Idzik willing to let Sanchez compete for starting job

[slats]

i agree with most of what you say but how exactly is Nick Mangold overpaid?

Having the best center in football doesn't do a whole lot more for your football team than having merely an average center. It's not a smart place to invest that heavily. When Tannenbaum was trying to fit "the big four" under contract, I think he took it as a challenge when people said he couldn't do it. In reality, he shouldn't've.

[bitonti]

Having the best center in football doesn't do a whole lot more for your football team than having merely an average center. It's not a smart place to invest that heavily. When Tannenbaum was trying to fit "the big four" under contract, I think he took it as a challenge when people said he couldn't do it. In reality, he shouldn't've.

The Jets are better off with Mangold than without him. The same is true for Revis. This stuff about the cap is bullcrap. if you don't pay your good players cause they don't play the right positions, the end result is losing good players.

[slats]

The Jets are better off with Mangold than without him. The same is true for Revis. This stuff about the cap is bullcrap. if you don't pay your good players cause they don't play the right positions, the end result is losing good players.

No, the result is having overpaid players at less consequential positions, and less money to spend on the more important ones.

[cr726]

Strongly disagree with the last. I agree with everything up to ..."Sanchez isn't the biggest problem." He's far from the only problem, but he's certainly the biggest. By far.

The WR's are awful, play call was awful and the running game was inconsistent.

[bitonti]

No, the result is having overpaid players at less consequential positions, and less money to spend on the more important ones.

the problem with your logic is that having money to spend doesn't necessarily equal talented players.

Serious question when's the last time money alone bagged a franchise QB? Manning this offseason didn't even want to entertain taking the Jets money.

it's not like the Jets can dump Revis and Mangold for Brady and JJ Watt. There's not an exchange desk like for currency.

if the Jets don't pay their good players, the stars that they drafted, they are gonna be left with no stars but some draft picks and alot of money to spend.

My concern is they will spend that money and make those draft picks and be worse off than before.

[flgreen]

The WR's are awful, play call was awful and the running game was inconsistent.

Not sure the WR's are awful.

As much of a pain in the ass as Holmes is, he is a pretty good WR. Grossly over paid, but still a good WR. Kerley is a good slot guy. Hill is the question. He was a project from the get go, and had a very disappointing season, but way to early to call him a bust. Guys got a ton of talent. There shold be quit a few good WR's in the mid rounds in the draft.

Greene is gone. Doesn't fit the WCO at all. Powell will be a better player in the WCO. McKnight? Who knows. Like WR there should be some decent RB's in the mid rounds. Key is to select the right ones for the system.

Sanchez is by far the major problem on the O

[flgreen]

the problem with your logic is that having money to spend doesn't necessarily equal talented players.

Serious question when's the last time money alone bagged a franchise QB? Manning this offseason didn't even want to entertain taking the Jets money.

it's not like the Jets can dump Revis and Mangold for Brady and JJ Watt. There's not an exchange desk like for currency.

if the Jets don't pay their good players, the stars that they drafted, they are gonna be left with no stars but some draft picks and alot of money to spend.

My concern is they will spend that money and make those draft picks and be worse off than before.

Obliviously, the key to that argument is to use those draft picks wisely. The Jets haven’t been doing that lately.

There is a new GM in town. We will see in a few years if he can.

Giving Revis QB money just to have a great player on a bad team solves nothing

If Idzik takes great players with those picks, he is a genius, and trading Revis was a great idea.

If he misses then he is a bum.

[#27TheDominator]

The WR's are awful, play call was awful and the running game was inconsistent.

I can agree with all of that and it still does not remotely change my post.

[bitonti]

Giving Revis QB money just to have a great player on a bad team solves nothing

all this talk of QB money, what QB are we talking about? Flacco wants (and is gonna get) 20 million. Brees got 21 mil.

Revis isn't gonna get franchise QB money. He's gonna get mediocre QB money like what Sanchez is paid.

[The Crusher]

WR that can actually get separation would be nice too.

If Sanchez is under center it also wouldn't hurt if he was 9 foot tall as well.

[slats]

the problem with your logic is that having money to spend doesn't necessarily equal talented players.

Serious question when's the last time money alone bagged a franchise QB? Manning this offseason didn't even want to entertain taking the Jets money.

it's not like the Jets can dump Revis and Mangold for Brady and JJ Watt. There's not an exchange desk like for currency.

if the Jets don't pay their good players, the stars that they drafted, they are gonna be left with no stars but some draft picks and alot of money to spend.

My concern is they will spend that money and make those draft picks and be worse off than before.

There's really very little logic in your attempt to find fault with my logic.

