TRADE dept. ~ ~ ~

[kelly]

 -- In the last 10 years, six teams have traded out of a top-five draft spot. One of them traded out but still stayed in the top five.

With the Tennessee Titans second in the draft order and a possible scenario where they don’t want a quarterback but someone might want to trade up for them, I set out to look at those six trades. (Thanks to Evan Kaplan of ESPN Stats and Info for the help.)

Here is a run through of each of the trades, and a look at how the two teams involved fared the next season. The changes in records were hardly a result of only the trade. Bad teams draft at the top and make a lot of changes. They often regress to the mean. Still, we want some sense of how much, or how little, things improved.

 

~ ~   2009 -- Browns trade out of No. 5 with New York Jets

The deal : The Jets took quarterback Mark Sanchez. The Browns got No. 17, a second-rounder (defensive end David Veikune) and three veterans: Safety Abram Elam, quarterback Brett Ratliff and end Kenyon Coleman. Cleveland traded No. 17 to Tampa Bay for No. 21 and a sixth-rounder (defensive back Coye Francies). The Browns traded No. 21 to Philadelphia for No. 24 (center Alex Mack) and a sixth-rounder (running back James Davis).

Review : Sanchez helped the Jets make it to the AFC Championship Game in his first two seasons and was their starter for four years. He was with Philadelphia in 2014 and is set to be a free agent. Mack started every game over his first five seasons, earning two Pro Bowl selections and one second-team All-Pro nod. The other six players the Browns got out of the trade combined for 58 starts and 83 games. None are still with the team.

The Browns improved by one game.The Jets posted the same record but went to the playoffs.

 

rest of above article :

> http://espn.go.com/blog/tennessee-titans/post/_/id/12560/a-look-at-trades-out-of-the-top-5-over-the-last-10-years

[kelly]

If Marcus Mariota slips to 6, the Jets should take him in a NY minute

 -- Let's make it easy for New York Jets general manager Mike Maccagnan: If Marcus Mariota is available with the sixth pick, take him. There's no need to over-think this. The Jets are desperate for a quarterback, and Mariota is a top quarterback prospect. Simple.

Don't look a gift Duck in the mouth.

"If he falls to the Jets, I'd be sending the card up to the commissioner in two seconds," said ESPN analyst Mark Dominik, formerly the general manager of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers.

There is a lot of chatter here at the NFL scouting combine about Mariota's background in Oregon's uptempo spread offense and whether that will somehow prevent him thriving in a pro-style system. Obviously, it's not an ideal situation. But guess what? Neither is the Jets' current quarterback depth chart. In case you haven't noticed, Geno Smith isn't the long-term answer. If they pass on Mariota, they could be staring into the quarterback abyss for another few years.

 

Mariota might not be a plug-and-play prospect, a la Andrew Luck, but he has the arm, the legs and the brain to succeed in the NFL. With a new regime, the Jets can afford to be patient, allowing Mariota the time to learn the nuances of Chan Gailey's offense.Maccagnan admitted there's an element of uncertainty with a player like Mariota because they haven't seen him perform certain functions that will be required in the NFL -- taking a snap under center, executing routine dropbacks and reading progressions. In cases like this, Maccagnan studies the prospect's intangibles -- his intelligence and work ethic -- trying to determine if he has the goods to make the transition.

"It's dangerous to start putting Marcus in a box as a spread quarterback who won't be able to make the jump and project to a pro-style offense," said former Philadelphia Eagles personnel director Louis Riddick, an ESPN analyst. "You have to watch him very closely and watch some of the things they asked him to do, especially as the year went on in Oregon."

Riddick gave an insightful explanation on how Mariota evolved last season, displaying NFL-type traits within the structure of the Ducks' offense."If you watch the national-championship game, even though they're always in the gun, it wasn't catch the ball, take a step and throw it," he said. "It was catch the ball, and he would actually do an abbreviated, three-step drop.

"Watch him scan the field. Watch how he's going through progressions -- one, two, three, sometimes even four. The route concepts even started becoming much more complicated as the year went on. They weren't just typical spread route concepts. There were things you see on Sundays in the NFL.

The easy way out is to say, 'It's an easy spread offense that Bryce Petty runs down at Baylor.' It's nothing like what Baylor does. Nothing. Marcus would be a better third-down passer than RG III ever was -- ever. They're totally different in my view. He's going to need some time. It's not going to be like Jameis [Winston], who is running a pro-style offense. Marcus is going to need a good coach who will teach it to him in an orderly fashion, but he's more than capable of handling it."

Eagles coach Chip Kelly, who coached Mariota at Oregon, has said his former pupil has Peyton Manning-like intelligence on the field. This explains why he's reportedly is hot to trade up for Mariota. He has the power to shop for the Eagles' groceries, thanks to a recent shake up in the organization, so you can't rule out the possibility of him trying to trade up from 20th to sixth. Unless the Eagles offer a ridiculous package -- it would have to be their first-round pick this year and next year, plus Nick Foles, just to get the conversation started -- the Jets should say, "Thanks, but no thanks."

You take Mariota and build a potential franchise quarterback.

"He's that good," Dominik said.

