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Tony Dungy - Hall of Famer - Yeah or Neigh


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On 2/7/2016 at 3:54 PM, The Troll said:

Remember how he used to always sit his starters at the end of the regular season and then they'd immediately go one and done in the playoffs?

For Christsakes, Robot Jim Caldwell took the team to the Super Bowl the year after Dungy retired.

Dungy joins Bettis and Swann as the least deserving men in the Hall.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

That's "Cardwell"

 

 

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On February 12, 2016 at 9:01 AM, Nick Blitz said:

How Dungy gets in and TO doesn't I'll never know, TO is the 3rd best receiver of all time for crying out loud.

Too much weight is being put on or perceived 'character guys'.

Not everyone thinks highly of Dungy's character. Personally I think he's a lowlife. 

T.O. might be a better person. He's just dumber.

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On 2/13/2016 at 11:22 AM, Embrace the Suck said:

Neigh, but he'll get in thanks to Peyton Manning. He didn't invent the Tampa 2 Dungy and Kiffin modified the Steelers cover 2. I also am forced to wonder who did more of the brain storming as Dungy failed to create a decent defense over 7 years that he was in Indy.

he's already been elected and they made and won their only SB in Indy thanks to the defense.

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3 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

I'm sure Dungy would have surely still gotten there in the first place with Rex Grossman.

They won the SB in Indy thanks to Jeff Saturday. And Rex Grossman.

The D led them, that's reality.  The D was outstanding in postseason.

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1 hour ago, nyjunc said:

he's already been elected and they made and won their only SB in Indy thanks to the defense.

Sure, keep telling yourself that. Indy was 21 total defense that season. Indy was 3 total offense that season. During the postseason the D was 1 and the O was 2. But oh wait....

During the playoffs the Colts played:

The Trent Green Chiefs who had the 16th O that season.

The Steve McNair Ravens who had the 17th O that season.

The only good O the Colts faced was the patriots and the the patriots put up 34 points on them, 21 in the first half.

The Bears featuring Rex Grossman 15th that season.

Yeah, the colts D was legendary. They beat up on average offenses. That guy Manning and the O were lucky to piggy back on the defense.

 

 

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3 hours ago, nyjunc said:

The D led them, that's reality.  The D was outstanding in postseason.

Oh please. If it was the same defense on the Jets we'd have had 3 years of threads about how the D crapped the bed in the AFCCG. The reason Colts fans don't talk about that is their offense scored almost 40 points against a cheating, 13.5ppg Patriots defense to get them to the big dance in the first place. They also had the good fortune of playing Herm's Chiefs in the first playoff game, where empty-headed Herm bragged what his gameplan was going to be when he went out to dinner with Dungy and Lovie before the game. 

They faced a very hit or miss Rex Grossman, who was very much miss that day. Had they faced an actual good QB, and if they don't run all over the place against Chicago (keeping their D off the field in the process), then they lose the game despite Dungy's precious D.

Dungy is and was as overrated as they come, both as a human being and as a HC. He belongs in the HOF of a-holes, nothing more.

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On February 12, 2016 at 9:01 AM, Nick Blitz said:

How Dungy gets in and TO doesn't I'll never know, TO is the 3rd best receiver of all time for crying out loud.

Too much weight is being put on or perceived 'character guys'.

TO got screwed by the stupid media.  Dungy shouldn't get punished because TO made a couple dumb sports writers upset.

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, Embrace the Suck said:

Sure, keep telling yourself that. Indy was 21 total defense that season. Indy was 3 total offense that season. During the postseason the D was 1 and the O was 2. But oh wait....

During the playoffs the Colts played:

The Trent Green Chiefs who had the 16th O that season.

The Steve McNair Ravens who had the 17th O that season.

The only good O the Colts faced was the patriots and the the patriots put up 34 points on them, 21 in the first half.

The Bears featuring Rex Grossman 15th that season.

Yeah, the colts D was legendary. They beat up on average offenses. That guy Manning and the O were lucky to piggy back on the defense.

 

 

I think Dungy deserves to be in Hall of Fame just based on what he did in Tampa?  How bout them apples?

 

 

 

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14 hours ago, Embrace the Suck said:

Sure, keep telling yourself that. Indy was 21 total defense that season. Indy was 3 total offense that season. During the postseason the D was 1 and the O was 2. But oh wait....

During the playoffs the Colts played:

The Trent Green Chiefs who had the 16th O that season.