If you spend too much money on positions of lesser importance, it leaves you less money to spend on positions of greater importance. So while there may not be instant gratification when deciding not to have the highest paid center in the NFL, making that decision will free up money in the coming years to apply it at more critical spots. If Mangold had been replaced with a decent mid-round pick, maybe his salary could in turn be used to lock up a guy like Landry. The different between an average and great center has a small impact on a team, but the difference between an average and a great safety has a much greater impact - for example.

GMs need to make tough decisions. Tannenbaum sucked at the tough decisions. A franchise like the Steelers is very good at it. You have to know when to let players go, and where to allocate your cap limited resources.

[SenorGato]

The Jets are better off with Mangold than without him. The same is true for Revis. This stuff about the cap is bullcrap. if you don't pay your good players cause they don't play the right positions, the end result is losing good players.

Completely agreed with this. It's the over focus on QB, which I will admit I fall into more often than not because it makes a lot of sense, causing this nonsense.

The only player I really regret the Jets locking up is Harris. Sanchez too, but given the QB landscape in the year he can't be cut (2013) I don't even care as much about it as Im told I should.

OTOH it's pretty annoying that J. Goodwin has been the starting center for the Saints and 49ers very recently.

[SenorGato]

The Jets' problem isn't that they haven't thrown enough cap money at the QB position.

[The Crusher]

The Jets' problem isn't that they haven't thrown enough cap money at the QB position.

It's the fact they kept throwing it after they knew it was the wrong QB.

[SenorGato]

It's the fact they kept throwing it after they knew it was the wrong QB.

Yes, and taking that dummy frustration out on Revis does not necessarily make the team better in the long or short term. If this dummy franchise can pull off drafting a QB then they will have years of cheap QB play to offset Revis' crippling contract. That would be ideal.

[cr726]

If Sanchez is under center it also wouldn't hurt if he was 9 foot tall as well.

That's bs, if you have mediocre WR's who run the same play over and over that's not on the qb

[bitonti]

If you spend too much money on positions of lesser importance, it leaves you less money to spend on positions of greater importance.

free money doesn't guarantee any improvement. Good teams draft and develop their talent (or even undrafted) they don't need piles of money to sign free agents. In fact the free agents that usually pay off are the cheap ones. the teams that are making huge free agency splashes the day the market opens are never the teams in the playoffs or super bowl the next year.

we agree that the new GM has to make better decisions than the old GM.

but the free agency market is not a cure all. The Jets can free all of the cap space in the world but it won't bring a QB version of Revis, just cause they have the money to pay this fictional player. there isn't even a franchise QB in this draft.

[The Crusher]

That's bs, if you have mediocre WR's who run the same play over and over that's not on the qb

Get back to me when he hits a receiver in stride 5 times in the same game.

[cr726]

Get back to me when he hits a receiver in stride 5 times in the same game.

He did this year, try not to be a "I hate him no matter what guy".

[jbone]

He did this year, try not to be a "I hate him no matter what guy".

Perfect in stride passes to defenders don't count.

[#27TheDominator]

That's bs, if you have mediocre WR's who run the same play over and over that's not on the qb

A well designed play can be run repeatedly with success. I will admit that poor play design and mediocre WR make success dificult, but that doesn't explain many of the horrible throws that Sanchez made or his receiver selection. How many times do I have to see a wide-open player waving his arms and Sanchez throwing a pick elsewhere before I blame him? I used to defend him, but he took a big step back this year.

He did this year, try not to be a "I hate him no matter what guy".

Once? I watched him this year and it was on him. He folded up like a lawn chair. His performances in the 2nd game against the Pats and against Seattle, Arizona and Tennesse were all well beyond play calling or receiver play,

[The Crusher]

He did this year, try not to be a "I hate him no matter what guy".

I hate dieting no matter what. Im just sick of Sanchez being one of the worst QB's in the league. Feel bad for him in a way.

[flgreen]

all this talk of QB money, what QB are we talking about? Flacco wants (and is gonna get) 20 million. Brees got 21 mil.

Revis isn't gonna get franchise QB money. He's gonna get mediocre QB money like what Sanchez is paid.

LOL

Revis is reported to be asking for 16-18 million. Sanchez salary is around 8.5 this year. That’s twice what Sanchez is paid.

Sanchez surely isn’t worth 8.5 million to the team, and Revis isn’t worth 17

[SouthernJet]

He did this year, try not to be a "I hate him no matter what guy".

really? wow, I didnt see much. he is worst I have ever seen at leading a WR. this clown cant even lead a dump off pass to rb out of backfield.

and NOW, the new WCO makes it MANDATORY that a QB can lead a receiver cause YAC is so important in a WCO scheme. ask jerry rice (Mr. YAC and Roger craig)

[bitonti]

LOL

Revis is reported to be asking for 16-18 million. Sanchez salary is around 8.5 this year. That’s twice what Sanchez is paid.

