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Stephen Hill....


Villain The Foe

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The outrage from some of you over not signing a guy who, as of week 2 into the NFL season, is not even being brought in for a workout with other teams is absolutely laughable. The man hasn't had over 200 yards receiving in a season since we cut him three years ago, get over it, he's toast. I love the guy, but his knee is shredded. 

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It probably has to do with learning all the routes and getting the right footwork. Wr is a difficult position to play, it takes years for rookie wr's to learn the position. Everyone is having way to high expectations on Hill, he was raw coming out of college, so I'd imagine it's going to take him even longer to get it down, but once he does he'll be good. People need to remember that players like Aj Green who come out of college and do extremely well their first year are rare. Hell, a lot of wr's don't even play their rookie year. If Hill wasn't raw coming out of college, we wouldn't have gotten him in the 2nd. 

 

List of WRs taken in the top-100 of the 2012 draft:

#5 Justin Blackmon

#13 Michael Floyd

#20 Kendall Wright

#30 AJ Jenkins

#33 Brian Quick

#43 Stephen Hill

#45 Alshon Jeffrey

#54 Ryan Broyles

#63 Rueben Randle

#68 DeVier Posey

#69 TJ Graham

#83 Muhammed Sanu

#92 TY Hilton

#96 Chris Givens

#100 Travis Benjamin

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List of WRs taken in the top-100 of the 2012 draft:

#5 Justin Blackmon

#13 Michael Floyd

#20 Kendall Wright

#30 AJ Jenkins

#33 Brian Quick

#43 Stephen Hill

#45 Alshon Jeffrey

#54 Ryan Broyles

#63 Rueben Randle

#68 DeVier Posey

#69 TJ Graham

#83 Muhammed Sanu

#92 TY Hilton

#96 Chris Givens

#100 Travis Benjamin

 

 

What a list of WR's....  :rl:

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Sucks major balls, and thats only IF he doesnt fumble or drop them. 

 

Such a tool. Seriously can't believe Mike Tannenbaum had this dude as a 1st round grade drafting him out of college. You cant even call this kid a bust because he was never an impressive WR, he simply had an impressive physique that this terrible ex-GM compared to Calvin Johnson. Dude is an athlete but he is not even a halfway decent WR. 

 

We could have atleast got Alshon Jeffery, who may not blow the top off of every defense in the league but he can f'ing catch a football. Whats the point of having a ultra fast WR who cant run solid routes, catch and secure the football? 

 

This WR corp is terrible, but this Stephen Hill dude can seriously be replaced by quite a few WR's currently on free agency. 

 

 

We've seen basketball players get turned into not just viable players, but star-level players in this league. I think, given that the physical gifts are there, that anything is possible.

 

There used to be a belief that it takes at least 3 years for raw receivers to grow into the NFL. If Hill is still not productive for us by the end of next year, then I see the case for him being terrible. As for right now, he's about as up-and-down as I expected him to be.

 

Guys like Larry Fitz, AJ Green and Megatron are the exception. Most teams have to develop WRs. It's all good, let him and Kerley grow up in year 2 with Geno.

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Sucks major balls, and thats only IF he doesnt fumble or drop them. 

 

Such a tool. Seriously can't believe Mike Tannenbaum had this dude as a 1st round grade drafting him out of college. You cant even call this kid a bust because he was never an impressive WR, he simply had an impressive physique that this terrible ex-GM compared to Calvin Johnson. Dude is an athlete but he is not even a halfway decent WR. 

 

We could have atleast got Alshon Jeffery, who may not blow the top off of every defense in the league but he can f'ing catch a football. Whats the point of having a ultra fast WR who cant run solid routes, catch and secure the football? 

 

This WR corp is terrible, but this Stephen Hill dude can seriously be replaced by quite a few WR's currently on free agency. 

 

The same Jeffery who was blamed for the packers loss because of his offensive PIs, the big sunday night endzone drop, the broken hand that caused him to miss a month and the guy who lets balls get into his chest and double catches a lot?? If he were our WR instead of Hll, we'd be having the same damned discussions; no one wants to wait for a 2nd round WR to develop, they all want them to be a first round top 5 pick like fitzgerald or AJ green.  These guys take time; Hill isn't great, but he's certainly making strides from year one.  If he continues to improve, you might see a few big games the end of this year and breakout next year.  It is possible to develop.

