Jets are aiming for a QB early - and I think they mean it

[Paradis]

Off-topic: anyone seen "TheMikeIsHot" since JI sank in the ocean? He was a regular and same with Woody59 or something. Haven't seen those cats around anywhere.

[Colgateman]

On February 9, 2016 at 8:11 PM, Paradis said:

 

Last year ppl were down on that class, talking up 2016 like it was legendary with cook hack and cardale. None are projected to go in the 1st as of today and both Winston and Mariota appear to be hits.

I think you have to throw all that jazz out the window. Next year, this year, comparing what's available to what's not etc. Just scout the guys available as they are and go after one of you see franchise potential

If we're not developing the next face of Geen and White, then we're just wasting our time with the Fitz show IMO

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agreed 100% also what is your opinion on petty?

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, Colgateman said:

Agreed 100% also what is your opinion on petty?

He's a nice piece of putty, but it's not a given he'll develop. Bryce had a pedigree that was attractive and played big in some big time games, however there's legitimate concern if he's mentally ever going to be able to keep up with the pro game. 

In other words, I wouldn't make any plans around him. To be honest, if we draft a QB this year like Lynch, Petty's going to have to beat out Geno in camp/pre-season. 

[Beerfish]

22 hours ago, Paradis said:

Off-topic: anyone seen "TheMikeIsHot" since JI sank in the ocean? He was a regular and same with Woody59 or something. Haven't seen those cats around anywhere.

I am pretty sure I have sen Mike the main forum but not Woody,

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

I am pretty sure I have sen Mike the main forum but not Woody,

I've seen Woody's name once or twice in the hampur but only on the main forum. A quick search says TheMike isn't registered here... peculiar. Them two were far too involved to just walk away I would think. 

[Colgateman]

2 hours ago, Paradis said:

He's a nice piece of putty, but it's not a given he'll develop. Bryce had a pedigree that was attractive and played big in some big time games, however there's legitimate concern if he's mentally ever going to be able to keep up with the pro game. 

In other words, I wouldn't make any plans around him. To be honest, if we draft a QB this year like Lynch, Petty's going to have to beat out Geno in camp/pre-season. 

Agreed again, but I wouldn't say it is too far fetched to say petty could develop into being like Kirk cousins or Marc bulger, but the people who are saying he could be the next Brady need to simmer down

[Powpow]

9 hours ago, Paradis said:

He's a nice piece of putty, but it's not a given he'll develop. Bryce had a pedigree that was attractive and played big in some big time games, however there's legitimate concern if he's mentally ever going to be able to keep up with the pro game. 

In other words, I wouldn't make any plans around him. To be honest, if we draft a QB this year like Lynch, Petty's going to have to beat out Geno in camp/pre-season. 

Yea I'm sure Petty can beat Geno. A good right to the kisser and down goes Geno.

[win4ever]

I think Petty next year in camp will be interesting.  I like his arm and skills, but that offense is just a ridiculous transition.  I also want to see what the Jets do with Fitzpatrick, because I think he wants a multi-year deal, and I'm not giving it to him if I'm the GM,

As far as drafting, I think we'll know with free agency where they'll go.  I'm probably in the minority, but I have no faith Fitz repeats the success he had this season (both with weapons staying healthy, him being healthy, and quality of opponents going up next year) so I won't be heartbroken if he signs elsewhere for multi years.  I don't believe the drop off from Fitz to Geno is going to be drastic enough to pay him big money.  

I think the Jets will take a QB, just not one early.  I think they wait for someone to drop into the 3rd/4th and then pounce.     

[Beerfish]

6 hours ago, win4ever said:

I think Petty next year in camp will be interesting.  I like his arm and skills, but that offense is just a ridiculous transition.  I also want to see what the Jets do with Fitzpatrick, because I think he wants a multi-year deal, and I'm not giving it to him if I'm the GM,

As far as drafting, I think we'll know with free agency where they'll go.  I'm probably in the minority, but I have no faith Fitz repeats the success he had this season (both with weapons staying healthy, him being healthy, and quality of opponents going up next year) so I won't be heartbroken if he signs elsewhere for multi years.  I don't believe the drop off from Fitz to Geno is going to be drastic enough to pay him big money.  

I think the Jets will take a QB, just not one early.  I think they wait for someone to drop into the 3rd/4th and then pounce.     

