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Report: Raiders Interested in Wilkerson


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37 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

You can go do that exercise. I don't take requests.

You are simply flat-out wrong. Again.

He is very, very good. He's not incredible. If he is, then surely teams would be falling over each other to cough up a pair of 1st rounders for him. Or even ONE team would be willing to give that up. Yet I sense the chances of this occurring are about zero.

Cool, then it will continue carrying the zero weight it should.

Nope, sorry. I am actually correct.

He is elite, the best non-Watt 300+ interior player against the pass in the league this decade. Teams will be falling over themselves to give up a multiple picks, maybe/probably even multiple firsts, for the chance to give him a big contract. That is just the reality of it. It would be whatever NFL inflation makes the Jared Allen trade today. I sense that to be 100% if the Jets were to actually let him go, but they won't.  (Mediocre trap/cushion with the multiple firsts, which has not happened for a non-rookie deal in 14 years)

53 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

It is not a simple fact. It would be a simple fact if they were both playing the same position. You are comparing apples and oranges and criticizing the apples for not being oranges.

Sorry, now Richardson is a full time linebacker? Less than a quarter of the snaps he took last year were at LB, and he already missed 41.09% of the D snaps this season as it was. He was probably being showcased.

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Just now, SenorGato said:

Cool, then it will continue carrying the zero weight it should.

Nope, sorry. I am actually correct.

He is elite, the best non-Watt 300+ interior player against the pass in the league this decade. Teams will be falling over themselves to give up a multiple picks, maybe/probably even multiple firsts, for the chance to give him a big contract. That is just the reality of it. It would be whatever NFL inflation makes the Jared Allen trade today. I sense that to be 100% if the Jets were to actually let him go, but they won't.  (Mediocre trap/cushion with the multiple firsts, which has not happened for a non-rookie deal in 14 years)

Sorry, now Richardson is a full time linebacker? Less than a quarter of the snaps he took last year were at LB, and he already missed 41.09% of the D snaps this season as it was. He was probably being showcased.

When did I say that, Captain Strawman? I said they did not play the same position, and they didn't.

And again, there will be no one offering up two first round picks for Wilkerson. 

You can now return to your usual routine of arguing against claims I never made or attempted to make.

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6 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

When did I say that, Captain Strawman? I said they did not play the same position, and they didn't.

And again, there will be no one offering up two first round picks for Wilkerson. 

You can now return to your usual routine of arguing against claims I never made or attempted to make.

Words and stuff

EXCELLENT tale. When you get the guy saying that you will be able to drop a whammy on them. Between this and taking down the guy claiming Wilkerson is better than Watt, you guys have been kicking some non-existent ass. 

 

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The train is leaving the station.  Better hurry up and get your best offers in for Mo.  Oil will probably never be this cheap again and Vladimir Putin is offering excellent deals this month for customers willing to sign up for very long term contracts.

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7 minutes ago, EM31 said:

I predict this thread goes 25 pages at least.

Tops out @ 30.  If Mo does get traded though it's gonna get 40 easy.

I personally have no horse in this race. I love Mo, want him to stay, but if he won't budge and we have a shot to trade up for someone like Carson Wentz (or even Goff if he slips a bit), then I say f*ck it.  Leonard is my favorite of the four lineman anyway. I'd rather have the young QB and Snacks than throw QB money at Wilkerson.

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Just now, Mogglez said:

Tops out @ 30.  If Mo does get traded though it's gonna get 40 easy.

I personally have no horse in this race. I love Mo, want him to stay, but if he won't budge and we have a shot to trade up for someone like Carson Wentz (or even Goff if he slips a bit), then I say f*ck it.  Leonard is my favorite of the four lineman anyway. I'd rather have the young QB and Snacks than throw QB at Wilkerson.

Personally I wanted to use some of our cap room on him as early as two years ago.  I think we could have structured something which averaged out his remaining cheap rookie years, given him a big signing bonus and  added a good number of years onto the backed at a manageable yearly average.  Alas that ship has sailed and we are getting to the expensive part of the "we still have plenty of time" approach.

