Is Bowles a Safe Bet to Fix Pryor?

[Ghost]

I really hope you're wrong on this one...but I do recall a play late in the season where he got run over at/near the goal line and made what looked like a half-hearted attempt to make the tackle. Hopefully just a bad day.

I hope I'm wrong, too. I honestly can't remember any plays involving Pryor that made me excited for the future. I remember him missing on tackles and stinking up the place in coverage.

The only good play I remember came against the Bengals (pre-season) where he forced and recovered a fumble. I hope this guy wakes up. I don't mind when players have big mouths as long as they can back it up on the field, something Pryor has failed to do.

[AFJF]

I hope I'm wrong, too. I honestly can't remember any plays involving Pryor that made me excited for the future. I remember him missing on tackles and stinking up the place in coverage.

The only good play I remember came against the Bengals (pre-season) where he forced and recovered a fumble. I hope this guy wakes up. I don't mind when players have big mouths as long as they can back it up on the field, something Pryor has failed to do.

 

Another play that worries me was in wk 17 against Miami.  On Lamar Miller's 97 yd TD run Miami had good blocking up front but Pryor was untouched.  He was a step or two away from the gap that Miller shot through so the only defender with a chance to stop him.  As Pryor stepped up, he just fell flat on his face and didn't get a hand on him....hopefully lost his footing and not trying to avoid contact.

[legler82]

What's there to fix?  The guy is what is he is glorified Eric S

mith.

 

Leave him at Strong Safety and throw away the key.

 

I'm going to give Idzik and company the benefit of the doubt and believe that thought they were drafting a highly rated FS, which Pryor was, and got fooled into drafting a "glorified Eric Smith".  Coming into the draft they already had 3 capable SSs on the roster with Landry, Allen and Jarrett.  If they knowingly used a 1st on a SS despite already being 3 deep at the position and desperately needing a coverage FS, then Idzik and our personnel department were even more incompetent than I could have imagined.

[Ex-Rex]

I like Allen more to play his Nickel Linebacker position. He's 6"2 210 played some corner last year and can hit. Pryor is one of the most underwhelming Jets picks in a while. Since he was not selected by the new regimen they have no loyalty to play the kid.

He was considered a first round pick, but didn't live up to it. Rex used him wrong and it got in his head. I think Bowles will use him for what he is - a big hitting in the box safety who can blitz the QB. He is NOT a free safety by any means. He can't cover and can't tackle in space. He may get better at it as he matures but I doubt he will be anything resembling a free safety. Play him where he can have the biggest impact. For my money, I would have never taken him last year in the first place. I was shocked that Idzik bypassed Kyle Fuller and a few other CB's to take essentially what the Jets already had in abundance. Stupid is as stupid does.

[Ex-Rex]

I'm going to give Idzik and company the benefit of the doubt and believe that thought they were drafting a highly rated FS, which Pryor was, and got fooled into drafting a "glorified Eric Smith".  Coming into the draft they already had 3 capable SSs on the roster with Landry, Allen and Jarrett.  If they knowingly used a 1st on a SS despite already being 3 deep at the position and desperately needing a coverage FS, then Idzik and our personnel department were even more incompetent than I could have imagined.

He didn't play free safety at Louisville so how in the freakin world could Idzik have thought he was getting a free safety. Even Rex said when they drafted him that he was a big hitter and a strong safety that would play in the box and shore up the run defense. 

[Ex-Rex]

Another play that worries me was in wk 17 against Miami.  On Lamar Miller's 97 yd TD run Miami had good blocking up front but Pryor was untouched.  He was a step or two away from the gap that Miller shot through so the only defender with a chance to stop him.  As Pryor stepped up, he just fell flat on his face and didn't get a hand on him....hopefully lost his footing and not trying to avoid contact.

I saw that too. I have my doubts about this guy, but I am sure Big Mac and Bowles will weed out the underachievers and send them packing. Pryor may be a bust, but I would give him another shot since he is still young and probably learned very little under Rex, who knew his time was up and didn't coach his defense much at all.

[Villain The Foe]

Why does everyone keep referring to putting Pryor "back" at SS?  He was a FS in college.

Because he was drafted as a Strong Safety, not a Free Safety. Also, when playing at Louisville it didnt really matter that they had a SS in Pryor playing FS. It wasnt like he was playing in the Pac 12 or something. 

[legler82]

He didn't play free safety at Louisville so how in the freakin world could Idzik have thought he was getting a free safety. Even Rex said when they drafted him that he was a big hitter and a strong safety that would play in the box and shore up the run defense. 

