It's been almost 20 years

[Lizard King]

Since we hired a veteran football executive in the front office. Bill Parcells in 1997 was the last time that we weren't throwing the future into the hands of a rookie who was learning on the job how to handle his role. Since then, we have had rookies in both major capacities- general manager and head coach.

The late Leon Hess, with plenty of faults of his own, finally knew it was time to pay to play. Woody Johnson has never once spent the necessary money to bring in a true established professional - not once. Why?

[T0mShane]

Since we hired a veteran football executive in the front office. Bill Parcells in 1997 was the last time that we weren't throwing the future into the hands of a rookie who was learning on the job how to handle his role. Since then, we have had rookies in both major capacities- general manager and head coach.

The late Leon Hess, with plenty of faults of his own, finally knew it was time to pay to play. Woody Johnson has never once spent the necessary money to bring in a true established professional - not once. Why?

Because Woody Johnson believes he is that established professional.

[Integrity28]

Failing sports franchises in big markets can print money from the souls of their miserable fans.

[JustInFudge]

Charlie. Casserly.

[Integrity28]

Charlie. Casserly.

 

I was thinking a guy like Casserly or Polian to fill some sort of Director of Football Operations role for us... we need a football guy to shield the team from Woody, and to guide decisions from a football-centric set of priorities. Enough of this MBA bullsh*t.

[JustInFudge]

I was thinking a guy like Casserly or Polian to fill some sort of Director of Football Operations role for us... we need a football guy to shield the team from Woody, and to guide decisions from a football-centric set of priorities. Enough of this MBA bullsh*t.

 

Polian is another name I could dig.  Both guys have a history of helping create some bad ass teams.  And they're personnel guys, not MBA, back office, cap specialists.

 

Is Polian done though?  You'd think he would have gotten gobbled up quickly if he was still interested.  Casserly too I guess.  

 

But I'm with ya.  Get me a Football guy tough enough to tell Woody to STFU and just walk around with his ball cap shaking hands while I do the heavy lifting. 

[Integrity28]

Polian is another name I could dig.  Both guys have a history of helping create some bad ass teams.  And they're personnel guys, not MBA, back office, cap specialists.

 

Is Polian done though?  You'd think he would have gotten gobbled up quickly if he was still interested.  Casserly too I guess.  

 

But I'm with ya.  Get me a Football guy tough enough to tell Woody to STFU and just walk around with his ball cap shaking hands while I do the heavy lifting. 

 

Could you imagine how the past 2 years would have gone if we'd fired Rex with Tanny, and gotten our first choices at GM?

 

Remember this:

 

 

 

Jets begin search for GM

Updated: January 5, 2013, 1:52 AM ET

Associated Press

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NEW YORK -- The New York Jets have begun their search for Mike Tannenbaum's replacement.

David Caldwell, Atlanta's director of player personnel, was scheduled to meet with the Jets on Friday, while Tom Gamble, San Francisco's director of player personnel, was set to sit down with the team Saturday, according to published reports.

Former Cleveland GM Tom Heckert canceled a scheduled interview with the Jets, the New York Post reported Friday night.

 

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Giants director of college scouting Marc Ross, Green Bay director of football operations John Dorsey and Jets assistant GM Scott Cohen also have been mentioned as candidates.

The team hasn't commented on individual candidates or the interview process.

Tannenbaum was fired Monday, after a 6-10 finish and seven seasons as the team's general manager. In a statement Monday, owner Woody Johnson said the team hired Jed Hughes of the search firm Korn/Ferry International to find the best candidates.

"Like all Jets fans, I am disappointed with this year's results," Johnson said in the statement. "However, I am confident that this change will best position our team for greater success going forward."

While Johnson fired Tannenbaum, who had been with the organization for 15 years, he chose to keep coach Rex Ryan. ESPNNewYork.com reported Friday that the team, according to sources, is telling candidates they must be willing to work with Ryan for at least next season.

"It's an interesting situation because you usually don't see it done that way where just the GM is fired," defensive lineman Mike DeVito said in an interview on WFAN radio. "But Rex is a great coach, he really is."

Ryan, who has two years remaining on his contract, will address the media Tuesday, along with Johnson, for the first time since the season ended. Ryan is vacationing in the Bahamas, where his tattoo of wife Michelle wearing a No. 6 Jets jersey -- Mark Sanchez's jersey number -- became an Internet sensation after the Daily News ran a front-page photo Friday.