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1 minute ago, SenorGato said:

I don't think you know what a feeding frenzy is. There is only one Wilkerson to go around. That said, FA will open at 4 PM on March 15.

Some Jets fans said the same thing about Curtis Martin before we started negotiating against ourselves and gave him his last huge contract.

It is in the nature of some Jets fans to overrate our home grown stars.  It is happening here again with Wilkerson.  Very good, not great except in the mind of a few Jets message board posters.  But let's go ahead and pay him like he is a budding Reggie White type talent (he is not).

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16 minutes ago, EM31 said:

Some Jets fans said the same thing about Curtis Martin before we started negotiating against ourselves and gave him his last huge contract.

It is in the nature of some Jets fans to overrate our home grown stars.  It is happening here again with Wilkerson.  Very good, not great except in the mind of a few Jets message board posters.  But let's go ahead and pay him like he is a budding Reggie White type talent (he is not).

No, no in this case you're underrating this sh*t out of this player. Paying a 30 year old RB is not the same as paying a 27 year old DE/DT. Martin's not even a home grown starter ffs. This is insane.

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1 hour ago, SenorGato said:

No, no in this case you're underrating this sh*t out of this player. Paying a 30 year old RB is not the same as paying a 27 year old DE/DT. Martin's not even a home grown starter ffs. This is insane.

Of course I understand the provenance of Curtis Martin but including that tidbit in the original sentence made the whole thing unwieldy.

In any event you missed my real point which is that he is not anything even remotely close to a Reggie White no matter how much you have managed to convince yourself that he might be.  Forget Reggie White I am not sure he is even as much of a game altering force as John Abraham was for us.  The closest I can come is that he is a more consistent and better version of Sean Ellis.  Nothing to turn your nose up at but not HOF material either.

If we get bowled over by offers of more than a first round pick then perhaps you are correct.  I suspect the best we will see is a low first rounder.  If anyone offers two firsts for him or even a first and a third then you may be correct.

Otherwise not.

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So your point to that gem didn't have anything to do with the Curtis Martin stuff that ate up most of the post. Instead, it was that Wilkerson is not Reggie White? Hard hitting stuff, but you're rambling. 

So you guys have managed to haphazardly subdue the guy/s saying Wilkerson is better than or equal to JJ Watt, Reggie White, and worth multiple first round picks. Those guys are going to be piiiissseeed.

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7 hours ago, SenorGato said:

So your point to that gem didn't have anything to do with the Curtis Martin stuff that ate up most of the post. Instead, it was that Wilkerson is not Reggie White? Hard hitting stuff, but you're rambling. 

So you guys have managed to haphazardly subdue the guy/s saying Wilkerson is better than or equal to JJ Watt, Reggie White, and worth multiple first round picks. Those guys are going to be piiiissseeed.

I suppose Reggie White being allowed to get away in his prime has no correspondence here.

So are you firmly committing to a general apology here on this thread if his price does not manage to reach two first round picks?  Is that your commitment?

Once it does not reach that level please feel free to make use of the broken leg rationale.

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The cold hard truth is that there are three options for Wilk and the best two options mean he is no longer a Jet

1. Option 1 Tag and trade, Best option if we could pull it off, would need to get 2-3 picks for him, either and 1st and and 3rd to mid-rounder, or 3 picks including at least 1 2nd round pick. I think it is quite possible we could get something along these lines

2. Option 2 Let him walk. Second best option for the Jets. Anything over $10 million is a non-starter for Wilkerson who is not an impact player. He is very good, but in reality Snacks has more impact than he does, and our DL is still very strong with a resigned Snacks, Sheldon and Leonard. Wilkerson is a very expensive luxury for an old team that needs to almost completely rebuild over the next 3 years. We would get at least a 3rd round compensatory for Wilk, assuming we are very quiet in FA which we should be.

3. Sign him. Should not really even be a consideration. Not enough value to a team that already has strength on the DL and needs to almost completely overhaul the roster in three years. Our only focus for the next two years should be accumulating as many picks as possible, trying to get a long term solution at QB, and getting younger and faster, while building cap space for 2019 and 2020 to flesh out a young team poised for long term success.