Because of supply and demand at quarterback, there's always a chance Mariota could be picked in the top five. If Winston goes first to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, don't be surprised if the Tennessee Titans hold an auction for the second pick, trying to attract Mariota-seeking teams. If that happens, the Jets would have to take their commitment to a different level, and that could be prohibitive. But if he's there at six, it's a no-brainer

 

> http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49364/if-marcus-mariota-slips-to-6-the-jets-should-consider-themselves-ducky

[kelly]

-- Answering your questions from the center of the NFL universe, the scouting combine  :

@RichCimini: If Marcus Mariota is gone by the Jets' pick, it means someone probably traded up to get him because I don't think the Tennessee Titans will take him at No. 2. In this scenario, I see Mariota, Jameis Winston, Leonard Williams and Amari Cooper somewhere in the top 5. That would leave one of the top pass-rushers, Randy Gregory or Shane Ray, for the Jets. In a perfect world, I think the Jets would like to pick a cornerback. Todd Bowles really, really, really wants a cornerback. Could they take Trae Waynes at six? That might be considered a bit of a reach, but Waynes' stock could rise if he aces the 40 at the combine or his pro day. You want to know the real best-case scenario? If Mariota is gone, the Jets should trade back a few spots and take Waynes or the top corner. The question is, who'd want the sixth pick if both quarterbacks are gone? We have two months to analyze the various scenarios.

 

@RichCimini: You raise a very good point. If the Eagles really want Mariota, it makes sense to jump ahead of the Jets. In a situation like this, you wouldn't want to negotiate with another quarterback-needy team because it hurts your leverage. The Jets could say to the Eagles, "Sorry, Chip, if you don't give us this, this and this, we'll just take Mariota ourselves." The Eagles could talk to the aforementioned teams, but how high can they realistically go? The cost to jump from 20 into the top-5 would be enormous. The Washington Redskins at 5 could be an interesting partner because they could be looking to stockpile draft picks after getting ripped off with the RG III trade a few years ago.

 

@RichCimini: Let me start by saying I think Darrelle Revis will work out a deal with the New England Patriots. They have until the start of the league year (March 10) to get that done. If not, they probably will release him because the cap charge on his existing contract is a prohibitive $25 million. If that happens, I'd put the Jets over the Buffalo Bills. I'd be surprised if he ends up in Buffalo. We all know he has a great relationship with Rex Ryan, and I'm sure Ryan is interested, but I think Revis wants to play in a big market. He really likes New York, the big-city feel. He was looking to buy a place in Manhattan before the trade in 2013. Bottom line: Revis is in a great negotiating position.

 

@RichCimini: Actually, it goes back to before Rex Ryan's arrival. The Jets have picked a defensive player in the first round in seven of the last eight drafts, starting with Revis in 2007. The lone offensive pick was Mark Sanchez in 2009. But, hey, that's what happens when you have defensive-minded coaches, Ryan and Eric Mangini. Obviously, Todd Bowles is from the same side of the ball, so don't be shocked if they go defense again. But, you're right, it's time to start investing in the offense. The last time they drafted a first-round wide receiver was Santana Moss in 2001. This is an offensive-minded league, but you don't want to reach to fill a need because that's when you get burned. That's what happened with Sanchez in '09, when they traded up because they were desperate for a quarterback.

 

@RichCimini: Depends on your defensive scheme. At 6-foot-6, 245 pounds, Gregory is a classic 3-4 outside linebacker. That's where he'd fit in Bowles' system. Gregory is an excellent pass-rusher, but he could use some sand in the pants, as scouts like to say. In other words, he needs more size and strength to anchor at the point of attack. Initially, he could be used as a third-down rusher. Some scouts say he's similar to Dion Jordan, which isn't a flattering comparison. Vic Beasley (6-3, 245) is a terrific player, but his size has some teams wondering about his position. He wouldn't be a good fit in the Jets' system, but he could fit as a weakside 'backer in a 4-3 system.

 

> http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49389/jets-mailbag-marcus-mariota-draft-scenarios-and-darrelle-revis

[kelly]

There's more to being a successful general manager than picking talented players. It's about building a good team. There's a difference, so there's no guarantee an experienced evaluator (hello, Mike Maccagnan) can make the jump. Much like the players they scout, it's wait and see.

"It's not an easy transition," said Houston Texans general manager Rick Smith, who was Maccagnan's boss for nine years. "As much as you think about it and prepare for it, when you get into the position, there's still a huge learning curve. That's just the reality of the position. From that standpoint, there will be a learning curve [for Maccagnan]. There will be things he will be responsible for and skills he will have to develop that he didn't have to do. But the aptitude is there for him to develop those skills in order to be successful."Smith was speaking at the NFL scouting combine in Indianapolis, where scouting reports are created on the players. Smith gave his scouting report on Maccagnan, whom the New York Jets hired last month to replace John Idzik.

"Thorough. Detailed. A great evaluator. Thoughtful," Smith said. "I think he's going to do a fantastic job. ... He's a heck of a talent evaluator. He's talented."

Of course, Maccagnan hasn't drafted a single player yet and he hasn't spent any of Woody Johnson's money. There will be plenty of time to do that over the next couple of months, and then we'll get a sense of Maccagnan's philosophy. Even Smith, who knows Maccagnan's football acumen better than anyone in the league, doesn't know what kind of general manager his former protege will be -- i.e. aggressive, conservative, reactive, etc. Too early to tell, he said.

"I gave him a lot of advice, but I'm going to keep it between us," Smith said, laughing. "He has deserved this opportunity. He's very loyal, he's a hard-working guy. He loves football. He has earned this opportunity."
 

>   http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49423/mike-maccagnan-faces-a-huge-learning-curve-per-former-boss

[FidelioJet]

If the Eagles want Mariotta and willing to give up a lot - there's no way he gets past the Skins.  They can't risk the Jets potentially taking him and making a move with the Jets.  I would imagine the Skins are salivating to make that trade...

 

two 1's and two 2's...and Foles would be a great fall back if RGIII once again fails or inevitably gets hurt.

[Gastineau Lives]

If the Eagles want Mariotta and willing to give up a lot - there's no way he gets past the Skins.  They can't risk the Jets potentially taking him and making a move with the Jets.  I would imagine the Skins are salivating to make that trade...

 

two 1's and two 2's...and Foles would be a great fall back if RGIII once again fails or inevitably gets hurt.

When was the last time such a trade was made within the same division?

