Francesa- "Woody should ask the league office to help find him a GM"

[Matt39]

Rarely I take Francesa's comments too seriously...but sometimes you can tell he's in the know on something and it seems the league wide perception is Idzik's completely in over his head...

Jets need a football guy to take over he operation. Woody wanted a business guy as the GM...

Overall point was the NFL will help Woody If he asks. Sorry this post is a bit rambly but I'm on my phone.

[joewilly12]

I hate Francessa but he's been dead nuts on when discussing the Jets lately.

[Warfish]

First mistake, taking anything Francessa says seriously.

 

He's piling on.  No different than his usual schtick, only now, with us in the toilet, it gains a resonance and is taken seriously far more than it should be.

 

Francessa would say the same thing even if we were 4-4 right now, or 6-2 right now.

 

No owner should ever "ask the NFL to "help" find a GM", the entire idea is a ******* joke.

 

The entire "football guy" vs. "Business guy" is wrongheaded.  Both guys will pick whomever the scouts and coaches say is the best guy to take, often leaning one way (scouts) or the other (coaches) if disagreement exists.

 

No NFL GM is singlehandedly evaluating and picking talent on his lonesome, they ALL depend, entirely, on their talent evaluators, i.e. coaches and scouts.

 

Maybe the guy who needs fired most, more than anyone else, is "Head Scout" Terry "Failed GM" Bradway?

[Ex-Rex]

I hate Francessa but he's been dead nuts on when discussing the Jets lately.

That's because nothing good is happening. Guy is a Jet hater along with Steve Serby, Rich Cimini and Phil Simms. But right is right and he has been correct.

[Ex-Rex]

First mistake, taking anything Francessa says seriously.

 

He's piling on.  No different than his usual schtick, only now, with us in the toilet, it gains a resonance and is taken seriously far more than it should be.

 

Francessa would say the same thing even if we were 4-4 right now, or 6-2 right now.

 

No owner should ever "ask the NFL to "help" find a GM", the entire idea is a ******* joke.

 

The entire "football guy" vs. "Business guy" is wrongheaded.  Both guys will pick whomever the scouts and coaches say is the best guy to take, often leaning one way (scouts) or the other (coaches) if disagreement exists.

 

No NFL GM is singlehandedly evaluating and picking talent on his lonesome, they ALL depend, entirely, on their talent evaluators, i.e. coaches and scouts.

 

Maybe the guy who needs fired most, more than anyone else, is "Head Scout" Terry "Failed GM" Bradway?

If the Jets had listened to Bradway we would have Russell Wilson at QB right now. Would you take that? I know I would.

[RutgersJetFan]

If there is one man capable of fixing this mess, it is Roger Goodell.

[JetsFanInDenver]

That's because nothing good is happening. Guy is a Jet hater along with Steve Serby, Rich Cimini and Phil Simms. But right is right and he has been correct.

 

People who have been criticizing the JETS have been right for 45 years. Does not take a genius to figure out where the chorus is at.

[faba]

Go to Monster.com or CareerBuilder

[JetsFanInDenver]

Rarely I take Francesa's comments too seriously...but sometimes you can tell he's in the know on something and it seems the league wide perception is Idzik's completely in over his head...

Jets need a football guy to take over he operation. Woody wanted a business guy as the GM...

Overall point was the NFL will help Woody If he asks. Sorry this post is a bit rambly but I'm on my phone.

 

 

IIRC the last time Woody asked a commish for help we ended with Herm Edwards. No thanks.

[faba]

Yes he wants to pile on- any hate he can bring to the Jets gives him goosebumps

[Warfish]

If the Jets had listened to Bradway we would have Russell Wilson at QB right now. Would you take that? I know I would.

 

After the fact PR fantasy.  If, stress if, you believe Bradway when he says suck things (I don't).

 

Frankly, Russell Wilson, under Rex and M.M., would be just like Geno Smith, a failure, or Matt Simms, never given a chance.

 

That's the Rex Resume when it comes to QB's.

[slats]

First mistake, taking anything Francessa says seriously.

 

He's piling on.  No different than his usual schtick, only now, with us in the toilet, it gains a resonance and is taken seriously far more than it should be.

 

Francessa would say the same thing even if we were 4-4 right now, or 6-2 right now.

