Eagles Chiefs talking about QB Foles-this figured

[faba]

INDIANAPOLIS -- Talks between the Eagles and Chiefs about Nick Foles are reportedly heating up again.

The two teams met this week at the NFL Scouting Combine to discuss a potential deal that would send the second-year quarterback to Kansas City and reunite him with Andy Reid, according to a USA Today report citing a person informed of the talks. The story also said no progress toward a deal was made.

Last week, when a USA Today report surfaced that the Chiefs would be interested in dealing for Foles, CSNPhilly.com reported from league sources that the Eagles felt strongly about the quarterback’s potential and would only be willing to deal if they were blown away by an offer.

Perhaps the Chiefs are in the process of wowing the Eagles enough to complete a deal. Kansas City has the the first-overall pick, along with the 34th and 63rd. The Chiefs also have either the first or second pick in Rounds 4, 5, 6 and 7.

It would be reasonable to assume that any trade between the Eagles and Chiefs would involve draft picks and need to be executed before the NFL draft, which starts April 21.

On Thursday, in his podium interview at the Combine, Eagles coach Chip Kelly gave his strongest endorsement yet of Foles, telling the media that he wanted to coach the second-year quarterback and calling himself  “a big fan.”

“I want to get a chance to spend time with him,” Kelly said. “I've said before, I'm a big fan of his, the way he plays the game, his toughness, his ability to throw the ball, very accurate. I want a chance to hopefully get him out on the practice field."

But he later added that he’s on board with any decision that would upgrade the roster or serve the team’s best interest.

"I don't know about [draft] picks,” Kelly said “I never heard any of that, but I think anybody that's up here as a head coach, if you would ask them, ‘Would you entertain any position on your team?’ You're always going to listen, but that doesn't mean anything."

Reid on Thursday was asked about his interest in attaining Foles, but suggested that a deal was very unlikely to take place.

"He's not available,” the former Eagles coach said. “Listen, Nick is the property of the Philadelphia Eagles, and I think they like him."

 

 

 

Tags:  Eagles, chiefs, Chip Kelly, Nick Foles, Andy Reid

 

 

 

 

E-mail Geoff Mosher at gmosher@comcastsportsnet.com.

 

[Greenseed4]

Just speculation here:

 

We trade for Nick Foles. He can run Morningwig's offense, and give Sanchez some competition. We also ask that Nnamdi Asomugha be included in the trade. Rex was high on him several years ago, and could probably return him to elite status he was once known for in Ryan's system.  It will help that Nnamdi will be playing second fiddle to Cromartie, and as bad as you might tell me he is, he is better than Kyle Wilson.  Not that Philly would care, they're probably just going to release him anyway. In addition to Foles, and Nnamdi, we ask that they also toss in their first round pick (#4 overall).  

 

In return, they get Darrelle Revis.  Clearly better than any first round CB in this year's draft, and an elite player to rebuild a dismantled secondary around.  We get a little leverage from the fact that they will likely let DRC walk in free agency, because he is "too soft" for the new DC.  Darrelle Revis isn't soft, he's amazing. 

 

They're willing to overpay for an elite CB, Nnamdi just didn't deliver. Revis will deliver. 

 

Jets win: They find a viable QB without having to spend a draft pick on one. They get a once-elite CB who has half his salary paid for by his former team, and They get the first round draft pick they wanted.  

 

Eagles win: Their off-season needs are OT, OG, and CB (in an OL deep draft).  They walk away from the first round with the league's best CB, and can still get a valuable O-lineman at the top of the second. 

 

Revis wins: He gets paid, and gets to play for a contending team. 

[Integrity28]

Why the undertone of disappointment? Is Foles really how desperate we are for he grass to always be greener?

[Integrity28]

Just speculation here:

 

We trade for Nick Foles. He can run Morningwig's offense, and give Sanchez some competition. We also ask that Nnamdi Asomugha be included in the trade. Rex was high on him several years ago, and could probably return him to elite status he was once known for in Ryan's system.  It will help that Nnamdi will be playing second fiddle to Cromartie, and as bad as you might tell me he is, he is better than Kyle Wilson.  Not that Philly would care, they're probably just going to release him anyway. In addition to Foles, and Nnamdi, we ask that they also toss in their first round pick (#4 overall).  

