Who should the Jets fire?

[T0mShane]

You don't know that for sure. None of us do.

But if he is retained, the perception will be that he is on a very short leash. That will factor in on a coach's decision to come work here.

What will be the perception if he's chased off?

[T0mShane]

Disagree on both counts. It'd probably be a nice bump in pay for me, and I'm getting close to retirement anyway.

Your view that this job becomes less attractive if Idzik is fired after this season is just flat out wrong, IMHO. And the idea that giving this guy another two years is the best course of action is crazy. The team now is much worse than it was two years ago. You talk about potential GMs not wanting to come here if Idzik is fired, what head coach candidates are gonna wanna come to work for Idzik on the two year plan? And do you want to continue the keep the GM fire the coach, keep the coach fire the GM thing going in perpetuity?

This is a great time to clean house. Under a new GM, the head coaching job is much more attractive, too.

The team was similar in 2012 in that it was also poorly coached, but it was significantly more expensive because they were still paying off the coach's pals.

[bitonti]

My first choice is both of them my second choice is neither. There's no standard by which Idzik did a better job than Rex. I understand that it's time for Rex to go and all but I don't trust Idzik to pick the next coach, or even the next set of draft picks. 

 

The 2014 draft the Jets had 12 picks in a historically deep year was a draft disaster for all time. It will rank up there with the 1997 debacle where the Jets traded out of Pace, Walter Jones and got James Farrior and Jason Ferguson (and like 9 other wasted picks). 

 

when you fire a coach it should be because he isn't getting the most out of his team. Rex is actually getting the most out of this terrible awful roster. Or close to it. Idzik the guy who built the roster is more to blame. Woody pocketing 30 mil of potential payroll is the most to blame. BUt I guess they can't fire him... 

[peebag]

If they could move the current franchise to another city, say LA, and  then award a new franchise to NYC....I think that would be best.

[slats]

The T0mShane wet dream plan:

 

1.  Fire Rex

2.  Fire every scout underneath Idzik.

3.  Hire Parcells in a well-paid, 2-year consultant role.

4.  Allow Idzik to have ultimate authority on next HC decision (Bevell) and steal as many of Seattle's scouting people as possible.

 

If a turnaround doesn't happen by the end of 2016, completely start from scratch and hope Woody sells the team.

  

Not if, when. Idzik is in over his head, and should be relieved of his duties. The idea that the GM job will be less attractive if the team fires Idzik, but that the head coaching position will be attractive enough to bring in quality candidates is absurd.

And the GM job becomes less attractive in two years, too. The way the new CBA is written, teams have a four year period in which they have to spend x amount of the cap. Hand the job over to a new GM now, and he'll have a lot more money to play with than two years down the road when Idzik will've been forced to spend most of the room he hoarded this season.

And Parcells quit on Woody once, he'd be a fool to rehire him.

The team was similar in 2012 in that it was also poorly coached, but it was significantly more expensive because they were still paying off the coach's pals.

Sounds a lot like when Bradway & Herm took over.

[T0mShane]

Not if, when. Idzik is in over his head, and should be relieved of his duties. The idea that the GM job will be less attractive if the team fires Idzik, but that the head coaching position will be attractive enough to bring in quality candidates is absurd.

And the GM job becomes less attractive in two years, too. The way the new CBA is written, teams have a four year period in which they have to spend x amount of the cap. Hand the job over to a new GM now, and he'll have a lot more money to play with than two years down the road when Idzik will've been forced to spend most of the room he hoarded this season.

And Parcells quit on Woody once, he'd be a fool to rehire him.

Sounds a lot like when Bradway & Herm took over.

Except it took Herm and Groh 5 years to drive Parcells' team into the ground. It took Rex two to drive Mangini's into the ground. Granted, Parcells was a much better franchise builder than Mangini.

I think you vastly underestimate how pervasive and ruinous Rex's hold on this franchise is.

[sourceworx]

What will be the perception if he's chased off?

That he did a poor job and was swiftly let go, as opposed to being retained and crossing our fingers in hopes of him improving. You know, the mistake we seem to make over and over again.

Maybe it'll show that Woody isn't f*cking around anymore.

Look at the ridicule the Browns received for firing their coach after only one season. No one is making fun of them now, are they?

[Villain The Foe]

I think Rex needs to go for sure. I have no problem with Idzik as of right now. My reasoning is this. Name a game that the Jets have won in the 6 years under Rex that you can say that the team won because of Rex strategic moves on the fly? It's never happened. All of the good/great coaches have a game where they've done it. It's hard for Rex to even do given that he practically has no influence on the offensive side of the ball. My like for Rex should have nothing to do with the fact that he's failed 4 of his 6 years here. 