The rest of the Jets' coaches also are away from the facility until Monday. Despite rampant speculation, the team hasn't made a decision on the fate of offensive coordinator Tony Sparano, whose offense finished 30th overall in his first season with New York. Defensive coordinator Mike Pettine turned down a contract extension early in the season, and special teams coordinator Mike Westhoff retired after the season finale, so there could be several changes to Ryan's staff.

The new general manager might also have some say on who stays or goes -- but will have to be able to work with Ryan.

Caldwell was hired in 2008 by Atlanta as the team's director of college scouting and was promoted to his current role before this past season. Along with the others high on the Jets' list, Caldwell is being considered by several other teams for GM vacancies.

Gamble, the son of former Philadelphia Eagles president Harry Gamble, has spent the past seven years helping rebuild the 49ers into one of the NFL's top teams.

 

Look at what Caldwell did for the Jaguars. Through the draft he added Bortles, Joeckel, Allen Robinson, Marquise Lee, Storm Johnson, Ace Sanders, Denard Robinson on offense in two off-seasons. Add in the Allen Hurns UDFA, and FA like Gerhart and you've got a rebuilt offense. They do it over two bad seasons, but they aren't missing on these picks, so the reps they are getting are valuable. Next year, they can spend on their defense and they are going to be competitive again.

 

Caldwell did what Idzik said he was going to do, imo more successfully. Especially if you consider that the Jaguars were in a worse starting point than the Jets.

 

What a waste of time this team is for us... 

[FidelioJet]

I was thinking a guy like Casserly or Polian to fill some sort of Director of Football Operations role for us... we need a football guy to shield the team from Woody, and to guide decisions from a football-centric set of priorities. Enough of this MBA bullsh*t.

 

I think this is the key...The more I see of this organization the more I realize Woody has been behind many of the bad decisions this team makes.  He seems waaaay more concerned with PR than winning (and he has PR people advising him.)  

 

I'm not sure he doesn't want to spend the money for a top flight guy but rather a top flight guy will demand autonomy and he's not willing to give that up.  Until he does this team won't get better.

[dbatesman]

Weird that Marc Ross doesn't have a GM job yet. You wonder if there's a DeCosta-type deal in place for when Reese retires.

[JustInFudge]

Could you imagine how the past 2 years would have gone if we'd fired Rex with Tanny, and gotten our first choices at GM?

 

Remember this:

 

 

Look at what Caldwell did for the Jaguars. Through the draft he added Bortles, Joeckel, Allen Robinson, Marquise Lee, Storm Johnson, Ace Sanders, Denard Robinson on offense in two off-seasons. Add in the Allen Hurns UDFA, and FA like Gerhart and you've got a rebuilt offense. They do it over two bad seasons, but they aren't missing on these picks, so the reps they are getting are valuable. Next year, they can spend on their defense and they are going to be competitive again.

 

Caldwell did what Idzik said he was going to do, imo more successfully. Especially if you consider that the Jaguars were in a worse starting point than the Jets.

 

What a waste of time this team is for us... 

 

Meh, I want to see the Jags actually produce before I start blowing Caldwell for "revamping" an offense that is still terrible (I realize they're very young) but the Jags are 1-7 and look worse than last year.  That's not something to be proud off or something you cant point at and claim they're moving in the right direction.  Caldwell, like our boy Dimitroff are wayyyyy overrated.  Neither have really done anything impressive.  Drafting a cant miss Julio Jones certainly isnt.  I know Bortles is a baby, he's looked terrible for the most part.

 

I mean, they went into the season with terrible Toby Gerhart as their starting running back and committed to Chad Henne which they ended up abandoning 2 games in.  They're doing anything special here in Jax.  That said, they're still probably in a better place than the Jets.

 

fml

[Integrity28]

Meh, I want to see the Jags actually produce before I start blowing Caldwell for "revamping" an offense that is still terrible (I realize they're very young) but the Jags are 1-7 and look worse than last year.  That's not something to be proud off or something you cant point at and claim they're moving in the right direction.  Caldwell, like our boy Dimitroff are wayyyyy overrated.  Neither have really done anything impressive.  Drafting a cant miss Julio Jones certainly isnt.  I know Bortles is a baby, he's looked terrible for the most part.

 

I mean, they went into the season with terrible Toby Gerhart as their starting running back and committed to Chad Henne which they ended up abandoning 2 games in.  They're doing anything special here in Jax.  That said, they're still probably in a better place than the Jets.