 

He did play FS at Louisville and EVERY major draft site listed him as a FS.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012/profiles/calvin-pryor?id=2543469

 

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=119927&draftyear=2014&genpos=FS

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1851284/calvin-pryor

[legler82]

Because he was drafted as a Strong Safety, not a Free Safety. Also, when playing at Louisville it didnt really matter that they had a SS in Pryor playing FS. It wasnt like he was playing in the Pac 12 or something. 

 

With regards to the bold, how do you know that Idzik and Rex told you?

[slats]

He didn't play free safety at Louisville so how in the freakin world could Idzik have thought he was getting a free safety. Even Rex said when they drafted him that he was a big hitter and a strong safety that would play in the box and shore up the run defense. 

 

Actually, no. Rex envisioned him in coverage shortening the arms of receivers with intimidating hits and the threats thereof. Ideally, that's what he'd still develop into. 

[flgreen]

I didn't like the selection of Pryor at all last year.  He played about the way I thought he would play.  

 

With that said, I think he has a good chance to be one of the big break out players on the Jets this year.  Bowles "Big Nickel" position, was custom written for Pryor's skill set.   Big impact tackler, Not a very good cover guy in space, but enough short area cover skills to do a good job in the short middle of the field.

 

and to light up a WR, RB,TE when they catch the ball.  Strong against the run.     The Big nickle position is a key component of Bowles D.   Pryor is going to get an opportunity to show case his skill set

[Villain The Foe]

With regards to the bold, how do you know that Idzik and Rex told you?

No. I never met John Idzik and Rex Ryan, but ever since the pick was made Calvin Pryor was considered a Strong Safety. Even when compared to Clinton-Dix last year. If you were looking for a Free Safety then you would go Clinton Dix, if you were looking for a Strong Safety then you would go Calvin Pryor. 

Did you really think that Pryor was a Free Safety this entire time or are you waiting for Idzik and Rex to tell you exactly what he is? 

[legler82]

I didn't like the selection of Pryor at all last year.  He played about the way I thought he would play.  

 

With that said, I think he has a good chance to be one of the big break out players on the Jets this year.  Bowles "Big Nickel" position, was custom written for Pryor's skill set.   Big impact tackler, Not a very good cover guy in space, but enough short area cover skills to do a good job in the short middle of the field.

 

and to light up a WR, RB,TE when they catch the ball.  Strong against the run.     The Big nickle position is a key component of Bowles D.   Pryor is going to get an opportunity to show case his skill set

 

He's a big impact "hitter" NOT "tackler"; there's a big difference.  His desire to always land the big hit often times causes him to take poor angles and/or miss tackles.

[flgreen]

He's a big impact "hitter" NOT "tackler"; there's a big difference.  His desire to always land the big hit often times causes him to take poor angles and/or miss tackles.

I agree

 

That was a big part of his problem last year.   He would be out alone with someone, and instead of wrapping them up and holding them to a 7 yard gain,  try to make the big highlight reel hit, and fly right by them, allowing them to pick up another 15-30 yards.

 

The new position he is going to frequently be in traffic, close to the LOS, with 3-4 DB's behind him.   That's where he can lay the wood on them. 

[legler82]

No. I never met John Idzik and Rex Ryan, but ever since the pick was made Calvin Pryor was considered a Strong Safety. Even when compared to Clinton-Dix last year. If you were looking for a Free Safety then you would go Clinton Dix, if you were looking for a Strong Safety then you would go Calvin Pryor. 

Did you really think that Pryor was a Free Safety this entire time or are you waiting for Idzik and Rex to tell you exactly what he is? 

 

I saw a college FS who once he got on a NFL field looked more like a SS.  I personally thought even while at Louisville that he projected more as a SS.   However, given that he played FS in college, we had 3 more than capable SSs already on the roster, had a desperate need that draft for a FS and Rex played him mostly at FS all of last year, I made an educated guess that they thought they were getting a FS.  Note I'm not saying they were right.  

[Villain The Foe]

I saw a college FS who once he got on a NFL field looked more like a SS.  I personally thought even while at Louisville that he projected more as a SS.   However, given that he played FS in college, we had 3 more than capable SSs already on the roster, had a desperate need that draft for a FS and Rex played him mostly at FS all of last year, I made an educated guess that they thought they were getting a FS.  Note I'm not saying they were right.  

Seems like everyone is making educated guesses over here given that some may have made the guess that with guys like Antonio Allen moving around and the depletion of CB's it caused Pryor to play out of position given what had to be compensated at other parts of the secondary. 

 

 

But the guy is a strong safety so what does it matter...

