Woody Johnson likely to cave to pressure, fire Idzik: NFL execs

[T0mShane]

This is just flat out wrong. No coach the new guy has to retain, not being forced to trade the team's best player, $50M in cap space that he'll be required to spend per the CBA. This is an attractive job.

This is also a place with a track record of not firing people prematurely. Tannenbaum lasted from when Leon Hess was the owner. Bradway's been with the team since 2001. Rex has lasted six years. If Idzik gets fired, potential candidates will recognize that he's the exception to the general rule around here. Do even something close to decent job, get the owner's ear, and you can put down roots. Problem with Idzik is that he hasn't done close to a decent job, and truly qualified candidates interested in being placed in one of 32 such jobs in existence probably recognize that, too.

And really, the idea that we should keep this incompetence around because we might hire someone worse is the same sort of logic you rallied against when people said the same thing about Rex. Only thing is those people were talking about the coach who's won the most playoff games in franchise history, while this GM is about to oversee the longest losing streak in franchise history. If you thought that logic didn't hold water with Rex, it's really tough to back up applying that same logic to Idzik.

They can find a better GM. Even the clown school in the Jets alleged brain trust can do that.

 

 

 

It's not the same thing I railed about at all. Rex had failed--badly--when Woody stuck the new GM with him, and Bradway, and Bauer, etc. I don't believe you can say that Idzik has failed yet, other than at the task of taking a bad team and making it good in 22 months time. Idzik's worst offense as a GM was retaining the coach after last season, because that led to what you have now--an inability among the fan base to understand that we're a rebuilding team in the sixth year of a coach's tenure. There are conflicting philosophies inside the building there, and--because the Jets have literally no one in the building capable of controlling the public perception (like Pat Hanlon does with the Giants), too many Jets fans have to rely on Mehta and Costello and Francesa to tell them what to think. The mythos surrounding the great horrors of John Idzik's buffoonery is overplayed. People are mad that he passed on Benjamin (who nobody wanted here, other than Aten), and that he got burned by Vontae Davis. Other than that, people are generally talking out of their ass. 

[T0mShane]

They were 8-8 that year, they're about to lose their 9th game in a row in week 10 this season.

 

 

They were 8-8, coming off an 11-5 with the chance to get good on the fly. Instead, they handed the keys to the head coach and he picked up Burress, Mason, and Holmes, who mutinied and sunk the ship.

[jorge o8]

Cowher isn't coming to the NYJ, or any NFL team for that matter.

I don't  think the jets,but he will coach again.

[afosomf]

There are planes flying over the stadium this weekend advocating the firing of a GM that's been in the job for less than two years. If that GM gets fired, your pool of candidates will consist of even lesser candidates than Idzik was. There is no way, short of bringing back Parcells or Jimmy Johnson to serve as a mediator, that any candidate of value is going to trust Woody Johnson with his career. 

 Planes and billboards were used in KC to rid themselves of Pioli, look who KC got? Reid and Dorsey. Your Logic is flawed for keeping Iddy. It's like asking Helen Keller  to do Movie Reviews!  0-3 on wrs in a deep pool! Look at who your starting CB's are tomorrow.

[T0mShane]

 Planes and billboards were used in KC to rid themselves of Pioli, look who KC got? Reid and Dorsey. Your Logic is flawed for keeping Iddy. It's like asking Helen Keller  to do Movie Reviews!  0-3 on wrs in a deep pool! Look at who your starting CB's are tomorrow.

 

 

The Hunt family is one of the most respected in the sport. 

[afosomf]

The Hunt family is one of the most respected in the sport. 

 

Yes it will be Woody to cause a high profile GM not to come not the dam billboard or planes. Not sure of your fascination with Iddy, you didn't work at IBM, around the league Iddy is viewed as incompetent. Again no high profile coach will come to Jets with a lame duck GM.

[slats]

It's not the same thing I railed about at all. Rex had failed--badly--when Woody stuck the new GM with him, and Bradway, and Bauer, etc. I don't believe you can say that Idzik has failed yet, other than at the task of taking a bad team and making it good in 22 months time. Idzik's worst offense as a GM was retaining the coach after last season, because that led to what you have now--an inability among the fan base to understand that we're a rebuilding team in the sixth year of a coach's tenure. There are conflicting philosophies inside the building there, and--because the Jets have literally no one in the building capable of controlling the public perception (like Pat Hanlon does with the Giants), too many Jets fans have to rely on Mehta and Costello and Francesa to tell them what to think. The mythos surrounding the great horrors of John Idzik's buffoonery is overplayed. People are mad that he passed on Benjamin (who nobody wanted here, other than Aten), and that he got burned by Vontae Davis. Other than that, people are generally talking out of their ass.