 

In return, they get Darrelle Revis.  Clearly better than any first round CB in this year's draft, and an elite player to rebuild a dismantled secondary around.  We get a little leverage from the fact that they will likely let DRC walk in free agency, because he is "too soft" for the new DC.  Darrelle Revis isn't soft, he's amazing. 

 

They're willing to overpay for an elite CB, Nnamdi just didn't deliver. Revis will deliver. 

 

Jets win: They find a viable QB without having to spend a draft pick on one. They get a once-elite CB who has half his salary paid for by his former team, and They get the first round draft pick they wanted.  

 

Eagles win: Their off-season needs are OT, OG, and CB (in an OL deep draft).  They walk away from the first round with the league's best CB, and can still get a valuable O-lineman at the top of the second. 

 

Revis wins: He gets paid, and gets to play for a contending team. 

No way I give up Revis fo "competition to Sanchez" and Namdi's over-rated ass.

If we trade Revis we better be good to go at QB for a decade.

[The Crusher]

Seems reasonable. 

[The Crusher]

Why the undertone of disappointment? Is Foles really how desperate we are for he grass to always be greener?

 

 

uhhh what?

[Integrity28]

uhhh what?

Original post title made it sound like Foles was someone we wanted here, was reacting to the "this figured" part. I don't see Foles as the answer.

[The Crusher]

Original post title made it sound like Foles was someone we wanted here, was reacting to the "this figured" part. I don't see Foles as the answer.

 

 

Do you think he can run the new offense better than Sanchez?

[faba]

This figured that Andy Reid in KC would takea  look at getting him- that was the point of thread title. I do not see us getting  involved in trading for him

[kelticwizard]

No way I give up Revis fo "competition to Sanchez" and Namdi's over-rated ass.

If we trade Revis we better be good to go at QB for a decade.

 

Totally agree.

 

Revis changes the entire complexion of the game.  You don't give him away for a rookie QB who didn't look that bad and a guy who used to be good a couple of years ago.

 

Reminds me of what Len Barker, a good pitcher for a perpetually futile Cleveland Indians team once said.   "The first thing this club does when they get a player who has talent", Barker stated, "is trade him for three guys who don't".

[Greenseed4]

No way I give up Revis fo "competition to Sanchez" and Namdi's over-rated ass.

If we trade Revis we better be good to go at QB for a decade.

 

The Revis trade has been debated. If we do it, we do it.

 

The idea behind my proposal is that Foles would eliminate the need to spend a draft pick on a QB meaning we could potentially use that 2-4th round pick on a skills player/defense etc. The fact that he has an understanding of Morningwig's offense just lubes up the fit, and as a second year player...who knows what he has? He had a couple impressive games last year, and could hold-the-fort until next year's much better QB-class rolls in. 

 

Nnamdi was in a horrible scheme to fit his skill-set.  (would be my argument...I really don't know).  I just know rex was high on him, and it would soften the blow of losing a strong CB.  Who knows if he could beat Kyle Wilson out for the CB2 spot; my hunch is "yes", but at the very least we add depth to our bench, and Philly loses a player they were going to release anyway. Philly helps pay for his contract ($4M gauranteed), so we get him at a discount.  His inclusion in the trade just bumps up the value of Nick Foles (a former 3rd rounder) because we were [reportedly] seeking a 1st and a 2nd.  Nnamdi just adds value to Foles' value. 

 

...and you forgot the #4 overall pick included in this deal.  If that pick is Star Lotulelei/Sharif Floyd, we could kick Que outside transforming our entire defense (i.e., 4-3= Demario Davis as Will, Harris as the Mike, McIntyre as the Sam). Then we can use the #9 on the OL. Or trade down and use thaat pick on the OL.  Two picks in the top-ten gives us more flexibility to add better quality skill players then, and later in the draft.  

[Greenseed4]

Totally agree.

 

Revis changes the entire complexion of the game.  You don't give him away for a rookie QB who didn't look that bad and a guy who used to be good a couple of years ago.

 

Reminds me of what Len Barker, a good pitcher for a perpetually futile Cleveland Indians team once said.   "The first thing this club does when they get a player who has talent", Barker stated, "is trade him for three guys who don't".

 

The pro-trade Revis argument goes like this:  Why play Revis next year, which, for all intents and purposes is a rebuild year, when he will walk the following year and give us no compensation?  (comp pick aside).   