The Steve McNair Ravens who had the 17th O that season.

The only good O the Colts faced was the patriots and the the patriots put up 34 points on them, 21 in the first half.

The Bears featuring Rex Grossman 15th that season.

Yeah, the colts D was legendary. They beat up on average offenses. That guy Manning and the O were lucky to piggy back on the defense.

 

 

you look at rankings, I watched the games.  yes during the reg season they weren't as good but healthy in the playoffs they carried Indy to the SB.  They didn't face big time QBs, so what? still have to play well and they did.  

They allowed 8 pts

They allowed 6 pts and despite 

They allowed 27 pts but slowed down Brady in the 2nd half and they never go down 21-6 at half if Manning doesn't throw a pick 6 or have a horrible half.  In the 2nd half Manning was great(for a change) and the D played well.

In the SB they allowed 10 pts and scored a TD

 

The D led them to that SB.  the D allowed 12.8 PPG, They were outstanding in postseason and as we have seen the only way Peyton can win is if his D plays out of their minds.

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11 hours ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Oh please. If it was the same defense on the Jets we'd have had 3 years of threads about how the D crapped the bed in the AFCCG. The reason Colts fans don't talk about that is their offense scored almost 40 points against a cheating, 13.5ppg Patriots defense to get them to the big dance in the first place. They also had the good fortune of playing Herm's Chiefs in the first playoff game, where empty-headed Herm bragged what his gameplan was going to be when he went out to dinner with Dungy and Lovie before the game. 

They faced a very hit or miss Rex Grossman, who was very much miss that day. Had they faced an actual good QB, and if they don't run all over the place against Chicago (keeping their D off the field in the process), then they lose the game despite Dungy's precious D.

Dungy is and was as overrated as they come, both as a human being and as a HC. He belongs in the HOF of a-holes, nothing more.

They got into a hole b/c the OFFENSE couldn't score and peyton threw a pick 6.

Indy played Herm's team in the 2002 playoffs, how did that work out? 

give me all the excuses you want, their D dominated that postseason and the offense had ONE great half(and wouldn't have needed it if they weren't so awful in the 1st half).

 

I couldn't care less about dungy as a human being, that isn't what this is about.  as a HC he is a slam dunk HOFer.

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2 hours ago, nyjunc said:

They got into a hole b/c the OFFENSE couldn't score and peyton threw a pick 6.

Indy played Herm's team in the 2002 playoffs, how did that work out? 

give me all the excuses you want, their D dominated that postseason and the offense had ONE great half(and wouldn't have needed it if they weren't so awful in the 1st half).

 

I couldn't care less about dungy as a human being, that isn't what this is about.  as a HC he is a slam dunk HOFer.

Excuses? They are causes and effects. 

His human traits are part of being in the HOF, as evidenced by reasons some have been kept out. Not that he was close to being a great HC even if he was a prince. But he's neither a great coach nor a good person. What he is and was is an overrated, smug, racist, homophobic lowlife. 

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1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Excuses? They are causes and effects. 

His human traits are part of being in the HOF, as evidenced by reasons some have been kept out. Not that he was close to being a great HC even if he was a prince. But he's neither a great coach nor a good person. What he is and was is an overrated, smug, racist, homophobic lowlife. 

the man turned around the worst franchise in all of sports and turned them into a SB caliber team.  That alone is HOF worthy, they leading Indy to a SB w/ that choker at QB and winning double digit games all but 3 seasons in the league are proof he belongs.  whether he's a jerk/phony or not is irrelevant.  it is distracting from the reality that he belongs.

 

It amazes me how people can tell me Tom Coughlin belongs in but Tony Dungy does not.  Mind boggling.

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On 2/18/2016 at 8:42 AM, drdetroit said:

I think Dungy deserves to be in Hall of Fame just based on what he did in Tampa?  How bout them apples?

 

 

 

Doesn't really matter to me. How bout that chief? Based on what he did in Tampa? You mean win during the regular season with an all pro roster on defense. Never able to get enough going on offense. Year after he leaves Tampa wins the SB with a half decent offense and from what I remember Brad freaking Johnson at QB. He then takes 7 years to win a sb with a hof qb, and never really builds a D. Your apples are rotten and worm infested. However, to each their own. 

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On 2/18/2016 at 8:56 AM, nyjunc said:

 

you look at rankings, I watched the games.  yes during the reg season they weren't as good but healthy in the playoffs they carried Indy to the SB.  They didn't face big time QBs, so what? still have to play well and they did.  