Sanchez surely isn’t worth 8.5 million to the team, and Revis isn’t worth 17

what Revis is asking for and what Revis will get are two very different numbers.

[cr726]

really? wow, I didnt see much. he is worst I have ever seen at leading a WR. this clown cant even lead a dump off pass to rb out of backfield.

and NOW, the new WCO makes it MANDATORY that a QB can lead a receiver cause YAC is so important in a WCO scheme. ask jerry rice (Mr. YAC and Roger craig)

Oh you didn't see much, wow case closed. QB is the most difficult position to play and surrounding the QB with mediocre talent and changing OC's should of helped, right? Sanchez has won and is not as bad as Jet fan wants to believe.

[pedro55]

what Revis is asking for and what Revis will get are two very different numbers.

it's the NFL. Teams like the Patriots, Steeand Broncos might not pay Revis 16-18 million per year, but a team like the Raiders or Browns might.

That's the thing. Bad teams overpay players, good teams find ways to replace those players.

I mean the 49ers replaced Montana. The Colts replaced Peyton Manning. Two of the greatest QBs of all time got dumped, why the hell wouldn't Revis? Revis is not even on the same page.

[SenorGato]

They replaced those guys because they were old and close to finished, not because of money. Both happened to have new QBs locked in almost immediately.

[pedro55]

They replaced those guys because they were old and close to finished, not because of money. Both happened to have new QBs locked in almost immediately.

The Colts dumped Manning because of Money. That's it. He was coming off injury, but Luck could have sat for a year or two, Manning could have been Manning and the Colts would be super bowl contenders for another few years. Luck would have learned like Aaron Rodgers did. Except paying Manning and Luck just wasn't going to happen. So they dumped Manning. But saying it wasn't about money is ignoring the truth. And Manning might be old, but the Broncos went 13-3 with him. They'll probably wind up 13-3 with him next year and the year after and compete for a super bowl.

With or without Revis, the Jets will probably be a 7-9 team next season. And then he'll be gone to the highest bidder. What's the point in that?

[SenorGato]

The Colts dumped Manning because of Money. That's it. He was coming off injury, but Luck could have sat for a year or two, Manning could have been Manning and the Colts would be super bowl contenders for another few years. Luck would have learned like Aaron Rodgers did. Except paying Manning and Luck just wasn't going to happen. So they dumped Manning. But saying it wasn't about money is ignoring the truth. And Manning might be old, but the Broncos went 13-3 with him. They'll probably wind up 13-3 with him next year and the year after and compete for a super bowl.

With or without Revis, the Jets will probably be a 7-9 team next season. And then he'll be gone to the highest bidder. What's the point in that?

At 34...with another generational QB falling into their laps...That breakup was not money related in the least. There was never even a thought of sitting Andrew Luck for "a season or two" because there was no reason to. He was pro ready, which is why he was such a no doubter at #1. Luck was an insanely better prospect than Rodgers and pretty much anyone else who's come out in the past 10 years. You throw Rodgers (or any other QB out there just based on their college career) in the same draft with Luck and Luck goes first every single time.

With Revis the Jets have a legitimate shot at beating 7-9. Without Revis 7-9 is probably a ceiling.

[pedro55]

At 34...with another generational QB falling into their laps...That breakup was not money related in the least. There was never even a thought of sitting Andrew Luck for "a season or two" because there was no reason to. He was pro ready, which is why he was such a no doubter at #1. Luck was an insanely better prospect than Rodgers and pretty much anyone else who's come out in the past 10 years. You throw Rodgers (or any other QB out there just based on their college career) in the same draft with Luck and Luck goes first every single time.

With Revis the Jets have a legitimate shot at beating 7-9. Without Revis 7-9 is probably a ceiling.

It was money. It was a decision. If the Colts didn't have the cancer ridden coach and wound up 4-12 this season with Luck, which is what many expected, who wouldn't be second guessing them? It was an easy choice, but at the same time, Manning was the face of the franchise. He was the Colts. Who the hell has remembered anything about the Colts before Manning? Maybe going back to Baltimore and Unitas. But thats a long long time ago. It was the same up in Green Bay. The Packers dumped Favre for Rodgers. And Rodgers was an unknown.

Both cases involved QBs and old vs new. The truth is you can replace Revis like they did this year and not really become horrible. The Kyle Wilson's of the world might not be any good, but a CB is far easier to replace or find somebody good enough, compared to a star QB.

If Sanchez was an avg QB, nobody would have even cared Revis missed this season. The Jets would have wound up 9-7 or 10-6. And nobody in their right mind would say Revis is worth 16 mil per year. But Sanchez stunk, the Jets gave up, and the team finished 6-10. But it wasn't because the defense sucked. That's the thing about Revis. As great as he is, the Jets aren't that different of a team. At least with Rex Ryan as HC. The defense might be better with Revis, but at the end of the day, the offense still stinks.

