Villain The Foe Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Just wanted to put that out into the world. It needed to be said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gastineau Lives Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 The difficulty of the jets 2016 schedule is a myth. Discuss. Sent from my VS930 4G using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Not sure about Lynch, but he's absolutely a better prospect than Cook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 On "Game Changers," both Hogan and Cook were given the opportunity to ask Kurt Warner one parting question. Cook: What advice would you give a rookie qb? Hogan: You're in a game with playoff implications in front of 70,000 screaming fans, and your headset device goes fuzzy, what is your go-to concept? (fwiw, I like both prospects just fine...but this goes to show whats going on upstairs) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamesr Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 3 hours ago, Greenseed4 said: On "Game Changers," both Hogan and Cook were given the opportunity to ask Kurt Warner one parting question. Cook: What advice would you give a rookie qb? Hogan: You're in a game with playoff implications in front of 70,000 screaming fans, and your headset device goes fuzzy, what is your go-to concept? (fwiw, I like both prospects just fine...but this goes to show whats going on upstairs) Geno Smith : "What time does the movie start?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdetroit Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 I don't like any of the supposed first round grade qb's this year except Wentz so probably agree with OP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrickTamland Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Always liked hogan a lot. Funky delivery tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 no arm strength. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 16, 2016 Author Share Posted April 16, 2016 55 minutes ago, Augustiniak said: no arm strength. Based on what? He has a much better arm strength and better accuracy than Ryan Fitzpatrick, a guy with no arm strength. From the video's I've come across not only can he can make just about every throw but he can put it right in the bread basket. This video tells a different story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 16, 2016 Author Share Posted April 16, 2016 1 hour ago, BrickTamland said: Always liked hogan a lot. Funky delivery tho. True. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 16, 2016 Author Share Posted April 16, 2016 2 hours ago, drdetroit said: I don't like any of the supposed first round grade qb's this year except Wentz so probably agree with OP Starting to feel the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant wait Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 9 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: Based on what? He has a much better arm strength and better accuracy than Ryan Fitzpatrick, a guy with no arm strength. From the video's I've come across not only can he can make just about every throw but he can put it right in the bread basket. This video tells a different story. I like the kids attitude but his mechanics need a lot of work, that's likely going to keep him from going until day 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 16, 2016 Author Share Posted April 16, 2016 14 minutes ago, cant wait said: I like the kids attitude but his mechanics need a lot of work, that's likely going to keep him from going until day 3 And thats cool, thats what we have coaches for. What I want to see is his movement in the pocket, ability to keep his eyes down the field, throwing decisions, accuracy on short, intermediate and deep throws. He doesnt have the livest arm, but its good enough. He also can read the field, and I dont just mean go through his progressions, but he takes what the defense gives him and he's patient. Mechanics wouldnt ruin that for me at all because that could be worked on. This kid has what a QB should have though. I have a feeling that the only reason why he's not in the "top QB" conversation is because he's 6'2. The shortest guys of the "Top 4" are Jared Goff and Connor Cook (6'4). The guy that is the rawest of the bunch is for some reason considered the the 3rd best QB simply because of his height and his arm (Lynch 6'7). The #1 guy is Wentz and he's 6'5. Perfect example is a guy like Cardale Jones. He's not good. He found himself in alot of conversations last year given the championship but mostly because of his size (6'5) and having possibly the strongest arm in the country. This year shows that he's not very good, yet that height and arm strength still intrigues. Its like a WR running a 4.38 40 time...its like it no longer matters if he can run a route or catch a football lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetscode1 Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 One analysis... Kevin Hogan QB Stanford STRENGTHS Kevin is the type of quarterback who grows on you as you watch film because of his football intelligence and how he never seems to panic. He has good arm strength and when his mechanics are in check, he has excellent accuracy. He