 

fml

 

Fair points, but all I'm saying is that by all accounts, they've found some players. Quite a few actually. They're still all young, but I think within a year or so, they are going to get them turned around. 

[Matt39]

I think this is the key...The more I see of this organization the more I realize Woody has been behind many of the bad decisions this team makes.  He seems waaaay more concerned with PR than winning (and he has PR people advising him.)  

 

I'm not sure he doesn't want to spend the money for a top flight guy but rather a top flight guy will demand autonomy and he's not willing to give that up.  Until he does this team won't get better.

 

Until this changes, there's not much we can do. Idzik I think has proven he's not qualified to be picking football players...or qualified to get a scouting dept in place considering Bradway is still here running the show.

[JustInFudge]

Fair points, but all I'm saying is that by all accounts, they've found some players. Quite a few actually. They're still all young, but I think within a year or so, they are going to get them turned around. 

 

They've done a good enough job of finding weaponz, I guess.  But just like any other GM/Head Coach, it all comes down to Bortles.  If he pans out, they're heroes.  If he doesnt, they'll be gone soon enough.

 

Another defensive Head Coach who's defense largely sucks, btw.  

[Matt39]

They've done a good enough job of finding weaponz, I guess.  But just like any other GM/Head Coach, it all comes down to Bortles.  If he pans out, they're heroes.  If he doesnt, they'll be gone soon enough.

 

Another defensive Head Coach who's defense largely sucks, btw.  

 

Bortles hasnt really looked all that great.

[predator_05]

Bortles hasnt really looked all that great.

 

He wasn't supposed to play so early in the season.

[Warfish]

Since we hired a veteran football executive in the front office. Bill Parcells in 1997 was the last time that we weren't throwing the future into the hands of a rookie who was learning on the job how to handle his role. Since then, we have had rookies in both major capacities- general manager and head coach.

The late Leon Hess, with plenty of faults of his own, finally knew it was time to pay to play. Woody Johnson has never once spent the necessary money to bring in a true established professional - not once. Why?

 

Before his time at the NY Jets, Bill Parcells had never operated, in any form, as an NFL Front Office/General Manager role.

 

i.e. Bill Parcells, in his duel-role of Head Coach and general manager, was 100% a "rookie" in the General manager position.

 

In both New York and New England, he was only the Head Coach, and in fact bristled specifically because he felt he 'did not have enough of a role in selecting the players".

 

So yes, Parcells was in fact "learning on the job" as a rookie General Manager.

[JustInFudge]

Bortles hasnt really looked all that great.

 

Yep.  Said it a few posts above.  He's been pretty bad.  They were breaking down his game the other day here on the local radio here the other day with Tony Boselli and they were rough on him.  Terrible decisions, bad throws, missing wide open receivers, etc.  But he's a baby.  At least there is some hope in Jags land unlike the hopelessness of the Jets QB situation.

[j4jets]

Since we hired a veteran football executive in the front office. Bill Parcells in 1997 was the last time that we weren't throwing the future into the hands of a rookie who was learning on the job how to handle his role. Since then, we have had rookies in both major capacities- general manager and head coach.

The late Leon Hess, with plenty of faults of his own, finally knew it was time to pay to play. Woody Johnson has never once spent the necessary money to bring in a true established professional - not once. Why?

 

Was there a yr in the Leon Hess era when he used 95% of the available cap during salary cap era, or be a top 5 team in any year as far salary was concerned in non-cap era? While you complete your search on that, also search for year when the Jets were EVER below 95% of the available cap outside of 2014 (which is a strategic move since the Jets weren't ready to make a playoff push, like it or not).

 

Then ponder why this might be for the rest of your life.

[Lizard King]

Before his time at the NY Jets, Bill Parcells had never operated, in any form, as an NFL Front Office/General Manager role.

i.e. Bill Parcells, in his duel-role of Head Coach and general manager, was 100% a "rookie" in the General manager position.

In both New York and New England, he was only the Head Coach, and in fact bristled specifically because he felt he 'did not have enough of a role in selecting the players".

So yes, Parcells was in fact "learning on the job" as a rookie General Manager.

While I did consider this, I weighed it against Parcells .650 winning percentage and Super Bowl championship resume. Factually you are correct, but if your post is interested in finding the truth of whether we had an established football executive in involved since God even knows, it's the best we've got. Carton said it best this morning, there is no football culture here since Weeb Ewbank.

