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Percy Harvin to the Seahawks

Integrity28

By Integrity28
in NY Jets Forum

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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.... but why would any new NFL news matter here where you guys circle jerk endlessly debating over who is spinning what?

 

 

 

ESPN's Adam Schefter confirms Seattle's trade for Percy Harvin will net the Vikings the Seahawks' first-round pick in the 2013 draft.

It's the 25th pick, and there may be more compensation. The trade is also pending a physical, but FOX Sports' Jay Glazer, ESPN's John Clayton, ESPN 1500 Twin Cities' Tom Pelissero, and Schefter have all confirmed it's a done deal. Per NFL Network's Ian Rapoport, the Seahawks will indeed be signing Harvin to a new, long-term contract. Schefter reports the new deal will be consummated within 24 hours. Harvin has been said to be seeking Calvin Johnson money. We suspect he's more likely to receive in the range of $12 million annually.

 

 

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JustInFudge

JustInFudge

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A 1st rounder? Wow.

BTW - I love how the Seahwaks are great origination now and Carrol is a great HC because they finally found a QB and finally had a winning season. And they just gave up a 1st rounder for a lockerroom headache (pun intended) and they are a bunch of geniuses out there.

lulz - this place

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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A 1st rounder? Wow.

BTW - I love how the Seahwaks are great origination now and Carrol is a great HC because they finally found a QB and finally had a winning season. And they just gave up a 1st rounder for a lockerroom headache (pun intended) and they are a bunch of geniuses out there.

lulz - this place

 

Agreed, but I actually really like what the Seahawks have done. They're an organization fighting the "QB is god" mantra which kinda sorta makes them a sister organization to Los Yets. Russell Wilson isn't anything special as a QB but he's tough, smiles alot, gives a good interview, and competent at running an NFL offense. That can go pretty far with a balanced roster that allows him to experience and overcome all kind of situations...Wow does that sound like hogwash once I left my own head. 

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The Crusher

The Crusher

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A 1st rounder? Wow.

BTW - I love how the Seahwaks are great origination now and Carrol is a great HC because they finally found a QB and finally had a winning season. And they just gave up a 1st rounder for a lockerroom headache (pun intended) and they are a bunch of geniuses out there.

lulz - this place

 

 

Franchise QB's make geniuses.   Just like 10 million dollars can make an ugly dude look sexy. 

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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A 1st rounder? Wow.

BTW - I love how the Seahwaks are great origination now and Carrol is a great HC because they finally found a QB and finally had a winning season. And they just gave up a 1st rounder for a lockerroom headache (pun intended) and they are a bunch of geniuses out there.

lulz - this place

 

 

Did anyone actually say all this? 

 

I think Harvin makes them better, but they gave up a lot to get him. Not sure, but probably on par with what Atlanta did to get Julio Jones, except Harvin is proven.

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pedro55

pedro55

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Agreed, but I actually really like what the Seahawks have done. They're an organization fighting the "QB is god" mantra which kinda sorta makes them a sister organization to Los Yets. Russell Wilson isn't anything special as a QB but he's tough, smiles alot, gives a good interview, and competent at running an NFL offense. That can go pretty far with a balanced roster that allows him to experience and overcome all kind of situations...Wow does that sound like hogwash once I left my own head. 

 

   As a rookie,  he had 26 TD passes and like 10 INTs.    Petyon Manning had 26 TD passes his rookie year.  ANd like 20+ interceptions.   

You know who else had 26 TD passes in their rookie seasons?   Nobody.   I'd say that's pretty damn special.

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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As a rookie, he had 26 TD passes and like 10 INTs. Petyon Manning had 26 TD passes his rookie year. ANd like 20+ interceptions.

You know who else had 26 TD passes in their rookie seasons? Nobody. I'd say that's pretty damn special.

Peyton Manning did that in 1998. Russel Wilson did his in 2012. Two COMPLETELY different passing environments with waaaaay more NFL rules working in Russel's favor. It's nowhere near as special as what Manning did, and beyond that coincidence there is no comparison between the two.

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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Peyton Manning did that in 1998. Russel Wilson did his in 2012. Two COMPLETELY different passing environments with waaaaay more NFL rules working in Russel's favor. It's nowhere near as special as what Manning did, and beyond that coincidence there is no comparison between the two.