 

I would like to see what Idzik could do with his own coach. Unfortunately it would at the time looked like a mistake if be fired Rex after last season given the talent that was available to him, at the same time this Jets team did not look like a 1-8 team heading into week 10 on paper before the start of the season. that one is on Rex, Marty and Geno. 

[slats]

Except it took Herm and Groh 5 years to drive Parcells' team into the ground. It took Rex two to drive Mangini's into the ground. Granted, Parcells was a much better franchise builder than Mangini.

I think you vastly underestimate how pervasive and ruinous Rex's hold on this franchise is.

I scoff at this BS that Mangini built a team. He built an OL. I'll give him that and nothing more. That team was 5-16 over his last two years without a healthy Favre. Rex went to the AFCCG the next two years without a healthy Favre. The Mangini ball washing around here is amazing to me.

And I think you underestimate just how bad a GM your boy Idzik is.

I'm happy with them both going. If Idzik stays, he'll be picking from a lesser group of potential head coaching candidates, and all of us are going to have a bad time. This is the ideal time to clean house once and for all, and getting rid of the lesser candidate who landed the GM job last time in the process.

[Jetsfan80]

In no scenario should Rex Ryan be kept.  The fact that 7 of the 27 voters in the poll would opt to keep Rex is utterly ridiculous.  And I'm one who still thinks Rex can be a good head coach or top 5 defensive coordinator.  We simply need fresh blood.  Rex will have success as the next Jaguars HC or DC of a contending team.  But he's damaged goods here.

 

Even a bad franchise can turn things around if they can get lucky with a solid HC/QB combo.  We need to have a clear chain of command where the GM is allowed to bring in his guy, and together they can select our potential franchise QB/veteran starter, then craft the roster around him.

[Jetsfan80]

Not if, when. Idzik is in over his head, and should be relieved of his duties. The idea that the GM job will be less attractive if the team fires Idzik, but that the head coaching position will be attractive enough to bring in quality candidates is absurd.

 

Our GM job will always be attractive.  2 more years won't change this.  But in order to maintain at least the illusion that Woody Johnson is a good owner to work for, Idzik needs to be able to get his shot to hire his HC.  Otherwise some VP of Personnel for a strong org will hesitate to take a job where the previous guy had a HC forced on him and was fired 2 years later when said HC led the team to a bottom 5 of the league record.

[ylekram]

Except it took Herm and Groh 5 years to drive Parcells' team into the ground. It took Rex two to drive Mangini's into the ground. Granted, Parcells was a much better franchise builder than Mangini.

I think you vastly underestimate how pervasive and ruinous Rex's hold on this franchise is.

all this talk of manginis players. where was manginis championship game appearances? what did mangini do with his star studded cast that he personally assembled? besides the obvious, I don't know the answer

[derp]

It's certainly time for Rex to go. I can see thinking he might have success elsewhere, but the team and he are both clearly in need of a change.

 

As far as Idzik goes, I'd fire him too.

 

Only seven of Idzik's twelve draft picks are still on the roster of a 1-8 team. We're not talking about a team that should be tough to make. And two of the seven are on IR - one of whom (Evans) was probably getting cut.

 

I have no issue whatsoever with what Idzik did in free agency. But that draft alone is worthy of being fired.

 

 

For perspective, a number of fans (myself included) thought Martavis Bryant would have been a good value in the fourth round heading into day three. The Jets drafted two wide receivers ahead of Bryant in the fourth round - Jalen Saunders who was released and Shaq Evans who is on IR and probably would have been released if he had not had a season ending injury.

 

Bryant now has five touchdown catches this season - all in the last three weeks. Jets wide receivers have five touchdown catches this season, in nine games.

 

Granted, the situation in Pittsburgh is far better. But that's just me cherry picking one aspect of a horrible draft that stuck out even at the time.

[JustInFudge]

I voted no one.  This is too much fun to fire them both.  The Jets suck. Always have, always will.  Lets just keep it entertaining because the new Head Coach, GM, QB, whatever, is going to suck.  Why? Because its the New York Jets.

[slats]

Our GM job will always be attractive.  2 more years won't change this.  But in order to maintain at least the illusion that Woody Johnson is a good owner to work for, Idzik needs to be able to get his shot to hire his HC.  Otherwise some VP of Personnel for a strong org will hesitate to take a job where the previous guy had a HC forced on him and was fired 2 years later when said HC led the team to a bottom 5 of the league record.

Don't listen to T0mShane's BS. He's grasping at straws to keep Idzik, relying on minions like you to believe what he says. Don't.

Tannenbaum lasted here since Parcells, Bradway is still here, Rex lasted six years, no one outside this organization is looking at it as a place where people routinely get fired prematurely. If/when Idzik gets the ax, it'll be pretty clear that he got it because he was incapable. Anyone worth their salt isn't going to be concerned about the shortness of Idzik's tenure.