 

No owner should ever "ask the NFL to "help" find a GM", the entire idea is a ******* joke.

 

The entire "football guy" vs. "Business guy" is wrongheaded.  Both guys will pick whomever the scouts and coaches say is the best guy to take, often leaning one way (scouts) or the other (coaches) if disagreement exists.

 

No NFL GM is singlehandedly evaluating and picking talent on his lonesome, they ALL depend, entirely, on their talent evaluators, i.e. coaches and scouts.

 

Maybe the guy who needs fired most, more than anyone else, is "Head Scout" Terry "Failed GM" Bradway?

 

No, the GM needs to be a football guy. Of course he's not single-handedly making every selection, but when he is making the determination between his coach and scouts, he needs to be able to make an informed choice rather than try to guess which of those guys is right. This was the failing with Tannenbaum. He couldn't identify talent, so he overpaid for it (in picks or free agent money) to compensate. Idzik appears to be in a similar boat, except he's too frugal to compensate for his shortcomings. 

 

Any number guy can handle the business side of things. Talent evaluation is more of an art, and you need someone with that rare, particular skill making the final calls. 

[Lizard King]

He must have been listening when I called in this morning.

[Bugg]

Francesa has hit on a good point today. If after having owned this team for a decade and a half, and having spoken to other owners and football people, Woody Johnson still has NO IDEA that he has to hire a "football guy" to run the show, and even worse has NO IDEA about who might be a candidate for that job, he should sell the team.

[nj meadowlands]

He must have been listening when I called in this morning.

 

He wasn't happy when I called in earlier this year...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHQZqZJrnIs

[Matt39]

His overall point was the league office will pretty much survey every "football guy" and they'll compile a list of candidates from those responses...instead of going only to a Parcells or Polian where they'll get a biased response and you get guys like Mo Carthon or Al Groh or John Idzik. The league would prefer the Jets weren't a joke I'd imagine. You don't go to Korn Ferry to find someone who knows how to pick football players.

 

You can tell when Francesa's talking out of his ass, this wasn't one of them. If Woody's incapable of identifying someone who can run a football team he should just sell.

 

idzik's a joke...Terry Bradway  is still doing our scouting...nothing has changed.

[j4jets]

I hate Francessa but he's been dead nuts on when discussing the Jets lately.

Where was his fat ass last year when the entire league was praising Idzik? 

 

Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while. Fatcessa is that blind squirrel.

[Matt39]

IIRC the last time Woody asked a commish for help we ended with Herm Edwards. No thanks.

 

I don't think anyone actually knows how that fully went down. Parcells recommended Bradway to Woody after Groh quit.

[SenorGato]

Why? Business is booming no matter what. Not the NFL's problem.

[ebonix]

First mistake, taking anything Francessa says seriously.

 

He's piling on.  No different than his usual schtick, only now, with us in the toilet, it gains a resonance and is taken seriously far more than it should be.

 

Francessa would say the same thing even if we were 4-4 right now, or 6-2 right now.

 

No owner should ever "ask the NFL to "help" find a GM", the entire idea is a ******* joke.

 

The entire "football guy" vs. "Business guy" is wrongheaded.  Both guys will pick whomever the scouts and coaches say is the best guy to take, often leaning one way (scouts) or the other (coaches) if disagreement exists.

 

No NFL GM is singlehandedly evaluating and picking talent on his lonesome, they ALL depend, entirely, on their talent evaluators, i.e. coaches and scouts.

 

Maybe the guy who needs fired most, more than anyone else, is "Head Scout" Terry "Failed GM" Bradway?

Well, it certainly possible that Bradway is the culprit behind all the failure..... bur he's been with the Jets , like 25 years..?   How do we get rid of him. Cerainly , somebody has to take the hit for the last 2 drafts--- they are an embarrassment.!    Irony of ironies--- we would have been better off with Mark Sanchez.!                   see below

 

-- "  This wasn’t just a case of the other team being better or Geno having a ‘bad day.’ From what I’ve read Geno has lost most, if not all, support from the locker room & I suspect there are reasons for this beyond his on-field struggles.

At this point, it looks like Idzik, Rex & the incompetent coaching staff he put together (everyone but Dunbar), & most or all of the scouting department deserve to be fired "

[Bugg]

Where was his fat ass last year when the entire league was praising Idzik? 

