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What do we do with Harvin?


Beerfish

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It only takes one. Someone will chase his past performance and offer him $7M per. If you cut him I think he's gone I guess is the point. The idea of cutting and renegotiating is a pipe dream imho. I'd rather sign a one year deal with the Pats and bet on myself than sign a 4 year deal with Jets for below what I think I'm worth (even if incorrect in that self-valuation).

No one chased the past performance of Hakeem Nicks. He got 1 year $4M. I think it's more likely Harvin gets a short deal like that in FA. Maybe a couple bucks more than Nicks got because there's more hype around Harvin, but I don't see a 4 year deal for a career headache who caused big team trouble during the time no one could possibly fathom (week before the SB).

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No one chased the past performance of Hakeem Nicks. He got 1 year $4M. I think it's more likely Harvin gets a short deal like that in FA. Maybe a couple bucks more than Nicks got because there's more hype around Harvin, but I don't see a 4 year deal for a career headache who caused big team trouble during the time no one could possibly fathom (week before the SB).

 

i don't think we will get a chance to find out since jets will keep him but if he gets cut i make you a friendly wager that his contract will be much bigger than nicks, who was coming off significant foot surgery and was never the same since his original foot injury. nicks is a really poor comparator. harvin is a head case but his physical talent is unquestioned. talent gets paid in nfl. it only takes one team.

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i don't think we will get a chance to find out since jets will keep him but if he gets cut i make you a friendly wager that his contract will be much bigger than nicks, who was coming off significant foot surgery and was never the same since his original foot injury. nicks is a really poor comparator. harvin is a head case but his physical talent is unquestioned. talent gets paid in nfl. it only takes one team.

 

I don't understand the wager offer, since I already said to you that I think he would get more than Nicks (thought it would be up to around $5-6M per on a 3 year deal or 1 year $6M on a show-me). But I don't have a dog in the race; makes no difference to me if one team does end up overpaying for him. I don't see him getting what people are suggesting we offer him (with what would surely be 2 years' guaranteed $ to boot). It's been 3 seasons since he was really productive for more than a random game here or there.

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Two things.

If you didn't learn from the Holmes fiasco, there is probably zero hope for you.

Second, here is a stat for you. Harvin's career avg per catch is 11.5. In comparison, Golden Tate is 13.5. Vincent Jackson is 17. Stevie Johnson's is 12.7, in case you wish to argue the QBs they play with. Even Cecil Shorts is 2 yards better per catch. 11.5 per catch is NOT a home run hitter in anyone's definition. He is merely a fast fraud who also happens to be a total schmuck.

I rest my case.

#owned

Owned? What are you 12?

If you don't think Harvin is a home-run hitter, then your IQ is as good as a wet paper towel.

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I don't understand the wager offer, since I already said to you that I think he would get more than Nicks (thought it would be up to around $5-6M per on a 3 year deal or 1 year $6M on a show-me). But I don't have a dog in the race; makes no difference to me if one team does end up overpaying for him. I don't see him getting what people are suggesting we offer him (with what would surely be 2 years' guaranteed $ to boot). It's been 3 seasons since he was really productive for more than a random game here or there.

Ok was just a figure of speech really. Nicks is a really poor predictor of harvins future is my point imho

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Two things.

If you didn't learn from the Holmes fiasco, there is probably zero hope for you.

Second, here is a stat for you. Harvin's career avg per catch is 11.5. In comparison, Golden Tate is 13.5. Vincent Jackson is 17. Stevie Johnson's is 12.7, in case you wish to argue the QBs they play with. Even Cecil Shorts is 2 yards better per catch. 11.5 per catch is NOT a home run hitter in anyone's definition. He is merely a fast fraud who also happens to be a total schmuck.

I rest my case.

#owned

That's because Harvin does all his work running flat and drag routes. That doesn't mean he's not an effective player.

I know 10.5 is overpaying but in the long run it's worth it just to maintain flexibility on his deal because we can cut him after next season. Today's nfl is just as much a WR/TE league now as it is a qb league. If you cut Harvin we're going to have to sign 2 big time FA WR's instead of just one.

#doyourhomework

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i don't think we will get a chance to find out since jets will keep him but if he gets cut i make you a friendly wager that his contract will be much bigger than nicks, who was coming off significant foot surgery and was never the same since his original foot injury. nicks is a really poor comparator. harvin is a head case but his physical talent is unquestioned. talent gets paid in nfl. it only takes one team.

Nobody is giving Harvin more than a 1 year deal in free agency. He's basically on a 1yr deal with us next season if we don't restructure his deal.

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Jets will cut Harvin.  It's a no-brainer.  Although I could see them then try to re-sign him at a more reasonable price.  Something in the 3 year $12mil range.  If he no like, see ya.

If the Jets cut Harvin, he's signing somewhere else. The Jets are coming off a 4-12 season, and have a long history of having WRs careers die here. The team has undergone a complete management change, but still has no QB. If the Jets release him, he's going to bolt. In fact, his hard line refusal to take a pay cut stance could easily be a ploy to get himself cut from this team.

I don't think he's worth $10.5M, but he's certainly worth (and will get) more than $4M/year. The only way the Jets could possibly retain him for less would be if they gave him more than he's worth on the open market. That would have to be an offer in the $7M+/year range. And I'm not sure he'd even accept that.