And the job will be much more attractive this year, with a ton of cap space to work with, than it will be two years from now after Idzik has been forced by the CBA to spend the cap room he's created - most likely strapping the new guy in with a few difficult to get out of contracts.

Now is the time to clean house. Completely.

[munchmemory]

I voted no one.  This is too much fun to fire them both.  The Jets suck. Always have, always will.  Lets just keep it entertaining because the new Head Coach, GM, QB, whatever, is going to suck.  Why? Because its the New York Jets.

Very difficult to argue against you.  

[Ex-Rex]

I voted Rex and Idzik but in reality everyone needs to go. From the coaches to the GM, scouting staff. Anyone involved in the construction of this debacle needs to go.

I would fire the doggone janitor and the secretaries. No one remains intact in the entire building.

[ylekram]

Don't listen to T0mShane's BS. He's grasping at straws to keep Idzik, relying on minions like you to believe what he says. Don't.

Tannenbaum lasted here since Parcells, Bradway is still here, Rex lasted six years, no one outside this organization is looking at it as a place where people routinely get fired prematurely. If/when Idzik gets the ax, it'll be pretty clear that he got it because he was incapable. Anyone worth their salt isn't going to be concerned about the shortness of Idzik's tenure.

And the job will be much more attractive this year, with a ton of cap space to work with, than it will be two years from now after Idzik has been forced by the CBA to spend the cap room he's created - most likely strapping the new guy in with a few difficult to get out of contracts.

Now is the time to clean house. Completely.

minions...lol

[JustInFudge]

My first choice is both of them my second choice is neither. There's no standard by which Idzik did a better job than Rex. I understand that it's time for Rex to go and all but I don't trust Idzik to pick the next coach, or even the next set of draft picks. 

 

The 2014 draft the Jets had 12 picks in a historically deep year was a draft disaster for all time. It will rank up there with the 1997 debacle where the Jets traded out of Pace, Walter Jones and got James Farrior and Jason Ferguson (and like 9 other wasted picks). 

 

when you fire a coach it should be because he isn't getting the most out of his team. Rex is actually getting the most out of this terrible awful roster. Or close to it. Idzik the guy who built the roster is more to blame. Woody pocketing 30 mil of potential payroll is the most to blame. BUt I guess they can't fire him... 

 

This is actually, exactly where I'm at.  If they fire one and not the other, its just another pathetic miscalculation moment in Jets history. 

 

Here's what we know about Rex Ryan and John Idzik.

 

Rex: 1 win seasons are not the norm for Rex Ryan.  He's only had 1 losing season in his career.  This myth that he cant win games, is very near sighted. Rex has always had his teams in "contention" and was a game from the SB twice with an average team.  This is the first season he hasnt at least been "in the hunt", even though they finished way out of it in 2012, they had a shot at one point to salvage the season if they could have strung some wins together.  He's clueless on offense, genius on defense and has some clear deficiencies as HC, just like 95% of Head Coaches in the NFL. 

 

Idzik: we know he can gut a roster that a 5th grader could gut and that he's a shrewd negotiator that probably resulted in the loss of some very solid FA's. He's an absolute disaster in the draft, selecting one decent player in Sheldon Richardson which was probably Rex, but I wont contradict myself, the GM selects the players so kudos to Idzik for hitting on 1 of his 4 top 40 picks.  He cant sign FA's, his team is the least talented in the NFL, he's a terrible talent evaluater, he's Woody's puppet,  he's never had single hand in constructing a roster and its obvious....finally, in a season where he had every opportunity in the world to upgrade his team, he failed miserably.

 

So???? Yeah.  Fire them both or just give the **** up already. This franchise is ******* pathetic. 

[JustInFudge]

Don't listen to T0mShane's BS. He's grasping at straws to keep Idzik, relying on minions like you to believe what he says. Don't.

Tannenbaum lasted here since Parcells, Bradway is still here, Rex lasted six years, no one outside this organization is looking at it as a place where people routinely get fired prematurely. If/when Idzik gets the ax, it'll be pretty clear that he got it because he was incapable. Anyone worth their salt isn't going to be concerned about the shortness of Idzik's tenure.

And the job will be much more attractive this year, with a ton of cap space to work with, than it will be two years from now after Idzik has been forced by the CBA to spend the cap room he's created - most likely strapping the new guy in with a few difficult to get out of contracts.

Now is the time to clean house. Completely.

 

On one hand; Woody doesnt hold anyone accountable and lets losers stay around forever.

On the other; Woody needs to hold on to the person failing the most, because 2 years ago I said I like him.

[ylekram]

This is actually, exactly where I'm at.  If they fire one and not the other, its just another pathetic miscalculation moment in Jets history. 

 

Here's what we know about Rex Ryan and John Idzik.

