Jetsfan80 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Are you re-thinking your position? I know many said they preferred Geno to Fitz because, at least if Geno failed, he'd fail spectacularly, whereas the Jets would win about 7-9 games with Fitz. Thus this would put us in "no mans land", where we'd likely miss the playoffs but also not earn a top draft pick. However, isn't it more fun to be as competitive as possible? Isn't it nice to finally see a great defensive performance rewarded thanks to some points being score on the other side of the ball? Yes, Fitz had his struggles. But he led a TD drive early to give us the lead and a TD drive late to seal the victory. I'm not convinced Geno would have done the same. In years past this was a game that would have gotten away from us. And those losses are demoralizing to a team. Having a competent QB, while not anywhere close to as good as having an elite QB (though you saw what we did to an elite QB last night), is far more preferable to having a tank-job season just to secure a high draft pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I was on board for tanking last season to get Winston, or Mariota, Rex ****ed that up. I didn't see many saying anything about tanking this season. And what the **** is there to tank for? There isn't 1 QB worth spit in the upcoming draft, and don't give me this Conner Cook BS dude is as inaccurate as they come, just because you have the prototypical NFL QB body, and size doesn't make you a good NFL QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Who the hell wanted to see us tank? I would still have preferred Smith not to get hurt and see him in this offense, but Fitz has done nothing to be taken out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Are you re-thinking your position? I know many said they preferred Geno to Fitz because, at least if Geno failed, he'd fail spectacularly, whereas the Jets would win about 7-9 games with Fitz. Thus this would put us in "no mans land", where we'd likely miss the playoffs but also not earn a top draft pick. However, isn't it more fun to be as competitive as possible? Isn't it nice to finally see a great defensive performance rewarded thanks to some points being score on the other side of the ball? Yes, Fitz had his struggles. But he led a TD drive early to give us the lead and a TD drive late to seal the victory. I'm not convinced Geno would have done the same. In years past this was a game that would have gotten away from us. And those losses are demoralizing to a team. Having a competent QB, while not anywhere close to as good as having an elite QB (though you saw what we did to an elite QB last night), is far more preferable to having a tank-job season just to secure a high draft pick. Anyone who thought this was not going to be a good solid football team was simply not paying attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
artemusclyde Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I was on board for tanking last season to get Winston, or Mariota, Rex ****ed that up. I didn't see many saying anything about tanking this season. And what the **** is there to tank for? There isn't 1 QB worth spit in the upcoming draft, and don't give me this Conner Cook BS dude is as inaccurate as they come, just because you have the prototypical NFL QB body, and size doesn't make you a good NFL QB. Jared Goff looks legit. He might fall though cause he has similar arm strength and size to Bridgewater. Hopefully, he has a crappy pro day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I keep saying it... 10 wins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 talk about a straw man argument Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Bit Special Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 14 games left to play. Lots of season left to f#ck up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunAticcalm Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 However, isn't it more fun to be as competitive as possible? Over drafting a franchise quarterback and becoming perennial contenders? NO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 Over drafting a franchise quarterback and becoming perennial contenders? NO. Franchise QB's can, and have, been drafted outside of the top 10 picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obrien2Toon Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Last year was the time to tank. Who was talking about tanking this year. Maccag put together a nice roster, there was no shot at tanking this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonWaterfalls Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 In the past (05, 07) I was fine wis shooting for draft position to possibly get a big time QB obviously that never worked out. But after the Sanchez nightmare and watching good QBs come out of later rounds, I've decided that it's more practical to just wait it out. I was all for Geno being drafted, it didn't work out but I rather have a player fall to us and not pan out than to tank, and get a guy like Jamarcus Russell. by the way, this is my first post here. I'm new in town after spending over a decade at another forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
predator_05 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Tank for who? Nobody worth tanking for in next year's draft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jet Nut Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I was on board for tanking last season to get Winston, or Mariota, Rex ****ed that up. I didn't see many saying anything about tanking this season. And what the **** is there to tank for? There isn't 1 QB worth spit in the upcoming draft, and don't give me this Conner Cook BS dude is as inaccurate as they come, just because you have the prototypical NFL QB body, and size doesn't make you a good NFL QB. No QBs this year? You're kidding right? You think today that the top QBs have more questions about them than Winston and his off field nonsense or Mariota and can his game translate to the NFL talk of a year ago? And Rex ****ed nothing up, the guy was on his death walk with the Jets you think he was going to tank games? No team should, but thats another topic. But then again, I remember sitting in my seats at GS and the whole stadium screaming because we beat the Raiders and missed out on the sure fire, can't miss, HOF guaranteed, the great all around RB..........Reggie Bush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetster Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I read these boards everyday, I don't remember ANY conversation regarding tanking THIS YEAR? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Tank for who? Nobody worth tanking for in next year's draft Nobody is ever worth tanking for. Tanking infects your organization and players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I will never understand a fan rooting for his team to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 JF80 making an astute, passionate argument against no one in particular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Straw Man A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument which was not advanced by that opponent.[1] The so-called typical "attacking a straw man" argument creates the illusion of having completely refuted or defeated an opponent's proposition by covertly replacing it with a different proposition (i.e., "stand up a straw man") and then to refute or defeat that false argument ("knock down a straw man") instead of the original proposition.[2][3] This technique has been used throughout history in polemical debate, particularly in arguments about highly charged emotional issues where a fiery, entertaining "battle" and the defeat of an "enemy" may be more valued than critical thinking or understanding both sides of the issue. In the United Kingdom the argument is also known as an Aunt Sally, after the pub game of the same name where patrons throw sticks or battens at a model of an old woman's head.