 

Wilson did it after spending most of the season being held back by his coach and OC, which they admitted to. It's altogether possible he would have had better numbers... which would have been a pretty impressive rookie season even in the context of comparing 1998 to 2012, hell, even without it was a damn good season the kid put together.

 

You are just wrong, again.

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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Just further stuff on that Manning/Wilson thing:

Comparing 1998 and 2012 passing stats...teams passed 2000+(!!!) more times in 2012...despite that they dropped a full percent in INT rates and completed 4% more passes. There's the restrictions on DBs and how they can cover and hit...there's the rules against going after QBs...it's a WAY safer environment to be a passer than it was when Manning walked in.

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CrazyCarl40

CrazyCarl40

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You put Harvin in the slot with Miller at TE, Rice and Tate on the outside and Lynch and Turbin in the backfield and that team just got super scary.  Wilson could have an even better year as he got better with each week this past season.  Not only that but they should take the handcuffs off from jump this season.  His game against the Bears was unreal.

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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Wilson did it after spending most of the season being held back by his coach and OC, which they admitted to. It's altogether possible he would have had better numbers... which would have been a pretty impressive rookie season even in the context of comparing 1998 to 2012, hell, even without it was a damn good season the kid put together.

You are just wrong, again.

No one said it wasn't a damn good season dummy. Anyone with half a brain could see it was a fine season. That does not make him the equivalent to Peyton Manning in anyway, they just happen to share the same number of rookie touchdowns. You can celebrate that without being naive enough to look at the most basic numbers without any kind of context (there it is again, ignored) and equating it with what Peyton Manning did. I mean seriously, how cartoonish can you get? His coach and OC admitted to holding him back "most" of the year? Tf does that mean? That he was a 40 TD rookie but the Seahawks didn't think the league was ready for that? Give me a break...

As usual if you take the time to understand what I'm saying and appreciate the very fine differences that are out there, I come out correct.

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pedro55

pedro55

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Peyton Manning did that in 1998. Russel Wilson did his in 2012. Two COMPLETELY different passing environments with waaaaay more NFL rules working in Russel's favor. It's nowhere near as special as what Manning did, and beyond that coincidence there is no comparison between the two.

 

  And how many other rookie QBs have done that?  Ever.      

Yes, we can say Manning was on a different kind of team in a different era  And nobody is saying Wilson is close to Manning. Manning is a HOF QB.

One of the best QBs ever.   Wilson had a great rookie year. Who knows where he will go from here.  

 

 But the point is, Wilson is the only Rookie QB to have 26 TD passes besides Manning.   So as easy as it is to pass these days, I didn't see Newton, RG3, Luck, Stafford, Ryan, Bradford, etc do it.    

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Bleedin Green

Bleedin Green

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Just further stuff on that Manning/Wilson thing:

Comparing 1998 and 2012 passing stats...teams passed 2000+(!!!) more times in 2012...despite that they dropped a full percent in INT rates and completed 4% more passes. There's the restrictions on DBs and how they can cover and hit...there's the rules against going after QBs...it's a WAY safer environment to be a passer than it was when Manning walked in.

 

Forget the Manning comparison, the fact is Wilson put up some of the greatest numbers ever by ANY rookie QB in NFL history, past or present.  The only category which he didn't put up all-time type rookie numbers was passing yards, and he still passed for 3,000+ yards.  Forgetting even just rookies, he put up amongst the best numbers of any QB in the league this year.  The guy was a Pro Bowler for crying out loud.  Trying to diminish his accomplishments last season, and acting like he had nothing to do with the Seahawk's vast improvement last year and thus they in some way disproved the value of a QB to an NFL team, is flat out laughable.

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Bleedin Green

Bleedin Green

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No one said it wasn't a damn good season dummy. Anyone with half a brain could see it was a fine season. That does not make him the equivalent to Peyton Manning in anyway, they just happen to share the same number of rookie touchdowns. You can celebrate that without being naive enough to look at the most basic numbers without any kind of context (there it is again, ignored) and equating it with what Peyton Manning did. I mean seriously, how cartoonish can you get? His coach and OC admitted to holding him back "most" of the year? Tf does that mean? That he was a 40 TD rookie but the Seahawks didn't think the league was ready for that? Give me a break...