[FidelioJet]

When was the last time such a trade was made within the same division?

 

If the Eagles want Mariotta as desperately as we're hearing and are willing to give up 2 first, 2 seconds and a starting caliber QB - the deal will happen.  Division or no division - they can certainly make the move earlier too.  

 

It's all irrelevant anyway because Mariotta is going to to the Titans.

[BurnleyJet]

If we reach for a corner #6 , with all that talent on the board, this new coaching a GM will be over before they starts. I know we need corners, but hell no!

[kelly]

Barring an epic swing and miss, the New York Jets should land a very good player with the sixth overall pick. There will be no shortage of options.

  2015 NFL DRAFTRound 1: April 30, time TBA
 Rds. 2-3: May 1, TBA
Rds. 4-7: May 2, TBA
Where: Auditorium Theatre of Roosevelt University, Chicago

Several players improved their stock at the NFL scouting combine, which concluded Monday. A few players, previously projected to be picked in the 10-20 range, are pushing to crack the top 10. Here's our "Watch" list, possibilities for the Jets at No. 6, based on positional need and the assumption that quarterback Jameis Winston and defensive tackle Leonard Williams already will be gone:

Amari Cooper, WR, Alabama -- He didn't do anything to hurt his status as the top receiver in the draft, clocking a time of 4.42 seconds in the 40. The Oakland Raiders (No. 4) are the popular landing spot for Cooper.

Randy Gregory, OLB, Nebraska -- He has a high ceiling as a pass-rusher, but he has to convince teams he can add bulk. His measurements -- 6-foot-5, 235 pounds. He ran the 40 in 4.64 seconds.

Shane Ray, DE, Missouri -- The SEC Defensive Player of the Year (14.5 sacks) didn't work out at the combine because of a foot injury he suffered in Missouri's bowl game. Ray will perform for scouts at his pro day, March 19. He's 6-foot-3, 245 pounds, on the smallish side for an every-down edge player in a 3-4 scheme.

Marcus Mariota, QB, Oregon -- He didn't disappoint, running exceptionally well (4.52) and drawing high marks for his throwing performance. He also impressed teams during interviews with his football acumen. Mariota-to-the-Jets is the hot speculation. ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay said Monday, "You better have a plan, if you're the Jets, on how you're going to develop him -- and really feel great about the fact that he's going to be able to make the transition, and what your plan is. By that, I mean he has a lot of work to do in terms of anticipating."

Kevin White, WR, West Virginia -- White made himself a lot of money, blazing the 40 in 4.35 seconds -- at 6-foot-3, no less. He probably moved into the top 10 and could be a consideration for the Jets, especially if Cooper is off the board.

Trae Waynes, CB, Michigan State -- Cornerback is a huge need for the Jets, but is Waynes worth the sixth pick? He improved his stock by crushing the 40 (4.31), the fastest time among defensive backs. He has press-corner skills and experience, which makes him attractive to Todd Bowles.

Dante Fowler, OLB, Florida -- He projects as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 scheme. He created a buzz at the combine, running 4.60 seconds at a rock-solid 6-foot-3, 261 pounds. He may have pushed his way into the top 10.

Vic Beasley, OLB, Clemson -- He worked out with the defensive linemen, but he's seen as a 3-4 outside 'backer. He might have been one of the top athletes in Indianapolis, running 4.53 seconds, leaping 41 inches in the vertical jump and recording 35 reps on the bench press. Problem is, he's a tweener at 6-foot-3, 246 pounds

 

> http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49430/examining-post-combine-options-for-jets-with-sixth-pick

[kelly]

A major trade coming between Redskins and Eagles ?

 

When Chip Kelly was coaching the Oregon Ducks, the offense moved at a speed unlike much college football had seen. At the helm of Kelly's most prolific teams was quarterback Marcus Mariota. Kelly, now coaching the Eagles, may be interested in reuniting with Mariota, who will be a top pick in May's NFL Draft. Since the Eagles hold the No. 20 draft pick, odds are Mariota will be long gone, and Kelly's team needs to move way up in the draft. That's where the Redskins come in. Washington holds the No. 5 pick, and if the NFC East rivals can work out a trade, Kelly would likely be able to get his guy. 

 

Peter King of MMQB.com wrote that such a scenario could unfold, with the Redskins sending the No. 5 pick to Philadelphia in exchange for the Eagles' 20th pick as well as their fourth round pick this year, and 2016 first- and fourth-round picks. From King:

Washington could be moving from five to 20 in the first round by doing this deal, with GM Scot McCloughan scoring points with his new boss for not giving away the store in a trade, but rather acquiring the store. This has so many poetic points to it. The Eagles gave Donovan McNabb to Washington a few Easters ago; now Washington would be giving a longer-term quarterback, theoretically, to Chip Kelly. The Eagles coach would be reunited with the quarterback he recruited out of a Hawaii high school and helped make a star while both were at Oregon. It just feels right, though Howie Roseman will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into giving up so much draft capital for a player with some question marks.

 

King suggests questions could arise from the Eagles side of this hypothetical trade, but there would certainly be some from the Redskins side as well. 

1. Would McCloughan want to make a trade that gives a division rival a franchise QB? In two seasons with Philadelphia, Kelly's teams have gone 20-12, and that's without his ideal QB running the show. Mariota in Philly running Kelly's offense could present a significant hurdle to Washington getting back on top of the division. 
2. Is the proposed trade haul enough? The Redskins would basically be swapping first-rounders, and dropping 15 spots in the process, along with adding a pair of fourth-rounders and a 2016 first-round pick. Compared to the crop of picks Washington gave up to acquire Robert Griffin III in 2012, King's proposal seems a bit thin. If the fourth-rounders became second-round picks? That would change things. Considering the New York Jets draft at No. 6, and Mean Green really needs a QB, the 'Skins should be able to extract more out of their position in front of the   Jets   . 