Three year rebuilds are a thing of the past around the rest of the league. This was the year, with 12 picks and a ton of cap space, that the man was expected to turn the roster around. Even if you're inclined to give him a pass on saving the free agent money, his draft was one whiff after another. He's got two useful players out of 12 picks, his first two picks, and at safety and TE represent to of the lowest valued positions on an NFL roster. For those picks to be great, he needs them to be Ed Reed and Jimmy Graham. So far, they're not.

And last year's draft, once touted for producing five starters looks a lot different a year later - and not in a good way. The injury prone Milliner is shockingly on injured reserve, with an injury that'll be tough to recover from. Geno is on the bench, pending a permanent replacement next year. Winters was sucking before he went on the IR. That leaves Richardson, who nearly had the fan base collectively jump off a bridge when he was selected, and a FB.

The draft is the most important part of the man's job by the man's own assessment of how he intended to build a team, and he's not good at it. He got worse when he shuffled before his staff before second draft.

Being unable to adjust on the fly and land a Vontae Davis or consummate a draft day trade are other problems that it's hard to imagine him correcting in the future. It's not a PR issue. It's an issue of ability. He lacks it.

[T0mShane]

Three year rebuilds are a thing of the past around the rest of the league.

 

Where is there evidence of this? 

 

 

This was the year, with 12 picks and a ton of cap space, that the man was expected to turn the roster around.

 

 

Half of those picks were in the sixth and seventh rounds. As for the "ton" of cap space, I implore you to find the players he could have signed (that would have realistically signed here) that would have made this team contend this year. Revis? Cromartie? Old, expensive vets that won't be on the roster in 2015?

 

safety and TE represent to of the lowest valued positions on an NFL roster.

 

 

I agree with you on the safety pick--I hated it because (as I stated at the time, and before the draft) he needs to be an immortal player to justify that draft slot. I disagree about Amaro. Good TE's are hard to find, and a good one makes a QB's life infinitely easier. Amaro was a good pick and will be a good player here for a long time. The two receivers drafted behind Amaro were Allen Robinson and Davante Adams, who both would have been solid picks, but weren't superior prospects at the time they were drafted. Many thought Amaro would go in the first. FWIW, the other highly-rated TE taken before Amaro, Ebron, has been awful and injured.

 

And last year's draft, once touted for producing five starters looks a lot different a year later - and not in a good way

 

I don't think we need to revisit the Rex-with-young-players argument. They simply don't develop here. I attribute it to a lax environment that isn't conducive to teaching or disciplining young talent. You attribute it to them all just being bad players who had no chance from the get-go, which I don't think is possible.

 

Being unable to adjust on the fly and land a Vontae Davis or consummate a draft day trade are other problems that it's hard to imagine him correcting in the future

 

 

 

He got played by an agent to get a better deal from a team that the player wanted to stay with in the first place. It happens. Remember when all those players were going to take less money to play for Rex Ryan? Never materialized. 

[slats]

Half of those picks were in the sixth and seventh rounds. As for the "ton" of cap space, I implore you to find the players he could have signed (that would have realistically signed here) that would have made this team contend this year. Revis? Cromartie? Old, expensive vets that won't be on the roster in 2015?

 

Not quite, although half of them were taken in the first four rounds. After Pryor and Amaro, only one of those guys is on the 53 man roster (Dozier), and last I looked, he has yet to be active for a single game. Another is on his second practice squad since being cut by a team that's currently 1-8.

 

I agree with you on the safety pick--I hated it because (as I stated at the time, and before the draft) he needs to be an immortal player to justify that draft slot. I disagree about Amaro. Good TE's are hard to find, and a good one makes a QB's life infinitely easier. Amaro was a good pick and will be a good player here for a long time. The two receivers drafted behind Amaro were Allen Robinson and Davante Adams, who both would have been solid picks, but weren't superior prospects at the time they were drafted. Many thought Amaro would go in the first. FWIW, the other highly-rated TE taken before Amaro, Ebron, has been awful and injured.

The tight end position has the lowest franchise tag number in the league outside of punters and kickers, that's why Jimmy Graham was fighting to be tagged as a WR instead of a TE. So the NFL marketplace disagrees with your assessment. Fwiw, safety has the second lowest number. Finding serviceable players (if they've done that) at two of the lower valued positions in the first two rounds of the draft does not a good draft make. A solid #2 WR would've been a stronger pick in the second round.

And I don't think they get credit for not taking a player that was off the board when they picked.

[ucrenegade]

I don't  think the jets,but he will coach again.

i think cowher would take the giants job if coughlin is as expected to leave after this year.