 

Here's how I see it playing out:  Revis will play LIGHTS OUT; It's his walk year.  As a result our team does well, but not well enough to make the playoffs...Let's face it, we're filling out our roster with bargain-basement FA's.  This means our CB-of the decade playing well actually hurts us moving forward.  The next year Revis goes to New England and rubs our faces in it for the forseeable future. 

 

1. Trading him now dictates his next location, to a degree.  

2. It gives us better compensation than we'll receive next off-season. 

3. It allows us to move-on in a rebuild year, rather than postponing the inevitable. 

4. Kyle Wilson as a #2 is more realistic than having a Madden roster with two top-10 CBs, and an anemic offense. 

 

I like that quote you offered.  But, who really knows what Foles has, or what Nnamdi has left in the tank.  Given the #4 overall pick, in conjunction with our #9 gives us more opportunity to trade down.  Maybe even better opportunity being as teams might want that second best OT or whatever.  Then, having Foles means we don't need to spend another pick on a QB.  So it is potentially like trading Revis for up to 5 players. In a rebuild year.    

[Integrity28]

Do you think he can run the new offense better than Sanchez?

 

I have no idea. I know you don't trade Revis for a 2nd year question mark QB, especially not for him to "compete" wth Sanchez. If we trade Revis for a QB, he'd better be THE guy. Can't trade Revis for crap just because we are desperate.

 

This figured that Andy Reid in KC would takea  look at getting him- that was the point of thread title. I do not see us getting  involved in trading for him

 

Gotcha, I just misinterpreted the "this figured" as if you were saying "another QB the Jets won't get". My bad.

[Integrity28]

The Revis trade has been debated. If we do it, we do it.

 

The idea behind my proposal is that Foles would eliminate the need to spend a draft pick on a QB meaning we could potentially use that 2-4th round pick on a skills player/defense etc. The fact that he has an understanding of Morningwig's offense just lubes up the fit, and as a second year player...who knows what he has? He had a couple impressive games last year, and could hold-the-fort until next year's much better QB-class rolls in. 

 

Nnamdi was in a horrible scheme to fit his skill-set.  (would be my argument...I really don't know).  I just know rex was high on him, and it would soften the blow of losing a strong CB.  Who knows if he could beat Kyle Wilson out for the CB2 spot; my hunch is "yes", but at the very least we add depth to our bench, and Philly loses a player they were going to release anyway. Philly helps pay for his contract ($4M gauranteed), so we get him at a discount.  His inclusion in the trade just bumps up the value of Nick Foles (a former 3rd rounder) because we were [reportedly] seeking a 1st and a 2nd.  Nnamdi just adds value to Foles' value. 

 

...and you forgot the #4 overall pick included in this deal.  If that pick is Star Lotulelei/Sharif Floyd, we could kick Que outside transforming our entire defense (i.e., 4-3= Demario Davis as Will, Harris as the Mike, McIntyre as the Sam). Then we can use the #9 on the OL. Or trade down and use thaat pick on the OL.  Two picks in the top-ten gives us more flexibility to add better quality skill players then, and later in the draft.  

 

 

I was one of the first here to advocate trading Revis, but my expectation was that it be done with reason. I don't view this trade as reasonable, I view it as desperate for a QB. 

[Greenseed4]

I was one of the first here to advocate trading Revis, but my expectation was that it be done with reason. I don't view this trade as reasonable, I view it as desperate for a QB. 

 

Fair.  I thought unreasonable trade proposals, free agent signings, and firing decisions was the backbone of this site come this time of year.  I was just trying to fit it.

[The Crusher]

I was one of the first here to advocate trading Revis, but my expectation was that it be done with reason. I don't view this trade as reasonable, I view it as desperate for a QB. 

 

 

Dude we ARE desperate for a QB.  I doubt it happens but if it did happen this way I would be fine with it.  Nobody giving up a proven franchise QB for a DB.  Even if it's the be DB ever. 

[The Crusher]

Fair.  I thought unreasonable trade proposals, free agent signings, and firing decisions was the backbone of this site come this time of year.  I was just trying to fit it.

 

Ignore the Ape.  Crusher likes it. 

[Integrity28]

Fair.  I thought unreasonable trade proposals, free agent signings, and firing decisions was the backbone of this site come this time of year.  I was just trying to fit it.

