Butt Fumble Game

[JetsFanatic]

Simply put, Sanchez stinks. It honestly doesn't make me happy saying that.

[SAR I]

Wtf are you watchingMoore is not only pushed back but steered right into the path of Sanchez. I've watched it over and over. Moore was dominated on the play and almost picked up and thrown into Sanchez. 

Finally the voice of reason.

SAR I

[SAR I]

Sanchez is the worst QB the Jets have ever had. Geno Smith has a brighter future. 

You're better than this, Sperm.

Mark Sanchez is the most misused QB the Jets have ever had.  He was off to one of the most phenomenal starts in NFL history, 22 years old, college junior, wins 4 road playoff games, takes us on an 18-4 run best stretch in team history, saves the 2010 season with 5 miracle comeback wins, was the best Jet on the field in back-to-back AFC Championship Games.

But because of the wrong head coach at the wrong time, instead of investing in our young QB and building a competent offense around him, drafting some WR's for him to grow with, we do the exact opposite.  We cut all the decent vets, we don't draft anyone, we pick up some scrubs, mess with his head via Manning and Tebow flirtations, and give him Tony Sparano as an offensive coordinator.

It's the biggest tragedy in team history.  Who knows what might have been with a real head coach.

SAR I

[TuscanyTile2]

You're better than this, Sperm.

Mark Sanchez is the most misused QB the Jets have ever had.  He was off to one of the most phenomenal starts in NFL history, 22 years old, college junior, wins 4 road playoff games, takes us on an 18-4 run best stretch in team history, saves the 2010 season with 5 miracle comeback wins, was the best Jet on the field in back-to-back AFC Championship Games.

But because of the wrong head coach at the wrong time, instead of investing in our young QB and building a competent offense around him, drafting some WR's for him to grow with, we do the exact opposite.  We cut all the decent vets, we don't draft anyone, we pick up some scrubs, mess with his head via Manning and Tebow flirtations, and give him Tony Sparano as an offensive coordinator.

It's the biggest tragedy in team history.  Who knows what might have been with a real head coach.

SAR I

If only he could be given an opportunity to work with an offensive HC like Chip Kelly.  Then he'd turn things around for sure. 

 

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

I have to admit it was fun yesterday watching the Mark Sanchez led Eagles embarrass themselves on Thanksgiving, the curse and the legend has left the Jets and now lives with the Eagles, Chip and Mark have both earned it, RIP

 

 

[neckdemon]

You're better than this, Sperm.

Mark Sanchez is the most misused QB the Jets have ever had.  He was off to one of the most phenomenal starts in NFL history, 22 years old, college junior, wins 4 road playoff games, takes us on an 18-4 run best stretch in team history, saves the 2010 season with 5 miracle comeback wins, was the best Jet on the field in back-to-back AFC Championship Games.

But because of the wrong head coach at the wrong time, instead of investing in our young QB and building a competent offense around him, drafting some WR's for him to grow with, we do the exact opposite.  We cut all the decent vets, we don't draft anyone, we pick up some scrubs, mess with his head via Manning and Tebow flirtations, and give him Tony Sparano as an offensive coordinator.

It's the biggest tragedy in team history.  Who knows what might have been with a real head coach.

SAR I

agreed 100%. this is something we can definitely see eye to eye on. allowing mark sanchez to take offensive snaps, make hand-offs to rb's and, most egregiously, allowing him to throw passes to receivers has most definitely constituted mishandling of mark sanchez. 

[SAR I]

If only he could be given an opportunity to work with an offensive HC like Chip Kelly.  Then he'd turn things around for sure. 

 

Mark Sanchez, January 2011, was a confident 24 year old with more playoff experience and playoff success under his belt than 28 other starting NFL quarterbacks, he'd been a big part of an 18-4 stretch, he led us on 5 miracle 4th quarter comebacks to an 11-5 record.  It's what we'd kill and die for now-  a first round quarterback showing such poise under pressure for two years, ready to be developed into a 10 year franchise quarterback, our Rodgers, our Brees, our Rivers.

But we had a head coach with different plans, a defensive coordinator who didn't give a damn about quarterbacks, and he disregarded him and didn't invest in him and hired the wrong coordinator and focused only on the defensive side of the ball and that was that.

What Mark Sanchez is today heading to January 2016 is not a reflection of what might have been back in January 2011.  Quarterbacks lose their confidence, and as backups don't get the reps.  Chip Kelly didn't pick up Mark Sanchez to be a starter so he was never treated like one.  The Jets ruined him, it's the biggest tragedy since Cleveland '86 we've witnessed, but because of all the Rex Ryan love it gets forgotten, Rex was so good at scapegoating it apparently worked on you too.