> http://www.csnwashington.com/redskinsblog/major-trade-coming-between-redskins-and-eagles-marcus-mariota-rg3-chip-kelly-nfl-draft?p=ya5nbcs&ocid=yahoo

[Sperm Edwards]

A major trade coming between Redskins and Eagles ?

 

When Chip Kelly was coaching the Oregon Ducks, the offense moved at a speed unlike much college football had seen. At the helm of Kelly's most prolific teams was quarterback Marcus Mariota. Kelly, now coaching the Eagles, may be interested in reuniting with Mariota, who will be a top pick in May's NFL Draft. Since the Eagles hold the No. 20 draft pick, odds are Mariota will be long gone, and Kelly's team needs to move way up in the draft. That's where the Redskins come in. Washington holds the No. 5 pick, and if the NFC East rivals can work out a trade, Kelly would likely be able to get his guy. 

 

Peter King of MMQB.com wrote that such a scenario could unfold, with the Redskins sending the No. 5 pick to Philadelphia in exchange for the Eagles' 20th pick as well as their fourth round pick this year, and 2016 first- and fourth-round picks. From King:

Washington could be moving from five to 20 in the first round by doing this deal, with GM Scot McCloughan scoring points with his new boss for not giving away the store in a trade, but rather acquiring the store. This has so many poetic points to it. The Eagles gave Donovan McNabb to Washington a few Easters ago; now Washington would be giving a longer-term quarterback, theoretically, to Chip Kelly. The Eagles coach would be reunited with the quarterback he recruited out of a Hawaii high school and helped make a star while both were at Oregon. It just feels right, though Howie Roseman will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into giving up so much draft capital for a player with some question marks.

 

King suggests questions could arise from the Eagles side of this hypothetical trade, but there would certainly be some from the Redskins side as well. 

1. Would McCloughan want to make a trade that gives a division rival a franchise QB? In two seasons with Philadelphia, Kelly's teams have gone 20-12, and that's without his ideal QB running the show. Mariota in Philly running Kelly's offense could present a significant hurdle to Washington getting back on top of the division. 
2. Is the proposed trade haul enough? The Redskins would basically be swapping first-rounders, and dropping 15 spots in the process, along with adding a pair of fourth-rounders and a 2016 first-round pick. Compared to the crop of picks Washington gave up to acquire Robert Griffin III in 2012, King's proposal seems a bit thin. If the fourth-rounders became second-round picks? That would change things. Considering the New York Jets draft at No. 6, and Mean Green really needs a QB, the 'Skins should be able to extract more out of their position in front of the   Jets   . 

> http://www.csnwashington.com/redskinsblog/major-trade-coming-between-redskins-and-eagles-marcus-mariota-rg3-chip-kelly-nfl-draft?p=ya5nbcs&ocid=yahoo

 

Yeah, I know they don't adhere to the chart so strictly anymore, but I also think King's way off for a team trading up for their franchise QB (though time will certainly tell). This isn't the Rams moving up into the top 10 for a midget WR because he's the only one in the draft with a first round grade. That was a weak draft up top and it was probably harder to trade down and get value.

 

Chart-wise, he's proposing the Eagles send Washington about 1250 "points" (2015 #1=750, 2016 #1=~400, 2015 #4=~60, 2016 #4=~30). Washington's pick is valued at 1700. He's missing roughly the value of this year's 2nd rounder from Philly (or Foles, I suppose). That might still leave some value-separation but a trade of this magnitude I don't think they squabble over <50 "chart points" of discrepancy (as valued by Jimmy Johnson 20+ years ago before the NFL even had free agency). But with nearly 500 points of discrepancy, like King has proposed? I don't know. That's a whole lot less for Washington to take, and whatever they think of Mariota for themselves, in the back of their minds they've got to be concerned about what Kelly might turn him into, being division rivals and all.

 

I think that's a hard sell for these 2 to come to an agreement unless Philadelphia is willing to put together a chart-value type package, and they may not want to send all that Washington's way themselves.

[jetsrebirth]

It would be so great if Mariota slips to 6. If the Jets are high on him, you have the QB to develop, and if not, you can hopefully get a good deal to trade back and pick up quality picks.

 

Which means he probably won't slip.

[kelly]

Yeah, I know they don't adhere to the chart so strictly anymore, but I also think King's way off for a team trading up for their franchise QB (though time will certainly tell). This isn't the Rams moving up into the top 10 for a midget WR because he's the only one in the draft with a first round grade. That was a weak draft up top and it was probably harder to trade down and get value.

 

Chart-wise, he's proposing the Eagles send Washington about 1250 "points" (2015 #1=750, 2016 #1=~400, 2015 #4=~60, 2016 #4=~30). Washington's pick is valued at 1700. He's missing roughly the value of this year's 2nd rounder from Philly (or Foles, I suppose). That might still leave some value-separation but a trade of this magnitude I don't think they squabble over <50 "chart points" of discrepancy (as valued by Jimmy Johnson 20+ years ago before the NFL even had free agency). But with nearly 500 points of discrepancy, like King has proposed? I don't know. That's a whole lot less for Washington to take, and whatever they think of Mariota for themselves, in the back of their minds they've got to be concerned about what Kelly might turn him into, being division rivals and all.

 

I think that's a hard sell for these 2 to come to an agreement unless Philadelphia is willing to put together a chart-value type package, and they may not want to send all that Washington's way themselves.

 

I don't think he'll be there at # 6..but, if he is...we better grab him 

[Sperm Edwards]

I don't think he'll be there at # 6..but, if he is...we better grab him 

 

No one thought a lot of QBs, projected into the top 5, would drop to where they ultimately went. 

[kelly]

No one thought a lot of QBs, projected into the top 5, would drop to where they ultimately went. 