Wow I really disagree on one of your points.  I agree that Fitz could drop off but Geno is awful and is no way close to Fitz.

He has a better arm, has zero pocket presence at all, none.  If Geno is the Qb expect our sacks taken to triple, our Qb lost fumbles to triple and ints to be 1.5 times as much.

[Paradis]

1 hour ago, Beerfish said:

Wow I really disagree on one of your points.  I agree that Fitz could drop off but Geno is awful and is no way close to Fitz.

He has a better arm, has zero pocket presence at all, none.  If Geno is the Qb expect our sacks taken to triple, our Qb lost fumbles to triple and ints to be 1.5 times as much.

It'll never happen.

As much as I hate the idea of overpaying Fitz the way BUF did, the Jets hands are tied unless he's asking for an outrageous amount. There's too much at risk from a PR/lockerroom/roster standpoint after a 10-6 season regardless of strength of opponents we faced.

[drdetroit]

51 minutes ago, Paradis said:

It'll never happen.

As much as I hate the idea of overpaying Fitz the way BUF did, the Jets hands are tied unless he's asking for an outrageous amount. There's too much at risk from a PR/lockerroom/roster standpoint after a 10-6 season regardless of strength of opponents we faced.

Fitz is going nowhere Mac fully intends to resign him

 

I'm not crazy about any of the first rd grade qb's other than Wentz.  If we can't get Wentz we should just wait until rd 3 for Cardale

[peebag]

On 2/3/2016 at 11:34 AM, CrazyCarl40 said:

He did look great i the championship run, for sure. But I like to see QBs get better over the four years of school, not regress.

He lost a bunch of playmakers from the previous year - also had to deal with injuries.  If they Jets have a chance to get him - they should.

[Beerfish]

19 minutes ago, peebag said:

He lost a bunch of playmakers from the previous year - also had to deal with injuries.  If they Jets have a chance to get him - they should.

None of the top Qb's had great weapons.  MSU has the 3rd ranked center and 4th ranked ot.  In any case we'll at least learn a lot physically at the combine I would imagine.  (Unless Cook chickens out of throwing at that as well.)

[win4ever]

15 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Wow I really disagree on one of your points.  I agree that Fitz could drop off but Geno is awful and is no way close to Fitz.

He has a better arm, has zero pocket presence at all, none.  If Geno is the Qb expect our sacks taken to triple, our Qb lost fumbles to triple and ints to be 1.5 times as much.

I think it's complicated, because I'm thinking of it sort of like a stock market.  I believe Fitzpatrick is going to get around $8 million or so per season for maybe 2 years (at best for Jets) or 3 years (at best for Fitz).  That's pretty much what Skrine makes (he has a 4th year I believe) on the team.  I would rather have Geno + Skrine caliber player (+the possibility of a compensation pick) than Fitz (with Geno, no incentive in dumping him).  I don't think the drop off from Fitz to Geno is worth losing that kind of caliber player signing opportunity.  

I think Fitz had a great year, but he also benefited a ton from Marshall and Gailey.  There are a ton of plays where Fitz locked in on Marshall from the snap, stared him down, and threw the ball, with Marshall making a great grab.  I don't think Geno is going to have as great of a year if he's thrown to the wolves next year, but Geno plus whatever money they can invest elsewhere I think helps out the team much better.  I also expect a decent amount of regression from Fitz this year.  The Jets had quite possibly the easiest passing strength of schedule this year, which will change next year with the NFC West coming into play.  

For the record, I don't think Geno is the answer either, but I feel as if there is every indication that Fitz will regress.  I think those sack rates, and interception rates are going higher anyway next year.  If we have an amazing year next year, it's most likely going to be because our defense decided to be an all time great team or Bryce Petty developed unexpectedly.  Or we signed a free agent QB (like RGIII or Kap) and revived their career.  We're really not going anywhere with Fitz or Geno, so may as well take the cheaper option, IMO, try to get a pick, and sign someone young at another position with the money saved.   

[Ohio State NY Jets fan]

5 hours ago, win4ever said:

I think it's complicated, because I'm thinking of it sort of like a stock market.  I believe Fitzpatrick is going to get around $8 million or so per season for maybe 2 years (at best for Jets) or 3 years (at best for Fitz).  That's pretty much what Skrine makes (he has a 4th year I believe) on the team.  I would rather have Geno + Skrine caliber player (+the possibility of a compensation pick) than Fitz (with Geno, no incentive in dumping him).  I don't think the drop off from Fitz to Geno is worth losing that kind of caliber player signing opportunity.  