SAR I

[SAR I]

agreed 100%. this is something we can definitely see eye to eye on. allowing mark sanchez to take offensive snaps, make hand-offs to rb's and, most egregiously, allowing him to throw passes to receivers has most definitely constituted mishandling of mark sanchez. 

After back to back AFC Championship Game runs, Mark Sanchez had the Jets sitting at 8-5 in November 2011.

Then Rex Ryan's supposed "great" defense got torched 45-19 in Philadelphia and 29-14 vs the Giants and from there the offseason brought us Tony Sparano and Tim Tebow and the immortal Chaz Schillens and no pass-catching investment in our young quarterback who had showed such promise with one-year rental weapons like Jericho Cotchery, Braylon Edwards, Plaxico Burress, and Ladanian Tomlinson. 

SAR I

[JetsFanatic]

 

It does take something special for a young QB to do these things, in addition to winning 4 road playoff games in his first 2 seasons.  However, something went wrong somewhere.

[neckdemon]

Mark Sanchez, January 2011, was a confident 24 year old with more playoff experience and playoff success under his belt than 28 other starting NFL quarterbacks, he'd been a big part of an 18-4 stretch, he led us on 5 miracle 4th quarter comebacks to an 11-5 record.  It's what we'd kill and die for now-  a first round quarterback showing such poise under pressure for two years, ready to be developed into a 10 year franchise quarterback, our Rodgers, our Brees, our Rivers.

But we had a head coach with different plans, a defensive coordinator who didn't give a damn about quarterbacks, and he disregarded him and didn't invest in him and hired the wrong coordinator and focused only on the defensive side of the ball and that was that.

What Mark Sanchez is today heading to January 2016 is not a reflection of what might have been back in January 2011.  Quarterbacks lose their confidence, and as backups don't get the reps.  Chip Kelly didn't pick up Mark Sanchez to be a starter so he was never treated like one.  The Jets ruined him, it's the biggest tragedy since Cleveland '86 we've witnessed, but because of all the Rex Ryan love it gets forgotten, Rex was so good at scapegoating it apparently worked on you too.

SAR I

this is ridiculous. pure ridiculousness. the fact that you compare him to rivers, brees and rodgers is nothing more than a tremendous joke. btw, our fat and stupid head coach cared so little about mark sanchez that he had him tattooed on his arm (well his wife in a sanchez jersey, close enough)

[SAR I]

this is ridiculous. pure ridiculousness. the fact that you compare him to rivers, brees and rodgers is nothing more than a tremendous joke. btw, our fat and stupid head coach cared so little about mark sanchez that he had him tattooed on his arm (well his wife in a sanchez jersey, close enough)

Stop it.  I didn't say Mark had the capability to be like those quarterbacks, I said we didn't even try to develop him at all.  It's criminal.  What's ridiculous is that you watched all the games and you can't see the truth. 

And if your only proof that Rex Ryan gave a crap about developing his young quarterback is a tattoo, you don't have any proof.  And I know you don't.  Because there isn't any.  In his misguided attempt to recreate the 1985 Bears defense, Rex Ryan succeeded in recreating the 1976 Buccaneers offense.

SAR I

 

[BowlesMovement]

this is ridiculous. pure ridiculousness. the fact that you compare him to rivers, brees and rodgers is nothing more than a tremendous joke. btw, our fat and stupid head coach cared so little about mark sanchez that he had him tattooed on his arm (well his wife in a sanchez jersey, close enough)

Caring about him and having a clue of how to develop him are two different things completely. In addition, I believe he did care about Sanchez, but I think like always, Rex cared a heck of a lot more about himself and his reputation than he did Sanchez, or the franchise. In 2011 Rex chose to let go Sanchez's two favorite targets, and use the money to go after Asoumgua, why? Because all Rex really gives a crap about is how good HIS defense is.

And for the record, I think it was a long shot that Sanchez would have ever been a true franchise QB anyway. But that does not absolve Rex for what he did to the franchise in his time here at all.

[TuscanyTile2]

SAR I, I think you are one crazy mofo for defending Sanchez but I have to admit I respect you for (vehemently!) defending such an unpopular opinion.  I do the same on other (non-sports) topics so I can relate.

After his first 2 seasons I will admit that I had hopes Chez would develop into a top 10-15 QB.  As many turnovers as he committed, he definitely did step up his game in the post-season (most notably in the AFC championship game in Indy his rookie year).  There were always questions, however, about how much he was responsible for the team's success though as he had a great OL, a very good running game, and a very good defense (again during his first 2 years).  For example, I remember in the SD playoff game he barely did anything (Rex took the ball out of his turnover-prone hands) but he did make one crucial completion for a TD that helped us win that game.  And it is most certainly true he won 4 road playoff games, 2 of which were against HOFers Brady and Peyton (plus one against Rivers). 