 

agreed  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

cheers ~ ~

[GREENBEAN]

Yeah, I know they don't adhere to the chart so strictly anymore, but I also think King's way off for a team trading up for their franchise QB (though time will certainly tell). This isn't the Rams moving up into the top 10 for a midget WR because he's the only one in the draft with a first round grade. That was a weak draft up top and it was probably harder to trade down and get value.

 

Chart-wise, he's proposing the Eagles send Washington about 1250 "points" (2015 #1=750, 2016 #1=~400, 2015 #4=~60, 2016 #4=~30). Washington's pick is valued at 1700. He's missing roughly the value of this year's 2nd rounder from Philly (or Foles, I suppose). That might still leave some value-separation but a trade of this magnitude I don't think they squabble over <50 "chart points" of discrepancy (as valued by Jimmy Johnson 20+ years ago before the NFL even had free agency). But with nearly 500 points of discrepancy, like King has proposed? I don't know. That's a whole lot less for Washington to take, and whatever they think of Mariota for themselves, in the back of their minds they've got to be concerned about what Kelly might turn him into, being division rivals and all.

 

I think that's a hard sell for these 2 to come to an agreement unless Philadelphia is willing to put together a chart-value type package, and they may not want to send all that Washington's way themselves.

If washington feels like the Jets will trade Mariota to the Eagles anyway, they may want to take the ransom for themselves as opposed to letting Kelly get his guy and getting nothing for it.

 

I have a hard time thinking Mariota falls to the Jets. Maybe I'm shell shocked and beaten down, but I just can't see it being so perfect.

[jack48]

If washington feels like the Jets will trade Mariota to the Eagles anyway, they may want to take the ransom for themselves as opposed to letting Kelly get his guy and getting nothing for it.

 

I have a hard time thinking Mariota falls to the Jets. Maybe I'm shell shocked and beaten down, but I just can't see it being so perfect.

I don't know.  I do not think the Jets take him unless they feel he will play some games this season.  He would be hard to just pass on, though.  That old fear that he might wind up a star.

[Sperm Edwards]

If washington feels like the Jets will trade Mariota to the Eagles anyway, they may want to take the ransom for themselves as opposed to letting Kelly get his guy and getting nothing for it.

 

I have a hard time thinking Mariota falls to the Jets. Maybe I'm shell shocked and beaten down, but I just can't see it being so perfect.

Maybe not. What was the lowest slot you thought truly likely for Manziel and Bridgewater?

[Patriot Killa]

Maybe not. What was the lowest slot you thought truly likely for Manziel and Bridgewater?

I always thought highly of Bridgewater. Manziel.. ehh...

[GREENBEAN]

Maybe not. What was the lowest slot you thought truly likely for Manziel and Bridgewater?

Good point. I had a feeling Manziel would go the way of Breese and slide to the 2nd rd , but Bridgewater i thought would be top 5 or certainly 10. I was very surprised that he slid as far as he did.  It was a better draft over all though with more dynamic impact players in the mix. Especially WR's

 

It's a very specific situation this year with the Kelly/Mariota relationship in the mix.

[GREENBEAN]

I don't know.  I do not think the Jets take him unless they feel he will play some games this season.  He would be hard to just pass on, though.  That old fear that he might wind up a star.

Well the thing is he might. He's a great athlete and is a top notch character guy and leader. He's got the size and speed as well. If he slides to us we need to take him imo. The only way we shouldn't is if someone offers two number 1's two number 2's and a QB or something rich like that.

 

That being said, I don't think he makes it to us for just that reason. We're taking him if he makes it to 6 and everyone knows it.

[jack48]

Well the thing is he might. He's a great athlete and is a top notch character guy and leader. He's got the size and speed as well. If he slides to us we need to take him imo. The only way we shouldn't is if someone offers two number 1's two number 2's and a QB or something rich like that.

 

That being said, I don't think he makes it to us for just that reason. We're taking him if he makes it to 6 and everyone knows it.

Probably not.  But I just cannot totally accept that because he comes from a spread it will be impossible for him.  Geno's problem was that he did not learn from mistakes. There is nothing to say that this guy will not.  You cannot just assume the same thing about every guy based on the situation he comes out of.  But---it would be an assumption.

[GREENBEAN]

Probably not.  But I just cannot totally accept that because he comes from a spread it will be impossible for him.  Geno's problem was that he did not learn from mistakes. There is nothing to say that this guy will not.  You cannot just assume the same thing about every guy based on the situation he comes out of.  But---it would be an assumption.

I hear ya but the assumption then applies to both sides of the debate. Anyone coming into the NFL can fail and not live up to their potential. We look at what the particular player brings to the table. Mariota has many of the traits which you would want in a leader. You take the shot with a guy like this over the Manziel types of the world.

Mariota may amount to a hill of beans but he's got the potential to the guy. I would think it impossible not to take a shot on a guy like that especially considering our QB history.

 

Or we can take another Pryor type in the 1st which isn't changing a thing for the direction of the franchise.

[aec4]

If the Eagles want Mariotta and willing to give up a lot - there's no way he gets past the Skins. They can't risk the Jets potentially taking him and making a move with the Jets. I would imagine the Skins are salivating to make that trade...

two 1's and two 2's...and Foles would be a great fall back if RGIII once again fails or inevitably gets hurt.

They aren't dealing Foles to a division rival.

The jets make the most sense because Foles has value to us. Helps offset the picks they have to give up

[Sperm Edwards]

They aren't dealing Foles to a division rival.

The jets make the most sense because Foles has value to us. Helps offset the picks they have to give up

Yup, like the 3 players we gave up to help the move up for Sanchez. Absent throwing them in we would have needed to also cough up our 3rd (or the following year's 2nd) along with our first and second.