Agree with the market analogy and your point is stronger if that market goes up to ~12M per year, a figure used by some of the beat writers, I would be happy with a 3 year 20m deal with 10 guaranteed but 2 year 24m or 3 year 30 starts to really hurt the teams ability to sign other players. I think/hope Fitz takes a team friendly deal since a 7th team, even if someone pays him more would be a difficult transition and he will not find better support than Chan and Brandon...

also not signing Fitz or Kap would show Mac's cards on Draft day - first round QB 

[Paradis]

13 hours ago, win4ever said:

I think it's complicated, because I'm thinking of it sort of like a stock market.  I believe Fitzpatrick is going to get around $8 million or so per season for maybe 2 years (at best for Jets) or 3 years (at best for Fitz).  That's pretty much what Skrine makes (he has a 4th year I believe) on the team.  I would rather have Geno + Skrine caliber player (+the possibility of a compensation pick) than Fitz (with Geno, no incentive in dumping him).  I don't think the drop off from Fitz to Geno is worth losing that kind of caliber player signing opportunity.  

I think Fitz had a great year, but he also benefited a ton from Marshall and Gailey.  There are a ton of plays where Fitz locked in on Marshall from the snap, stared him down, and threw the ball, with Marshall making a great grab.  I don't think Geno is going to have as great of a year if he's thrown to the wolves next year, but Geno plus whatever money they can invest elsewhere I think helps out the team much better.  I also expect a decent amount of regression from Fitz this year.  The Jets had quite possibly the easiest passing strength of schedule this year, which will change next year with the NFC West coming into play.  

For the record, I don't think Geno is the answer either, but I feel as if there is every indication that Fitz will regress.  I think those sack rates, and interception rates are going higher anyway next year.  If we have an amazing year next year, it's most likely going to be because our defense decided to be an all time great team or Bryce Petty developed unexpectedly.  Or we signed a free agent QB (like RGIII or Kap) and revived their career.  We're really not going anywhere with Fitz or Geno, so may as well take the cheaper option, IMO, try to get a pick, and sign someone young at another position with the money saved.   

I'm with you on the 2 accounts; I'm adversely against overpaying Fitz (aging QB who'll likely regress somewhat next year) AND on the front that Geno isn't the dramatic drop-off that some let on... 

However, it doesn't matter. The way last summer unfolded (the punch) and Fitz's magical season (regardless of the schedule) it puts us in a situation where we stand to risk too much by letting him go... and by we, i mean Mac & Bowles. Fitz being overpaid to play average football is not an ideal outcome, but it's far less heinous that Fitz playing well somewhere else, and Geno having another incident of any kind, here in NY. Mac and Bowles would be public enemy #1. They won't risk that. 

The best outcome is we resign Fitz and draft a QB to groom. I personally don't think either Fitz or Geno are here in 2017. 

[CrazyCarl40]

31 minutes ago, Paradis said:

I'm with you on the 2 accounts; I'm adversely against overpaying Fitz (aging QB who'll likely regress somewhat next year) AND on the front that Geno isn't the dramatic drop-off that some let on... 

However, it doesn't matter. The way last summer unfolded (the punch) and Fitz's magical season (regardless of the schedule) it puts us in a situation where we stand to risk too much by letting him go... and by we, i mean Mac & Bowles. Fitz being overpaid to play average football is not an ideal outcome, but it's far less heinous that Fitz playing well somewhere else, and Geno having another incident of any kind, here in NY. Mac and Bowles would be public enemy #1. They won't risk that. 

The best outcome is we resign Fitz and draft a QB to groom. I personally don't think either Fitz or Geno are here in 2017. 

Why wouldn't Fitz be around in 2017? If they bring him back in 2016 and he had a comparable year to last season, he'd be the guy in 2017. Also, I'd guess they'd at least keep him in a backup role to help transition the new QB if he wasn't very good in 2016. He could have a lot to teach the young gunslingers, he's already started with Petty.

[Paradis]

34 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Why wouldn't Fitz be around in 2017? If they bring him back in 2016 and he had a comparable year to last season, he'd be the guy in 2017. Also, I'd guess they'd at least keep him in a backup role to help transition the new QB if he wasn't very good in 2016. He could have a lot to teach the young gunslingers, he's already started with Petty.