understands the purpose of the running game and this year I have seen him throw receivers open more than in the past. He has excellent athletic talent to run for first downs when needed and stands tall in the pocket. He has improved every year I have watched him play in every aspect of his game. Kevin is a deceivingly good quarterback who has the mental strength, football intelligence, strong accurate arm and big athletic talent to become a starting quarterback for the team that selects him. CONCERNS Kevin works well in the offensive system that his college team uses and that system relies on an impact running game and 2 tight ends for protection. It’s the same system I suggested would limit Andrew Luck when he came out in the draft. Kevin also has this funky throwing motion that bothers most scouts when they watch him play. It doesn’t seem to affect his accuracy, but knocking his passes down could be an issue and in the NFL the longer he is on the field for a 16 game schedule, the more this dropping down in his motion and changing his release point could become more than troublesome and will keep him on the bench. TALENT BOARD ROUND: 3 This year Kevin has done a good job changing his throwing motion and coming over the top more but he does revert at times during a game to dropping down especially when he throws the ball deep. It almost looks like he launches it instead of throwing it and his ball loses velocity when he does this although…he still seems to be pretty accurate. Right now most teams will look at Kevin as a backup quarterback because of his football intelligence but I think he is more than that if he can continue to work on his throwing motion and of course gets on the field for a length of time that shows he can be more than a backup quarterback. I like his potential and in the later rounds of this draft I would select him with the thought that he can come in and learn a system and at some point become a very good productive starter. If it doesn’t happen I still think you have yourself an excellent backup quarterback and I don’t think that’s bad at all. For me personally, I would not draft a quarterback who I don’t think honestly has the potential to be a starter and be a winning quarterback at any point in a draft. I don’t draft backups but that’s just me. Some other people think differently. Kevin reminds me a lot of a former Super Bowl quarterback Brad Johnson. Brad played 7 seasons for the Vikings before moving on to the Redskins and then the Buccaneers where he played in the Super Bowl. Then back to the Vikings and finally the Cowboys. He never seemed to be appreciated but obviously was always in demand. I think right now you could put Kevin in the same category as unappreciated because this kid’s record does speak for itself and should be taken into account when evaluating him. It does for me.Drew Boylhart MAR.2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrickTamland Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 Happy this guy is getting some love. I put him in my mock draft in March or so. I think i was told he was trash by a few esteemed members here. guy is talented and experienced and coached well and tall and decent arm and has played too competition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant wait Posted April 16, 2016 Share Posted April 16, 2016 12 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: And thats cool, thats what we have coaches for. What I want to see is his movement in the pocket, ability to keep his eyes down the field, throwing decisions, accuracy on short, intermediate and deep throws. He doesnt have the livest arm, but its good enough. He also can read the field, and I dont just mean go through his progressions, but he takes what the defense gives him and he's patient. Mechanics wouldnt ruin that for me at all because that could be worked on. This kid has what a QB should have though. I have a feeling that the only reason why he's not in the "top QB" conversation is because he's 6'2. The shortest guys of the "Top 4" are Jared Goff and Connor Cook (6'4). The guy that is the rawest of the bunch is for some reason considered the the 3rd best QB simply because of his height and his arm (Lynch 6'7). The #1 guy is Wentz and he's 6'5. Perfect example is a guy like Cardale Jones. He's not good. He found himself in alot of conversations last year given the championship but mostly because of his size (6'5) and having possibly the strongest arm in the country. This year shows that he's not very good, yet that height and arm strength still intrigues. Its like a WR running a 4.38 40 time...its like it no longer matters if he can run a route or catch a football lol. You've seen it with a guy like tebow though, mechanics are not always easily fixed. I could see a team with an established starter though taking him in the middle rounds and let him develop on the bench for a couple years. I don't think his height really has anything to do with it, he really checks all the boxes you want in a QB except it's going to take time to fix his mechanics. A team like SD or AZ would be smart to take this guy and hope he can take over eventually Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 16, 2016 Author Share Posted April 16, 2016 8 minutes ago, cant