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The same Jeffery who was blamed for the packers loss because of his offensive PIs, the big sunday night endzone drop, the broken hand that caused him to miss a month and the guy who lets balls get into his chest and double catches a lot?? If he were our WR instead of Hll, we'd be having the same damned discussions; no one wants to wait for a 2nd round WR to develop, they all want them to be a first round top 5 pick like fitzgerald or AJ green.  These guys take time; Hill isn't great, but he's certainly making strides from year one.  If he continues to improve, you might see a few big games the end of this year and breakout next year.  It is possible to develop.

Nope, not the same Jeffery. 

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This is an issue with all of our receivers. They need to fight for the ball. Last night no one fought for the ball. SHill is struggling but Gates has to go first. Play Spadola!

If Kerley is back we see neither but I'd like to see Spadola get more of a shot. Gates is 100% the most useless player on the roster.
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Nope, not the same Jeffery. 

 

It's the same Jeffery, I just didn't explain it well enough; Bears fans crucified the kid for his multiple offensive pass interference penalties and other drops in that game, which they lost to the packers.  My point was, as talented as he is, if he were ours, we'd be doing the same thing to him we are to Hill.  These kids take time to develop, which they both seem to be doing, lets wait and see.

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they could run that play 1000 more times and the defender would not kick the ball out of the dude's arms like that.

 

Hill could have held it tighter but the kick fumble, really? how often does that happen in the NFL?  have to say it again, super - fluke.

 

Agreed, really poor luck.  He wasn't being lackadaisical with the ball like David Wilson, he made a play and caught some bad luck.  I did like the fact that he seemed to shake it off and continue to compete both in the run-game and make some pretty big catches.  The only negative thing that I would openly criticize him for would be to remember that he's a big f*cking kid and lower his shoulder against arrington? to get that first down.  Whether people want to see it or not, he's night and day better than last year and if he continues to improve at this pace, he will be a breakout candidate for next year, the year where most receivers click.  

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The fumble was atrocious, other than that I thought he was decent against the Pats.

 

I think he's improved blatantly from last season, at least he's constantly getting involved. If he keeps getting open he will improve. When you draft raw talent like Hill you have to be patient, the Gholston comparisons are ridiculous. He contributed nothing at any point for the team and was a top 6 pick. 

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Sucks major balls, and thats only IF he doesnt fumble or drop them. 

 

Such a tool. Seriously can't believe Mike Tannenbaum had this dude as a 1st round grade drafting him out of college. You cant even call this kid a bust because he was never an impressive WR, he simply had an impressive physique that this terrible ex-GM compared to Calvin Johnson. Dude is an athlete but he is not even a halfway decent WR. 

 

We could have atleast got Alshon Jeffery, who may not blow the top off of every defense in the league but he can f'ing catch a football. Whats the point of having a ultra fast WR who cant run solid routes, catch and secure the football? 

 

This WR corp is terrible, but this Stephen Hill dude can seriously be replaced by quite a few WR's currently on free agency. 

Tanny fell in love with guys over their 'measurables' the time in the 40, how many reps they do in bench press etc... Never bothered to see how they did in actual GAMES, because Hill hardly caught ANY passes in college and was used mostly as a blocker on the edge. How that translates to a second round pick I will NEVER know. Could have picked this guy in the fourth round or later, but just like his selection of Ducasse, Mr. T thought he was smarter that everyone else only to find that was NOT the case. He should have learned his lesson with Vernon Gholston, the ULTIMATE workout warrior who couldn't play.

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I want to see Hill benched and Gates cut. Bring in Terrell Owens he will show you 100% effort and make plays unlike Hill.

 

The same guy who would lead the league in drops and boneheaded moves almost every year? He had a slow first year and came into his own in year three and four, let's just wait past the second game for Hill.