[ylekram]

Why does everyone keep referring to putting Pryor "back" at SS?  He was a FS in college.

it fits the " rex sucks" agenda

[legler82]

it fits the " rex sucks" agenda

 

Pretty much.

[Villain The Foe]

it fits the " rex sucks" agenda

 

 

Pretty much.

...because thats the answer you were looking for the entire time huh? 

 

Rex does suck though. People who think thats more of an agenda than actual fact would also assume that a guy playing FS at Louisville is actually a FS given that he played in the Big East Conference with "offensive powerhouses" such as UConn, Rutgers, Pitt, Cincy and Syracuse. lol. 

[dbatesman]

If Rex couldn't coach him up, nobody can.

[Shockwave]

They called this guy the Louisville Slugger.. Dude is soft! Kyle Wilson 2.0

I think hell be worse then Kyle Wilson. 

 

Calvin Pryor is not a big guy with a similar build as Kyle Wilson. Thats a problem when you have to cover Te/WR these days that are all huge. All those WR/TE that are 6'3 and up are also much faster then him. He is simply not that good of an athlete. People are forgetting him getting run over by Brandon Oliver? 

 

He did play FS at Louisville and EVERY major draft site listed him as a FS.

 

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012/profiles/calvin-pryor?id=2543469

 

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=119927&draftyear=2014&genpos=FS

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1851284/calvin-pryor

 

Exactly. People are making too much of this. Our Safeties were interchangeable. He was not out of position. In todays NFL he is going to have to play in coverage a TON. Get used to it. 

 

As far as the general topic goes if Bowles can fix him that would be great. We expected Rex to Fix gholston as well but that didn't happen.  All we can ask for is a legit competition where the best person wins and a guy isn't forced into the lineup simply bc he was drafted high. 

 

These were the kind of draft picks that got everyone fired - Deservedly so. 

[legler82]

...because thats the answer you were looking for the entire time huh? 

 

Rex does suck though. People who think thats more of an agenda than actual fact would also assume that a guy playing FS at Louisville is actually a FS given that he played in the Big East Conference with "offensive powerhouses" such as UConn, Rutgers, Pitt, Cincy and Syracuse. lol. 

 

No one is assuming he is FS; he's always been one.  The fact that he wasn't very good at it at the NFL level his rookie year is a different discussion all together.  My "agenda" was simply to draw attention to the false narrative that he was a SS at some point that Rex was forcing to play FS and needed to be placed "back" at SS.  He NEVER was a SS.  However, you and I agree that he would probably be best served at SS instead of FS given his style of play and deficiencies in coverage.

[Jetster]

If Rex couldn't coach him up, nobody can.

Damn straight. The turnovers we created were incredible....uh, well, we got a couple.

Meanwhile in 2013 the Pats were in the top 5 in creating TOs with guys like Chris Jones & Ninkovich, McCourty & a bunch of NOBODIES.

[legler82]

I think hell be worse then Kyle Wilson. 

 

Calvin Pryor is not a big guy with a similar build as Kyle Wilson. Thats a problem when you have to cover Te/WR these days that are all huge. All those WR/TE that are 6'3 and up are also much faster then him. He is simply not that good of an athlete. People are forgetting him getting run over by Brandon Oliver? 

 

 

Exactly. People are making too much of this. Our Safeties were interchangeable. He was not out of position. In todays NFL he is going to have to play in coverage a TON. Get used to it. 

 

As far as the general topic goes if Bowles can fix him that would be great. We expected Rex to Fix gholston as well but that didn't happen.  All we can ask for is a legit competition where the best person wins and a guy isn't forced into the lineup simply bc he was drafted high. 

 

These were the kind of draft picks that got everyone fired - Deservedly so. 

 

Personally, I prefer Allen at SS because he's good at man on man coverage on TEs and he's a solid tackler.  Franky, I find good tacklers more appealing than big hitters.  Like you said, hopefully Bowles and company do not fall into the trap of having to play Pryor simply because he was a 1st round pick.  Instead play the best guy.

[ylekram]

...because thats the answer you were looking for the entire time huh? 

 

Rex does suck though. People who think thats more of an agenda than actual fact would also assume that a guy playing FS at Louisville is actually a FS given that he played in the Big East Conference with "offensive powerhouses" such as UConn, Rutgers, Pitt, Cincy and Syracuse. lol. 

its even more of a "lol" that this guy was selected with the 18th overall pick in the first place. a really big "lol". your boy idzik is also a "lol". actually he is more of a "lmfao" than a "lol".

