TuscanyTile2 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 It's the exception not the rule but we're a lot closer to being a team built like Denver than a team built around a star QB. If we draft Jaylon Smith, and he fully recovers, we might have a shot at being what Denver was this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 The more I watch the NFL the more I feel there is no 'formula' to winning. Teams win with offense, teams win with defense teams win with hof Qb's teams win with past it or hold the fort QB's. - Be healthy - Get hot at the right time - Generate turnovers and do not turn it over (It also really helps to have that good reg season record so you can play one less game or get that one home filed game you need in the playoffs.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Offense wins game Defense wins Championships Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 6 minutes ago, Beerfish said: The more I watch the NFL the more I feel there is no 'formula' to winning. Teams win with offense, teams win with defense teams win with ho Qb's teams win with past it or hold the fort QB's. - Be healthy - Get hot at the right time - Generate turnovers and do not turn it over (It also really helps to have that good reg season record so you can play one less game or get that one home filed game you need in the playoffs.) Offense wins in the regular season, defense wins in the postseason. Which is why the Patriots haven't won more Super Bowls despite having the best QB and HC in the era (cheating aside) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 3 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said: Offense wins in the regular season, defense wins in the postseason. Which is why the Patriots haven't won more Super Bowls despite having the best QB and HC in the era (cheating aside) They have won 4... more than any other team in the last 25 years. Havent won more? They have been there 7 times as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 2 minutes ago, southparkcpa said: They have won 4... more than any other team in the last 25 years. Havent won more? They have been there 7 times as well. 4 in 25 years is not really a good percentage. Better than us, but Yankees fans scoff at that Steelers won 4 in 6 years. Niners won 4 in 9 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, UnitedWhofans said: 4 in 25 years is not really a good percentage. Better than us, but Yankees fans scoff at that Steelers won 4 in 6 years. Niners won 4 in 9 years. Please stop, they were there 7 times in 15 years. Won 4 of them. Fukk them but Brady is pretty good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Just now, southparkcpa said: Please stop, they were there 7 times in 15 years. Won 4 of them. Fukk them but Brady is pretty good. Did I say he was bad? No. But their dynasty ended in 2005, just like the Yankees dynasty ended in 2001. Same situation, despite the different sport Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainejet Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Well, looking at this logically..... We have a good defense, but can we put up the kind of dominant performances that Denver has the last two weeks? The answer to that is a resounding NO. We have an OK offense. It is a work in progress. Certainly not as potent and high scoring as the Denver offense is capable of being. We also do NOT have the kind of blocking that was necessary for the Broncos to merely run the ball as much as they did yesterday. So can we do the kinds of things that Denver was able to offensively yesterday? The answer to that is a resounding NO. Our Special Teams absolutely sucked A$$ this season. So are we capable of assisting the offense or defense with a good potent kicking and punting game/good punt returning? The answer to that is a resounding NO. So if you're looking to draw some similarities between the Jets and he SB winners? My answer is to say that we haven't a snowballs chance in hell of getting to the big game with the current compliment of players on this team. Not one single f*cking chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 4 minutes ago, Mainejet said: Well, looking at this logically..... We have a good defense, but can we put up the kind of dominant performances that Denver has the last two weeks? The answer to that is a resounding NO. We have an OK offense. It is a work in progress. Certainly not as potent and high scoring as the Denver offense is capable of being. We also do NOT have the kind of blocking that was necessary for the Broncos to merely run the ball as much as they did yesterday. So can we do the kinds of things that Denver was able to offensively yesterday? The answer to that is a resounding NO. Our Special Teams absolutely sucked A$$ this season. So are we capable of assisting the offense or defense with a good potent kicking and punting game/good punt returning? The answer to that is a resounding NO. So if you're looking to draw some similarities between the Jets and he SB winners? My answer is to say that we haven't a snowballs chance in hell of getting to the big game with the current compliment of players on this team. Not one single f*cking chance. Why can't we put up a dominant defensive performance? Why do people keep saying this? We're only 2-3 players away on defense. That could very easily be made possible with just one offseason. Denver added Wade Phillips and DeMarcus Ware; otherwise their D was mostly the same as the year before (when they were also very good). Why can't that be us in that position? Because we don't have John Elway to recruit coaches/players? Come on. Your other arguments make little sense too. Our O-line was very good this past season. Powell and Ivory looked great running behind it. Replace Breno with a Bobby Massie-type and we're fairly set (though of course we need to draft an OT high to eventually replace Brick). As for Special Teams, I expect we'll have more depth next year, and thus ST's will get better. Not to mention, we have a new coach. "Wait and see" is how we should look at ST's. Not just throw up our hands and say "Our ST's suck and always will". No, they