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Tanny fell in love with guys over their 'measurables' the time in the 40, how many reps they do in bench press etc... Never bothered to see how they did in actual GAMES, because Hill hardly caught ANY passes in college and was used mostly as a blocker on the edge. How that translates to a second round pick I will NEVER know. Could have picked this guy in the fourth round or later, but just like his selection of Ducasse, Mr. T thought he was smarter that everyone else only to find that was NOT the case. He should have learned his lesson with Vernon Gholston, the ULTIMATE workout warrior who couldn't play.

Precisely my point. On top of the fact I recall Tanny grading him out to be a first round talent. HOW??? The number one responsibility of a WR is to catch the ball. Dude did very little of that in college or in the pros. I can understand seeing potential, but thats different than grading him out to be a first round type talent when his production shouldnt even had him as a 2nd rd talent. 

 

Some have gotten on me for bring up Jeffery but atleast his production in college would have made it atleast a sensible decision. Taking a guy with "measurables" but WR ability being a complete mystery will more often than not lead you down this very road. If Stephen Hill could pluck a football out of the air we'd all be prasing him right now. The kid needs to develop his catching and ball security. 

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Tanny fell in love with guys over their 'measurables' the time in the 40, how many reps they do in bench press etc... Never bothered to see how they did in actual GAMES, because Hill hardly caught ANY passes in college and was used mostly as a blocker on the edge. How that translates to a second round pick I will NEVER know. Could have picked this guy in the fourth round or later, but just like his selection of Ducasse, Mr. T thought he was smarter that everyone else only to find that was NOT the case. He should have learned his lesson with Vernon Gholston, the ULTIMATE workout warrior who couldn't play.

 

Vlad is starting to improve and really come into his own. The thing with projects is they take a while. Vernon Gholston is also a bad example because I don't even think that Vernon wants to play football. Hill and Vlad both have good attitudes and seem to like football. I honestly believe Hill and Ducasse are going to make leaps. Hill's going to become a really good receiver in the future, and probably is going to become are #1, you guy's can quote me on that because the kid's an athletic freak whose got a good head on his shoulders. Give him some time and be patient.

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I feel like hill will eventually develop into a decent wr, but right now he's afraid of contact. I've noticed he closes his eyes when he goes up for the ball and a defender is near.

 

 

Say what???  Hill is dead from the neck up.  Can't run routes.  Can't concentrate on a bowl of Cocoa Puffs.  He is an effin' idiot.  Go back to his rookie year and watch his interviews.  He is too phucking stupid to work for UPS. He is what he is -- a steaming pile of crap and a wasted draft pick. 

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I can't make any judgements about any players from this game. No one including Brady had a good game, it was one of those jinxed, doomed to failure games that happen a couple times a season to someone.

 

Even Edeleman who had 13 catches but only averaged 5 yds per wasn't very good and he blew some shots that shouldn't have been dropped or misplayed. It happens, so for me I write this entire game off and won't make any udgements of players till the next couple of games. And yeah this means Geno also. Just a freak kinda game, forget about it and move on.

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When they chose Hill they were hoping for the next Al Toon but instead got Mike Williams or Charles Rogers.

 

Meh, at least I heard of those guys when they were playing in college. When they drafted Hill I couldn't believe how pitiful his stats were in college, they were also saying he's still learning the position. 

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Cut Gates and bring gack Zach Rogers. Keep the youth movement going. If we need Braylon to teach Hill how to catch then why is Sanjay Lal getting paid. Get a new WR coach. Roll will Kerley, Hill, Spadola, Rogers and Holmes(who actually looked decent against the Pats). Keep Obamanu if you want a little depth. I am done with signing guys who are over the hill.

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I still have a lot of hope for Hill. He came into the league as a project -everyone knew this going in- and in his second year in the NFL, he's on his second OC and second QB. His first coordinator and QB were sh*t, and his new QB isn't exactly setting the world on fire. The kid is physically gifted, and has a great attitude (a rarity at his position). This is exactly the type of player I hope to see progress in a rebuilding year.

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  • 3 weeks later...

Alshon Jeffery Vs. Saints: 10 catches 218 yards 1TD

Alshon Jeffery Vs. Lions: 5 catches 107 yards 1TD, 1 run for 27 yards.