I will also agree with you that he was not given talent around him.  The OL was whittled away and the WRs were terrible.  Rex focused far more on defense (probably thinking he was building a 2000 Ravens type D).  In his 3rd season, Rex took the shackles off Chez but it was pretty clear that he, at the very least, needed more help (game breakers) than he was given.  But if you're saying that season ruined him as a QB (caused him to lose confidence that he never regained) then I question whether he had the mental toughness to be a very good QB in the first place.  Eli suffered through like 4 rough seasons before coming into his own.  I remember I used to defend Chez thinking that he could follow Eli's career arc.

In the end, it felt like Chez got exposed as a mediocre QB.  You could argue that he could be considered a starting QB on a bad team.   But that's really not the kind of QB any team wants.  Chez is a basically a solid backup QB.  He's not a Ryan Lindley type guy who gives your team zero shot to win.  He can potentially hold the fort for a few games, given the right conditions (e.g. he's not asked to do to much). 

In retrospect, even given perfect conditions, I don't think he ever could've come anywhere close to Rodgers, Brees, or Rivers.  Maybe his heights were some kind of an uninspiring QB like a Matt Schaub type of guy.

 

[BowlesMovement]

SAR I, I think you are one crazy mofo for defending Sanchez but I have to admit I respect you for (vehemently!) defending such an unpopular opinion.  I do the same on other (non-sports) topics so I can relate.

After his first 2 seasons I will admit that I had hopes Chez would develop into a top 10-15 QB.  As many turnovers as he committed, he definitely did step up his game in the post-season (most notably in the AFC championship game in Indy his rookie year).  There were always questions, however, about how much he was responsible for the team's success though as he had a great OL, a very good running game, and a very good defense (again during his first 2 years).  For example, I remember in the SD playoff game he barely did anything (Rex took the ball out of his turnover-prone hands) but he did make one crucial completion for a TD that helped us win that game.  And it is most certainly true he won 4 road playoff games, 2 of which were against HOFers Brady and Peyton (plus one against Rivers). 

I will also agree with you that he was not given talent around him.  The OL was whittled away and the WRs were terrible.  Rex focused far more on defense (probably thinking he was building a 2000 Ravens type D).  In his 3rd season, Rex took the shackles off Chez but it was pretty clear that he, at the very least, needed more help (game breakers) than he was given.  But if you're saying that season ruined him as a QB (caused him to lose confidence that he never regained) then I question whether he had the mental toughness to be a very good QB in the first place.  Eli suffered through like 4 rough seasons before coming into his own.  I remember I used to defend Chez thinking that he could follow Eli's career arc.

In the end, it felt like Chez got exposed as a mediocre QB.  You could argue that he could be considered a starting QB on a bad team.   But that's really not the kind of QB any team wants.  Chez is a basically a solid backup QB.  He's not a Ryan Lindley type guy who gives your team zero shot to win.  He can potentially hold the fort for a few games, given the right conditions (e.g. he's not asked to do to much). 

In retrospect, even given perfect conditions, I don't think he ever could've come anywhere close to Rodgers, Brees, or Rivers.  Maybe his heights were some kind of an uninspiring QB like a Matt Schaub type of guy.

 

While I agree with this, and think Sanchez was not very mentally tough, even if 2011 did not completely ruin him, 2012 did. Sproano and that offense was amongst the worst I have ever seen. Sanchez had no idea where the WR's were going to be most plays, the Oline sucked, and the play calling was atrocious. 2011 was the beginning of the end, 2012 was the end. Eli never had to deal with anything even close to 2012, and Eli is so dumb that he is a rare breed. 

I do think in 2010 Sanchez showed enough flashes to think he had a chance to be a starting QB in the league, he seemed to play his best when the games mattered most. That said, he made so many dumb, dumb mistakes that he would need to be able to fix to do so. 

[neckdemon]

Stop it.  I didn't say Mark had the capability to be like those quarterbacks, I said we didn't even try to develop him at all.  It's criminal.  What's ridiculous is that you watched all the games and you can't see the truth. 

And if your only proof that Rex Ryan gave a crap about developing his young quarterback is a tattoo, you don't have any proof.  And I know you don't.  Because there isn't any.  In his misguided attempt to recreate the 1985 Bears defense, Rex Ryan succeeded in recreating the 1976 Buccaneers offense.

SAR I

 

this i do agree with. Rex sucked

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

Rex filled his head with air and Tanny fked up team chemistry but Mark Sanchez ruined Mark Sanchez

Mark should have stayed at USC another year (Pete was right and Rex would have won the SB with Favre)

Mark spent his time with 17 year old girls and making late night videos, you can argue that Rex should have benched him but Mark should have known better and taken advice from others who had gone down that road...

After 5 years with a defensive coach and no weapons, Cam is 11-0 so why not Mark? 

[Miss Lonelyhearts]

Stop it.  I didn't say Mark had the capability to be like those quarterbacks, I said we didn't even try to develop him at all.  It's criminal.  What's ridiculous is that you watched all the games and you can't see the truth. 