won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 13 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said: Offense wins in the regular season, defense wins in the postseason. Which is why the Patriots haven't won more Super Bowls despite having the best QB and HC in the era (cheating aside) Step one, make the playoffs Step two get hot and win the SB. People love to bring out the defense wins championships every year after a D has actually done so but there are tons of examples of offense winning championships. You cannot suck in any phase of the game to win but offense can carry the days just as much as defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said: Why can't we put up a dominant defensive performance? Why do people keep saying this? We're only 2-3 players away on defense. That could very easily be made possible with just one offseason. Denver added Wade Phillips and DeMarcus Ware; otherwise their D was mostly the same as the year before (when they were also very good). Why can't that be us in that position? Because we don't have John Elway to recruit coaches/players? Come on. Really? We got dissected by Buffalo twice. Our defense is old and slow. As we add these 2 or 3, then Crow ages out, Harris et al , Revis gets older etc...I agree with you however, but speed is needed. Denvers D-line is perhaps better, their LBers are better and their secondary is better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 2 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Why can't we put up a dominant defensive performance? Why do people keep saying this? We're only 2-3 players away on defense. That could very easily be made possible with just one offseason. Denver added Wade Phillips and DeMarcus Ware; otherwise their D was mostly the same as the year before (when they were also very good). Why can't that be us in that position? Because we don't have John Elway to recruit coaches/players? Come on. The problem is that to add 2-3 players we are going to have remove 2-3 as well. We have prioritized interior Dline and corners for a long time on this team. We could make the leap as you say, it is possible. (I've been saying for 7 or 8 years the only thing separating this team from being a great defense from a good one is a true pass rushing olb.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigRy56 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Football does not begin and end with at the quarterback position. I hate the argument of "nothing matters if you don't have a quarterback". Championships are won by complete football teams. While it's true that the quarterback is important and plays a larger role, they are just a part of that winning puzzle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsfan80 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 5 minutes ago, Beerfish said: The problem is that to add 2-3 players we are going to have remove 2-3 as well. We have prioritized interior Dline and corners for a long time on this team. We could make the leap as you say, it is possible. (I've been saying for 7 or 8 years the only thing separating this team from being a great defense from a good one is a true pass rushing olb.) Yes, we'll be losing Cromartie (waste of space), Demario Davis (too slow) and unfortunately either Snacks or Wilkerson (big loss either way, but what can you do)? Goes without saying that Calvin Pace is a goner too. But in exchange, we'll see a big emphasis on Lorenzo Mauldin's development. We'll likely see a couple athletic LB's added in the draft or as well as free agency, in all likelihood. We may get to see a DL containing Richardson, Wilkerson, and Leonard Williams (who will also continue to develop, and should not at all be forgotten). We'll maybe get to see the much awaited emergence of a guy like Dexter McDougle, or at the very least, we'll see Marcus Williams attempt to lock down a starting job. Both are young and hungry. Losing players opens up opportunities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted February 8, 2016 Author Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, BigRy56 said: Football does not begin and end with at the quarterback position. I hate the argument of "nothing matters if you don't have a quarterback". Championships are won by complete football teams. While it's true that the quarterback is important and plays a larger role, they are just a part of that winning puzzle. QB is the most important part IMO. Look at recent SB QBs. Cam/Peyton (though Peyton was terrible this year). Brady/Russell Wilson (both great). Peyton/Wilson (both great). Flacco/Kaepernick (both very good at the time). Eli/Brady (Brady possible GOAT. Eli possible HOF) Rodgers/Big Ben (both great) Brees/Peyton (both great) Big Ben/Warner (both great) Eli/Brady (see above) Peyton / Rex Grossman (Rex stunk but Peyton was great). XLI Feb. 4, 2007 Dolphin Stadium (Miami) Indianapolis 29, Chicago 17 XLII Feb. 3, 2008 University of Phoenix Stadium (Glendale, Ariz.) New York Giants 17, New England 14 XLIII Feb. 1, 2009 Raymond James Stadium (Tampa, Fla.) Pittsburgh Steelers 27, Arizona Cardinals 23 XLIV Feb. 7, 2010 Sun Life Stadium (Miami) New Orleans Saints 31, Indianapolis Colts 17 XLV Feb. 6, 2011 Cowboys Stadium (Arlington, Texas) Green Bay Packers 31, Pittsburgh Steelers 25 XLVI Feb. 5, 2012 Lucas Oil Stadium (Indianapolis) New York Giants 21, New England Patriots 17 XLVII Feb. 3, 2013 Mercedes-Benz Superdome (New Orleans) Baltimore Ravens 34, San Francisco 49ers 31 XLVIII Feb. 2, 2014 MetLife Stadium (East Rutherford, N.J.) Seattle Seahawks 43, Denver Broncos 8 XLIX Feb. 1, 2015 University of Phoenix Stadium (Glendale, Ariz.) New England Patriots 28, Seattle Seahawks 24 50 Feb. 7, 2016 Levi's Stadium (Santa Clara, Calif.) Denver Broncos 24, Carolina Panthers 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainejet Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 10 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said: Why can't we put up a dominant defensive performance? Why do people keep saying this? We're only 2-3 players away on defense. That could very easily be made possible with just one offseason. Denver added Wade Phillips and