[Lizard King]

Was there a yr in the Leon Hess era when he used 95% of the available cap during salary cap era, or be a top 5 team in any year as far salary was concerned in non-cap era? While you complete your search on that, also search for year when the Jets were EVER below 95% of the available cap outside of 2014 (which is a strategic move since the Jets weren't ready to make a playoff push, like it or not).

Then ponder why this might be for the rest of your life.

What does salary cap have to do with hiring and paying an established football executive

[Matt39]

While I did consider this, I weighed it against Parcells .650 winning percentage and Super Bowl championship resume. Factually you are correct, but if your post is interested in finding the truth of whether we had an established football executive in involved since God even knows, it's the best we've got. Carton said it best this morning, there is no football culture here since Weeb Ewbank.

 

Word. With Parcells here it felt like the Jets were running a football program. Nowadays it seems like we're running a sh*tty marketing firm. 

[j4jets]

What does salary cap have to do with hiring and paying an established football executive

 

 

 

Woody Johnson has never once spent the necessary money to bring in a true established professional - not once. Why?

 

True established professional does certainly cost more than a rookie. But its never been about money with woody. How many playoff seasons did Mr. Hess' Jets have? How about Woody's Jets?

 

I don't get why we even compare the two. 

[Lizard King]

True established professional does certainly cost more than a rookie. But its never been about money with woody. How many playoff seasons did Mr. Hess' Jets have? How about Woody's Jets?

I don't get why we even compare the two.

You're not following. It's fine.

[Bugg]

I was thinking a guy like Casserly or Polian to fill some sort of Director of Football Operations role for us... we need a football guy to shield the team from Woody, and to guide decisions from a football-centric set of priorities. Enough of this MBA bullsh*t.

Very sensible-a team president who appoints a talent guy to be the GM and run the draft.

And it won't happen because Johnson likes pretending he has a clue.

[Bugg]

Could you imagine how the past 2 years would have gone if we'd fired Rex with Tanny, and gotten our first choices at GM?

 

Remember this:

 

 

Look at what Caldwell did for the Jaguars. Through the draft he added Bortles, Joeckel, Allen Robinson, Marquise Lee, Storm Johnson, Ace Sanders, Denard Robinson on offense in two off-seasons. Add in the Allen Hurns UDFA, and FA like Gerhart and you've got a rebuilt offense. They do it over two bad seasons, but they aren't missing on these picks, so the reps they are getting are valuable. Next year, they can spend on their defense and they are going to be competitive again.

 

Caldwell did what Idzik said he was going to do, imo more successfully. Especially if you consider that the Jaguars were in a worse starting point than the Jets.

 

What a waste of time this team is for us...

Would love to see Polian or Casserly as president, with Ross or Gamble as GM/personnel guy. Again, Johnson won't give up control. So that won't happen. Instead we'll have another 2 or 3 years of being bled white by Idzik.

[Il Mostro]

Very sensible-a team president who appoints a talent guy to be the GM and run the draft.

And it won't happen because Johnson likes pretending he has a clue.

 

 

In effect, this removes Woody from the mix, which isn't going to happen.  It is the right move, though.  He is not a football guy in any way, shape or form and is the real crux of the problem.  He is not smart enough to know what he doesn't know.  

[Warfish]

While I did consider this, I weighed it against Parcells .650 winning percentage and Super Bowl championship resume. Factually you are correct, but if your post is interested in finding the truth of whether we had an established football executive in involved since God even knows, it's the best we've got. Carton said it best this morning, there is no football culture here since Weeb Ewbank.

 

And as a Head Coach he was quality.

 

As a General manager, it seems to be forgotten, he was not very good.  His drafts were average to sub-par, his management of the cap was horrible, he left us very quickly, and left us in incapable hands in Groh.

 

With respect, Bill Parcells was not a professional General manager, he was a good Coach doing a mediocre job in the Front Office, a job we paid for in the years after his departure.

 

Very few Head Coaches have done very well wearing both hats, and I think that would be a poor direction for us to persue.

 

We need a professional, legitimate, General manager with a quality talent evaluation/scout staff below him.  I think many fans oversimplify the process....the GM "makes the pick", but it's as much based on the scouts, coaches and other evaluators as it is the GM's "hunches".

 

A quality Front Office is as much a team effort as a quality football team.