 

LOL

 

Dude we ARE desperate for a QB.  I doubt it happens but if it did happen this way I would be fine with it.  Nobody giving up a proven franchise QB for a DB.  Even if it's the be DB ever. 

 

We can keep Revis and draft someone that's as big a question mark as Foles. I'm not saying we'll get Brees for Revis, but we should get way more than Foles. 

 

Ignore the Ape.  Crusher likes it. 

 

What a jerk face!

[jetsjetsjetss]

i dont think there is any way we can trade revis for a "starting" caliber qb. Qb position if just too important nowadays

[The Crusher]

LOL

 

 

We can keep Revis and draft someone that's as big a question mark as Foles. I'm not saying we'll get Brees for Revis, but we should get way more than Foles. 

 

 

What a jerk face!

 

 

Why are you ignoring we are also getting Nnamdi?  Plus a pick?  It will never happen but if it did it's not bad. 

[Integrity28]

Why are you ignoring we are also getting Nnamdi?  Plus a pick?  It will never happen but if it did it's not bad. 

 

I'm not. I said I think Namdi is grossly over-rated. Also, if we don't want to pay Revis then where is the logic in acquiring a CB that will want more $$$ than Revis? 

 

Nnamidi IS a guy whose stats and reputation were impacted by teams just not bothering to throw at him when he was a Raider, because teams ran ALL OVER that Raider D when he was there. Since Namdi joined Philly we've seen how good he really is. He sucks.

[Smashmouth]

Nick Foles is a QB who played in an offense that had speed, talent and an elite RB (even though misused) and he had 6 TD's 5 Ints and 5 fumbles

 

What about these numbers makes him so attractive you would want to include Revis in the deal ? This league is so caught up in the QB we constantly have deals being done that should not. Flynn, Kolb, Cassel .... Teams are just too desparate and too stupid to develop an entire offense. Im surprised teams are not offering a kings ransom for Cousins who looks to be a good player but once again an unknown. How many QB's have been traded early on and moved to SB status relatively fast ?

[The Crusher]

I'm not. I said I think Namdi is grossly over-rated. Also, if we don't want to pay Revis then where is the logic in acquiring a CB that will want more $$$ than Revis? 

 

Nnamidi IS a guy whose stats and reputation were impacted by teams just not bothering to throw at him when he was a Raider, because teams ran ALL OVER that Raider D when he was there. Since Namdi joined Philly we've seen how good he really is. He sucks.

 

 

I think it's scheme with him.  Truth is he had a bad year and he will be willing to accept a reasonable contract.  Dude is barely a top ten DB anymore.  Him and Cromartie would be nice.

[#27TheDominator]

The Revis trade has been debated. If we do it, we do it.

 

The idea behind my proposal is that Foles would eliminate the need to spend a draft pick on a QB meaning we could potentially use that 2-4th round pick on a skills player/defense etc. The fact that he has an understanding of Morningwig's offense just lubes up the fit, and as a second year player...who knows what he has? He had a couple impressive games last year, and could hold-the-fort until next year's much better QB-class rolls in. 

 

Nnamdi was in a horrible scheme to fit his skill-set.  (would be my argument...I really don't know).  I just know rex was high on him, and it would soften the blow of losing a strong CB.  Who knows if he could beat Kyle Wilson out for the CB2 spot; my hunch is "yes", but at the very least we add depth to our bench, and Philly loses a player they were going to release anyway. Philly helps pay for his contract ($4M gauranteed), so we get him at a discount.  His inclusion in the trade just bumps up the value of Nick Foles (a former 3rd rounder) because we were [reportedly] seeking a 1st and a 2nd.  Nnamdi just adds value to Foles' value. 

 

...and you forgot the #4 overall pick included in this deal.  If that pick is Star Lotulelei/Sharif Floyd, we could kick Que outside transforming our entire defense (i.e., 4-3= Demario Davis as Will, Harris as the Mike, McIntyre as the Sam). Then we can use the #9 on the OL. Or trade down and use thaat pick on the OL.  Two picks in the top-ten gives us more flexibility to add better quality skill players then, and later in the draft.  

 

I know that there are other things that I should be commenting on in here, but...

It is questionable whether David Harris could play MLB in a 4-3.  There is no reason to think that McIntyre can play OLB. 