[Villain The Foe]

No one is assuming he is FS; he's always been one.  The fact that he wasn't very good at it at the NFL level his rookie year is a different discussion all together.  My "agenda" was simply to draw attention to the false narrative that he was a SS at some point that Rex was forcing to play FS and needed to be placed "back" at SS.  He NEVER was a SS.  However, you and I agree that he would probably be best served at SS instead of FS given his style of play and deficiencies in coverage.

Really? Louisville's former head coach Charlie Strong disagrees with you. He was interviewed by the Jets and Rex and when speaking to them stated that Calvin Pryor is more of a Strong Safety. He went on about how he even nicknamed Pryor "Linebacker" because of his hitting ability and ability to play in the box. Granted, he did talk about how he could also cover in man coverage with TE's but he emphasized that the guy given his skill set was basically a Strong Safety. Furthermore, Strong was excited that Pryor was taken by the Jets because he felt that with the way Rex played defense it would really compliment what Pryor can do. 

 

That's coming from a guy who was Pryor's head coach for 3 seasons at Louisville and told the team that drafted him that he was a Strong Safety. 

[legler82]

Really? Louisville's former head coach Charlie Strong disagrees with you. He was interviewed by the Jets and Rex and when speaking to them stated that Calvin Pryor is more of a Strong Safety. He went on about how he even nicknamed Pryor "Linebacker" because of his hitting ability and ability to play in the box. Granted, he did talk about how he could also cover in man coverage with TE's but he emphasized that the guy given his skill set was basically a Strong Safety. Furthermore, Strong was excited that Pryor was taken by the Jets because he felt that with the way Rex played defense it would really compliment what Pryor can do. 

 

That's coming from a guy who was Pryor's head coach for 3 seasons at Louisville and told the team that drafted him that he was a Strong Safety. 

 

Are you retarded or just stupid?  How exactly does what Charlie Strong said disagrees with what I wrote? Despite what Coach Strong said to Rex, both he and Rex played him predominantly at FS.  At this point I'm completely clueless on what it is you are trying to argue.  Do you not believe Pryor played FS both in college and with the Jets last year?  Do you not understand the distinction between the position where one thinks a player should be playing versus where they are actually playing?

 

EDIT:  For example, I think Ty Montgomery should be playing RB but he's a WR in college and more than likely will be drafted as such in the pros.  Until someone actually comes to the realization that he should really be playing RB, he's a WR no matter what I say on an message board or what his college coach may suggest to his NFL coach.

[Pac]

I remember when Rex was going to turn Gholston into a star, remember when he told us that?

 

No one remembers that because he never said it.  Don't succumb to the elementary mind tricks of the ilk.

 

 

In all honesty, I think that Bowels just needs to put him back at his real position, unlike Rex did, and we will see if he can play or not. If he cannot play at his natural position, he probably was a huge bust and waste of a premium draft pick.

 

 

Bowels and Macc were so terrified of trying to win with the roster that Idzik burdened Rex with that they spent more money on DB's than any team ever has.

 

The last time we had anywhere near the backfield we currently have this was the #1 defense in the league.  Lets hope Bowles, who thankfully runs a very similar system to Rex, can produce similar results.

[Villain The Foe]

Are you retarded or just stupid?  How exactly does what Charlie Strong said disagrees with what I wrote? Despite what Coach Strong said to Rex, both he and Rex played him predominantly at FS.  At this point I'm completely clueless on what it is you are trying to argue.  Do you not believe Pryor played FS both in college and with the Jets last year?  Do you not understand the distinction between the position where one thinks a player should be playing versus where they are actually playing?

 

EDIT:  For example, I think Ty Montgomery should be playing RB but he's a WR in college and more than likely will be drafted as such in the pros.  Until someone actually comes to the realization that he should really be playing RB, he's a WR no matter what I say on an message board or what his college coach may suggest to his NFL coach.

Here's your answer, because though he played FS in college, he was drafted to the pros as an SS. Thats why. 

You couldn't miss that even if you WERE retarded or stupid, so if you did that would be a "special" type of retarded or stupid. 

 

And Rex played Pryor a sh*t load at FS, but as I said he played Pryor mostly at FS because of injuries and lack of talent in the secondary. Here's a piece of an article: 

 

“He’s playing pretty well,” defensive coordinator Dennis Thurman said. “Sometimes you just don’t have opportunities. If you don’t have the opportunities, you can’t manufacture them. That’s when you break structure of your scheme and your system. You can’t just go looking for hits and trying to have impact that way.”

Pryor, to his credit, was not making excuses.

“I look myself in the mirror and I have to step it up,” he said. “I have to play football the way I know how to play football.”