 

Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while. Fatcessa is that blind squirrel.

Perhaps Franceas is the blind squirrel; doesn't make him wrong here. At the time of Idzik's hire, was a lot of chatter here and everywhere that he had been more back office that talent evaluator any place he had been.Idzik has been in football forever but not clear his fingerprints are really anywhwere he has worked. Don't recall anyone praising Idzik since the hire.

[Integrity28]

Perhaps Franceas is the blind squirrel; doesn't make him wrong here. At the time of Idzik's hire, was a lot of chatter here and everywhere that he had been more back office that talent evaluator any place he had been.Idzik has been in football forever but not clear his fingerprints are really anywhwere he has worked. Don't recall anyone praising Idzik since the hire.

 

When Idzik was hired, Francessa criticized the hire heavily because he wasn't a personnel guy, he was a cap guy. He was very outspoken about it not making sense.

[Matt39]

When Idzik was hired, Francessa criticized the hire heavily because he wasn't a personnel guy, he was a cap guy. He was very outspoken about it not making sense.

 

And cap wise, idzik has done a good job. As Sperm alluded to...the one positive here is we didn't build an expensive team around a bad QB like we did with Tannenbaum.

 

But if you can't pick players you can't be the GM.

[slats]

When Idzik was hired, Francessa criticized the hire heavily because he wasn't a personnel guy, he was a cap guy. He was very outspoken about it not making sense.

 

Yeah, but he's a grown-up. In a room. 

[flgreen]

Matt, you really want Herm as the GM?

[Warfish]

No, the GM needs to be a football guy. Of course he's not single-handedly making every selection, but when he is making the determination between his coach and scouts, he needs to be able to make an informed choice rather than try to guess which of those guys is right. This was the failing with Tannenbaum. He couldn't identify talent, so he overpaid for it (in picks or free agent money) to compensate. Idzik appears to be in a similar boat, except he's too frugal to compensate for his shortcomings. 

 

Any number guy can handle the business side of things. Talent evaluation is more of an art, and you need someone with that rare, particular skill making the final calls. 

 

Pure typical fan guff, frankly.

 

Talent (and human being) evaluation is not "an art", and the numbers (i.e. the cap management) is far from something some first year Accounting Degree guy can handle.

 

Again, you've (incorrectly) described a system of "one man rule", and no GM in the NFL operates that way today, no matter how much some may CLAIM they do.

 

In the modern NFL, personnel decisions are made by teams of people, not brilliant lone GM's striding across rooms to overrule his coach and scouts with his brilliant unexpected pick.

 

What you're probably trying to avoid is that fact that Rex Ryan, Head Coach and larger than life personality, beloved by his owner, has had a hell of a lot more power and hand in selecting the talent than his defenders would like to admit.

 

I have a truly hard time seeing many moves when Idzik "overruled" Rex, and denied Rex the guy (or position) Rex wanted.  Especially with yes-man Terry Bradway leading the scouting department.

 

The is Rex's team far more today than it's Idziks, and the endless denials of Rex's involvement and footprint will not change that.

 

The best the Rex defenders can come up with is the (pure bullsh*t) media reporting that "Revis wanted to come back".  That's pure agent-issued fantasy, Revis never wanted to come back, he wanted to leverage the Jets to get the biggest deal he could get from any team that would pay it.  To come back, the Jets would have had to pony up the same 16 mil. a year Revis wanted earlier, and that was never going to happen nor should it, especially at that point before both our #1 and #2 CB's got hurt.

 

Too many Fans buying into hype-maker GM talk on ESPN.  We don't need some brilliant lone-wolf "football guy" GM, we need a better scouting department, and a better head coach.

[C Mart]

His overall point was the league office will pretty much survey every "football guy" and they'll compile a list of candidates from those responses...instead of going only to a Parcells or Polian where they'll get a biased response and you get guys like Mo Carthon or Al Groh or John Idzik. The league would prefer the Jets weren't a joke I'd imagine. You don't go to Korn Ferry to find someone who knows how to pick football players.

You can tell when Francesa's talking out of his ass, this wasn't one of them. If Woody's incapable of identifying someone who can run a football team he should just sell.

idzik's a joke...Terry Bradway is still doing our scouting...nothing has changed.