They allowed 8 pts

They allowed 6 pts and despite 

They allowed 27 pts but slowed down Brady in the 2nd half and they never go down 21-6 at half if Manning doesn't throw a pick 6 or have a horrible half.  In the 2nd half Manning was great(for a change) and the D played well.

In the SB they allowed 10 pts and scored a TD

 

The D led them to that SB.  the D allowed 12.8 PPG, They were outstanding in postseason and as we have seen the only way Peyton can win is if his D plays out of their minds.

I watched the games as well. I simply put context to your statement of their D playing lights out and being the reason they got to and won the SB. Playing sh*t offenses tends to make a defense look better than it is. As I said, they played one good offense during the playoffs. Lets not act like the d shut down the pats, because it didn't. Context matters it just doesn't fit your narrative, so you choose to ignore it. Actually the D just has to hold its own for Peyton to win, which it generally never did in Indy. Dungy was there for seven years not just one post season. The offense was already a high caliber offense before Day 1 of his tenure, all he had to do was create a good D and aside from a splashy pass rusher or two the D was average at best. Like in Tampa it was all about the drafting in Tampa they drafted really good on D in Indy they did not.  

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On 2/17/2016 at 1:54 PM, Sperm Edwards said:

Not everyone thinks highly of Dungy's character. Personally I think he's a lowlife. 

T.O. might be a better person. He's just dumber.

I agree. He comes off as a creepy faux religious phony, that is arrogant and judgemental and faintly racist. He creeps me out. 

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On 2/21/2016 at 1:28 AM, Embrace the Suck said:

I watched the games as well. I simply put context to your statement of their D playing lights out and being the reason they got to and won the SB. Playing sh*t offenses tends to make a defense look better than it is. As I said, they played one good offense during the playoffs. Lets not act like the d shut down the pats, because it didn't. Context matters it just doesn't fit your narrative, so you choose to ignore it. Actually the D just has to hold its own for Peyton to win, which it generally never did in Indy. Dungy was there for seven years not just one post season. The offense was already a high caliber offense before Day 1 of his tenure, all he had to do was create a good D and aside from a splashy pass rusher or two the D was average at best. Like in Tampa it was all about the drafting in Tampa they drafted really good on D in Indy they did not.  

there is no context, you are posting meaingless reg season rankings when the Colts D a)wasn't healthy and b- they didn't have to be great.

The Indy D was MUCH better than the Indy O in postseason. that's a fact, it's not debatable.  the Indy O had ONE great half all postseason and needed that great half b/c of how poorly they played in the 1st half to put them in that spot.

The Indy/Den D's have been better in postseason than the NE Ds yet Brady has 4 titles in 6 apps and Manning has 2 in 4 and manning was completely carried in one.

How many playoff games had Peyton won pre Dungy?  and the O went to a new level post Dungy.

Indy had good enough D's to win 2-3 SBs if the QB wasn't such a choker.  a D shouldn't have to dominate for peyton and his O's to win but in his only 2 SB wins his Ds dominated and the O was average/bad.

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On February 18, 2016 at 1:09 PM, nyjunc said:

the man turned around the worst franchise in all of sports and turned them into a SB caliber team.  That alone is HOF worthy, they leading Indy to a SB w/ that choker at QB and winning double digit games all but 3 seasons in the league are proof he belongs.  whether he's a jerk/phony or not is irrelevant.  it is distracting from the reality that he belongs.

 

It amazes me how people can tell me Tom Coughlin belongs in but Tony Dungy does not.  Mind boggling.

No that is not HOF worthy. All it means is that franchise was run horribly poorly in the past. What you're doing is grading on a curve. 

He is horribly overrated as a coach, a horrible person, and should not be in the HOF. 

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1 minute ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No that is not HOF worthy. All it means is that franchise was run horribly poorly in the past. What you're doing is grading on a curve. 

He is horribly overrated as a coach, a horrible person, and should not be in the HOF. 

averaging 11 wins a season is overrated?  I hope some day we can get such an overrated coach.

How many HCs in the history of the game have averaged 11 wins a season? I don't believe anyone has averaged more but he sucks.

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Just now, nyjunc said:

averaging 11 wins a season is overrated?  I hope some day we can get such an overrated coach.

How many HCs in the history of the game have averaged 11 wins a season? I don't believe anyone has averaged more but he sucks.