Part of the problem has been the way the Jets have used Pryor. He is playing deep safety most of the time as the Jets don’t have a player that fits the description of a true free safety on the roster. The Jets have also played a ton more zone coverage with safety help this season to cover up for their deficiencies at cornerback.

 

The Jets don’t sound like they are down on Pryor, but they also sound like they have accepted that he won’t flourish until they can surround him with more talent in the secondary and allow him to play closer to the line of scrimmage as a box safety.

 

You can read the entire article here. 

http://nypost.com/2014/10/24/pryor-beware-ryan-says-rookie-safety-has-not-made-big-impact/

 

So yeah, he played FS in college but his head coach that utilized him in that role told the team that drafted him that he was actually a SS player that flourishes in the box, and the article provided shows that out of necessity Pryor was used "in a failing effort" at FS. 

 

It doesnt make someone retarded or stupid when they're diametrically opposed to your position. Whats wrong with people having to resort to ad hominem attacks when they dont get their way? 

[legler82]

Here's your answer, because though he played FS in college, he was drafted to the pros as an SS. Thats why. 

You couldn't miss that even if you WERE retarded or stupid, so if you did that would be a "special" type of retarded or stupid. 

 

And Rex played Pryor a sh*t load at FS, but as I said he played Pryor mostly at FS because of injuries and lack of talent in the secondary. Here's a piece of an article: 

 

“He’s playing pretty well,” defensive coordinator Dennis Thurman said. “Sometimes you just don’t have opportunities. If you don’t have the opportunities, you can’t manufacture them. That’s when you break structure of your scheme and your system. You can’t just go looking for hits and trying to have impact that way.”

Pryor, to his credit, was not making excuses.

“I look myself in the mirror and I have to step it up,” he said. “I have to play football the way I know how to play football.”

Part of the problem has been the way the Jets have used Pryor. He is playing deep safety most of the time as the Jets don’t have a player that fits the description of a true free safety on the roster. The Jets have also played a ton more zone coverage with safety help this season to cover up for their deficiencies at cornerback.

 

The Jets don’t sound like they are down on Pryor, but they also sound like they have accepted that he won’t flourish until they can surround him with more talent in the secondary and allow him to play closer to the line of scrimmage as a box safety.

 

You can read the entire article here. 

http://nypost.com/2014/10/24/pryor-beware-ryan-says-rookie-safety-has-not-made-big-impact/

 

So yeah, he played FS in college but his head coach that utilized him in that role told the team that drafted him that he was actually a SS player that flourishes in the box, and the article provided shows that out of necessity Pryor was used "in a failing effort" at FS. 

 

It doesnt make someone retarded or stupid when they're diametrically opposed to your position. Whats wrong with people having to resort to ad hominem attacks when they dont get their way? 

 

....

[Villain The Foe]

You ******* moron MY POSITION YOUR POSITION…LOL

Glad to see that I won yet another debate. 

 

 

Rookie. 

[Ghost]

Another play that worries me was in wk 17 against Miami. On Lamar Miller's 97 yd TD run Miami had good blocking up front but Pryor was untouched. He was a step or two away from the gap that Miller shot through so the only defender with a chance to stop him. As Pryor stepped up, he just fell flat on his face and didn't get a hand on him....hopefully lost his footing and not trying to avoid contact.

LOL I remember that.

[drdetroit]

I'm going to give Idzik and company the benefit of the doubt and believe that thought they were drafting a highly rated FS, which Pryor was, and got fooled into drafting a "glorified Eric Smith". Coming into the draft they already had 3 capable SSs on the roster with Landry, Allen and Jarrett. If they knowingly used a 1st on a SS despite already being 3 deep at the position and desperately needing a coverage FS, then Idzik and our personnel department were even more incompetent than I could have imagined.

You are a better talent evaluator than John Idzik. All the draft sites had Clinton-Dix rated ahead of Pryor literally all of them.

Let Allen play FS next season and Pryor can compete with Landry and Jarret for SS job.

I'd also like to see us give gay Kerry another shot.

[legler82]

BTW it's a pretty funny narrative when you write it out.  A coverage FS needy team coming into the draft uses their first round pick on a collegiate FS who supposedly they and his college coach project as an in the box SS.  This team does so despite already having 3 in the box SSs, which can be argued are just as good if not better than the one they drafted.  Not to mention sitting there when they pick is a clear cut coverage FS with a comparable rating to that of the fake FS they drafted.  Ultimately, they are forced to play the rookie FS in name only at, you guessed it, FS because they failed to address the gaping hole at the FS with any of their remaining 11 picks.  No wonder everyone got fired.

[legler82]

Glad to see that I won yet another debate. 

 

 

Rookie. 

 

Retard