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Nice to see you Drunk Kid Tyler.And you're probably right, but my overarching point stands. Sam isn't good enough (yet), flexable enough (at all) or with enough potential to warrant nearly this much attention.

like wise, no idea if Sam can cut it in the NFL, you've made sound reasons why he probably won't, but something that I feel keeps getting overlooked, the Rams are pretty stacked up front, it always seemed unlikely he'd make that team. Cowboys on the other hand, they are terrible on defense. Not surprised Sam landed there.
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Sam is being treated like he's an injury or attitude risk--teams are weighing his level of talent vs the level of potential aggravation (vis a vis media attention) that comes along with signing him. You hate to see it, but I'm not sure that, as a GM, I'd be in a rush to invite that onto my organization unless I was pretty sure he'd develop into a fairly significant contributor for my team. If he goes to Dallas and gets ten sacks this year, it's a great story. But if he struggles and is out of the league next year, I don't know that it'll be because the league hates gays, per se. It'll be because teams like to control how their team is covered and having players with baggage who aren't stars is exceedingly inconvenient.

 

If you changed the name from Sam to Tebow and changed the issue from gay to zealously Christian then the point is pretty much the same.

 

The size of your personality can't outstretch your performance on the field.

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Yes, it must suck to be drafted, then given a second chance.

Not right now he isn't. He's a college-level talent tweener who offers no flexabillity as a third stringer on the D-line as he only plays rush DE, can't play NFL LB, and doesn't play Specials. His stats were almost all against the Future Meat Cutters Union of the NFL (i.e. 3rd and 4th string guys also now cut).

That fame is the only reason he was drafted.

The same NFL that gave Tebow, Vick, Ray Lewis, a drunk driving hit-and-running WR and a wife beating Raven second (or more) chances?

Please. NFL teams will deal with any distraction.....if you're worth it on the field.

Sams isn't.

Yes, the only reason this guy gets the attention he does is because he is a homosexual. Which is fine, but being homosexual isn't a reason to keep a guy on an NFL roster.

He either needs to be a MUCH better pass rush DE, bulk up massively so he can play DE & DT, or play the ever living **** out of specials a la a former Bill we might mention.

Otherwise he's just another guy too small and slow to play in the pros who was really good in the minors.

Sports is full of these guys, most never get their name mentioned, because most aren't homosexual and milking it for all it's worth to get chances his talent doesn't neccessarily warrant.

It was hi-larious listening to political radio try and talk football today on Sams, and try (without knowing anything about football) to make a case for why the only reason Sams was cut was "homophobia". /shrug.

I think your comments about the distraction are mostly correct, but he also was the SEC co-defensive player of the year- so I think the truth is somewhere in the middle of talent and baggage as to why he was cut.

St Louis was never the right place for him... He wasn't drafted until then strictly because of his orientation. His value in round 7 should have been off the charts, but teams wanted to see how he would do in the locker room.

I always said he'd be a better fit in a Dallas, but they weren't ready to give him that chance 5 months ago. Now they are? That's clearly them dodging controversy at draft time.

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Yes, it must suck to be drafted, then given a second chance.

 

Not right now he isn't. He's a college-level talent tweener who offers no flexabillity as a third stringer on the D-line as he only plays rush DE, can't play NFL LB, and doesn't play Specials. His stats were almost all against the Future Meat Cutters Union of the NFL (i.e. 3rd and 4th string guys also now cut).

 

That fame is the only reason he was drafted.

 

The same NFL that gave Tebow, Vick, Ray Lewis, a drunk driving hit-and-running WR and a wife beating Raven second (or more) chances?

Please. NFL teams will deal with any distraction.....if you're worth it on the field.

Sams isn't.

 

Yes, the only reason this guy gets the attention he does is because he is a homosexual. Which is fine, but being homosexual isn't a reason to keep a guy on an NFL roster.

He either needs to be a MUCH better pass rush DE, bulk up massively so he can play DE & DT, or play the ever living **** out of specials a la a former Bill we might mention.

Otherwise he's just another guy too small and slow to play in the pros who was really good in the minors.

Sports is full of these guys, most never get their name mentioned, because most aren't homosexual and milking it for all it's worth to get chances his talent doesn't neccessarily warrant.

It was hi-larious listening to political radio try and talk football today on Sams, and try (without knowing anything about football) to make a case for why the only reason Sams was cut was "homophobia". /shrug.