wait said: You've seen it with a guy like tebow though, mechanics are not always easily fixed. I could see a team with an established starter though taking him in the middle rounds and let him develop on the bench for a couple years Tim Tebow wasnt a quarterback. And sometimes, mechanics simply are what they are. As long as he can deliver the ball and make the right decisions, you take that over some general mechanic. All QB's throw differently, though there is a general mechanic thing that goes on. Maybe he can changte, maybe not...but unlike Tebow, when you look at Hogan it looks like you're watching a QB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cant wait Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 10 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: Tim Tebow wasnt a quarterback. And sometimes, mechanics simply are why they are. As long as he can deliver the ball and make the right decisions, you take that over some general mechanic. All QB's throw differently, though there is a general mechanic thing that goes on. Maybe he can chance, maybe not...but unlike Tebow, when you look at Hogan it looks like you're watching a QB Yeah I mean you've seen some QB's like rivers do alright with a funny delivery, but he definitely needs to clean up his footwork and get the ball out quicker. Who knows he could be a sleeper pick who ends up going higher than expected. All it takes is one coach who thinks they can work with him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said: And thats cool, thats what we have coaches for. What I want to see is his movement in the pocket, ability to keep his eyes down the field, throwing decisions, accuracy on short, intermediate and deep throws. He doesnt have the livest arm, but its good enough. He also can read the field, and I dont just mean go through his progressions, but he takes what the defense gives him and he's patient. Mechanics wouldnt ruin that for me at all because that could be worked on. This kid has what a QB should have though. I have a feeling that the only reason why he's not in the "top QB" conversation is because he's 6'2. The shortest guys of the "Top 4" are Jared Goff and Connor Cook (6'4). The guy that is the rawest of the bunch is for some reason considered the the 3rd best QB simply because of his height and his arm (Lynch 6'7). The #1 guy is Wentz and he's 6'5. Perfect example is a guy like Cardale Jones. He's not good. He found himself in alot of conversations last year given the championship but mostly because of his size (6'5) and having possibly the strongest arm in the country. This year shows that he's not very good, yet that height and arm strength still intrigues. Its like a WR running a 4.38 40 time...its like it no longer matters if he can run a route or catch a football lol. Hogan isn't 6'2. He's 6'perfect, check his combine measures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 17, 2016 Author Share Posted April 17, 2016 4 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said: Hogan isn't 6'2. He's 6'perfect, check his combine measures. Then no one really knows his height except him. On NFL.com they have him listed at 6'3. The place I originally looked had him at 6'2 and your source says 6 foot. http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/kevin-hogan?id=2555263 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I think Hogan certainly checks a-lot of boxes as a QB but that throwing motion falls VERY close to tebow/Leftwich which were far more productive in college and failed. Its been said often for a very long time about him so I'm only stating the obvious here. Unless he makes major changes theres going to be tons of strip sacks, fumbles, and Int as CB's will see that coming early. He's got a-lot going for him besides that but its extremely rare for a QB to fix that issue after so many years of doing it. Should be interesting to see where he goes on draft day as all it takes is one team to fall in love and think they can change his motion ala Tebow (1st rounder). However some teams will likely have him OFF there draft board or rated very low. My question is why don't college coaches correct this upon players arrival? Why wait? Anyway he belongs on a team with an established franchise guy in which he can sit and work on his mechanics etc for a few years. If he corrects it he surely has upside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenseed4 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 47 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: Then no one really knows his height except him. On NFL.com they have him listed at 6'3. The place I originally looked had him at 6'2 and your source says 6 foot. http://www.nfl.com/draft/2016/profiles/kevin-hogan?id=2555263 He's a tall 6'3 then. Just a shade under Connor Cook when they stood side by side on Game Changers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gas2No99 Posted April 17, 2016 Share Posted April 17, 2016 I've been banging my head against the wall WAILING! about Hogan as a legit Day 2 or Day 3 QB draft prospect to groom in what is a VERY UNSPECTACULAR QB draft this year. I agree that you draft a QB every year and Hogan SHOULD be the guy in late 3rd or early 4th IMO. I've posted PLENTY of info on him - posted on this thread a while back. Everyone knocks his mechanics but good coaching and HIS WORK ETHIC will overcome that IMO. I think he may have the best career of all these 2016 prospects, THAT SAID, it seems his delivery/mechanics is what's scaring everyone off: NFL Draft: Mechanics hinder Stanford QB Kevin Hogan by Sal Maiorana 9:15 a.m. EDT April 14, 2016 Learning an NFL team’s playbook will not pose the slightest bit of a problem for Stanford’s Kevin Hogan. The issue scouts, general managers, and coaches are concerned about is whether he can ever learn to throw like an NFL quarterback. “Hogan is probably the most ready, intellectually, of any of the quarterbacks,” said NFL Network draft analyst Mike Mayock. “He’s going to come in and pick it up very quickly.” That’s because no one in the 2016 quarterback draft class has played more college football than Hogan. He apprenticed one season as a redshirt under Andrew Luck, served as a backup for the first half of 2012, and then started his last 3½ years for the Cardinal and won 35 games, the most in school history, impressive when you consider Luck, Jim Plunkett, and John Elway played in Palo Alto. But Hogan’s mechanics — partly his footwork, mainly his elongated delivery — are “a mess” according to one scout, and if he is ever going to become a starter in the NFL, they will have to be cleaned up. “I feel like I’ve put a lot of good things on tape,” Hogan said at the NFL Scouting Combine. “I know all of these coaches are going to watch my tape and that’s who I am. I’m trying to make strides with my base in the pocket and really tighten up my base and have a more compact delivery. And I feel once I put it all together, I’ll be good to go.” John Ramsdell, who spent 19 years as a coach in the NFL including a seven-year tenure with the San Diego Chargers where he helped fine-tune Philip Rivers’ unorthodox delivery, is trying to do the same with Hogan. Is it possible to overhaul his throwing motion? Of course, and that’s why the Bills have shown some interest in Hogan throughout the pre-draft process. Tyrod Taylor is Buffalo’s starter in 2016, and he very well could be the starter in 2017 and beyond if the Bills either sign him to a long-term deal, or utilize the franchise tag next year. In that scenario, Hogan could be an ideal mid-round pick for the Bills because there will be no need for him to step in and start right away, and Buffalo clearly needs a capable backup. Bills general manager Doug Whaley and coach Rex Ryan met with Hogan in Indianapolis prior to the combine, and then Whaley was personally on hand for Hogan’s pro day last month prior to the NFL owners’ meetings. He downplayed his attendance, saying that it just happened to work out that he was in northern California when Stanford and the University of California were holding their pro days, but the Bills are certainly performing due diligence on the 6-foot-3, 218-pound Hogan. Whaley was asked specifically whether Hogan, given the fact that he operated in a pro-style, run-first offense, is an attractive fit, and he said, “I would say for us, probably, because he runs the same system we run. Now for everybody else, I can’t say that.” Hogan completed 65.9 percent of his passes for 9,385 yards with 75 touchdowns and 29 interceptions at Stanford, and he was given much more leeway on the field than most of the other top quarterbacks in the draft because of his intelligence. In other words, he did things NFL quarterbacks are expected to do. “I think it’s absolutely beneficial,” said Hogan. “I’ve been taking snaps for five years under center. I’ve called plays in the huddle. I’ve had to manage tons of different looks at the line — not checking to the sideline to see what the adjustment should be. So I feel extremely comfortable having to change protections, ‘Mike’ somebody else, readjusting the ‘Mike’ point, check run plays against exotic blitzes, just getting us into efficient plays.” And what cannot be measured, but something he has in ample supply, is grit and leadership, traits that Whaley was concentrating on while watching Hogan as well as quarterback Jared Goff during Cal’s pro day. “Well, with Hogan and Goff you always like to go out and see those guys live, just to see,” said Whaley. “And then what I like to do, especially at quarterback pro days, is see his interactions with his teammates, (his) presence when he’s doing the drills … how did he command the session? Were people coming up to him and listening to him? Was he in total control of not only the drills but his players? Those are the types of things I get when I see a quarterback live at a pro day.” Hogan has been projected anywhere from the third round all the way back to the sixth round, so it will just depend on how worried teams are about his mechanics. All he wants is a chance to prove the naysaying scouts wrong. “I played a lot of football,” Hogan said. “I started 46 games in college and never missed a game. I feel like I’m a fairly healthy person and know how to take care of my body and be smart, especially out there on the field. I know I’m going to learn the game as it comes with experience. I’m just excited to learn.” MAIORANA@Gannett.com MY MAN for the Jets at QB is Kevin F'n HOGAN!!!!!!!! from Stanford (late 3rd to 5th