If you trade him, you get a couple high picks, and an extra $12-15M or so in money to use in free agency. So whether that money is used for a franchise QB, or LaRon Landry & friends, it's money they can use for talent they need.

Your last paragraph is why. It's not Revis for 2 players. It's Revis for 4 players and two of them are pro bowl quality veterans like Landry.

If we get Revis to agree to an extension for "only" $12M/year (with something majorly punitive if he holds out; one of the better things Tannenbaum negotiated), then I'd be ok with it because he's so unique. Keep in mind, though, that means his annual cap hit will be hovering at $15-16M/year when you factor in his previously-paid signing bonus money. But I'm not ok with keeping Revis and Cromartie for some $23-25M total per year on the cap and, in the process, bypassing some very high draft picks for that privilege.

My guess is that if Revis agrees to an extension it will be something like this:

$12M/year for 4 years which jumps to the $15M/year for 4 years he really wanted (adds $12M guaranteed to the total) if he makes all-pro and/or the pro bowl in 2013 coming off his injury. If he reaches that incentive, of course, that extra $12M will be amortized over the final 3 years not the original 4. So it will add an average of $4M/year to the already $3M/year from his 2010 contract. So that's $7M/year plus the $12M/year average of the amortized amount of his new signing bonus and new salary for this new extension. In my made-up scenario, which is easy to imagine, you're talking about (for 2014-2016) having Revis counting some $19M/year give or take.

I don't see how he's worth that no matter how great he is.

[HessStation]

Even if they traded Revis for a 1 and a 2, say, this year...to, errrr, The Cowboys!

9. Bakvevious Mingo OLB/DE LSU

18. Chance Warmack OG, Alabama

40. Tavon Austin WR, West Virginia

49. Tyler Eifert TE, Notre Dame

73. Stepfan Taylor RB, Stanford

104. DJ Swearinger FS, S. Carolina

135. Landry Jones QB, Oklahoma

168. Tyrann Mathieu CB LSU

199. Miguel Maysonet RB, Stony Brook

[Sperm Edwards]

Even if they traded Revis for a 1 and a 2, say, this year...to, errrr, The Cowboys!

9. Bakvevious Mingo OLB/DE LSU

18. Chance Warmack OG, Alabama

40. Tavon Austin WR, West Virginia

49. Tyler Eifert TE, Notre Dame

73. Stepfan Taylor RB, Stanford

104. DJ Swearinger FS, S. Carolina

135. Landry Jones QB, Oklahoma

168. Tyrann Mathieu CB LSU

199. Miguel Maysonet RB, Stony Brook

You're forgetting about the 2 pro bowl free agents and change that we'd then be able to afford for 2014 and beyond.

[Integrity28]

1. Pass rush costs more than corners.

2. The passing offense having an advantage is exactly the reason to invest in the pass defense.

3. Claiming the team was 6-10 is proof that having Revis doesn't help is stupid (logic? stupid logic maybe) seeing as we didn't have Revis all year.

4. I agree that it is a bunch of money in corners, but that doesn't mean we should move them. Look into it? Fine with me, but if you think trading the two guys that are worth their contracts is the way to improve, I disagree.

5. Money should be spent on the offense. Much more importantly IMO, picks should be spent on the offense. I believe they are spending plenty of money on the O. It's just not being spent wisely. The two QBs and Holmes are getting played plenty. They just suck.

You can call it common sense all you want, but redistributing the wealth from the D to the O is okay, but making the D go from good to sh*t so the O can go from horrendous to terrible isn't so great. They should be looking to improve everywhere and dumping Revis and/or Cro isn't necessarily the way to go. If they change coaches and the guy doesn't want to rely on CBs, fine, but if Rex is here this D works well enough to win with a modestly successful offense.

Playing without Revis this year PROVED that we don't need two elite CBs to be a top pass defense. It also undermines your entire argument. It also proved that an elite pass defense doesn't do sh*t.

1. Revis and Cro's salaries in their 2nd and 3rd profession contracts combined > a pass rusher or two on a rookie deal or their 2nd professional contract.