 

You completely missed my point.  Of course it doesn't suck to get drafted and given a second chance, it sucks that he has done enough on the field to warrant more interest than what's being shown but because the media wants to tell us about his showering habits, teams are reluctant to give him a shot.  The media loves the story, but they don't care that they're killing his chances.  That's what sucks.

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I think your comments about the distraction are mostly correct, but he also was the SEC co-defensive player of the year- so I think the truth is somewhere in the middle of talent and baggage as to why he was cut.

I don't.

A lot of college players who have no chance to succeed in the NFL still manage to win prestigious awards for their play in the minors (college).

Tim Tebow may be the best college-level QB who ever lived, he's a nothing at the pro level, AND was a massive distraction to boot. He got his chances, he failed.

How many other Heisman winners or runners up never amounted to anything in the Pros? Quite a few.

I'm sure he was a great minor leaguer, the Crash Davis of college. In the Pros he is a tweener, too small, too slow, too inflexible, and unproductive on specials.

St Louis was never the right place for him... He wasn't drafted until then strictly because of his orientation. His value in round 7 should have been off the charts, but teams wanted to see how he would do in the locker room.

Again, disagree. The only he GOT drafted was his orientation, same reason anyone cares about him now.

He is strait, he goes undrafted, gets cut and no one cares and no one talks about him. Like hundreds of other great college players do when they fail at the pros every year.

I always said he'd be a better fit in a Dallas, but they weren't ready to give him that chance 5 months ago. Now they are? That's clearly them dodging controversy at draft time.

Or it could be they suck on the D-line (and they do), liked what they saw in Preseason (which they might have) or the Jerruh simply wants some good press and media attention (which he always does, especially after his recent media issues).

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You completely missed my point.  Of course it doesn't suck to get drafted and given a second chance, it sucks that he has done enough on the field to warrant more interest than what's being shown but because the media wants to tell us about his showering habits, teams are reluctant to give him a shot.  The media loves the story, but they don't care that they're killing his chances.  That's what sucks.

 

Has he done enough?

 

While I agree the media is far more detrimental to his pursuit of an NFL career than what he has done on the field, he did get good stats against 3rd and 4th stringers. Probably most of which are not on an active roster.

 

I believe NFL GMs would sign him if he had the talent. TO was tolerated until he was average and then he was gone. Same with Chad Johnson.

 

Fisher a defensive guy drafted him.  Had him in camp all pre-season.  Cut him and did not sign him to PS.  He is probably not that good.

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We all know Sam is not a great player, but he is also not some slouch. He was a very good college player and played well enough in the pre-season to legitimize the signing. 

 

And while Jerry may have signed Sam for the publicity, how many teams avoided him because of the bad publicity? In the end, i think he deserves a Practice Squad spot on a team with DL issues. 

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Has he done enough?

 

While I agree the media is far more detrimental to his pursuit of an NFL career than what he has done on the field, he did get good stats against 3rd and 4th stringers. Probably most of which are not on an active roster.

 

I believe NFL GMs would sign him if he had the talent. TO was tolerated until he was average and then he was gone. Same with Chad Johnson.

 

Fisher a defensive guy drafted him.  Had him in camp all pre-season.  Cut him and did not sign him to PS.  He is probably not that good.

 

While I completely understand that argument, I also don't hold it against a guy.  No player has any control over when they get in the game.  All he can do is try to perform in the situations he was put in, and Michael Sam did just that.  Even though these are guys that will be out of the league fairly soon, it's still the highest level of competition Sam has faced.  If these guys are on the field in an NFL pre-season game, they're still better than 99% of the players in college football.  So to me, it's a level somewhere between college and the "real" NFL.  Sam performed well at the first two levels, and if not for the media frenzy, I think he would have been picked up immediately.  I'm not saying how good of a player he'll be, but if I had to guess I'd say he'd be a productive starter.  Not a pro-bowler, but also not a guy who doesn't belong in the league.  If Dallas cuts him loose as badly as they're hurting on defense, then it may be true that he lacks the skills to play in the NFL.  We shall see.

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Cowboy$ will $ell Michael $am practice $quad jer$ey$

Posted by Darin Gantt on September 3, 2014, 4:15 PM EDT
c8ce235661e6faf1ec44eb587e5d6389-e140977AP

Earlier today, Cowboys coach Jason Garrett said with a straight face that the addition of Michael Sam to the practice squad was only “about football.”