Cap space is not a problem for the Jets, and a fourth round pick isn't that big a deal. As Sperm says, it's easy enough to get additional picks from the Jets current draft position. Unless they see a clear path to getting a better (safer?) player with that $10.5M, I wouldn't be in a rush to cut him. Right now, it's hard -if not impossible- to argue that he's not the most talented skill position player on the offense.

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That's because Harvin does all his work running flat and drag routes. That doesn't mean he's not an effective player.

I know 10.5 is overpaying but in the long run it's worth it just to maintain flexibility on his deal because we can cut him after next season. Today's nfl is just as much a WR/TE league now as it is a qb league. If you cut Harvin we're going to have to sign 2 big time FA WR's instead of just one.

#doyourhomework

Harvin is a jerk. Sometimes, a player's talent is worth some baggage for a short stint if a team has quality leadership. IE: Moss (Brady and Belicheat) and Owens (McNabb and Reid)... they wear out their welcome quickly though. I do not believe Harvin is anywhere close to that level, plus he is always hurt, and the Jets have uncertainty at QB and a brand new HC. Harvin is a horrific idea under those circumstances. I will just leave it as we can agree to disagree. Even if you are really, really wrong.
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can the Jets trade Percy Harvin??? if he don't want to restructure his contract get something for him instead of losing him for nothing its a lot of teams that would love to have him.

Very few teams would be interested in adding Harvin. None would be interested in trading for him under his current contract. So the answer is zero chance for a trade.

SMH

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yup. i'd rather pay him an extra $2M and have the flexibility to cut him after next season. all these guys who want to cut and resign for $7M (assuming you are high bidder at that) it's going to look something like 4 yrs/28M with $12M guaranteed. You'd be paying him $19.5M next year if he santonios out and you want to cut him after the season. salary cap much more nuanced than "omg he is getting more per year than he is worth." guaranteed money is what equals cap hell. not salaries.

it's worth the money for the flexibility.

It's basically a one year deal for Harvin next year. We need as much help on offense as we can get its either we overpay 1 season for Harvin or overpay 3-4 seasons for someone who sucks like James Jones.

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Prediction on January 30, 2015 by operaguy -- Harvin will restructure so he gets guaranteed money and Jets take a reduced cap hit.

Thats the thing with a restructure, the cap hit with pro rata guaranteed money will likely be higher than 10.5 next year or about the same. And then we have dead money if he goes turd style and we cut him next year.

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Prediction on January 30, 2015 by operaguy -- Harvin will restructure so he gets guaranteed money and Jets take a reduced cap hit.    

OMFG for a second there I thought that was actually a legit news link or something.

 

This is what the jets need to do: nothing.

 

Keep Harvin at his current cap # and he's basically on a one year deal next season. We maintain flexibility and much-needed depth at WR.

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Thats the thing with a restructure, the cap hit with pro rata guaranteed money will likely be higher than 10.5 next year or about the same. And then we have dead money if he goes turd style and we cut him next year.

Sure, the overall cap hit will be higher if you increase guaranteed money and extend it across a few years.  Doesn't mean restructure is a bad move.  Right now lets say its 10.5 to keep him for one year and then we have flexibility to lose him.

Instead make it 14 total and split it equally across two years and add in performance bonuses.  

Then you are looking at an additional 3.5 in cap flexibility for this year.  For a talent like Harvin for 14 / 2 years is not a bad deal, probably around what he gets on the market (i.e. the market would value him at that figure while taking into account the risk of injury or diminished quality).  The Jets aren't going to get Thomas or Dez or any playmaker like that.  With a guy like Gailey who actually maximizes talent I think that Harvin could return to Minnesota form.   

Worst move here would be to dump Harvin and get no serious replacement talent during FA (I don't trust the draft to produce and immediate WR contributor).  Better move would be to limit our ability to get talent from FA this year because we're committing excessive money to Harvin in short term (this is still worse than a restructure because NOBODY in the market would pay Harvin 10.5 for one year if he hit FA).  Best move would be to get Harvin with cap friendly numbers for this upcoming year so we can take advantage of our cap space to bring more talent to Jets (i.e. what other teams would do and what he would commit to if he's at all interested in staying in NY).

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Cut him he is not worth ten million of cap space. The draft is loaded again this year a last and the free agent market has much talent and you will save cap space. You cannot afford to keep him with his history and you need room to sign free agents. Myself I would resign back Cromartie and also sign Flowers at cornerback. Two big corners like this and than sign a guard like Clint Boling or Orland Franklin. We need that blocking up the middle with our running game. We need to resign Ellis and Snacks and let go of Pace, Vick and Wilson which will save some cap space. I would also sign an under the radar WR in Cecil Shorts and look to make a run at Torrie Smith or Demaryius Thomas. The ladder I feel is going to sign back with Denver as their priority. The most important thing we need to do is to find a QB. Either Mariota will fall in our lap at 6th and either we keep him and trade him for Foles and their 1st round pick we have to get another QB in here. There are four QBS in free agency I would talk to. Mallet, Hoyer, Locker, and Moore should be looked at as well as Austin Davis but he is a restricted free agent. Without a decent QB we are going nowhere.

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