rounds) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 21, 2016 Author Share Posted April 21, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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Colgateman Posted April 21, 2016 Share Posted April 21, 2016 I like this guy a lot, but his throwing motion looks just like Phillip rivers and that sh*t is ugly. but as long as it gets there, it gets there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 26, 2016 Author Share Posted April 26, 2016 QB: Cerebral, tested Kevin Hogan could be the best fit for the Bills [BN] the know Subscribe for just $2.24/wk All packages include unlimited access to our websites & apps SUBSCRIBE TODAY Kevin Hogan during the 102nd Rose Bowl Game on January 1, 2016. (Getty Images) By Tyler Dunne Updated 5:25 PM April 25, 2016 SHARE TWEET EMAIL Kevin Hogan repeats the play call aloud, one of many Quarterbacking 601 tongue-twisters he’d shout in the Stanford huddle. “Green Right, 95 weak, Kill 96 Force, Alert Hound 2, Double Stutter." The call has three layers. First, Hogan can go with an inside-zone run to the weak side of the line. If there’s a defensive lineman in a 3-technique there, he rolls with an outside-zone run to the other side. And if Hogan spots a safety creeping into the box? He licks his chops, checks to “double stutter,” and hits a receiver in one-on-one coverage downfield off play action. Get all that? ADVERTISEMENT Hogan can speak to NFL coaches and scouts on a level almost all other quarterbacks in this draft cannot. Most were robots in spread offenses mechanically taking plays from the sideline, racing to the line at warp speed and making one read during a play with speed, speed, SPEED the emphasis. The brain, for many, is not. So in this year's draft, Hogan is the cerebral alternative. For teams stuck in this quarterback crisis, he's the throwback to simpler times. “It’s easy for me,” said Hogan, one day after visiting with the San Diego Chargers. “It’s fun. It’s a breath of fresh air for them for me to be able to speak the same language as them. … It was like you’re a blast from the past for these guys.” And he may make the most sense for the Buffalo Bills, too. [Top 10 QBs gallery: Tyler Dunne breaks them down] If it’s the mind they covet — rather than Cardale Jones’ boomerang arm, Dak Prescott’s dual-threat intrigue or Christian Hackenberg’s prototypical size, arm — then Hogan is the choice. General Manager Doug Whaley has called him the most pro ready in the draft. A meeting with Hogan is different than any other. The Bills have only drafted four quarterbacks since Jim Kelly retired. With Tyrod Taylor entering a contract year, they must choose wisely. Hogan, for many reasons, could be the pick in the middle rounds. Here's why. The Bills know Hogan; Hogan knows the Bills. The 6-foot-3, 218-pounder spent a substantial amount of time with Buffalo’s coaches at the Senior Bowl, the NFL scouting combine and then performed a handful of requested throws for the team at his pro day. Hogan had an “easy conversation” with offensive coordinator Greg Roman — this is, after all, the same offense he ran. Run-first. A lot of dissecting the front seven (in addition to the back four). A lot of play-action. Audibles. A huddle. Rollouts. Hogan never played for Roman at Stanford, but the coach originally recruited him out of McLean, Va. He knows what the coach wants out of a quarterback. A fit in Buffalo? Absolutely. He doesn't hesitate. “It’s the same one we ran at Stanford,” Hogan said. “You’re going to have three plays called and you’ll have to go up to the line of scrimmage with 12 seconds left on the play clock and read the defense pre-snap and see what the best play is to get into. A lot of the game is handled before the ball is even snapped. Coach Roman is going to have a lot of play action, a lot of turning your back to the defense, a lot of turning around and seeing what’s happened. “What adjustments have been made? And that’s what I’ve been doing at Stanford. So I feel very confident in my abilities, what I’ve learned here and I feel it will transfer very well.” He overcame life’s greatest loss: his dad. Hogan's father died from colon cancer after a five-year battle and the experience was brutal for son, for his family. The two watched all sports together, from golf to football — his fondest memories were simply “hearing his stories” and “sitting and talking” for hours. But the quarterback who once took over for No. 1 overall pick Andrew Luck quit sweating the small stuff. Dad's death inherently changed him on and off the field. “It allowed me to catch my breath, gather my rhythm and just play the game,” Hogan said. “I think that really helped me. At times, I was pressing too hard and not really letting the game come to me. “You realize it’s just a game that you’re playing. A game I’ve played my whole life. You don’t need to force it. Let the game come to you. Take what the defense gives you and have fun. That’s what I did this past season — I just had fun.” As a senior, Hogan completed 67.8 percent of his passes for 2,867 yards, 27 touchdowns and only eight picks, in addition to 336 rushing yards and six scores. He’s battle-tested on the field. Hogan won three Pac-12 titles, appeared in three Rose Bowls and