2. I never said we should disregard our pass defense, only that it should not hinge upon 2 top 5 cornerbacks and predictable blitzes by old LBers. I'm saying remove the bloated salary of Revis or Cro, in order to add necessary pieces to the LBer corps where improved pass rush will make up for whatever dropoff their is between Cro and whoever we bring in to replace him. My suggestion doesn't make our defense worse, it just distributes more talent to the rest of the team rather than having it tied up in two veterans that play the same position.

3. Claiming that the team won playoff games 2 seasons ago is also stupid. This team, the whole team, is a 6-10 team without Revis this year and how good were we with him and Cro last year? Yeah.

4 & 5. We don't have picks or money. There is a salary cap. Bad contracts on unskilled and untradeable players has us on the wrong side of the cap. In order to get more cap space and more picks, you have to trade from a strength. With Cro and Revis we aren't making a run anytime soon. With them as trade bait, we can get the much needed picks to replenish the talent we lack. On offense. On defense. And we can get ourselves back on the right side of the cap situation, so we can sustain success.

I think we can move Revis or Cro, and still maintain a very strong pass defense, we have evidence that this is true after this season... and it affords us the opportunity to address areas of need with younger, cheaper talent. This team needs to build through the draft, and it can't do that without draft picks.

Arguing that a team with NO talent and/or youth at WR, RB or QB, or LB needs two top 5 CBs is short-sighted. If Rex is the defensive genius he's supposed to be, then he should be able to maintain what he did this year with his D, without elite CBs. He should also be more focused on finding the next elite CB than paying FAs.

[SouthernJet]

I don't see how he's worth that no matter how great he is.

Sperm, do u take best offer on table after he passes physical for 2013 picks or do you wait until he proves to trade partners he is all the way back via camp/preseason/sept games? And then get hopefully better offer for 2014 picks?

[#27TheDominator]

Playing without Revis this year PROVED that we don't need two elite CBs to be a top pass defense. It also undermines your entire argument. It also proved that an elite pass defense doesn't do sh*t.

1. Revis and Cro's salaries in their 2nd and 3rd profession contracts combined > a pass rusher or two on a rookie deal or their 2nd professional contract.

2. I never said we should disregard our pass defense, only that it should not hinge upon 2 top 5 cornerbacks and predictable blitzes by old LBers. I'm saying remove the bloated salary of Revis or Cro, in order to add necessary pieces to the LBer corps where improved pass rush will make up for whatever dropoff their is between Cro and whoever we bring in to replace him. My suggestion doesn't make our defense worse, it just distributes more talent to the rest of the team rather than having it tied up in two veterans that play the same position.

3. Claiming that the team won playoff games 2 seasons ago is also stupid. This team, the whole team, is a 6-10 team without Revis this year and how good were we with him and Cro last year? Yeah.

4 & 5. We don't have picks or money. There is a salary cap. Bad contracts on unskilled and untradeable players has us on the wrong side of the cap. In order to get more cap space and more picks, you have to trade from a strength. With Cro and Revis we aren't making a run anytime soon. With them as trade bait, we can get the much needed picks to replenish the talent we lack. On offense. On defense. And we can get ourselves back on the right side of the cap situation, so we can sustain success.

I think we can move Revis or Cro, and still maintain a very strong pass defense, we have evidence that this is true after this season... and it affords us the opportunity to address areas of need with younger, cheaper talent. This team needs to build through the draft, and it can't do that without draft picks.

Arguing that a team with NO talent and/or youth at WR, RB or QB, or LB needs two top 5 CBs is short-sighted. If Rex is the defensive genius he's supposed to be, then he should be able to maintain what he did this year with his D, without elite CBs. He should also be more focused on finding the next elite CB than paying FAs.

We don't really disagree that much.