I personally think his play falls off a cliff next year. I hope it doesn't, but history repeats itself more often than not.

From a contract standpoint, you're right -- he's likely to be a back up at least in 2017, but I just got the hunch that we're going to draft a "name" this april and by spring camp in 2017 it'll be that guy + Petty as our #2. The other version is of course Petty shows zero development and he's the one send packing and Fitz backs up the new guy in 2017

[win4ever]

18 hours ago, Ohio State NY Jets fan said:

Agree with the market analogy and your point is stronger if that market goes up to ~12M per year, a figure used by some of the beat writers, I would be happy with a 3 year 20m deal with 10 guaranteed but 2 year 24m or 3 year 30 starts to really hurt the teams ability to sign other players. I think/hope Fitz takes a team friendly deal since a 7th team, even if someone pays him more would be a difficult transition and he will not find better support than Chan and Brandon...

also not signing Fitz or Kap would show Mac's cards on Draft day - first round QB 

I think Fitz signs a deal around 8 million with some incentives to push it up, I'm just not sure it's worth it at this point.  I definitely expect him to regress, and I don't think he's good enough to lead us anywhere significant.  

Right now, everyone is a bit high from the Broncos, and how game manager Peyton won a Super Bowl.  But they were one stupid fumble from the Pitt RB away from losing their first game in the playoffs.   I don't think the super defense with ok game manager is really leading us anywhere.  I'd rather hope Geno learned something, Petty improved, sign a younger upside QB, or draft one.  

Last year, a team with playoff aspirations desperate for a QB gave him up for a what 7th round pick?  I think his transition had more to do with the better weapons around him and the system than some kind of magical progression he made.   They were willing to go into the season with Geno as the starter last year, so I think they can do it again this season.  I agree with Paradis in that they won't do it, because of the media backlash that awaits such a move.  

10 hours ago, Paradis said:

I'm with you on the 2 accounts; I'm adversely against overpaying Fitz (aging QB who'll likely regress somewhat next year) AND on the front that Geno isn't the dramatic drop-off that some let on... 

However, it doesn't matter. The way last summer unfolded (the punch) and Fitz's magical season (regardless of the schedule) it puts us in a situation where we stand to risk too much by letting him go... and by we, i mean Mac & Bowles. Fitz being overpaid to play average football is not an ideal outcome, but it's far less heinous that Fitz playing well somewhere else, and Geno having another incident of any kind, here in NY. Mac and Bowles would be public enemy #1. They won't risk that. 

The best outcome is we resign Fitz and draft a QB to groom. I personally don't think either Fitz or Geno are here in 2017. 

Yeah, last year's good stats have Mac in a hard place now.  Too much risk to let Fitz back away, but too much risk to move back to Geno or pick up a replacement option.  

[Shockwave]

As of right now Lynch is my favorite. Tall, Mobile, and a great arm. Has all the talent of Carson Wentz yet will likely be picked much later. 

But he like every other QB in this draft needs to sit for a year or Longer. I'm not sure Im willing to take any QB early that needs to sit - May as well just keep drafting one every year in the mid rounds and develop them. 

The worst part of drafting one early is your locked into them even if they suck. Drafting one in the second round or later gives you a ton of flexibility and really allows competition. 

[Tinstar]

Pulling for the Hack today at Happy Valley .

Really like this kid

[Tony The Wiz]

On 2/2/2016 at 1:46 AM, Paradis said:

The new regime wants their guy. They made it public, they've made it known.  They did so last year - and worked out Winston, Mariota and anyone else they felt was worth the time..Now it's 2016 and they're playing that song again. 

Why?

Well, consider the following not-so-unlikely scenario.. .. A year from now we enter the 2017 offseason and this is the situation:

1. Fitzpatrick regresses to the norm and plays more like an 6-10 QB, than the 10-6 we finished this year. Am I wishing for that? No but i'd be an idiot to rule it out. 
2. Geno is gone... whether it's this year or next, anything but his departure is unlikely.
3. Petty continues his legacy of holding a clipboard on the sidelines. If this wasn't likely, we wouldn't be meeting with Wentz at Mobile, Alabama last week.

If Fitz plays poorly or even mediocre next year, he won't be afforded the luxury of faith that someone like Rivers or Brees gets. Which brings us to the present; I feel like this year (while our draft position is less than ideal) is the right time. 