Revis wants 16+ Million. In a perfect world, the jets could have Patrick Willis and Osi Umenyiora for that amount. I'd take a team with those two guys and Kyle Wilson over just having Revis.

[SenorGato]

If the Colts didn't have the cancer ridden coach and wound up 4-12 this season with Luck, which is what many expected, who wouldn't be second guessing them?

No one since it was the no doubt pick. Luck could have come out and went #1 as a junior even with Cam Newton on the board. The fact that Manning was expensive only added more convenience to ending the relationship.

Both cases involved QBs and old vs new. The truth is you can replace Revis like they did this year and not really become horrible. The Kyle Wilson's of the world might not be any good, but a CB is far easier to replace or find somebody good enough, compared to a star QB.

Like the Colts did with Manning and the Pats did with Brady in '08...Therefore QB is unimportant. See, like Revis, Manning and Brady (especially Brady at the time) were the best at what they did. Their teams still found suitable replacements readily. So using this science, QBs are easy to replace as well. Hell, the Texans kept going when the uber-important Matt Schaub went down last year and they had to play the rookie TJ Yates. The Jets were able to build a repeat AFCCG team with a [bad] rookie QB purely based on loading the roster up with talent *everywhere,* and smart teams operate in the same way.

Revis wants 16+ Million. In a perfect world, the jets could have Patrick Willis and Osi Umenyiora for that amount. I'd take a team with those two guys and Kyle Wilson over just having Revis.

The Jets can't have Patrick Willis or Osi Umenyiora. Those guys are on other teams. Willis on the open market makes a killing. If he were available and wanted to play OLB, the Jets could pay for an Osi in FA after the 2013/2014 season.

If Sanchez was an avg QB, nobody would have even cared Revis missed this season. The Jets would have wound up 9-7 or 10-6. And nobody in their right mind would say Revis is worth 16 mil per year. But Sanchez stunk, the Jets gave up, and the team finished 6-10. But it wasn't because the defense sucked. That's the thing about Revis. As great as he is, the Jets aren't that different of a team. At least with Rex Ryan as HC. The defense might be better with Revis, but at the end of the day, the offense still stinks.

1. Sanchez isn't an average QB so nobody cares.

2. Then fix the offense. That should not require giving up the best player in the franchise to do, particularly since the offense isn't devoid of talent so much as it is devoid of a competent QB. Teams are showing you don't need to dedicate all your cap room to the position to get competence there. The problem is that Mark Sanchez is bad at his job. That has nothing to do with Revis.

[pedro55]

No one since it was the no doubt pick. Luck could have come out and went #1 as a junior even with Cam Newton on the board. The fact that Manning was expensive only added more convenience to ending the relationship.

Like the Colts did with Manning and the Pats did with Brady in '08...Therefore QB is unimportant. See, like Revis, Manning and Brady (especially Brady at the time) were the best at what they did. Their teams still found suitable replacements readily. So using this science, QBs are easy to replace as well. Hell, the Texans kept going when the uber-important Matt Schaub went down last year and they had to play the rookie TJ Yates. The Jets were able to build a repeat AFCCG team with a [bad] rookie QB purely based on loading the roster up with talent *everywhere,* and smart teams operate in the same way.

The Jets can't have Patrick Willis or Osi Umenyiora. Those guys are on other teams. Willis on the open market makes a killing. If he were available and wanted to play OLB, the Jets could pay for an Osi in FA after the 2013/2014 season.

1. Sanchez isn't an average QB so nobody cares.

2. Then fix the offense. That should not require giving up the best player in the franchise to do, particularly since the offense isn't devoid of talent so much as it is devoid of a competent QB. Teams are showing you don't need to dedicate all your cap room to the position to get competence there. The problem is that Mark Sanchez is bad at his job. That has nothing to do with Revis.

Paying Revis 16 Million per year will have a lot to do with the Jets being unable to fix many problems. You can't have a team who spends close to 40 Million on 3 players (Revis, Cromarties, Harris) and expect to get better and add talent and depth.

[SenorGato]

Paying Revis 16 Million per year will have a lot to do with the Jets being unable to fix many problems. You can't have a team who spends close to 40 Million on 3 players (Revis, Cromarties, Harris) and expect to get better and add talent and depth.

Cromartie and Harris are non-issues by the end of 2014 at the latest. If you can prove to me, definitively, that the bold is 100% true then sure. I don't see enough to make me believe this is true.

Trading Revis should fall behind in priority to finding out if someone will actually give up a king's ransom for him.

Nobody has expensive depth. Revis is talent. Draft your depth by avoiding trading up or trading picks for players who will require extensions sooner rather than later.

[TechJet]

we are doom!

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