If we were starting from scratch we'd totally agree. My problem is the whole "WE MUST MOVE HIM" philosophy. We have to see what he's asking for and what we'll get for him. He is a rare talent. Getting rid of a rare talent for picks is not generally the way to go in improving. Pass rushers on rookie deals aren't necessarily worth much. Is there any position that has more busts besides QB? See what he wants and what you can get for him, but for one #1? I don't pull that trigger unless the contract is particularly bad.

[Integrity28]

We don't really disagree that much.

If we were starting from scratch we'd totally agree. My problem is the whole "WE MUST MOVE HIM" philosophy. We have to see what he's asking for and what we'll get for him. He is a rare talent. Getting rid of a rare talent for picks is not generally the way to go in improving. Pass rushers on rookie deals aren't necessarily worth much. Is there any position that has more busts besides QB? See what he wants and what you can get for him, but for one #1? I don't pull that trigger unless the contract is particularly bad.

My assumption is Revis would get us 2-4 players/picks. At least 2 of them immediate starters.

[#27TheDominator]

My assumption is Revis would get us 2-4 players/picks. At least 2 of them immediate starters.

Never assume. How many picks do we have are immediate starters? There is something else at play, which is the simple fact that the more he wants the less we get for him and the less he wants the more he is worth to us. As I've said, I am not against checking out what we can get, but I think it is way premature to start spending these alleged picks. I'd be prefer to shop Cromartie personally. I think his value is peaking, but I'm not against keeping both. I don't want to overpay anybody, but we have to see what it will cost to replace them and what we are offered.

[Bleedin Green]

Never assume. How many picks do we have are immediate starters? There is something else at play, which is the simple fact that the more he wants the less we get for him and the less he wants the more he is worth to us. As I've said, I am not against checking out what we can get, but I think it is way premature to start spending these alleged picks. I'd be prefer to shop Cromartie personally. I think his value is peaking, but I'm not against keeping both. I don't want to overpay anybody, but we have to see what it will cost to replace them and what we are offered.

All things being equal I don't think anyone would disagree with the bold. However, things are far from equal. Of the two, Revis is the one commanding far more money, is set to be a FA next year and is not eligible to have the franchise tag used on him. Cromartie is getting paid about half of what Revis is looking for, has two years left on his current deal and is still franchise tag eligible after that. That's not to say I'm against the idea of trading Cro, but it's these circumstances that make Revis the one you really are forced to make a decision on in the coming months one way or the other, while there's plenty of time to wait to make that decision with Cro.

[Integrity28]

Never assume. How many picks do we have are immediate starters? There is something else at play, which is the simple fact that the more he wants the less we get for him and the less he wants the more he is worth to us. As I've said, I am not against checking out what we can get, but I think it is way premature to start spending these alleged picks. I'd be prefer to shop Cromartie personally. I think his value is peaking, but I'm not against keeping both. I don't want to overpay anybody, but we have to see what it will cost to replace them and what we are offered.

That is why I said "players/picks". Revis should get us at least a first rounder (early enough to start), in addition to maybe a player in return via trade, and/or a player signed via free agency with the cap space free'd up by Revis's contract being moved. So 2-3 starters, at least.

Shopping Cromartie before Revis is a given. I didn't think it needed to be said, tbh.

[Integrity28]

All things being equal I don't think anyone would disagree with the bold. However, things are far from equal. Of the two, Revis is the one commanding far more money, is set to be a FA next year and is not eligible to have the franchise tag used on him. Cromartie is getting paid about half of what Revis is looking for, has two years left on his current deal and is still franchise tag eligible after that. That's not to say I'm against the idea of trading Cro, but it's these circumstances that make Revis the one you really are forced to make a decision on in the coming months one way or the other, while there's plenty of time to wait to make that decision with Cro.

Revis, traded to the right team, has Hershel Walker potential.

A team that is literally one piece away is willing to give up more. Case in point, Atlanta trading away a ton to move up for Julio Jones. Hell, the Redskins weren't even one player away, but they went all in for RG3 because he plays the one position you've GOT to have talent at to win.

Defense may still matter in a Superbowl, but it's far less important an ingredient for getting there.

If trading Revis gave someone like Tom Gamble the ammunition and cap space he needed to turn us around, and fast, then I'm 100% all for it.