This is just absurd. Sanchez was never going to be any good because he started sixteen games in college and declared early. That's it. The idea that this could have been prevented by trying harder to develop him or whatever such nonsense is just a convenient excuse for the excitable goofballs who were dumb enough to get fooled by a few fleeting flashes of competence.

[SAR I]

 In 2011 Rex chose to let go Sanchez's two favorite targets, and use the money to go after Asoumgua, why? Because all Rex really gives a crap about is how good HIS defense is.

 

That's exactly right.  The reason Rex Ryan got another coaching job is strictly on the strength of his "dominant defense" myth.  Look closely, you'll see that the Jets failed from 2011 to 2014 because the two tenants of the Ryan doctrine fell to pieces:  A ground and pound rushing attack and a shut-down defense.

People blame Mark Sanchez, they should start there.

SAR I

[SAR I]

SAR I, I think you are one crazy mofo for defending Sanchez but I have to admit I respect you for (vehemently!) defending such an unpopular opinion.  I do the same on other (non-sports) topics so I can relate.

After his first 2 seasons I will admit that I had hopes Chez would develop into a top 10-15 QB.  As many turnovers as he committed, he definitely did step up his game in the post-season (most notably in the AFC championship game in Indy his rookie year).  There were always questions, however, about how much he was responsible for the team's success though as he had a great OL, a very good running game, and a very good defense (again during his first 2 years).  For example, I remember in the SD playoff game he barely did anything (Rex took the ball out of his turnover-prone hands) but he did make one crucial completion for a TD that helped us win that game.  And it is most certainly true he won 4 road playoff games, 2 of which were against HOFers Brady and Peyton (plus one against Rivers). 

I will also agree with you that he was not given talent around him.  The OL was whittled away and the WRs were terrible.  Rex focused far more on defense (probably thinking he was building a 2000 Ravens type D).  In his 3rd season, Rex took the shackles off Chez but it was pretty clear that he, at the very least, needed more help (game breakers) than he was given.  But if you're saying that season ruined him as a QB (caused him to lose confidence that he never regained) then I question whether he had the mental toughness to be a very good QB in the first place.  Eli suffered through like 4 rough seasons before coming into his own.  I remember I used to defend Chez thinking that he could follow Eli's career arc.

In the end, it felt like Chez got exposed as a mediocre QB.  You could argue that he could be considered a starting QB on a bad team.   But that's really not the kind of QB any team wants.  Chez is a basically a solid backup QB.  He's not a Ryan Lindley type guy who gives your team zero shot to win.  He can potentially hold the fort for a few games, given the right conditions (e.g. he's not asked to do to much). 

In retrospect, even given perfect conditions, I don't think he ever could've come anywhere close to Rodgers, Brees, or Rivers.  Maybe his heights were some kind of an uninspiring QB like a Matt Schaub type of guy.

 

Good post, I agree with it all. 

What will haunt me forever about the Ryan regime is what might have been if Rex had the defense ready for Pittsburgh in 2010 and what might have been if Sanchez had some good weapons around him at 8-5 in 2011.  Even if history shows that Mark wasn't the second coming of an all-time great, Mark was the perfect QB for what Rex Ryan was trying to accomplish-  Ground and Pound running game, Shut Down defense.  At his most average, Mark would do enough to get us a lead and at his very best, Mark would lead us from behind in remarkable fashion.  Say what you will about Mark, but he was money late in games coming from behind and money in the post-season.  I've seen great regular season QB's with all the gaudy stats who shrivel and die under the pressure.  Mark was the exact opposite.

SAR I

[SAR I]

this i do agree with. Rex sucked

Happy Thanksgiving.

SAR I

[dbatesman]

Defending Sanchez is like rooting for ISIS. 

ISIS dresses better.

[JetsFanatic]

While I agree with this, and think Sanchez was not very mentally tough, even if 2011 did not completely ruin him, 2012 did. Sproano and that offense was amongst the worst I have ever seen. Sanchez had no idea where the WR's were going to be most plays, the Oline sucked, and the play calling was atrocious. 2011 was the beginning of the end, 2012 was the end. Eli never had to deal with anything even close to 2012, and Eli is so dumb that he is a rare breed. 

I do think in 2010 Sanchez showed enough flashes to think he had a chance to be a starting QB in the league, he seemed to play his best when the games mattered most. That said, he made so many dumb, dumb mistakes that he would need to be able to fix to do so. 

Whether Sanchez was ruined or he sucks on his own we will never know.  However one thing for sure is that Jets management did not support a young QB who showed promise and the ability to win 4 road playoff games in his first two seasons.  Beginning with the end of the lockout in 2011, Tannenbaum/Ryan were simply awful with personnel decisions.