Oh whatever. He had Peyton Manning in his prime in an era where having a great QB is magnified unlike any prior one. His imbecile, hand-picked replacement went 15-1 and went to the Super Bowl the year after Dungy left. 

That they only ended up with one ring in all that time shows how overrated Dungy is. You presume that the alternative is worse. I'll bet there were Bucs fans who believed that when Dungy was fired, only to see his replacement coast to a SB win Dungy never could have done. Not unless an all time great QB in his prime was plopped in his lap. 

 

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18 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Oh whatever. He had Peyton Manning in his prime in an era where having a great QB is magnified unlike any prior one. His imbecile, hand-picked replacement went 15-1 and went to the Super Bowl the year after Dungy left. 

That they only ended up with one ring in all that time shows how overrated Dungy is. You presume that the alternative is worse. I'll bet there were Bucs fans who believed that when Dungy was fired, only to see his replacement coast to a SB win Dungy never could have done. Not unless an all time great QB in his prime was plopped in his lap. 

 

and he was the only HC to win a SB w/ peyton until the den D dragged him to this past SB.

Dungy was only w/ him for 7 seasons, let's not act like he had him for 15 years like BB has w/ Brady(the MUCH better QB).

Dungy made it possible for TB AND Indy to win SBs and has averaged 11 wins a season along the way.  There's no rational argument against him being a HOFer.

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3 minutes ago, nyjunc said:

and he was the only HC to win a SB w/ peyton until the den D dragged him to this past SB.

Dungy was only w/ him for 7 seasons, let's not act like he had him for 15 years like BB has w/ Brady(the MUCH better QB).

Dungy made it possible for TB AND Indy to win SBs and has averaged 11 wins a season along the way.  There's no rational argument against him being a HOFer.

Lol

You give him credit for a lot of things other people did. 

Dungy had him for the best years of his career. Then again, look what happened with Manning after he was clearly past his prime, rewriting record books in Denver, and you get an idea of what might have been with his career if not for Dungy.

Again, you're looking at what happened in Indy as though hat was as good as could have been expected. What you miss is how much better, or how many more rings, might have happened with a better coach in his place. Like in Tampa. 

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1 minute ago, Sperm Edwards said:

Lol

You give him credit for a lot of things other people did. 

Dungy had him for the best years of his career. Then again, look what happened with Manning after he was clearly past his prime, rewriting record books in Denver, and you get an idea of what might have been with his career if not for Dungy.

Again, you're looking at what happened in Indy as though hat was as good as could have been expected. What you miss is how much better, or how many more rings, might have happened with a better coach in his place. Like in Tampa. 

rewriting record books(as he did in Indy) and coming up small in postseason(as he did in Indy).  Let's not forget Peyton never won a playoff game until Dungy arrived.

Indy didn't win more SBs b/c of the QB not b/c of the HC.

How many rings did Tampa win w/o him? they took his team, won in 2002 then went back down to pre dungy depths w/in a few years.

 

1976-1996(21 seasons): TB made the playoffs 3 times and won as many as 10 games one time.

1996-2001(6 seasons): TB made the playoffs 4 times, won 10+ games 3 times.

2002-2015(14 seasons):  TB made playoffs 3 times, won 10+ 3 times.

 

so to recap: 35 seasons without Dungy:

6 playoff apps, 17% of seasons 

4 seasons winning 10 or more games, 11%

 

6 seasons w/ Dungy:

4 playoff seasons, 67%

3 double digit seasons, 50%

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1 hour ago, Sperm Edwards said:

No that is not HOF worthy. All it means is that franchise was run horribly poorly in the past. What you're doing is grading on a curve. 

He is horribly overrated as a coach, a horrible person, and should not be in the HOF. 

What makes you say he is a horrible person?

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On ‎2‎/‎21‎/‎2016 at 10:59 AM, drdetroit said:

You can always tell who never watched football before 2000.  The Bucs were an XFL team in the NFL before Dungy.

And he did not build the entire team. 

Wyche got the ball rolling, but could not get the Bucs over the hump.  Tony shows up and has two future HofFers in Sapp/Brooks entering their second year with a borderline HofFer in Lynch entering his third.

I think Tony fits Bill Simmons description of Drew Bledsoe.  "Very good, excellent at times, but never great."

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6 minutes ago, PFSIKH said:

And he did not build the entire team. 

Wyche got the ball rolling, but could not get the Bucs over the hump.  Tony shows up and has two future HofFers in Sapp/Brooks entering their second year with a borderline HofFer in Lynch entering his third.