As usual if you take the time to understand what I'm saying and appreciate the very fine differences that are out there, I come out correct.

 

You've got to be kidding right?  You've got absolutely no room to be talking about anyone else being a dummy.  This whole thing was started off by this statement from you:

 

 

They're an organization fighting the "QB is god" mantra which kinda sorta makes them a sister organization to Los Yets. Russell Wilson isn't anything special as a QB

 

Desperately cling onto the Manning comparison all you want as if that somehow proves you right, but the point is your original statement has absolutely zero merit to it and him not being Peyton Manning's clone doesn't change that.

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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No one said it wasn't a damn good season dummy. Anyone with half a brain could see it was a fine season. That does not make him the equivalent to Peyton Manning in anyway, they just happen to share the same number of rookie touchdowns. You can celebrate that without being naive enough to look at the most basic numbers without any kind of context (there it is again, ignored) and equating it with what Peyton Manning did. I mean seriously, how cartoonish can you get? His coach and OC admitted to holding him back "most" of the year? Tf does that mean? That he was a 40 TD rookie but the Seahawks didn't think the league was ready for that? Give me a break...

As usual if you take the time to understand what I'm saying and appreciate the very fine differences that are out there, I come out correct.

 

 

You said he was nothing special, which insinuates he didn't have a good rookie season. The other guy gave you Manning as a point of reference to illustrate that he not only had a good rookies season, but one that compares to a HOFer. Proving your criticism short-sighted.

 

I offered the quote by the coach about holding him back to imply that the latter half of the season was a better indicator for what Wilson's capable of, it should be obvious what that means. Wilson was terrific over the back half of this season, which also proves your criticism short-sighted.

 

Edit: Rather than squirming, just shut up and own the fact that you weren't giving credit where it's due. The rest of your post is sh*t, I can appreciate that. Somewhat. 

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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Oh I forgot the one year of statistical scouting makes you special rule. Throwing as many TDs as Peyton Manning makes HIM special, not the rookie season. ****. He IS special. He's a special boy.

 

Hahaha.... the Senorgato go-to move: effeminate mock over-reactions

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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You've got to be kidding right?  You've got absolutely no room to be talking about anyone else being a dummy.  This whole thing was started off by this statement from you:

 

 

Bro, just so you know... he is allowed to curse me out, call me names, whatever he wants... it's science.

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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Hahaha.... the Senorgato go-to move: effeminate mock over-reactions

As usual, I nailed the general tone.

 

 

You said he was nothing special, which insinuates he didn't have a

good rookie season.

 

No, it doesn't. He's a fidget who did the job competently in the role of facilitator for a team that put him in a position to succeed through many different factors. They reduced his pass attempts. They rolled him out of the pocket constantly. They ran the ball more than anyone else in the league and got top 5 performance out of the OL. The defense produced the 5th most turnovers in the league while finished 1st in points allowed, 8th in 1st downs allowed, and 4th in yard allowed. All these create extremely favorable conditions for the QB. Russell Wilson put it all together, was a very competent facilitator for their offense, and produced a very statistically pleasing season. Since he's a QB he gets the most attention and everyone wants to call him special, but the far more special situation is that the still young roster allowed for a competent QB to headline a strong season for the organization.

 

The other guy gave you Manning as a point of

reference to illustrate that he not only had a good rookies season, but

one that compares to a HOFer. Proving your criticism short-sighted.

I can cop to that. Still worked in insanely more favorable conditions than Manning did for his rookie season, and Manning's rookie season is still far more impressive for the individual.

 

I offered the quote by the coach about holding him back to imply that

the latter half of the season was a better indicator for what Wilson's

capable of, it should be obvious what that means. Wilson was terrific

over the back half of this season, which also proves your criticism

short-sighted.

 

You offered no quote, you offered that the coaches said they held him back somehow. That might be true in some small fashion as his two best games were late in the year (Chicago and ATL), but he aslo opened up the year and his career with a 34 pass game. That happened only 3 more times as they supposedly let him loose.