went 16-6 against Top 25 teams in his 46-start career. Big games under bright lights were the norm — he insists that no situation ever fazes him. Never has since he slayed No. 2-ranked Oregon, on the road, in his second career start as a redshirt freshman. “After that," Hogan said, "there was no situation I couldn’t handle." Fixing the fundamentals. This is No. 1 red flag with Hogan, one reason to pass. His awkward, wind-up delivery from head to toe in college was not a thing of beauty. So for two months, he went into the lab with former NFL quarterbacks coach, John Ramsdell. As the QB coach in San Diego 2006- ‘12, Ramsdell was the one who reworked Philip Rivers and his funky release. Before that, he coached two other Pro Bowlers in Kurt Warner and Marc Bulger with St. Louis. The key with Hogan? His lower body. Hogan says that Ramsdell changed his "entire perspective" on the quarterback position. Suddenly, it was all about his legs. Speed up his lower body on drops, on the release and the upper body will naturally speed up, too. “A lot of people make a big deal about throwing motions and mechanics but that’s not really what it’s about,” Hogan said. “What Coach Ramsdell and I did was really work on my lower half, my base and tightening it up — having a good, compact base, a powerful base with knee flexion so I could just torque my body and get the ball out. At times in my career, I would over-stride like a pitcher and it would cause me to elongate my throwing process and take a while because you can’t make a throw until your feet are in the ground. “When your hips go, your upper body’s going to follow. It really allowed me to compact everything. I feel much more comfortable in the pocket.” Just as Rivers never needed to completely change his easy-to-mock sidearm delivery, Hogan didn't need to re-do his release. By his pro day, his body movements were more snappy and decisive. Hours of poring through Rivers' film and doing drills with Ramsdell paid off. Ramsdell assures that Hogan, like all rookies, will be a work in progress. Whether the changes stick for good or Hogan reverts back to his pitcher-like motion remains to be seen. Remember, Tim Tebow was never able to make permanent changes. Ramsdell? He's convinced Hogan is a different passer now... and will only progress. “He was taking a real long throwing motion," Ramsdell said. "The higher level you go up, it’s an indicator of where you’re going with the ball. It telegraphs what you’re doing and helps the defense. It gives them a head start to react. So you want to be quick with your throwing motion — quick as possible — so that’s what we did. “I think his best days are ahead of him. I can see him improving greatly. He’s very tenacious. He wants to do it. He’ll play in the NFL.” Willing to wait. Hogan agrees with Ramsdell. Waiting, learning, watching on a sideline in Year 1 would be the best-case scenario. Whoever the Bills draft next week, that’d be the plan. Taylor is the clear-cut starter in 2016. Beyond 2016, there are no guarantees. With biting conviction, Hogan makes his case clear. He started for “one of the most pure offenses that has ever existed.” He managed a huddle. He called audibles at the line. His voice is laced with a swagger and not-so-subtle dig at other prospects. “It’s not about getting up to the line and looking to the sidelines to see what your coach says,” Hogan said. “It’s about handling it under center — that’s what the quarterback position is all about.” The Bills, he’s convinced, would be a perfect landing spot. Next week, Whaley, Roman and co. are on the clock. “I really admired what they did last season and I think there’s good things coming,” Hogan said. “I know Coach Roman’s offense. I know that I would be able to pick that up very easily. I know some things would be different and I’d have to adjust to the speed and schemes on the defensive side. “But, yes, I feel very comfortable with that system.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[BN] the know Subscribe for just $2.24/wk All packages include unlimited access to our websites & apps SUBSCRIBE TODAY Kevin Hogan during the 102nd Rose Bowl Game on January 1, 2016. (Getty Images) By Tyler Dunne Updated 5:25 PM April 25, 2016 SHARE TWEET EMAIL Kevin Hogan repeats the play call aloud, one of many Quarterbacking 601 tongue-twisters he’d shout in the Stanford huddle. “Green Right, 95 weak, Kill 96 Force, Alert Hound 2, Double Stutter." The call has three layers. First, Hogan can go with an inside-zone run to the weak side of the line. If there’s a defensive lineman in a 3-technique there, he rolls with an outside-zone run to the other side. And if Hogan spots a safety creeping into the box? He licks his chops, checks to “double stutter,” and hits a receiver in one-on-one coverage downfield off play action. Get all that? ADVERTISEMENT Hogan can speak to NFL coaches and scouts on a level almost all other quarterbacks in this draft cannot. Most were robots in spread offenses mechanically taking plays from the sideline, racing to the line at warp speed and making one read during a play with speed, speed, SPEED the emphasis. The brain, for many, is not. So in this year's draft, Hogan is the cerebral alternative. For teams stuck in this quarterback crisis, he's the