I think Tony fits Bill Simmons description of Drew Bledsoe.  "Very good, excellent at times, but never great."

Drew Bledsoe was not very good or excellent at times.  he was a mediocre, overrated QB.

 

every team has building blocks.  John Lynch was drafted in 1993, he didn't become a PB player until Tony was there. he helped develop John who wasn't starting until tony got there.  he also helped develop Warren and Brooks as well.

 

we all know BB didn't start winning until Brady but do we take away credit from him b/c he inherited law, Brushci, McGinest and all those guys?

 

the man averaged 11 wins a season.  even w/ all the greatness of NE since 2001 Belichick does not average as many wins a season as Dungy led his teams too.  Think about that, NE wins 12-14 every year and Bb averages less per year overall than Dungy.  that's how great Dungy was and he never had a big game QB to work with.

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7 hours ago, nyjunc said:

there is no context, you are posting meaingless reg season rankings when the Colts D a)wasn't healthy and b- they didn't have to be great.

The Indy D was MUCH better than the Indy O in postseason. that's a fact, it's not debatable.  the Indy O had ONE great half all postseason and needed that great half b/c of how poorly they played in the 1st half to put them in that spot.

The Indy/Den D's have been better in postseason than the NE Ds yet Brady has 4 titles in 6 apps and Manning has 2 in 4 and manning was completely carried in one.

How many playoff games had Peyton won pre Dungy?  and the O went to a new level post Dungy.

Indy had good enough D's to win 2-3 SBs if the QB wasn't such a choker.  a D shouldn't have to dominate for peyton and his O's to win but in his only 2 SB wins his Ds dominated and the O was average/bad.

Actually I posted the POSTSEASON rankings, where they were #1 in D,  as well in the same sentence. I also posted the POSTSEASON teams which they played which were clearly average at best offenses as being why they were the #1 D in the POSTSEASON. I also posted how the #1 POSTSEASON Indy D gave up 27 points against the one good O they played. So you must have missed that. Like I said previously, keep seeing what you want to see.   

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Just now, Embrace the Suck said:

Actually I posted the POSTSEASON rankings, where they were #1 in D,  as well in the same sentence. I also posted the POSTSEASON teams which they played which were clearly average at best offenses as being why they were the #1 D in the POSTSEASON. So you must have missed that. Like I said previously, keep seeing what you want to see.   

You did? where?

regardless of all the excuses their D dominated and the only way peyton has ever won a Sb is when his D has dominated.  You act like the Indy O was unstoppable, they had ONE great half all postseason.  they were GREAT the 2nd half of the title game but other than that they struggled.  kept KC in the WC game, kept Bal in the div rd(didn't even score a TD), gave NE  a big lead, kept Chi in a game they had no business being in.  if reg season Peyton shows up Indy wins every game by 20 in that postseason.

 

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4 hours ago, nyjunc said:

every team has building blocks.  John Lynch was drafted in 1993, he didn't become a PB player until Tony was there. he helped develop John who wasn't starting until tony got there.  he also helped develop Warren and Brooks as well.

we all know BB didn't start winning until Brady but do we take away credit from him b/c he inherited law, Brushci, McGinest and all those guys?

the man averaged 11 wins a season.  even w/ all the greatness of NE since 2001 Belichick does not average as many wins a season as Dungy led his teams too.  Think about that, NE wins 12-14 every year and Bb averages less per year overall than Dungy.  that's how great Dungy was and he never had a big game QB to work with.

What?

So Dungy developed those players and Belichick had no impact on the players he inherited?   Most of the honors Law won, he won after Belichick became HC of the NE.  It is the same with Bruschi.

And while I would not say Dungy cherry picked his HC positions, he did not try to take on a total rebuild like Belichick did Cleveland.  Wyche started the rebuild in Tampa and had the team trending in the right direction and again drafted 2 HofFers for Dungy the year before he was fired.  Then Mora started the rebuilding process for the Colts.  Dungy comes along with future top 5 QB of all-time Manning entering his prime and reaps the benefit. 

Again, I am not taking away what he was able to do, but lets not make him out like he built two dynasties.  He is very good, but not great.

 

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Lmao at the people itt saying he doesn't deserve to be in the hall of fame because he is homophobic. Apparently he's not the only one because Michael same isn't even in the nfl now, and let me guess all the old timers don't belong in the hall because a majority of them were bigots 

 

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