[Greenseed4]

Nick Foles is a QB who played in an offense that had speed, talent and an elite RB (even though misused) and he had 6 TD's 5 Ints and 5 fumbles

 

What about these numbers makes him so attractive you would want to include Revis in the deal ? This league is so caught up in the QB we constantly have deals being done that should not. Flynn, Kolb, Cassel .... Teams are just too desparate and too stupid to develop an entire offense. Im surprised teams are not offering a kings ransom for Cousins who looks to be a good player but once again an unknown. How many QB's have been traded early on and moved to SB status relatively fast ?

It's less about trading for Nick Foles, and more about getting something of value for Revis.  The Jets want a 1st and a 2nd. 

 

Of the three pieces I would say that the #4 overall pick is what the Jets would be trading Revis for.  Foles and Asomugha would combine  their respective values to satisfy the 2nd round pick value we are seeking.  

 

It's a tank year.  Foles isn't the world-beating franchise saver we need, but who is?  He's not in THIS draft, and we're not buying him in free agency THIS year.  Yet we have to do something.  Why spend a pick on him (the QB) when we can add him through this trade proposal?  Why Foles?  He has ties to Morhinweg, knows his offense, and is young enough for us to develop in conjunction with next year's acquisition.  

[Greenseed4]

I know that there are other things that I should be commenting on in here, but...

It is questionable whether David Harris could play MLB in a 4-3.  There is no reason to think that McIntyre can play OLB. 

 

hahaa.  It's fun though isn't it?

 

I could've sworn Harris played MLB at Michigan.  The case for McIntyre can be made, but a suitable SLB can be drafted; this is a great year for LBers. 

[jetsjetsjetss]

Nick Foles is a QB who played in an offense that had speed, talent and an elite RB (even though misused) and he had 6 TD's 5 Ints and 5 fumbles

 

What about these numbers makes him so attractive you would want to include Revis in the deal ? This league is so caught up in the QB we constantly have deals being done that should not. Flynn, Kolb, Cassel .... Teams are just too desparate and too stupid to develop an entire offense. Im surprised teams are not offering a kings ransom for Cousins who looks to be a good player but once again an unknown. How many QB's have been traded early on and moved to SB status relatively fast ?

 

 

dude come on the eagles had one of the sh*ttiest offensive lines in the league last year who cares about the RB and speed

[Darrellegivesmeaboner#24]

I am pretty positive that the Eagles are going to keep their pick at 4 and draft an OT. The proposal in this thread is not the worst I have seen for Revis, but doesn't really satisfy the Eagles needs at this point. They need help on the O-Line or their entire season is going to crumble once again. 

[Greenseed4]

I am pretty positive that the Eagles are going to keep their pick at 4 and draft an OT. The proposal in this thread is not the worst I have seen for Revis, but doesn't really satisfy the Eagles needs at this point. They need help on the O-Line or their entire season is going to crumble once again. 

 

Their O-line went to crap because Jason Peters, Jason Kelce and Todd Herreman were lost to season ending injuries last year.   

Its a deep draft for OL.  If they aren't satisfied with three returning peeps they can get a quality player at the top of the 2nd or 3rd or 4th. 

 

 

Getting the best CB in our generation however, is something they won't find at the top of the 2nd or 3rd or 4th.  They need to address their empty secondary (provided they lose Nnamdi & DRC). Revis could be their splashy addition this off season, and ignite a fan base that was let down last year and saw it's Head Coach of 13 years leave.  

[Lizard King]

Nick Foles is a QB who played in an offense that had speed, talent and an elite RB (even though misused) and he had 6 TD's 5 Ints and 5 fumbles

What about these numbers makes him so attractive you would want to include Revis in the deal ? This league is so caught up in the QB we constantly have deals being done that should not. Flynn, Kolb, Cassel .... Teams are just too desparate and too stupid to develop an entire offense. Im surprised teams are not offering a kings ransom for Cousins who looks to be a good player but once again an unknown. How many QB's have been traded early on and moved to SB status relatively fast ?

Have you actually seen him play, or are you just going by numbers? Serious question, not being a dick. Bc personally I think the kid has some serious potential. He has a cannon arm, is mobile and sees the field.

[Smashmouth]

Have you actually seen him play, or are you just going by numbers? Serious question, not being a dick. Bc personally I think the kid has some serious potential. He has a cannon arm, is mobile and sees the field.