throwback to simpler times. “It’s easy for me,” said Hogan, one day after visiting with the San Diego Chargers. “It’s fun. It’s a breath of fresh air for them for me to be able to speak the same language as them. … It was like you’re a blast from the past for these guys.” And he may make the most sense for the Buffalo Bills, too. [Top 10 QBs gallery: Tyler Dunne breaks them down] If it’s the mind they covet — rather than Cardale Jones’ boomerang arm, Dak Prescott’s dual-threat intrigue or Christian Hackenberg’s prototypical size, arm — then Hogan is the choice. General Manager Doug Whaley has called him the most pro ready in the draft. A meeting with Hogan is different than any other. The Bills have only drafted four quarterbacks since Jim Kelly retired. With Tyrod Taylor entering a contract year, they must choose wisely. Hogan, for many reasons, could be the pick in the middle rounds. Here's why. The Bills know Hogan; Hogan knows the Bills. The 6-foot-3, 218-pounder spent a substantial amount of time with Buffalo’s coaches at the Senior Bowl, the NFL scouting combine and then performed a handful of requested throws for the team at his pro day. Hogan had an “easy conversation” with offensive coordinator Greg Roman — this is, after all, the same offense he ran. Run-first. A lot of dissecting the front seven (in addition to the back four). A lot of play-action. Audibles. A huddle. Rollouts. Hogan never played for Roman at Stanford, but the coach originally recruited him out of McLean, Va. He knows what the coach wants out of a quarterback. A fit in Buffalo? Absolutely. He doesn't hesitate. “It’s the same one we ran at Stanford,” Hogan said. “You’re going to have three plays called and you’ll have to go up to the line of scrimmage with 12 seconds left on the play clock and read the defense pre-snap and see what the best play is to get into. A lot of the game is handled before the ball is even snapped. Coach Roman is going to have a lot of play action, a lot of turning your back to the defense, a lot of turning around and seeing what’s happened. “What adjustments have been made? And that’s what I’ve been doing at Stanford. So I feel very confident in my abilities, what I’ve learned here and I feel it will transfer very well.” He overcame life’s greatest loss: his dad. Hogan's father died from colon cancer after a five-year battle and the experience was brutal for son, for his family. The two watched all sports together, from golf to football — his fondest memories were simply “hearing his stories” and “sitting and talking” for hours. But the quarterback who once took over for No. 1 overall pick Andrew Luck quit sweating the small stuff. Dad's death inherently changed him on and off the field. “It allowed me to catch my breath, gather my rhythm and just play the game,” Hogan said. “I think that really helped me. At times, I was pressing too hard and not really letting the game come to me. “You realize it’s just a game that you’re playing. A game I’ve played my whole life. You don’t need to force it. Let the game come to you. Take what the defense gives you and have fun. That’s what I did this past season — I just had fun.” As a senior, Hogan completed 67.8 percent of his passes for 2,867 yards, 27 touchdowns and only eight picks, in addition to 336 rushing yards and six scores. He’s battle-tested on the field. Hogan won three Pac-12 titles, appeared in three Rose Bowls and went 16-6 against Top 25 teams in his 46-start career. Big games under bright lights were the norm — he insists that no situation ever fazes him. Never has since he slayed No. 2-ranked Oregon, on the road, in his second career start as a redshirt freshman. “After that," Hogan said, "there was no situation I couldn’t handle." Fixing the fundamentals. This is No. 1 red flag with Hogan, one reason to pass. His awkward, wind-up delivery from head to toe in college was not a thing of beauty. So for two months, he went into the lab with former NFL quarterbacks coach, John Ramsdell. As the QB coach in San Diego 2006- ‘12, Ramsdell was the one who reworked Philip Rivers and his funky release. Before that, he coached two other Pro Bowlers in Kurt Warner and Marc Bulger with St. Louis. The key with Hogan? His lower body. Hogan says that Ramsdell changed his "entire perspective" on the quarterback position. Suddenly, it was all about his legs. Speed up his lower body on drops, on the release and the upper body will naturally speed up, too. “A lot of people make a big deal about throwing motions and mechanics but that’s not really what it’s about,” Hogan said. “What Coach Ramsdell and I did was really work on my lower half, my base and tightening it up — having a good, compact base, a powerful base with knee flexion so I could just torque my body and get the ball out. At times in my career, I would over-stride like a pitcher and it would cause me to elongate my throwing process and take a while because you can’t make a throw until your feet are in the ground. “When your hips go, your upper body’s going to follow. It really allowed me to compact everything. I feel much more comfortable in the pocket.” Just as Rivers never needed to completely change his easy-to-mock sidearm delivery, Hogan didn't need to re-do his release. By his pro day, his body movements