[Sperm Edwards]

Sperm, do u take best offer on table after he passes physical for 2013 picks or do you wait until he proves to trade partners he is all the way back via camp/preseason/sept games? And then get hopefully better offer for 2014 picks?

I wouldn't be too worry about his long-term health prognosis.

In the end it depends on a couple of things: what is that best offer and what his demands are for 2014 and beyond. If the best offer is a single first round pick from a top-5-8 team (a single pick at #25 overall or later) it's a little harder to say. But if that's the top pick and Revis is demanding $15M/year again (or if he wants a deal that jumps to $15M/year or more if he reaches pro bowl incentives) then I would take that single first round pick, low as it sounds. But I think we can and would do better than that.

A corner, even one as great as Revis, just isn't worth $15M/year (plus the $3M every year we'd owe him for 2014-2016 from his 2010 extension bonus already paid to him). That's $18M in cap space per season to the Jets. Ridiculous. I don't even know if there are more than 2 or 3 QBs hitting their teams' caps to the tune of that average annual nut.

But to answer more simply, I think you have to wait until he's passed a physical to do anything. I can't see anyone giving up anything before that.

[#27TheDominator]

That is why I said "players/picks". Revis should get us at least a first rounder (early enough to start), in addition to maybe a player in return via trade, and/or a player signed via free agency with the cap space free'd up by Revis's contract being moved. So 2-3 starters, at least.

Shopping Cromartie before Revis is a given. I didn't think it needed to be said, tbh.

Players? Nah. Good players that are under lowball contracts are going to want new deals. These blockbuster deals are nice in theory, but in practice they don't happen and rarely work out.

Revis, traded to the right team, has Hershel Walker potential.

A team that is literally one piece away is willing to give up more. Case in point, Atlanta trading away a ton to move up for Julio Jones. Hell, the Redskins weren't even one player away, but they went all in for RG3 because he plays the one position you've GOT to have talent at to win.

Defense may still matter in a Superbowl, but it's far less important an ingredient for getting there.

If trading Revis gave someone like Tom Gamble the ammunition and cap space he needed to turn us around, and fast, then I'm 100% all for it.

This is exactly why I am arguing with you, despite our basic agreement on teambuilding. It leads to the idea that every time we don't make a trade the front office is stupid because it doesn't pull off a Herschel Walker deal. The fact is, there is no guarantee anybody else is going to make any realistic offer for Revis. They all have to pay him too. If we are going to get a Herschel Walker return for him I'm 100% for it too. I just think there is a .01% chance of that happening.

[#27TheDominator]

All things being equal I don't think anyone would disagree with the bold. However, things are far from equal. Of the two, Revis is the one commanding far more money, is set to be a FA next year and is not eligible to have the franchise tag used on him. Cromartie is getting paid about half of what Revis is looking for, has two years left on his current deal and is still franchise tag eligible after that. That's not to say I'm against the idea of trading Cro, but it's these circumstances that make Revis the one you really are forced to make a decision on in the coming months one way or the other, while there's plenty of time to wait to make that decision with Cro.

Oh sure, but my thought was that Cromartie is at a high for his value now. If we're looking to move him, I think we might get value for him. For Revis you are looking at our hand being forced. That doesn't generally lead to the kind of multiple high pick type offers you guys seem to be expecting.

[Integrity28]

This is exactly why I am arguing with you, despite our basic agreement on teambuilding. It leads to the idea that every time we don't make a trade the front office is stupid because it doesn't pull off a Herschel Walker deal. The fact is, there is no guarantee anybody else is going to make any realistic offer for Revis. They all have to pay him too. If we are going to get a Herschel Walker return for him I'm 100% for it too. I just think there is a .01% chance of that happening.

Ugh.

I don't expect a Hershel Walker style exchange where we get 987 players and picks in return. I am making the Hershel Walker reference in the spirit of "the trade that ignites an era of winning" like it did for the Cowboys.