I believe Seattle went to Korn Ferry with their GM search and hired Schneider.

To another point. Didn't the Giants go to the League for GM help and then hired George Young

[JustInFudge]

Pure typical fan guff, frankly.

 

Talent (and human being) evaluation is not "an art", and the numbers (i.e. the cap management) is far from something some first year Accounting Degree guy can handle.

 

Again, you've (incorrectly) described a system of "one man rule", and no GM in the NFL operates that way today, no matter how much some may CLAIM they do.

 

In the modern NFL, personnel decisions are made by teams of people, not brilliant lone GM's striding across rooms to overrule his coach and scouts with his brilliant unexpected pick.

 

What you're probably trying to avoid is that fact that Rex Ryan, Head Coach and larger than life personality, beloved by his owner, has had a hell of a lot more power and hand in selecting the talent than his defenders would like to admit.

 

I have a truly hard time seeing many moves when Idzik "overruled" Rex, and denied Rex the guy (or position) Rex wanted.  Especially with yes-man Terry Bradway leading the scouting department.

 

The is Rex's team far more today than it's Idziks, and the endless denials of Rex's involvement and footprint will not change that.

 

The best the Rex defenders can come up with is the (pure bullsh*t) media reporting that "Revis wanted to come back".  That's pure agent-issued fantasy, Revis never wanted to come back, he wanted to leverage the Jets to get the biggest deal he could get from any team that would pay it.  To come back, the Jets would have had to pony up the same 16 mil. a year Revis wanted earlier, and that was never going to happen nor should it, especially at that point before both our #1 and #2 CB's got hurt.

 

Too many Fans buying into hype-maker GM talk on ESPN.  We don't need some brilliant lone-wolf "football guy" GM, we need a better scouting department, and a better head coach.

 

Who is the person responsible for upgrading the scouting department and Head Coach?  

[Matt39]

I believe Seattle went to Korn Ferry with their GM search and hired Schneider.

To another point. Didn't the Giants go to the League for GM help and then hired George Young

 

Didn't know that about Seattle...but wasn't Caroll hired before Schneider?

 

And yeah Francesa alluded to the Giants hiring Young because the Mara's couldn't get along.

[Warfish]

Who is the person responsible for upgrading the scouting department and Head Coach?  

 

The General Manager......unless over-ruled by the Owner.

 

Now, between woody and Idzik, who do you think mandated we keep Rex Ryan and Terry Bradway on staff after hiring Idzik?

 

if anything, Idzik should be fired for not having the stones to say "No Woody.  if I have to keep these guys, I'd prefer to not have this job" as (it certainly seems) a number of other candidates told Woody, and hence never got offers.

[flgreen]

The General Manager......unless over-ruled by the Owner.

 

Now, between woody and Idzik, who do you think mandated we keep Rex Ryan and Terry Bradway on staff after hiring Idzik?

 

if anything, Idzik should be fired for not having the stones to say "No Woody.  if I have to keep these guys, I'd prefer to not have this job" as (it certainly seems) a number of other candidates told Woody, and hence never got offers.

 

 

Yep, your being offered a job that pays 10x what your currently making, you know you will never be offered this position again, but your going to dictate your terms to the owner

[Matt39]

The Seahawks Front Office has been a collaboration from the beginning. Schneider has control over salary cap and contract issues and works closely with Carroll on personnel matters. Generally, Schneider will scout the players and report to Carroll who has final decision over roster moves. The relationship has been described as Schneider setting the menu and Carroll picking specific players off of it.

 

 

How has this translated here...

[NYJ37/12]

We are all assuming or hoping that Woody is at the same conclusion most of us now have regarding what needs to be done. Big assumption.

 

With that being said: I think consulting the NFL for help is the right move.

[NYJ37/12]

How has this translated here...

Good question. From day one that Idzik arrived it was clear that Rex had been neutered, maybe for good reason?

[SoFlaJets]

IIRC the last time Woody asked a commish for help we ended with Herm Edwards. No thanks.

You're exactly right and the only thing we want Woody to ask the league to help him do is to help him FIND A BUYER FOR THE JETS!!!!!! Yes Idzik must go yes Rex must go, but most of all and most importantly WOODY MUST GO.