 

 

His last two games he's put up 325 yards, 2 TD's on 15 catches and avg 21.5 yards a catch . Im still pissed that we didnt draft this dude.

 

Alshon Jeffery was considered to be a lock as a top 5 pick heading into his last season at South Carolina, but he came in out of shape, had a bad season, and his draft stock plummeted, he did a lot of work just to get drafted in the 2nd round in the offseason, and because he went from a top 1st rounder to a mid to late 2nd rounder it cost him millions, and I am assuming he has worked much harder the last 2 years to make sure that 2nd contract get him his millions!

 

Lets not forget Jeffrey plays with a competent QB, with a top 3 WR playing opposite of him, it's a hell of a lot easier to get those kind of numbers in that situation compared to the situation Stephen Hill has been thrown into.  You won't be able to compare the 2 until Hill gets a chance to play with a competent QB, and offense, he has shown promising signs, but still is very raw, and his physical ability IMO is much better than Jeffrey's cieling wise, he just needs some time to get coached up, and a QB who isn't as bad as Sanchez, and the rookie version of G Smith.

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Alshon Jeffery was considered to be a lock as a top 5 pick heading into his last season at South Carolina, but he came in out of shape, had a bad season, and his draft stock plummeted, he did a lot of work just to get drafted in the 2nd round in the offseason, and because he went from a top 1st rounder to a mid to late 2nd rounder it cost him millions, and I am assuming he has worked much harder the last 2 years to make sure that 2nd contract get him his millions!

 

Lets not forget Jeffrey plays with a competent QB, with a top 3 WR playing opposite of him, it's a hell of a lot easier to get those kind of numbers in that situation compared to the situation Stephen Hill has been thrown into.  You won't be able to compare the 2 until Hill gets a chance to play with a competent QB, and offense, he has shown promising signs, but still is very raw, and his physical ability IMO is much better than Jeffrey's cieling wise, he just needs some time to get coached up, and a QB who isn't as bad as Sanchez, and the rookie version of G Smith.

Im not trying to hear all that in regards to physical ability or ceiling. The most important physical ability of a wide receiver has to do with their hands. Alshon Jeffery had arguably the best hands in the draft and put up numbers in college. He got out of shape yet still produced. Hill caught less than 40 passes his entire college career. Playing with a competent QB can sometimes be hard to recognize when the WR cant catch the ball consistently. Im not saying that Hill is terrible, he's had his moments, but Alshon is looking quite beastly on the field. People talked about him being slow yet he continues to create separation between him and the defender. He can jump up and flick the ball out of the air and more importantly his hands are consistent.

 

Consistency I'll take over a ceiling anyday. Why? Because you actually know what you have. What you "could have" only tells you what you "dont have".

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Im not trying to hear all that in regards to physical ability or ceiling. The most important physical ability of a wide receiver has to do with their hands. Alshon Jeffery had arguably the best hands in the draft and put up numbers in college. He got out of shape yet still produced. Hill caught less than 40 passes his entire college career. Playing with a competent QB can sometimes be hard to recognize when the WR cant catch the ball consistently. Im not saying that Hill is terrible, he's had his moments, but Alshon is looking quite beastly on the field. People talked about him being slow yet he continues to create separation between him and the defender. He can jump up and flick the ball out of the air and more importantly his hands are consistent.

 

Consistency I'll take over a ceiling anyday. Why? Because you actually know what you have. What you "could have" only tells you what you "dont have".

 

Your failing to address the most important point I have made, Jeffrey is not being game planned for, and has another WR on the other side who gets doubled, and sometimes triple teamed leaving Jeffrey in 1 on 1 coverage with the 2nd CB, mean while the last time S HIll played he caught 3 passes for 110 yards, and a TD in the 1st half, and then the opposing team changed up coverage to double team Hill, and take him away, and the other WR went on to catch 5 balls for 150+ yards, and a game winning 69 yard TD pass in single coverage because yup Hill demanded a double team on the other side of the field.  Last week Smith laid Hill out to dry, and got him concussed on the 2nd play of the game.

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