I take for granted that Kelly doesn't want to have to fork over another 2nd rounder (or two future 2nd rounders or whatever trade value Philly or other teams assign to Foles). He'd much rather give up his outgoing QB (one he knows for certain will be off the team the next year at the latest, if they can't move him for value immedately after trading up for Mariota).

Give up an immediate, sure-thing starter to the Jets? Meh. Give him up to Washington and immediately let the Redskins out of their RGIII fiasco (on top of another pair of 1's and maybe more)? Mariota would have to be incredible, not just merely good, to counter that. Or pray for more Foles injuries on top of the Skins taking busts with those newly-acquired Eagles draft picks. And not for nothing, but Washington could surely find someone to give up some type of pick, even if it's day 3, for RGIII and be done with him cleanly.

Far less risky for them to make this type of trade out of their division.

[kelly]

I always thought highly of Bridgewater. Manziel.. ehh...

 

manziel... ughhhhhh   

[jack48]

I hear ya but the assumption then applies to both sides of the debate. Anyone coming into the NFL can fail and not live up to their potential. We look at what the particular player brings to the table. Mariota has many of the traits which you would want in a leader. You take the shot with a guy like this over the Manziel types of the world.

Mariota may amount to a hill of beans but he's got the potential to the guy. I would think it impossible not to take a shot on a guy like that especially considering our QB history.

 

Or we can take another Pryor type in the 1st which isn't changing a thing for the direction of the franchise.

 

Yup.  The assumption works both ways.  QB is a very demanding position and the likelihood of failure is probably higher.  I want our first pick to work.   I mean, I want an impact guy out of so high a selection

[GREENBEAN]

Yup.  The assumption works both ways.  QB is a very demanding position and the likelihood of failure is probably higher.  I want our first pick to work.   I mean, I want an impact guy out of so high a selection

Agreed.  To get a blue chip type would be so nice. It's actually been a while and the last time we picked this high it was Gholston. 

I would love a truly great player here. 

If not Mariota or the Trade for him, I'm really hoping for a trade down and Devante Parker. I feel he will be the best WR in this class. 

[kelly]

Agreed.  To get a blue chip type would be so nice. It's actually been a while and the last time we picked this high it was Gholston. 

I would love a truly great player here. 

If not Mariota or the Trade for him, I'm really hoping for a trade down and Devante Parker. I feel he will be the best WR in this class. 

 

" ..gholston.. "...

 

[nycdan]

If the Raiders at 4 are targeting a WR, they shouldn't be too worried about a move to 6; particularly if they like both Cooper and White.  Assuming both are available at their pick, moving to #6 would guarantee one of them.  I bring this up because IF the Jets are really high on Mariota (as in they definitely want him, not just blowing smoke), they should be able to line up a reasonable deal with Oakland to swap picks and jump ahead of the Redskins.  Value is somewhere between a 3rd and 4th rounder so you could envision our 1st and 3rd for their 1st and 4th.  Good deal for the Raiders as they probably get their guy anyway, and not expensive for the Jets if they really want the QB.

 

I'm not saying it's the right move, but for all the people saying "Don't move up for him", I think this is a scenario where it makes sense if they really want him.

 

 

Edit: Just saw another thread started with this exact idea.  Da-amn, we have some smart posters on this board.

[kelly]

2. Duck hunting: Howie Roseman, the Philadelphia Eagles' executive vice president of football operations, was a panelist at the conference. There was a discussion on the philosophy of trading up in the draft and, although no specific players were mentioned, you couldn't help but think of Marcus Mariota. There has been a lot of chatter about the Eagles (20th pick) trying to move up for the Oregon quarterback, perhaps swapping places with the Jets (sixth).Roseman didn't sound keen on the concept of a blockbuster trade up."The history of trading up for one player, when you look at those trades, isn't good for the team trading up and putting a lot of resources into it," he said. "The guys who are really good at drafting, if you're hitting on 60 percent of your first-round picks, that's a pretty good track record and it's dropping as you go through the rounds. So, really, the more chances you get -- the more tickets to the lottery you get -- really, the better shape you're going to be."He doesn't have the final say on personnel -- coach Chip Kelly, who covets Mariota, has that power -- so Roseman's opinion has to be kept in the proper context. Nevertheless, it gives us an idea what one voice in the Eagles' draft room might be thinking.

3. Robo QB: New Orleans Saints coach Sean Payton, on a panel that covered cutting-edge technology, said he envisions the day when teams have a "quarterback simulator," as he called it -- a virtual-reality contraption in which quarterbacks can "face" specific opponents. Because of the limited amount of practice time under the collective bargaining agreement, a simulator would allow quarterbacks to get the extra practice reps they don't get on the field, he said. Think about it: If your rookie quarterback is preparing to play a complex defensive scheme, he can strap on a pair of high-tech goggles and play a virtual game against that defense.It also could be a great tool for evaluating quarterbacks in the draft. Imagine conducting a virtual contest between Mariota and Jameis Winston, testing their decision-making, reaction time, anticipation, etc. against a "real" defense. Why stop there? The Jets could stage a virtual quarterback competition, which probably would be more intense than the actual competition that occurred last summer.

4. Fixing the schedule: The Jets can't blame their struggles in recent years on an unfair schedule -- at least not according to a professor at the State University of New York at Buffalo. Murat Kurt submitted a research paper at the Sloan conference that reveals a competitive imbalance in the regular-season schedule, showing a significant disparity in the total number of games played against extra-rested opponents -- i.e., teams coming off the bye week or a Thursday night game. From 2002 to 2014, the Jets played 16 such games. Only the Cincinnati Bengals (14), Pittsburgh Steelers (15) and Washington Redskins (15) had fewer games against extra-rested foes.The most ? The Buffalo Bills had 29, including one last season against the Jets. It didn't prevent the Bills from administering a 38-3 beatdown.In his paper, Kurt offers a solution to the problem, but he lost me at "mixed-integer linear program."
 