DeMarcus Ware; otherwise their D was mostly the same as the year before (when they were also very good). Why can't that be us in that position? Because we don't have John Elway to recruit coaches/players? Come on. Your other arguments make little sense too. Our O-line was very good this past season. Powell and Ivory looked great running behind it. Replace Breno with a Bobby Massie-type and we're fairly set (though of course we need to draft an OT high to eventually replace Brick). As for Special Teams, I expect we'll have more depth next year, and thus ST's will get better. Not to mention, we have a new coach. "Wait and see" is how we should look at ST's. Not just throw up our hands and say "Our ST's suck and always will". No, they won't. Well, then let me ask you....... DID WE? Did we ever even once this season put up a defensive performance even close to what the Broncos did? The answer is NO. Not even close and we played a common opponent in NE.NE was absolutely gashed with injuries when we faced them and we had to use OT to finally win. Denver completely dominated ALL of NE's weapons and knocked the p*ss out of Brady. Something we didn't even come close to doing. And start listening to what I posted. I said that we haven't a snowballs chance in hell of doing anything even close to what Denver just yesterday with this current compliment of players. If you started listening it would serve you well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 You 100% need a QB to get you there. 100%. But the fact you need a D that can make a stop when it matters has never changed. Defense wins championships Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 you need dominant players...Offense and/or defense. Players that can take over a game - true difference makers. Right now there's no one on the Jets that you can say that about. Maybe Marshall, but I don't think he's explosive enough to truly take over a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetrider Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Fitz will be the first quarterback in NFL history to win a SB before the five teams that dumped him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nyjunc Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 hour ago, joewilly12 said: Offense wins game Defense wins Championships except for 2014, 2012, 2010, 2009, 2004, 2003, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 11 minutes ago, JiF said: You 100% need a QB to get you there. 100%. But the fact you need a D that can make a stop when it matters has never changed. Defense wins championships Sacks and turnovers win championships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Just now, T0mShane said: Sacks and turnovers win championships. Are sacks and turnovers created by defense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, JiF said: Are sacks and turnovers created by defense? You can be a good defensive team that doesn't get sacks and turnovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 2 minutes ago, T0mShane said: You can be a good defensive team that doesn't get sacks and turnovers. I think the mantra "defense wins championships" refers to great D's as opposed to just good D's but I feel ya. Got to get to the QB and cover the receivers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 I think if we Jets fans learned anything from last night it's that we gave up on both Chad Pennington and Mark Sanchez way to early. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TuscanyTile2 Posted February 8, 2016 Author Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, gEYno said: I think if we Jets fans learned anything from last night it's that we gave up on both Chad Pennington and Mark Sanchez way to early. Is this a serious post? I'm glad we gave up on both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 1 minute ago, TuscanyTile2 said: Is this a serious post? I'm glad we gave up on both. Both would have won last nights game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Both would have won last nights game. Our defense is nothing close to Denvers. They have better everything. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 2 minutes ago, The Troll said: Our defense is nothing close to Denvers. They have better everything. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Agreed. Our guys never got the benefits Peyton Manning has had... re: defense and weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
long suffering jets fan Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Been proven many many times before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Troll Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Agreed. Our guys never got the benefits Peyton Manning has had... re: defense and weapons. Why whine about keeping them, then? I don't want to hear any complaining about Pennington's weapons. He just had to have his guy Coles so we traded 10 years of Santana Moss for the death rattle of Coles' career. Sanchez had Holmes and Braylon. Neither were far removed from being insanely productive. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 Depends on how it fits into the NFL's narrative, but sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 3 minutes ago, The Troll said: Why whine about keeping them, then? I don't want to hear any complaining about Pennington's weapons. He just had to have his guy Coles so we traded 10 years of Santana Moss for the death rattle of Coles' career. Sanchez had Holmes and Braylon. Neither were far removed from being insanely productive. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Chad with Denver's weapons and defense wins last night by 2 touchdowns, minimum. Probably benched by the 4th Quarter. Do you even remember how accurate he was? Also, if you put Coles on Moss's shoulders, you'd have one real WR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BowlesMovement Posted February 8, 2016 Share Posted February 8, 2016 3 minutes ago, Integrity28 said: Depends on how it fits into the NFL's narrative, but sure... Bingo! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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