 

 

 

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The cold hard truth is that there are three options for Wilk and the best two options mean he is no longer a Jet

The best option is to keep Wilkerson, thats the cold hard truth. Either through tag or extension, possibly/probably both.

 

8 hours ago, EM31 said:

I suppose Reggie White being allowed to get away in his prime has no correspondence here.

So are you firmly committing to a general apology here on this thread if his price does not manage to reach two first round picks?  Is that your commitment?

Once it does not reach that level please feel free to make use of the broken leg rationale.

^^^ This guy has fallen into the deep end. What does any of this even mean?

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5 hours ago, SenorGato said:

The best option is to keep Wilkerson, thats the cold hard truth. Either through tag or extension, possibly/probably both.

 

^^^ This guy has fallen into the deep end. What does any of this even mean?

Weak sauce Gato.

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1 hour ago, SenorGato said:

There's not exactly much to be said to or for the ramblings going on in that post. Just as a heads up, Reggie White hit FA for the first time at age 32. Keep trying, I guess, maybe eventually you'll find a nut.

White was still very much in his prime when the Eagles let him walk.  He had another seven years left in the tank.

Reggie White was truly a HOF player whereas Mo is only on a HOF track in the bizzarro world in which you live.  Mo Wilkerson is a very nice player.  That is the difference and that is the nut that is sticking in your craw because you know I am right.  Mo is closer to a Sean Ellis type player than he is to a Reggie White and that is no shame on either Mo Wilkerson or Sean Ellis who was a very nice player for us for a very long time.

The only place where this does not make sense is the nonsensical universe where you live.

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39 minutes ago, EM31 said:

White was still very much in his prime when the Eagles let him walk.  He had another seven years left in the tank.

Reggie White was truly a HOF player whereas Mo is only on a HOF track in the bizzarro world in which you live.  Mo Wilkerson is a very nice player.  That is the difference and that is the nut that is sticking in your craw because you know I am right.  Mo is closer to a Sean Ellis type player than he is to a Reggie White and that is no shame on either Mo Wilkerson or Sean Ellis who was a very nice player for us for a very long time.

The only place where this does not make sense is the nonsensical universe where you live.

White lived on a diet of steroids and prayers, which is why he played until he was 39 and then dropped dead at 43. Nobody ages like that, nobody in football is on White's level as a player right now - even Watt. He averaged 16 sacks a season through age 32, 11 after, he was not in his prime. That said, just because Wilkerson does not have the same or better career as arguably the greatest defensive lineman and player in history does not mean he is either a) not on a HOF track or b ) not an elite player in the league right now. That you have to drag Reggie White into the discussion shows the lengths you clumsily have to reach to "prove" whatever it is you're shooting for.

The last line kind of sums up your arguments in a nutshell. None of this will stop the tag and then summer extension, or offers a convincing reason for the Jets not to do it. Thanks for the hard hitting analysis that Mo Wilkerson is, in fact, not Reggie White.

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The cold hard truth is that there are three options for Wilk and the best two options mean he is no longer a Jet

1. Option 1 Tag and trade, Best option if we could pull it off, would need to get 2-3 picks for him, either and 1st and and 3rd to mid-rounder, or 3 picks including at least 1 2nd round pick. I think it is quite possible we could get something along these lines

2. Option 2 Let him walk. Second best option for the Jets. Anything over $10 million is a non-starter for Wilkerson who is not an impact player. He is very good, but in reality Snacks has more impact than he does, and our DL is still very strong with a resigned Snacks, Sheldon and Leonard. Wilkerson is a very expensive luxury for an old team that needs to almost completely rebuild over the next 3 years. We would get at least a 3rd round compensatory for Wilk, assuming we are very quiet in FA which we should be.

3. Sign him. Should not really even be a consideration. Not enough value to a team that already has strength on the DL and needs to almost completely overhaul the roster in three years. Our only focus for the next two years should be accumulating as many picks as possible, trying to get a long term solution at QB, and getting younger and faster, while building cap space for 2019 and 2020 to flesh out a young team poised for long term success.