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

The Cowboys are already tapping into the marketing potential of the first ever openly gay player to be drafted into the NFL.

According to Clarence Hill of the Fort Worth Star-Telegram, the Cowboys will sell Sam jerseys at the team’s pro shop.

They don’t ordinarily sell jerseys of practice squad players since, you know, those guys never play in games.

But Sam presents a unique sales opportunity for a team that loves the “glitz and glamour,” and they’ll probably sell enough of them to make up the $6,300 a week he’ll make on the practice squad.

And then if he ever makes the 53-man roster, they can sell another one when he has to change numbers.

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We all know Sam is not a great player, but he is also not some slouch. He was a very good college player and played well enough in the pre-season to legitimize the signing. 

 

And while Jerry may have signed Sam for the publicity, how many teams avoided him because of the bad publicity? In the end, i think he deserves a Practice Squad spot on a team with DL issues.

I'm still at a loss as to what "bad publicity" you think exists here, in 2014 in the U.S.

For the league, it's a huge win, look how inclusive and tolerant we are!

For the team, it's a huge win, look at our Gay Player, now all you gay non-fans go buy his Jersey (which they did, and would).

For ESPN/Sports Media it's great, they get their civil rights moment they weren't around for for black baseball players.

This isn't 1964. A few religious folks might whine a bit, but the vast majority of fans and non-fans alike will go "oh? Yeah, and?" about a gay football player.

Literally everyone involved wants Sams to make it.

That he didn't (yet) says all that needs said about Sams play vs. his competition.

He may work out in Dallas, who knows, Chrebet was similarly a non-NFL talent and look how well he worked out (same for Woodhead tbqh).

I think the "homophobia cause" is VASTLY overstated as a cause for Sams cutting or issues getting signed.

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I'm still at a loss as to what "bad publicity" you think exists here, in 2014 in the U.S.

For the league, it's a huge win, look how inclusive and tolerant we are!

For the team, it's a huge win, look at our Gay Player, now all you gay non-fans go buy his Jersey (which they did, and would).

For ESPN/Sports Media it's great, they get their civil rights moment they weren't around for for black baseball players.

This isn't 1964. A few religious folks might whine a bit, but the vast majority of fans and non-fans alike will go "oh? Yeah, and?" about a gay football player.

Literally everyone involved wants Sams to make it.

That he didn't (yet) says all that needs said about Sams play vs. his competition.

He may work out in Dallas, who knows, Chrebet was similarly a non-NFL talent and look how well he worked out (same for Woodhead tbqh).

I think the "homophobia cause" is VASTLY overstated as a cause for Sams cutting or issues getting signed.

 

I misspoke. I didn't mean bad publicity, i was referring to media distractions and  locker room distractions. 

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http://thebiglead.com/2014/02/10/michael-sam-only-one-other-sec-defensive-player-of-the-year-has-been-drafted-outside-the-first-two-rounds/

This article covers some of it (award winners drafted low or going undrafted).

It's interesting reading the list of others who went low/UDFA, and how we don't know them because they too became JAGs and cuts.

College Awards =/= NFL Success.

Doesn't mean Sam won't ever prove himself, only that so far he has yet to do so enough to earn a job.

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While I completely understand that argument, I also don't hold it against a guy.  No player has any control over when they get in the game.  All he can do is try to perform in the situations he was put in, and Michael Sam did just that.  Even though these are guys that will be out of the league fairly soon, it's still the highest level of competition Sam has faced.  If these guys are on the field in an NFL pre-season game, they're still better than 99% of the players in college football.  So to me, it's a level somewhere between college and the "real" NFL.  Sam performed well at the first two levels, and if not for the media frenzy, I think he would have been picked up immediately.  I'm not saying how good of a player he'll be, but if I had to guess I'd say he'd be a productive starter.  Not a pro-bowler, but also not a guy who doesn't belong in the league.  If Dallas cuts him loose as badly as they're hurting on defense, then it may be true that he lacks the skills to play in the NFL.  We shall see.

 

I do not disagree.

 

I am saying you take his pre-season prodcution with a grain of salt.

 

Ryan Mallett looked NFL ready in his first pre-season. He looked terrible-to-average in the next three. Zach Sudfiled looked great last year. The Patriots got rid of him.