So I ask you, are you ready for the Jets go all in on a QB? How do you see that playing out?... 

Myself: 

I'm not buying this trash about DAL and SD considering a QB. None of the 3 prospect are can't miss, and neither team is desperate. One of those 3 is going tumble into the mid-teens. We may have to go up and get him, but i think he'll be there. I'm personally smitten with Lynch. I love everything about him and his potential. I see giant sized aaron rodgers... but this isn't a Paxton blow job thread. Lets hear from others.

 

Totally agree on Lynch.

[Augustiniak]

when all is said and done cook will be on the jets.  he's a better prospect than cousins.  

[Larz]

makes sense, this years class is a bunch of back-ups

[Gas2No99]

22 minutes ago, Larz said:

makes sense, this years class is a bunch of back-ups

To a certain degree I concur. 

I REALLY like Kevin Hogan from Stanford and think he'll rise to be the best out this year's crop 5-6 years from now in terms of a consistent performer. Went, Lynch, Goff, Prescott, Cook, Hackenburg all seem like Jay Cutler rollercoaster-types.

[HessStation]

My best guess is they trade up for Lynch.

[HessStation]

40 minutes ago, Gas2No99 said:

To a certain degree I concur. 

I REALLY like Kevin Hogan from Stanford and think he'll rise to be the best out this year's crop 5-6 years from now in terms of a consistent performer. Went, Lynch, Goff, Prescott, Cook, Hackenburg all seem like Jay Cutler rollercoaster-types.

I like Kevin Hogan 3-5 too!

[joewilly12]

Mo Wilk and #20 to the Titans for the #1 pick in the 2016 NFL draft!!!!!!!!!!

[section314]

5 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Mo Wilk and #20 to the Titans for the #1 pick in the 2016 NFL draft!!!!!!!!!!

And you take....?

[joewilly12]

7 minutes ago, section314 said:

And you take....?

Whoever Macc and Bowles feel is a franchise QB 

[section314]

2 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Whoever Macc and Bowles feel is a franchise QB 

You're not answering the question  Can only be one of two guys, right? Wentz or Goff?

[joewilly12]

9 minutes ago, section314 said:

You're not answering the question  Can only be one of two guys, right? Wentz or Goff?

Or Cook top 3 as I see it. 

[Gas2No99]

DAMN IT!!! MacCags BETTER HEAR ME OUT ON THIS ONE!!!!!

There's no QB STUD IN THIS DRAFT AND THE BEST ONE IS HOGAN!!! I'd be PISSED if he went to Buffalo

Kevin Hogan - QB -  Player

Speaking Monday, Bills GM Doug Whaley called Stanford's Kevin Hogan the "most pro ready" quarterback for Buffalo's system.

That's because of the run-heavy system Hogan ran for the Cardinal. Hogan has prototypical size at 6-foot-3, 217 pounds, and is also fairly athletic. He just isn't more than a game manager as a thrower. If the Bills, who have been connected to Hogan since the Senior Bowl, take a flier, it should be on day three.

Related: Bills

 

Source: Matthew Fairburn on Twitter 

Mar 21 - 2:12 PM

[Paradis]

8 hours ago, Gas2No99 said:

DAMN IT!!! MacCags BETTER HEAR ME OUT ON THIS ONE!!!!!

There's no QB STUD IN THIS DRAFT AND THE BEST ONE IS HOGAN!!! I'd be PISSED if he went to Buffalo

Kevin Hogan - QB -  Player

Speaking Monday, Bills GM Doug Whaley called Stanford's Kevin Hogan the "most pro ready" quarterback for Buffalo's system.

That's because of the run-heavy system Hogan ran for the Cardinal. Hogan has prototypical size at 6-foot-3, 217 pounds, and is also fairly athletic. He just isn't more than a game manager as a thrower. If the Bills, who have been connected to Hogan since the Senior Bowl, take a flier, it should be on day three.

Related: Bills

 

Source: Matthew Fairburn on Twitter 

Mar 21 - 2:12 PM

really lovin' some of that Hogan power hey

[Beerfish]

Some NFL exec was pulling a Paradis in an article on nfl.com today saying that Goff reminded him of cutler.  He also said he hopes some team drafts him before it is their pick so better players fall down the list.  lol

I'm one of the few people on earth that still likes Cutler as a QB.