 

 

Edit: Rather than squirming, just shut up and own the fact that you

weren't giving credit where it's due. The rest of your post is sh*t, I

can appreciate that. Somewhat.

 

OR you can not get your panties all bunched up because I didn't call Russell Wilson special based on a very good rookie season. He was very efficient and did not give away the very strong hand he was dealt for 2012. To be special requires a whole lot more.

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Integrity28

Integrity28

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As usual, I nailed the general tone.

 

 

No, it doesn't. He's a fidget who did the job competently in the role of facilitator for a team that put him in a position to succeed through many different factors. They reduced his pass attempts. They rolled him out of the pocket constantly. They ran the ball more than anyone else in the league and got top 5 performance out of the OL. The defense produced the 5th most turnovers in the league while finished 1st in points allowed, 8th in 1st downs allowed, and 4th in yard allowed. All these create extremely favorable conditions for the QB. Russell Wilson put it all together, was a very competent facilitator for their offense, and produced a very statistically pleasing season.

 

I can cop to that. Still worked in insanely more favorable conditions than Manning did for his rookie season, and Manning's rookie season is still far more impressive for the individual.

 

 

 

You offered no quote, you offered that the coaches said they held him back somehow. That might be true somehow as his two best games were late in the year (Chicago and ATL), but he aslo opened up the year and his career with a 34 pass game, something that happened only 3 more times as they supposedly let him loose.

 

 

OR you can not get your panties all bunched up because I didn't call Russell Wilson special based on a very good rookie season. He was very efficient and did not give away the very strong hand he was dealt for 2012. To be special requires a whole lot more.

 

 

^^^^

 

You used to argue that it wasn't about what coaches told players to do, it was about the players executing. You just made the case that the coaches created circumstances for Wilson to excel as a facilitator. This completely contradicts your defense of the criticisms I had for Schotty when we argued over that. By your history of logic, when a player can't execute it's the players fault, not the coach's fault, and when the player does execute, it's not a credit to the player but a credit to the coach. Sounds like you are either a.) an idiot that doesn't know he's contradicting himself, or b.) full of sh*t and trolling, or c.) all of the above.

 

All through the playoff run it was made common knowledge that the coaches said they held him back, so I don't have a direct quote, but you are being infantile ignoring the legitimacy of that widely known statement. 

 

All that said, my panties aren't in a wad... I'm not wearing any.

 

GFY if you think I'm going back and forth with you on this any further, LOL, goofball.

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SenorGato

SenorGato

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You used to argue that it wasn't about what coaches told players to do, it was about the players executing.

 

Yah, and the players executed to the the tune of the 5th most defensive turnovers, 8th in first downs allowed, 4th in points allowed, top OL play, and top RB play (5th in Y/C, 3rd in yards, and 9th in TDs).

 

You just made the case that the coaches created circumstances for Wilson to excel as a facilitator.

 

No, that's how you read it. There are two-three coach factors in there: the # of throws, # of carries, and the number of rollout passes. 

BTW: If you really want to do this sh*t with coaching setting him well up to be a facilitator....

 

The 2009 Jets had Mark Sanchez throw the ball 364 times, 40 less times than Russell Wilson did as a rookie. The defense finished 1st in yards, 1st in points, 1st in first downs, and 8th in defensive turnovers. The offense was 1st in carries, 1st in rushing yards, 3rd in rushing TDs, 5th in Y/C, the top pass D, and a top 10 run D.

 

One guy had the experience and confidence from his college years to handle what was thrown at him, the other did not. Even that can be bogged down with numbers as Wilson started almost 3 times as many college games as Sanchez did.

 

All through the playoff run it was made common knowledge that the

coaches said they held him back, so I don't have a direct quote, but you

are being infantile ignoring the legitimacy of that widely known

statement.

 

1. How the hell is some quote given by some guy pumping up his own player supposed to be widely known? Why would I be expected to know this quote?

 

2. Why would I find a coach pumping up a star rookie at a high profile position to be legitimate? Wouldn't this bear out somehow, somewhere tangibly in his numbers?

 

You were so darn close to having me within your grasp. Why did you keep talking....

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