5. Back in the real world ... : Quarterback Josh McCown, who agreed to terms with the Cleveland Browns, received a contract offer from the Jets, according to the Cleveland Plain Dealer. The Jets met with McCown last week at the scouting combine, so we knew there was some degree of interest. It reportedly wasn't a competitive offer, but still: Josh McCown? Granted, there aren't a lot of great options in the free-agent market, but this tells me the Jets are banking on Geno Smith or praying Mariota falls to them. By the way, McCown reportedly agreed to a three-year deal for $14 million, including $6.25 million in guarantees.

6. Chad hanging in: Former Jets quarterback Chad Pennington, a smart guy whose opinions are respected,refuses to throw in the towel on Smith. Pennington, speaking Friday on ESPN radio, said it takes three to five years to get an accurate read on a quarterback. Smith is entering his third year.

"There's no question I think Geno Smith has the physical talent," Pennington said. "He came from a spread system at West Virginia. There's obviously a huge learning curve, and I'd hate to see them give up on a talented player like this."Another former Jets quarterback, Vinny Testaverde, also has spoken highly of Smith. It's a tight fraternity, I suppose, although something tells me Smith wouldn't get a glowing review from Mark Sanchez.

7. Waiting on Revis: I think league executives, especially those in the AFC East, are curious to see the outcome of the Darrelle Revis negotiations with the Patriots. The two sides are trying to hammer out a contract extension before March 9. Failing a new deal, they'd probably cut him because of a prohibitive $25 million cap charge for 2015 on his current deal. There's an irony here :The Jets, who traded Revis because they didn't want to pay him, have helped his leverage by professing their interest in him. (See Woody Johnson's end-of-the-season comment about welcoming a Revis return.) That has to be in the back of New England's mind as it negotiates. The Jets, of course, could get penalized by the NFL, as the Patriots filed a tampering charge. The Jets could be fined or docked a draft pick. If that happens, they can take some solace in knowing Johnson's remark probably caused the Patriots to pay a little more than they preferred, eating up valuable cap space.

8. A pioneer calls it quits: James (Shack) Harris, 67, a longtime front-office executive who made history in 1969 when he became the first black quarterback to start an opening-day game, announced his retirement from the league this week. He worked most recently in the Detroit Lions' personnel department. Harris spent six decades in the game, leaving an indelible mark. He fulfilled his dream to play quarterback at a time in our history when young African-American players were steered to other positions. His first start came against the Jets, with whom he later worked.Harris was the Jets' assistant general manager from 1993 to 1996. I remember one story about him. When they were scouting Keyshawn Johnson before the 1996 draft, the Jets dispatched Harris to the USC pro day to get an accurate 40-yard dash time. There had been some question about Johnson's speed, and they needed that last piece of information before deciding to pick him No. 1 overall. Harris, who speaks with a slow, deep drawl, doesn't waste words. He keeps it simple and direct. When he called the team after the workout to report his findings, he said simply, "Speed won't be a problem." And that was that. The Jets drafted Johnson.

 

rest of above article :

> http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49505/jets-notes-analytics-marcus-mariota-and-qb-chatter

[kelly]

Unless you’ve been living under a rock for the last 12 months, you know what the Jets’ biggest area of need is. The team has not had two starting-caliber cornerbacks in a calendar year.The cornerback issue contributed to the downfall of former general manager John Idzik, who failed to adequately address the issue last year. Now, Mike Maccagnan, Idzik’s successor, gets a crack at it.

 

Maccagnan and new coach Todd Bowles have been honest about the need at the position, with both mentioning it in interviews.“I’d say there are certain positions, if you look at our roster, based on injuries last year … cornerback would be a position we’d probably address, whether it’s the draft or pro free agency,” Maccagnan said. “But, overall, we’re going to try to address the talent and make the team as competitive as we can be. We’re early in the process from that standpoint.”

 

Like Rex Ryan, Bowles needs good cornerbacks to run his defense the way he likes to with lots of man-press coverage and blitzing.The Jets will have about $51 million in salary-cap space to use, and you can expect a significant portion of that to go toward getting some new corners; they probably need to add more than one in free agency. The debate for the Jets will be whether to spend big money on one cornerback such as Byron Maxwell or spread it among two lesser cornerbacks, hoping to get more of a return on investment. The Jets cornerbacks had four total interceptions last year. They need all the help they can get at the position.

 

There are two wild cards at the position for the Jets. Old friend Darrelle Revis could end up on the market if the Patriots do not work out a new deal with him. The Jets would have definite interest if he becomes available. The other is Dee Milliner, who is recovering from Achilles surgery and the Jets are unsure of his return date.

  Currently on roster

Dee Milliner: $3.4M cap number for 2015 (2 years left on contract)

Dexter McDougle: $674,719 (3)

Marcus Williams: $510,000 (2)

Darrin Walls: $1.1M (1)

Keith Lewis: $435,000 (3)

Curtis Brown: $660,000 (1)

Dashaun Phillips: $435,000 (3)

  Pending free agents

Kyle Wilson: The 2010 first-round pick won’t be back. Maybe he can find a home in Buffalo with Rex Ryan.

Phillip Adams: Started four games for the Jets last year. If he is back in 2015, Maccagnan failed to upgrade.

  Top free agent CBs

Byron Maxwell, Seahawks: The 27-year-old member of the Legion of Boom is considered the best cornerback on the market and there is a significant drop-off after him. Expect the Jets to make a run at Maxwell, but his asking price could skyrocket as the top cornerback available.

Kareem Jackson, Texans: GM Mike Maccagnan knows Jackson well from his time as a scout with the Texans. The 26-year-old is one of the younger corners available, making him more appealing. He has 10 career interceptions and is just entering his prime.