 

 

 

10 a steal for Mo

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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8 hours ago, SenorGato said:

White lived on a diet of steroids and prayers, which is why he played until he was 39 and then dropped dead at 43. Nobody ages like that, nobody in football is on White's level as a player right now - even Watt. He averaged 16 sacks a season through age 32, 11 after, he was not in his prime. That said, just because Wilkerson does not have the same or better career as arguably the greatest defensive lineman and player in history does not mean he is either a) not on a HOF track or b ) not an elite player in the league right now. That you have to drag Reggie White into the discussion shows the lengths you clumsily have to reach to "prove" whatever it is you're shooting for.

The last line kind of sums up your arguments in a nutshell. None of this will stop the tag and then summer extension, or offers a convincing reason for the Jets not to do it. Thanks for the hard hitting analysis that Mo Wilkerson is, in fact, not Reggie White.

White was brought into the discussion since he was a player who was allowed to walk by the team that drafted him because he was too expensive.

You are the one who brought HOF into this discussion as it relates to Mo Wilkerson.  Pretty much everyone else agrees that he is a nice player, a really good player but one who has no chance at Canton.

I would say nice try Gato but in reality it was not that nice of a try.   I think it is you who needs to up YOUR game or the Canton for messageboard posters will not be awaiting you.

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27 minutes ago, EM31 said:

White was brought into the discussion since he was a player who was allowed to walk by the team that drafted him because he was too expensive.

You are the one who brought HOF into this discussion as it relates to Mo Wilkerson.  Pretty much everyone else agrees that he is a nice player, a really good player but one who has no chance at Canton.

I would say nice try Gato but in reality it was not that nice of a try.   I think it is you who needs to up YOUR game or the Canton for messageboard posters will not be awaiting you.

- White was let go because, at 32, it could reasonably be expected he was on the downside of his career. Turns out that didn't mean he was do e and, while not as good as he was as an Eagle, he played well pretty much for the rest of his life.

- "Pretty much everyone else" is a group of posters on a message board. Wilkerson's probably got another 3-5 prime seasons plus a handful of seasons after that to continue building his resume. As it is, relative to other 27 year olds he is, yes, on a HOF track. This is =/= already definitely a HOF. Also a reminder - not being as good or better than Reggie White =/= a HOF and not worth an extension. Still far and away the team's best and most valuable young player and overall.

Amother sw-ing and miss from you, sir.

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52 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

- White was let go because, at 32, it could reasonably be expected he was on the downside of his career. Turns out that didn't mean he was do e and, while not as good as he was as an Eagle, he played well pretty much for the rest of his life.

- "Pretty much everyone else" is a group of posters on a message board. Wilkerson's probably got another 3-5 prime seasons plus a handful of seasons after that to continue building his resume. As it is, relative to other 27 year olds he is, yes, on a HOF track. This is =/= already definitely a HOF. Also a reminder - not being as good or better than Reggie White =/= a HOF and not worth an extension. Still far and away the team's best and most valuable young player and overall.

Amother sw-ing and miss from you, sir.

5 time pro Bowler 2 time All Pro 133.5 sacks Abe has no shot at the HOF nor does 5 Time Pro Bowler 3 time All Pro Gastineau yet Mo who made his first Pro Bowl in year 5 does?? That must be one hell of a fast track Mo is on..LOL

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8 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

5 time pro Bowler 2 time All Pro 133.5 sacks Abe has no shot at the HOF nor does 5 Time Pro Bowler 3 time All Pro Gastineau yet Mo who made his first Pro Bowl in year 5 does?? That must be one hell of a fast track Mo is on..LOL

Must be, you guys can't help but keep on comparing him to players who have at least a decent case for the HOF before he's even 27. LOLZ

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5 minutes ago, SenorGato said:

Must be, you guys can't help but keep on comparing him to players who have at least a decent case for the HOF before he's even 27. LOLZ

Ok how about Klecko who didn't make Pro Bowl or All Pro till year 5 he played all the D- line positions would you say Mo is equal to Joe better or not as good??