Revis is the most valuable thing the Jets have had on their roster, possibly ever. If we were to deal him, we could in fact bring in the talent to build a more complete team and finally start doing something other than building expectations then embarrassing ourselves every other year.

[dbatesman]

#Jets GM interviews will commence on Friday.

Jeez, what's the big rush?

[Bleedin Green]

Oh sure, but my thought was that Cromartie is at a high for his value now. If we're looking to move him, I think we might get value for him. For Revis you are looking at our hand being forced. That doesn't generally lead to the kind of multiple high pick type offers you guys seem to be expecting.

That's a fair point and I think it's things like that which is why you can't make any sweeping generalizations either way without getting more information. The Jets would be wise to at least be willing to listen to offers from teams for both players to see what kind of market there is, while starting to look into what it would take to lock Revis up in a new deal. I'm not dead set on trading either or neither, but I think the team needs to go into the offseason with an open mind, especially if they don't intend to lock Revis up before the start of the 2013 season.

[#27TheDominator]

Ugh.

I don't expect a Hershel Walker style exchange where we get 987 players and picks in return. I am making the Hershel Walker reference in the spirit of "the trade that ignites an era of winning" like it did for the Cowboys.

Revis is the most valuable thing the Jets have had on their roster, possibly ever. If we were to deal him, we could in fact bring in the talent to build a more complete team and finally start doing something other than building expectations then embarrassing ourselves every other year.

Ugh is right.

He's the "most valuable thing the Jets have had on their roster, possibly ever", but he's not worth his contract. For some reason you think that his contract will be worth so much more to some other team that they will be willing to give us the talent to build a more complete team.

I know you aren't expecting a Herschel Walker deal, but some are. More importantly, you are acting like some seriously good offer is a foregone conclusion. I can't wait until we take a 3rd and 4th for him. Boy will we feel smart

[Bleedin Green]

Ugh is right.

He's the "most valuable thing the Jets have had on their roster, possibly ever", but he's not worth his contract. For some reason you think that his contract will be worth so much more to some other team that they will be willing to give us the talent to build a more complete team.

I know you aren't expecting a Herschel Walker deal, but some are. More importantly, you are acting like some seriously good offer is a foregone conclusion. I can't wait until we take a 3rd and 4th for him. Boy will we feel smart

I can't imagine that being the case and it would be absolutely asinine to do so. In that case you might as well get one more year out of him, let him walk next offseason and gladly take your 3rd round comp pick.

[Integrity28]

Ugh is right.

He's the "most valuable thing the Jets have had on their roster, possibly ever", but he's not worth his contract. For some reason you think that his contract will be worth so much more to some other team that they will be willing to give us the talent to build a more complete team.

I know you aren't expecting a Herschel Walker deal, but some are. More importantly, you are acting like some seriously good offer is a foregone conclusion. I can't wait until we take a 3rd and 4th for him. Boy will we feel smart

And you are acting like it's guaranteed we'll get fleeced.

Revis to us is what Barry Sanders was to his Lions team most of his career. One great player amidst a pile of sh*t. If we hire a GM capable of finding talent, then we should without question let Revis go play for a team that wants him now because they are already built for winning... and we should us what we get in return, players, pick and cap space, to build a more complete football team.

Literally, this team right now is 2 corners playing at an extremely high level. I don't know about you, but I'd like to see a team that can compete next year or in 2014. I see no point in passing on an opportunity to inject youth and talent, and fixing the cap situation, if a Revis trade is all it takes to get that done.

Revis will absolutely be worth his contract to a team that hasn't whiffed on all draft picks except maybe 2 in the past 3 years. We aren't that team. We are the team with no QBs, no RBs, no WRs worth keeping, no youth at LB, holes on the OL, and holes at safety.

[Integrity28]

I can't imagine that being the case and it would be absolutely asinine to do so. In that case you might as well get one more year out of him, let him walk next offseason and gladly take your 3rd round comp pick.

He's being mellowdramatic to try to make it seem like he's making a more salient point that me, because I'm advocating we trade a good player for the betterment of the whole team. God forbid.