 

Yes I have seen him play . Let someone else give him a big contract and see how that pans out. No way in hell does Revis enter a deal unless we are talking about another elite talent around the same age or a few draft picks preferably a 1 and a 2   +

[unbanmadmike1]

Just speculation here:

 

We trade for Nick Foles. He can run Morningwig's offense, and give Sanchez some competition. We also ask that Nnamdi Asomugha be included in the trade. Rex was high on him several years ago, and could probably return him to elite status he was once known for in Ryan's system.  It will help that Nnamdi will be playing second fiddle to Cromartie, and as bad as you might tell me he is, he is better than Kyle Wilson.  Not that Philly would care, they're probably just going to release him anyway. In addition to Foles, and Nnamdi, we ask that they also toss in their first round pick (#4 overall).  

 

In return, they get Darrelle Revis.  Clearly better than any first round CB in this year's draft, and an elite player to rebuild a dismantled secondary around.  We get a little leverage from the fact that they will likely let DRC walk in free agency, because he is "too soft" for the new DC.  Darrelle Revis isn't soft, he's amazing. 

 

They're willing to overpay for an elite CB, Nnamdi just didn't deliver. Revis will deliver. 

 

Jets win: They find a viable QB without having to spend a draft pick on one. They get a once-elite CB who has half his salary paid for by his former team, and They get the first round draft pick they wanted.  

 

Eagles win: Their off-season needs are OT, OG, and CB (in an OL deep draft).  They walk away from the first round with the league's best CB, and can still get a valuable O-lineman at the top of the second. 

 

Revis wins: He gets paid, and gets to play for a contending team. 

Why do you want to tie the franchise to mediocrity again? Foles is nothing great.

[Greenseed4]

Why do you want to tie the franchise to mediocrity again? Foles is nothing great.

 

For the love of Gawd.  Read the thread.  

 

I'm not advocating that we trade for Foles.  Foles isn't the lynch-pin of this proposition.  He isn't the focus of the trade.  Foles isn't my aim.

 

Foles is the fodder that would make up for the 2nd round value we are seeking.  He would hold the fort until next season when we'll be in a better position to acquire a franchise QB (be it through the draft or free agency).  His only plus is the fact that he has a working understanding of Morhingweg's offense, and the fact that Philadelphia is entertaining the thought of moving him.  I don't even want the 1st round pick per se (though #4 overall would begin to scratch the surface of the compensation we deserve).

 

We are losing Revis.  It is going to happen.  Do you want something in return, or not?

Foles also allows us to dedicate this ENTIRE draft to the roster spots not-named-QB. That makes our team better.  If we attempt to get a competitive QB this year it will in rounds 1-4, doing that takes away the possibility of getting another player in those rounds.  It's not just Foles, its the player Foles allows us to get.   

[unbanmadmike1]

For the love of Gawd.  Read the thread.  

 

I'm not advocating that we trade for Foles.  Foles isn't the lynch-pin of this proposition.  He isn't the focus of the trade.  Foles isn't my aim.

 

Foles is the fodder that would make up for the 2nd round value we are seeking.  He would hold the fort until next season when we'll be in a better position to acquire a franchise QB (be it through the draft or free agency).  His only plus is the fact that he has a working understanding of Morhingweg's offense, and the fact that Philadelphia is entertaining the thought of moving him.  I don't even want the 1st round pick per se (though #4 overall would begin to scratch the surface of the compensation we deserve).

 

We are losing Revis.  It is going to happen.  Do you want something in return, or not?

Foles also allows us to dedicate this ENTIRE draft to the roster spots not-named-QB. That makes our team better.  If we attempt to get a competitive QB this year it will in rounds 1-4, doing that takes away the possibility of getting another player in those rounds.  It's not just Foles, its the player Foles allows us to get.   

If you trade Revis who's value is 2 first round picks, you better be getting a QB back who is better than Foles. Just get the picks. 

[Greenseed4]

A similar idea would involve Jacksonville, except they actually have the cap to accommodate Revis. They also have a need at CB.

We would get their #2 overall, and Chad Henne.   

 

The idea isn't so much the QB involved--that he'll take us to the promised land.  The idea is that we are addressing the position before the draft...this year's FA crop is pretty bad.