[4][5] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Straw Man A straw man is a common form of argument and is an informal fallacy based on giving the impression of refuting an opponent's argument, while actually refuting an argument which was not advanced by that opponent.[1] The so-called typical "attacking a straw man" argument creates the illusion of having completely refuted or defeated an opponent's proposition by covertly replacing it with a different proposition (i.e., "stand up a straw man") and then to refute or defeat that false argument ("knock down a straw man") instead of the original proposition.[2][3] This technique has been used throughout history in polemical debate, particularly in arguments about highly charged emotional issues where a fiery, entertaining "battle" and the defeat of an "enemy" may be more valued than critical thinking or understanding both sides of the issue. In the United Kingdom the argument is also known as an Aunt Sally, after the pub game of the same name where patrons throw sticks or battens at a model of an old woman's head.[4][5] so straw man has nothing to do w/ Darryl Strawberry? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 As others have said, the end of last year was the time to lose a couple of games and get either Mariota or Winston. As things turned our, Williams fell to us at #6 but that would have been rated the longest of long shots by draft prognosticators before it actually happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 so straw man has nothing to do w/ Darryl Strawberry? <chuckles> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Nobody is ever worth tanking for. Tanking infects your organization and players. I never thought of it that way. The Colts have looked pretty infected the last three times they stepped on the field. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Used in this context is tanking the same as expecting to lose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryK Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Not saying I'm a doubter, but I need to see us win AFTER teams take away the short pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 Used in this context is tanking the same as expecting to lose Yes, but the reasoning seemed to be the following: People felt that based on Fitz's track record, he'd keep us competitive but not good enough to make it to the next level (correct thinking). Before Geno got punched, he was preferred by some because of a supposedly higher ceiling, as well as the lower floor. Essentially, if Geno was going to fail, they wanted a spectacular failure so that we could earn a top draft pick. This is a loser mentality in my mind. I wanted Fitz to start from the beginning because I want to win as many games as possible and don't believe Geno actually has a particularly high ceiling because of his mental limitations and lack of leadership skills at the most important position on the field. Let us worry about our draft slot later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I never thought of it that way. The Colts have looked pretty infected the last three times they stepped on the field. Maybe if it's end of season and you're sitting on 2 wins maybe worth "starting the young guys to get them experience" (AKA "tanking") is one thing. But going into season with that mindset just builds culture of losing imho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I never thought of it that way. The Colts have looked pretty infected the last three times they stepped on the field. Yeah and last three years too since they got him. Strategic losses at the end of the year should be considered (and implemented) for team at or near the top of the draft and once their season is already toast. There is rarely one or two players so far above the rest that implemneting such a strategy makes sense but last year, for a team desperate for a QB I think there were two such players. The notion of infection within and organization is completely dopey. Rex and Idzik did not do it last year because they put their personal need to keep their jobs above ther need of the organization (QB). I understand it to be sure but let's not pretend that either of them were operating with the best interests of the Jets in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EM31 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Yes, but the reasoning seemed to be the following: People felt that based on Fitz's track record, he'd keep us competitive but not good enough to make it to the next level (correct thinking). Before Geno got punched, he was preferred by some because of a supposedly higher ceiling, as well as the lower floor. Essentially, if Geno was going to fail, they wanted a spectacular failure so that we could earn a top draft pick. This is a loser mentality in my mind. I wanted Fitz to start from the beginning because I want to win as many games as possible and don't believe Geno actually has a particularly high ceiling because of his mental limitations and lack of leadership skills at the most important position on the field. Let us worry about our draft slot later. I wanted Fitz as well but as Smashmouth said, anyone watching the way this team was being assembled could see right away that we were never ever going to be a 4 win team even with Geno. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted September 23, 2015 Author Share Posted September 23, 2015 I never thought of it that way. The Colts have looked pretty infected the last three times they stepped on the field. Colts are simply an overrated organization with an even more clueless owner than Woody Johnson. They drafted Elway, Peyton, and Luck # 1 overall and have one Super Bowl title to show for it. They beat up on a bad division but struggle against everyone else. Their defense was pretty much awful headed into this season yet their biggest acquisitions were Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, and Phillip Dorsett in round 1. I mean, wtf. They're just collecting University of Miami skill position players and ignoring everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jgb Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Colts are simply an overrated organization with an even more clueless owner than Woody Johnson. They drafted Elway, Peyton, and Luck # 1 overall and have one Super Bowl title to show for it. They beat up on a bad division but struggle against everyone else. Their defense was pretty much awful headed into this season yet their biggest acquisitions were Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, and Phillip Dorsett in round 1. I mean, wtf. don't forget trent richardson for a 1st rounder. If the CLEVELAND BROWNS have an offense player on the trade block, especially one that appears at first glance to be their best player, proceed cautiously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Colts are simply an overrated organization with an even more clueless owner than Woody Johnson. They drafted Elway, Peyton, and Luck # 1 overall and have one Super Bowl title to show for it. They beat up on a bad division but struggle against everyone else. Their defense was pretty much awful headed into this season yet their biggest acquisitions were Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, and Phillip Dorsett in round 1. I mean, wtf. You left out Jeff George Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlito1171 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 After signing Revis, Cro, Skrine, and trading for BMarsh tanking was never in the question....whoever had tanking aspirations were being delusional... I'm still not sure exactly how good this team will be, but they will compete every game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ljr Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Tanking is for loser *$$-holes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RutgersJetFan Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Boy, you sure showed them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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