[jgb]

And as a Head Coach he was quality.

 

As a General manager, it seems to be forgotten, he was not very good.  His drafts were average to sub-par, his management of the cap was horrible, he left us very quickly, and left us in incapable hands in Groh.

 

With respect, Bill Parcells was not a professional General manager, he was a good Coach doing a mediocre job in the Front Office, a job we paid for in the years after his departure.

 

Very few Head Coaches have done very well wearing both hats, and I think that would be a poor direction for us to persue.

 

We need a professional, legitimate, General manager with a quality talent evaluation/scout staff below him.  I think many fans oversimplify the process....the GM "makes the pick", but it's as much based on the scouts, coaches and other evaluators as it is the GM's "hunches".

 

A quality Front Office is as much a team effort as a quality football team.

 

so we need a HC, a real GM, new scouts... that's all? we should be good again by Thanksgiving!

[T0mShane]

Weird that Marc Ross doesn't have a GM job yet. You wonder if there's a DeCosta-type deal in place for when Reese retires.

In that NFLN Giants draft show, Ross doesn't come off well at all. Kind of a wishy-washy dude.

[j4jets]

You're not following. It's fine.

 

Oh I follow. I just don't know why anyone thinks Hess was a better owner than Woody. He's spend every last dime this team can spend on in almost every year. Can't ask for anything else. Try being a Bucs fan and watch their owner spend half the cap until the last CBA.

[Sperm Edwards]

Charlie. Casserly.

 

 

I was thinking a guy like Casserly or Polian to fill some sort of Director of Football Operations role for us... we need a football guy to shield the team from Woody, and to guide decisions from a football-centric set of priorities. Enough of this MBA bullsh*t.

 

Polian? I don't know. I don't see that he did such an amazing job other than lucking into Peyton Manning. It was often said all through the Manning years that the Colts were a 6-8 win team plus the game's greatest (regular-season) QB in history.

 

Casserly was a guy I liked from before we hired Idzik. I don't know if he's seeking a GM job anymore. He's made some good moves and some bad moves. At least on TV he comes across like he knows what he's doing. Much better on camera than Idzik, anyway.

[JustInFudge]

Polian? I don't know. I don't see that he did such an amazing job other than lucking into Peyton Manning. It was often said all through the Manning years that the Colts were a 6-8 win team plus the game's greatest (regular-season) QB in history.

 

Casserly was a guy I liked from before we hired Idzik. I don't know if he's seeking a GM job anymore. He's made some good moves and some bad moves. At least on TV he comes across like he knows what he's doing. Much better on camera than Idzik, anyway.

 

Those Bills teams were pretty good too.

 

I like Casserly a lot.  He's typically spot on from a draft perspective.  Dude passed on EY and Bush for Williams.  Took some balls to make that move and it was the right call.  He's getting up there in age though...he might not want the responsibility and he doesnt seem to be as active in the analyst role anymore.  Who knows...but these are guys who have had incredible success dating back to the 80's.  That's they type of FO guy we need.  Live and die Football. 

[Warfish]

Can we maybe find a guy who isn't 139 years old?

 

Christ sake, Charlie Casserly is so old, he scouted Abraham Lincoln.

 

Can we find someone born AFTER 1900 maybe?

[Integrity28]

Polian? I don't know. I don't see that he did such an amazing job other than lucking into Peyton Manning. It was often said all through the Manning years that the Colts were a 6-8 win team plus the game's greatest (regular-season) QB in history.

 

Casserly was a guy I liked from before we hired Idzik. I don't know if he's seeking a GM job anymore. He's made some good moves and some bad moves. At least on TV he comes across like he knows what he's doing. Much better on camera than Idzik, anyway.

 

I don't want Polian as the GM, I was saying as a "director of football ops" type of figurehead. Someone who, perhaps, can make sure the next GM and coach aren't a from an accounting department.

[Integrity28]

Can we maybe find a guy who isn't 139 years old?

 

Christ sake, Charlie Casserly is so old, he scouted Abraham Lincoln.

 

Can we find someone born AFTER 1900 maybe?

 

Who cares how old he is... beggars can't be choosers. I want someone between Woody and the team, someone that knows the game and can give the Jets the stability and football respectability that it'll take to convince a good GM and coach to come here. We aren't just contending with Woody being cheap, we're also contending with what appears to be a league-wide disinterest in working for Woody.