were more snappy and decisive. Hours of poring through Rivers' film and doing drills with Ramsdell paid off. Ramsdell assures that Hogan, like all rookies, will be a work in progress. Whether the changes stick for good or Hogan reverts back to his pitcher-like motion remains to be seen. Remember, Tim Tebow was never able to make permanent changes. Ramsdell? He's convinced Hogan is a different passer now... and will only progress. “He was taking a real long throwing motion," Ramsdell said. "The higher level you go up, it’s an indicator of where you’re going with the ball. It telegraphs what you’re doing and helps the defense. It gives them a head start to react. So you want to be quick with your throwing motion — quick as possible — so that’s what we did. “I think his best days are ahead of him. I can see him improving greatly. He’s very tenacious. He wants to do it. He’ll play in the NFL.” Willing to wait. Hogan agrees with Ramsdell. Waiting, learning, watching on a sideline in Year 1 would be the best-case scenario. Whoever the Bills draft next week, that’d be the plan. Taylor is the clear-cut starter in 2016. Beyond 2016, there are no guarantees. With biting conviction, Hogan makes his case clear. He started for “one of the most pure offenses that has ever existed.” He managed a huddle. He called audibles at the line. His voice is laced with a swagger and not-so-subtle dig at other prospects. “It’s not about getting up to the line and looking to the sidelines to see what your coach says,” Hogan said. “It’s about handling it under center — that’s what the quarterback position is all about.” The Bills, he’s convinced, would be a perfect landing spot. Next week, Whaley, Roman and co. are on the clock. “I really admired what they did last season and I think there’s good things coming,” Hogan said. “I know Coach Roman’s offense. I know that I would be able to pick that up very easily. I know some things would be different and I’d have to adjust to the speed and schemes on the defensive side. “But, yes, I feel very comfortable with that system.”
Villain The Foe Posted April 26, 2016 Author Share Posted April 26, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YankeeJet22 Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 Hopefully the Bills take him. btw, he's a great competitor. Good size, but throws like a righty Tebow. 7th rounder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 On 4/16/2016 at 8:08 PM, Villain The Foe said: Just wanted to put that out into the world. It needed to be said. Honestly, I'd rather spend a 3rd or 4th on him over taking any QB in the 1st round (knowing Goff and Wentz are going 1st and 2nd). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 Wow, is this guy ever getting massively overrated all of a sudden. Ponderous baseball release, arm is nothing special. Might fashion a career as a backup at some point in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted April 26, 2016 Author Share Posted April 26, 2016 4 hours ago, YankeeJet22 said: Hopefully the Bills take him. btw, he's a great competitor. Good size, but throws like a righty Tebow. 7th rounder. And watching him torture the Jets for 15 years after Brady's retirement. lol. That would totally be poetic justice. And his throwing motion is more Colin Kaepernick than it is Tim Tebow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdetroit Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 We would be way better off taking Decker or Conklin at 20 and this guy later on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PepPep Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 I agree in general that passing on Lynch -if he is there- and going in a different direction while possibly addressing the QB position in the later rounds- or not at all in THIS draft (considering Fitz may still be back, and we have Petty and Geno) may be the best way to go. BUT. The Jets looked at Lynch closely and met with him. He has a number of things to work on and may never develop into a good NFL QB. But he may also have the most upside of any QB in the draft. Size matters in the NFL. Arm strength matters. Athleticism matters. Along with all the other things. Scouts look for the measurables- things you can't teach. After that, you look at their mechanics, football IQ, leadership, intelligence, etc., etc., etc. Hogan can have all the OTHER things you look for in a QB, but if he doesn't have the size, athleticism or arm strength, it could seriously limit his effectiveness in the NFL. And you can never 'learn' those. If the Jets believe Lynch could be THE guy. If they see the great upside and see that his weaknesses can be fixed, I have no problem with them taking a gamble on Lynch. I would rather they DID NOT trade up for him. But if he ends up being a Franchise QB (even if he doesn't lead the Jets to the promised land) and the Jets miss out on a number of very good players they could have gotten via a trade down or a Pro Bowler if they just went with a different guy at 20- IT WILL BE WORTH IT. Hindsight is 20/20 but I like a team that is willing to roll the dice on a high-upside prospect early in the draft, even if it is a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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