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Why does it matter if Wilkerson is on a HOF track or not?  Bottom line is this:  He's one of only 2 elite players on this roster under 30 years old.  And the other one committed 4 crimes in one day.  Good teams do everything in their power to keep elite, homegrown players. 

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16 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

Ok how about Klecko who didn't make Pro Bowl or All Pro till year 5 he played all the D- line positions would you say Mo is equal to Joe better or not as good??

Boy, you can't stop comparing him to some great players - can you? LOLZ 

I'd say Mo is on pace for a better career than Klecko - for instance he was two years younger than Klecko during his 5th season and will easily best his almighty sack total total from the 6th season on.  LOLZ

This is all meant to distract from/dance around the fact that the Jets should and will be extending their best player at 27. It is interesting to see the debate finally get to Klecko - listed as a DE/DT/NT just like Wilkerson plays on these Jets defenses.

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2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Why does it matter if Wilkerson is on a HOF track or not?  Bottom line is this:  He's one of only 2 elite players on this roster under 30 years old.  And the other one committed 4 crimes in one day.  Good teams do everything in their power to keep elite, homegrown players. 

Because I like to have fun in the back and forth with Gato as some others do as well.. As far as Mo goes it depends on how much he will cost and who will have to go in order to pay him.. Mo fanatic's want Sheldon and Snacks gone to free up money to pay Mo.. I contend without them Mo won't be the same player but that could be just me..:) 

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2 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

Because I like to have fun in the back and forth with Gato as some others do as well.. As far as Mo goes it depends on how much he will cost and who will have to go in order to pay him.. Mo fanatic's want Sheldon and Snacks gone to free up money to pay Mo.. I contend without them Mo won't be the same player but that could be just me..:) 

Mo was awesome before Snacks or Richardson arrived.  Mo was a rookie in 2011.  Snacks and Richardson didn't become starters until 2013.

It'd be easier to argue the other way around:  Without Mo having the ability to play every position on the DL effectively, perhaps Snacks and Richardson are the overrated ones.

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2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Mo was awesome before Snacks or Richardson arrived.  Mo was a rookie in 2011.  Snacks and Richardson didn't become starters until 2013.

It'd be easier to argue the other way around:  Without Mo having the ability to play every position on the DL effectively, perhaps Snacks and Richardson are the overrated ones.

In his first 2 years starting 31 games Mo had 8 sacks and 71 tackles..Coples who sucks starting just 15 games had 10 sacks and 46 tackles in his first 2 years.. When Mo and Snacks were added in 2013 Mo played much better.. As bad a you think Sheldon is he did make ROTY the great Mo didn't..

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3 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Mo was awesome before Snacks or Richardson arrived.  Mo was a rookie in 2011.  Snacks and Richardson didn't become starters until 2013.

It'd be easier to argue the other way around:  Without Mo having the ability to play every position on the DL effectively, perhaps Snacks and Richardson are the overrated ones.

Yeah, but is he as good as Deacon Jones?!?!? Why, back in MY day, Deacon Jones was the greatest who ever lived and he didnt go around demanding 100 million of Woody's hard earned dollars. I mean come on, this guy clearly isn't a Lawrence Taylor or Derrick Thomas, and what did they make? 

10 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

Because I like to have fun in the back and forth with Gato as some others do as well.. As far as Mo goes it depends on how much he will cost and who will have to go in order to pay him.. Mo fanatic's want Sheldon and Snacks gone to free up money to pay Mo.. I contend without them Mo won't be the same player but that could be just me..:) 

Richardson's gone next year whether they pay Wilkerson or not. As you don't notice the nearly 50% of the time Harrison is off the field anyway, you'll probably get over the 50% he's on being replaced by someone cheaper. 

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2 minutes ago, Savage69 said:

In his first 2 years starting 31 games Mo had 8 sacks and 71 tackles..Coples who sucks starting just 15 games had 10 sacks and 46 tackles in his first 2 years.

It isn't the least bit surprising that what you take out of this is "Wilkerson secretly sucks, I'm using pure undulerated science" instead of asking yourself whether you might be overrating the sack. 

 

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