 

It is an accomplishment to be good enough to earn a D1 athletic accomplishment. It is an accomplishment to be a good college player who earns SEC Defensive Player of year. It is an accomplishment to be drafted.

 

Jeff Fisher has seen him for the better part of the last 3-4 months and did not see enough potential to use a practive squad slot on him. He might be like the other 1000s of college footbal players that are good for the college level, but their lack of ability catches up to them when it comes to making the NFL.

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I do not disagree.

 

I am saying you take his pre-season prodcution with a grain of salt.

 

Ryan Mallett looked NFL ready in his first pre-season. He looked terrible-to-average in the next three. Zach Sudfiled looked great last year. The Patriots got rid of him.

 

It is an accomplishment to be good enough to earn a D1 athletic accomplishment. It is an accomplishment to be a good college player who earns SEC Defensive Player of year. It is an accomplishment to be drafted.

 

Jeff Fisher has seen him for the better part of the last 3-4 months and did not see enough potential to use a practive squad slot on him. He might be like the other 1000s of college footbal players that are good for the college level, but their lack of ability catches up to them when it comes to making the NFL.

 

Totally understand your point, but he was dumped by the Rams...a team that has arguably the best front-7 in the NFL.  I can see how they didn't need Sam, but I just think it's odd that Sam wasn't signed to somebodys PS immediately.  IMO, he had done enough to at least generate that much interest.  Glad he got a shot with the Cowboys, and they're desperate on defense, so if he can't work his way onto their 53, then it must  may be that he's not good enough.  I'm just glad somebody gave him a shot and ignored what will surely be a media onslaught.

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Jackson Jeffcoat this year

 

http://thebiglead.com/2014/02/10/michael-sam-only-one-other-sec-defensive-player-of-the-year-has-been-drafted-outside-the-first-two-rounds/

This article covers some of it (award winners drafted low or going undrafted).

It's interesting reading the list of others who went low/UDFA, and how we don't know them because they too became JAGs and cuts.

College Awards =/= NFL Success.

Doesn't mean Sam won't ever prove himself, only that so far he has yet to do so enough to earn a job.

 

Okay, it's not unknown to be Defensive Player of the Year in a major conference and not get drafted, but it is still unusual.  He had 3 sacks in preseason.  There are several clubs who could use a situational pass rusher.  The Rams are just loaded at Defensive Line.

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Totally understand your point, but he was dumped by the Rams...a team that has arguably the best front-7 in the NFL.  I can see how they didn't need Sam, but I just think it's odd that Sam wasn't signed to somebodys PS immediately.  IMO, he had done enough to at least generate that much interest.  Glad he got a shot with the Cowboys, and they're desperate on defense, so if he can't work his way onto their 53, then it must  may be that he's not good enough.  I'm just glad somebody gave him a shot and ignored what will surely be a media onslaught.

 

And that is my point about Fisher.  It was a slim shot he would make the team for the reasons given. 

 

Why wouldn't Fisher sign him to the practice squad?  He was in their system for 3-4 months.  If an injury were to happen, he would be an already trained replacement.

 

I do not think their were any great conspiracies to keepo him out.      

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And that is my point about Fisher.  It was a slim shot he would make the team for the reasons given. 

 

Why wouldn't Fisher sign him to the practice squad?  He was in their system for 3-4 months.  If an injury were to happen, he would be an already trained replacement.

 

I do not think their were any great conspiracies to keep him out.      

 

Fisher could have put him on the PS, but it does come down to need sometimes.  I heard an analyst on the radio yesterday (Sa Pal maybe) Saying that the Rams are nine deep at any position they could have played Sam in.  Even as a PS guy he'd never have a real shot at making the roster unless they were decimated by injuries.

 

Having seen a lot of players do less than him in college and pre-season but still make a roster is the only thing that made we wonder.  An o-lineman from Buff or SF tweeted the other day, prior to the signing, that the reason he wasn't on a team was because of ESPN, citing the onslaught of coverage and distractions it would bring.  

 

Like I said,  I'm just glad he got a shot...now we find out if he can play or not, rather than having to listen to the media blather on about the league being homophobic.

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Fisher could have put him on the PS, but it does come down to need sometimes.  I heard an analyst on the radio yesterday (Sa Pal maybe) Saying that the Rams are nine deep at any position they could have played Sam in.  Even as a PS guy he'd never have a real shot at making the roster unless they were decimated by injuries.