 

Rex: 1 win seasons are not the norm for Rex Ryan.  He's only had 1 losing season in his career.  This myth that he cant win games, is very near sighted. Rex has always had his teams in "contention" and was a game from the SB twice with an average team.  This is the first season he hasnt at least been "in the hunt", even though they finished way out of it in 2012, they had a shot at one point to salvage the season if they could have strung some wins together.  He's clueless on offense, genius on defense and has some clear deficiencies as HC, just like 95% of Head Coaches in the NFL. 

 

Idzik: we know he can gut a roster that a 5th grader could gut and that he's a shrewd negotiator that probably resulted in the loss of some very solid FA's. He's an absolute disaster in the draft, selecting one decent player in Sheldon Richardson which was probably Rex, but I wont contradict myself, the GM selects the players so kudos to Idzik for hitting on 1 of his 4 top 40 picks.  He cant sign FA's, his team is the least talented in the NFL, he's a terrible talent evaluater, he's Woody's puppet,  he's never had single hand in constructing a roster and its obvious....finally, in a season where he had every opportunity in the world to upgrade his team, he failed miserably.

 

So???? Yeah.  Fire them both or just give the **** up already. This franchise is ******* pathetic. 

its really hard to argue with any of this

[predator_05]

everyone

[Blackout]

I voted for patience. I see no reason to act hastily here. As long as these guys can win 2 game out of the last 7, that would show improvement and give me hope for next year. Sometimes you just have a down year.

 

 

you make a lot of sense, new poster.  thanks.

[munchmemory]

you make a lot of sense, new poster.  thanks.

I couldn't be happier that he's our owner.  What a champ the guy.

[jgb]

I couldn't be happier that he's our owner.  What a champ the guy.

 

is it wrong to wish woody gets caught on tape in a racist rant? after a scandal a publicity hound like donald trump would jump all over the jets to buy it

[T0mShane]

This myth that he cant win games, is very near sighted. Rex has always had his teams in "contention" and was a game from the SB twice with an average team. This is the first season he hasnt at least been "in the hunt",

It's this type of scholarship that truly embodies the flagging pro-Rex agenda.

[bitonti]

It's this type of scholarship that truly embodies the flagging pro-Rex agenda.

 

anytime the word agenda is used on a message board nothing good can come of it. 

 

let's just agree that we are all jets fans and our collective agenda is to be entertained, hopefully by wins. A plane flying a banner over practice will suffice in a pinch. 

[T0mShane]

anytime the word agenda is used on a message board nothing good can come of it.

let's just agree that we are all jets fans and our collective agenda is to be entertained, hopefully by wins. A plane flying a banner over practice will suffice in a pinch.

For the sake of the franchise, we need the pro-Rex movement and all its adherents driven into the sea. None can survive.

[#27TheDominator]

For the sake of the franchise, we need the pro-Rex movement and all its adherents driven into the sea. None can survive.

 

Not even Idzik!

[PatriotReign37]

By this standard, Belichick should never be allowed to make another pick as long as he lives.

 Izdk has been a front office guy since 1993. After 21 years shouldn't his drafts be better than this?

 

 I wouldn't trust him after Geno.

[GenoandtheJets]

The Idziot most definitely should be fired. Rex Ryan is still questionable

[munchmemory]

is it wrong to wish woody gets caught on tape in a racist rant? after a scandal a publicity hound like donald trump would jump all over the jets to buy it

Like Fredo, I'd prefer he go out fishing with Neri.

 

 Izdk has been a front office guy since 1993. After 21 years shouldn't his drafts be better than this?

 

 I wouldn't trust him after Geno.

Give the guy a break.  He was immersed in that decades long pencil sharpener comparison.

[IPBanBadPosters]

 

 

 

And LOL @ there actually being people who STILL want to retain Rex but fire the GM, putting us in the exact same position we were in when we had to scrape the bottom of the barrel to find a lower-tier candidate desperate enough for the gig that they were willing to be saddled with this buffoon. 

[JustInFudge]

It's this type of scholarship that truly embodies the flagging pro-Rex agenda.

 

I dont have an agenda, but clearly you do.  I'm a dumb ass loser who lives in Jacksonville, FL.  My opinion is as valuable as the toilet paper I used to wipe my ass after my morning coffee.

 

I'm just responding to a thread about who should be fired.  Between the options. 1 has a proven track record and has shown he can do his job.  The other, does not and has shown he cant do his job.  So either keep them both and let the lolz continue or do the right thing and fire them both.

[PatriotReign37]

 

 

Give the guy a break.  He was immersed in that decades long pencil sharpener comparison.

 

No way I trust Izzy with a top 3 pick and all that cap space. Hire a proven guy like Shanahan.

 

Rex needs to go as well for his game management, lack of discipline and offense.