[Jack Straw]

It's not the same thing I railed about at all. Rex had failed--badly--when Woody stuck the new GM with him, and Bradway, and Bauer, etc. I don't believe you can say that Idzik has failed yet, other than at the task of taking a bad team and making it good in 22 months time. Idzik's worst offense as a GM was retaining the coach after last season, because that led to what you have now--an inability among the fan base to understand that we're a rebuilding team in the sixth year of a coach's tenure. There are conflicting philosophies inside the building there, and--because the Jets have literally no one in the building capable of controlling the public perception (like Pat Hanlon does with the Giants), too many Jets fans have to rely on Mehta and Costello and Francesa to tell them what to think. The mythos surrounding the great horrors of John Idzik's buffoonery is overplayed. People are mad that he passed on Benjamin (who nobody wanted here, other than Aten), and that he got burned by Vontae Davis. Other than that, people are generally talking out of their ass. 

 

12 of the 19 picks that you speak of came in the 4th round or later. Of those 12 picks, only two players have so much as even sniffed the field (Tommy Bohanon and Oday Aboushi), and it took Brian Winters tearing his leg up to get Aboushi on the field. 

 

Nobody's overplaying Idzik's buffoonery - his track record speaks for himself. In a two year period, he has hands down been the worst drafting GM in football and it's not even close.

 

I suspect all the attention and blame Idzik is getting annoys you because you think Rex is equally (if not more) at fault for this team's failures. That's fine and fair. But don't parade around here acting like Idzik is being wrongfully attacked for doing an awful job; his track record has been terrible.

[T0mShane]

12 of the 19 picks that you speak of came in the 4th round or later. Of those 12 picks, only two players have so much as even sniffed the field (Tommy Bohanon and Oday Aboushi), and it took Brian Winters tearing his leg up to get Aboushi on the field. 

 

Nobody's overplaying Idzik's buffoonery - his track record speaks for himself. In a two year period, he has hands down been the worst drafting GM in football and it's not even close.

 

I suspect all the attention and blame Idzik is getting annoys you because you think Rex is equally (if not more) at fault for this team's failures. That's fine and fair. But don't parade around here acting like Idzik is being wrongfully attacked for doing an awful job; his track record has been terrible.

 

 

Let's apply some Jets fan math to other teams that we suspect have great GMs, shall we? 

 

In the last two drafts, the ratio of "contributing players drafted" to "OMG busts":

 

San Francisco: 4/23

Seattle: 3/20

Pittsburgh: 4/18

Giants: 4/18

Baltimore: 4/19

 

This is fun! Math! Science!

[T0mShane]

San Francisco just had their fourth round pick retire because of a knee injury he had in college! Fyreee the teeeem.

[Jack Straw]

Let's apply some Jets fan math to other teams that we suspect have great GMs, shall we? 

 

In the last two drafts, the ratio of "contributing players drafted" to "OMG busts":

 

San Francisco: 4/23

Seattle: 3/20

Pittsburgh: 4/18

Giants: 4/18

Baltimore: 4/19

 

This is fun! Math! Science!

 

And the Jets are 1/18, so you've proven my point. 

[afosomf]

Let's apply some Jets fan math to other teams that we suspect have great GMs, shall we? 

 

In the last two drafts, the ratio of "contributing players drafted" to "OMG busts":

 

San Francisco: 4/23

Seattle: 3/20

Pittsburgh: 4/18

Giants: 4/18

Baltimore: 4/19

 

This is fun! Math! Science!

WTF is this?   Very weak...........It is very tough for rooks 4th rd and up to make good teams, they can take a greater chance than the JoBlows of the world. If you cant make a terrible Jests team, then it was a really gawd awful putrid draft. lattimore was a reasonable risk for a team that just made it to SB.

?

[ylekram]

Let's apply some Jets fan math to other teams that we suspect have great GMs, shall we? 

 

In the last two drafts, the ratio of "contributing players drafted" to "OMG busts":

 

San Francisco: 4/23

Seattle: 3/20

Pittsburgh: 4/18

Giants: 4/18

Baltimore: 4/19

 

This is fun! Math! Science!

meh

[BurnleyJet]

Let's apply some Jets fan math to other teams that we suspect have great GMs, shall we?

In the last two drafts, the ratio of "contributing players drafted" to "OMG busts":

San Francisco: 4/23

Seattle: 3/20

Pittsburgh: 4/18

Giants: 4/18

Baltimore: 4/19

This is fun! Math! Science!

These are good teams, the Jets roster is terrible, if you can't make this side outside of Dline...

[freestater]

[jorge o8]

i think cowher would take the giants job if coughlin is as expected to leave after this year.

i have been thinking the same but what if the jets can get their hands on Mariota and our D looks good for next year maybe we need one CB but aside from a so so Oline this team will be in good shape for somebody who is a proven coach like him.

[ucrenegade]

i have been thinking the same but what if the jets can get their hands on Mariota and our D looks good for next year maybe we need one CB but aside from a so so Oline this team will be in good shape for somebody who is a proven coach like him.

nah just like peyton passed on us so will the good coaches because our dumbass owner.

[Jetmech]

Going to be awesome when everyone returns for another year.

Wait a second, what happen to JI hanging Rex out to dry?

I'm curious in this conspiracy theory.