 

Having seen a lot of players do less than him in college and pre-season but still make a roster is the only thing that made we wonder.  An o-lineman from Buff or SF tweeted the other day, prior to the signing, that the reason he wasn't on a team was because of ESPN, citing the onslaught of coverage and distractions it would bring.  

 

Like I said,  I'm just glad he got a shot...now we find out if he can play or not, rather than having to listen to the media blather on about the league being homophobic.

 

The messed up part is that I think this is a much bigger distraction for the media than it is for any football team. 

 

The shower story was unnecessary and pointless. One player said he hadn't noticed because he wasn't tracking Sam's shower habits, which was a funny response. The one player who went on record as saying that Sam wasn't showering with the rest of the team said it could have been for a variety of reasons like he was getting extra reps, meeting with coaches, extra time in the weight room. Based on that alone, it wasn't remotely newsworthy. But ESPN felt the need to do what they do and create a story where one didn't exist. 

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Fisher could have put him on the PS, but it does come down to need sometimes.  I heard an analyst on the radio yesterday (Sa Pal maybe) Saying that the Rams are nine deep at any position they could have played Sam in.  Even as a PS guy he'd never have a real shot at making the roster unless they were decimated by injuries.

 

Having seen a lot of players do less than him in college and pre-season but still make a roster is the only thing that made we wonder.  An o-lineman from Buff or SF tweeted the other day, prior to the signing, that the reason he wasn't on a team was because of ESPN, citing the onslaught of coverage and distractions it would bring.  

 

Like I said,  I'm just glad he got a shot...now we find out if he can play or not, rather than having to listen to the media blather on about the league being homophobic.

 

Which I think gets back to the points that many have made since December, he is not that athletic.  He is a high effort guy, but he is slow, small and couples that by not playing special teams.

 

It is similar to Teebow.  He could be in the NFL, but he wants to QB.  Why doesn't this guy play special teams?

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Has he done enough?

 

While I agree the media is far more detrimental to his pursuit of an NFL career than what he has done on the field, he did get good stats against 3rd and 4th stringers. Probably most of which are not on an active roster.

 

I believe NFL GMs would sign him if he had the talent. TO was tolerated until he was average and then he was gone. Same with Chad Johnson.

 

Fisher a defensive guy drafted him.  Had him in camp all pre-season.  Cut him and did not sign him to PS.  He is probably not that good.

 

Probably because he is limited in what he can do, which is basically rush the passer.

 

If he hadn't come out as being gay I wonder where he would have gone in the draft being that he was the SEC Defensive player of the year. I highly doubt it would have been 7th.

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Probably because he is limited in what he can do, which is basically rush the passer.

 

If he hadn't come out as being gay I wonder where he would have gone in the draft being that he was the SEC Defensive player of the year. I highly doubt it would have been 7th.

 

Sadly, it probably did not help.

 

It is not liked he graded out like Jadaveon.

 

I think most 'experts' pegged him for maybe a 4th or 5th to 6th round pick.

 

If he had not come out and was cut would it be leading ESPN?  No.

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.If he had not come out and was cut would it be leading ESPN?  No.

 

I don't see the fault of the media in this.  The past several decades have been full of firsts for various groups, from the first black students at all white schools to the first woman to have a beer at McSorley's.  Here you have another first of some significance, the media is there and paying attention to the question about whether he's getting equal treatment.  I don't blame the media here at all.

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I don't see the fault of the media in this.  The past several decades have been full of firsts for various groups, from the first black students at all white schools to the first woman to have a beer at McSorley's.  Here you have another first of some significance, the media is there and paying attention to the question about whether he's getting equal treatment.  I don't blame the media here at all.

 

Really?

 

I think you are giving the media way too much credit.  They are reporting his shower habits.

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I don't see the fault of the media in this.  The past several decades have been full of firsts for various groups, from the first black students at all white schools to the first woman to have a beer at McSorley's.  Here you have another first of some significance, the media is there and paying attention to the question about whether he's getting equal treatment.  I don't blame the media here at all.

Have you noticed a common thread among all these "firsts" reported by the media? I have. It's called "Regular People Don't Give A Rat's Ass". 

 

I don't want to get into politics, but it is what it is. Divide and Conquer is the Progs' mantra. "You're not an American. You're a gay, half Inuit, diabetic, ambidextrous American." This sh*t needs to end immediately.  

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