Chris Culliver, 49ers: There was a lot of buzz at the Scouting Combine that Culliver is in demand. The question with Culliver is whether he’s worth the headaches. He made anti-gay remarks before the Super Bowl two years ago, insulted women on Instagram and was involved in a hit-and-run incident last year. In the end, his talent will trump the trouble and he’ll get paid.

Antonio Cromartie, Cardinals: The former Jet has been campaigning for a return to Gang Green for two months. Cromartie played well last season in Arizona under then defensive coordinator Todd Bowles, and the coach may be interested in bringing him with him. The 30-year-old had hip issues in 2013, his last year with the Jets.

Brandon Flowers, Chargers: The Jets passed on signing Flowers when the Chiefs released him last June. He went to San Diego and had three interceptions, including one off Geno Smith. Will the Jets’ new bosses feel differently about Flowers this year? Flowers is only 5-foot-9, so he may be a poor fit for Bowles, who likes tall, long corners.

 

> http://nypost.com/2015/03/02/jets-maccagnan-needs-to-address-the-corner/

[kelly]

saw this..

 

~ ~  1. Tampa Bay Buccaneers -- Florida State QB Jameis Winston : This is almost a lock in my mind. How can they go anywhere else ?

 

2. Tennessee Titans -- Southern California DT Leonard Williams: He's the best player in the draft. They have to get better on defense and I think they like QB Zach Mettenberger.

 

3. Jacksonville Jaguars -- Florida OLB/DE Dante Fowler: He is coming off an impressive combine and would fill a huge need. He has emerged as the top edge rusher.

 

4. Oakland Raiders -- Nebraska OLB/DE Randy Gregory: He would team with Khalil Mack to give them a heck of a pair of young edge players.

 

5. Washington Redskins -- Clemson OLB Vic Beasley: He played defensive end in college, but will move to a 3-4 outside rusher on the next level. He's coming off an impressive combine.

 

6. Philadelphia Eagles (From    New York Jets    ) -- Oregon QB Marcus Mariota: The Eagles would be making a bold move to get a guy who fits what they do.

 

 

rest of above article :

> http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/writer/pete-prisco/25091137/nfl-mock-draft-10-eagles-make-mariota-move-pass-rushers-go-fast?FTAG=YHF7e3228e

[kelly]

A few quick thoughts on the Buffalo Bills' acquisition of former Philadelphia Eagles running back LeSean McCoy. (Note: The two teams have agreed to the trade, according to ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter, but it can't become official until next week.)

1. New York Jets linebacker David Harris, a pending free agent, just made some extra money. To get McCoy, the Bills traded linebacker Kiko Alonso, the runner-up to Sheldon Richardson in the 2013 NFL Defensive Rookie of the Year voting. Now old friend Rex Ryan has a hole in his linebacking corps, and he's expected to make a push for Harris, who ran his defense for six years in New York. Ryan was planning to pursue Harris anyway, but now the need is greater. So is Harris' leverage, which could force the Jets to pay more than they anticipated. They can't afford to lose him because ...

2. You could argue McCoy is now the best offensive weapon in the AFC East, not counting quarterbacks. It's either McCoy or New England Patriots tight end Rob Gronkowski. McCoy has rushed for a league-high 6,155 yards since 2010. The Jets almost always have a highly-ranked run defense, and they'll need to be on their game in 2015 with McCoy in the division.

3. Running back C.J. Spiller is a goner in Buffalo, intensifying speculation he's headed to the Jets as a free agent. But as I said earlier, I don't believe the Jets will be chasing Spiller in free agency.

4. Ryan said at his introductory news conference that his offense would be Ground & Pound. McCoy helps him immeasurably, but guess what? You can't win in this league without a quarterback, and Ryan still doesn't have one.

 

> http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/jets/post/_/id/49570/buffalo-bills-trade-for-lesean-mccoy-creates-ripples-in-afc-east

[kelly]

If Marcus Mariota is available at No. 6 in next month's NFL Draft, he likely will be taken. But a league source said the Jets, in desperate need for a quarterback, won't be selecting the former Oregon QB there and that the Eagles and Jets would make a trade if the scenario plays out.

 

Speaking on the condition of anonymity, a highly-placed league source termed a potential marriage between Mariota , the Heisman and Maxwell Award winner after a stunning 2014 season, and the Jets as “highly unlikely.” The source said that the Jets aren't in the mood to pick Mariota with their sixth pick and that if the Oregon quarterback is available, the “Jets will be shipping that pick away.”

The likely landing spot?“Philadelphia would make that move and pay that price. We're talking multiple picks and a player,” the source said. “The Jets would be open to moving the pick and the Eagles have internally prepared to move up in the draft. There are contingencies in place and they know that Marcus is that perfect fit.”

 

Of course, Mariota played under now Eagles head coach Chip Kelly before Kelly left for the NFL in 2013. Given his obvious familiarity with the Eagles' offense, Mariota would walk into Philadelphia as the likely starting quarterback of the Eagles come Week 1.

 

The source said with “100 percent certainty” that if Mariota is available at No. 6 it will be the Eagles, and not the Jets, who will be picking at that spot.“The Eagles covet Marcus and rightly so. He's a great fit for their offense,” the source said. “This could be a case where the Jets could cash in and would be willing to do so. Not quite Ricky Williams level but we're talking multiple picks and perhaps a player.”

 

The Williams trade refers to the 1999 NFL Draft deal where the New Orleans Saints sent eight draft picks to the Washington Redskins so they could move up seven slots to the No. 5 selection to select Williams, who won the Heisman the year before as a running back at Texas. 

 

> http://www.metro.us/kristian-dyer/source-if-marcus-mariota-is-at-no-6-eagles-will-make-trade-with-jets/zsJocd---mCQODxZ1xjBVA/