Jets GM says he's 'excited to see' what Geno Smith can do if he's starting QB

[ylekram]

1 minute ago, JiF said:

Exact same minus -  Todd Bowles, Chan Gailey, James Carpenter, Brandon Marshall, Devin Smith, Kenbrell Tompkins, Quincy Enuwa and Matt Forte. 

yea, matt forte was a monster for the jets last year

[JetBlue]

3 minutes ago, JiF said:

Exact same minus -  Todd Bowles, Chan Gailey, James Carpenter, Brandon Marshall, Devin Smith, Kenbrell Tompkins, Quincy Enuwa and Matt Forte. 

Lol, you forgot Derelle Revis, Buster Skrine, Leonard Williams, etc.  Yeah the defense makes a difference too when it comes to field position, etc. In the beginning of the year we were turning over teams at almost a record pace and Fitz was the beneficiary of that.  The previous two years we like last in forcing turnovers....  But none of that makes a difference I suppose.

[Sperm Edwards]

2 minutes ago, Warfish said:

He also went 4-12 with almost the exact same roster as Fitz did in 2015, with the exception of Marshall.

 

Not that it therefore makes him a good QB, because it doesn't, but this is a pretty steep glossing-over.

It suggests that an injured Decker = a healthy Decker, Marshall = not a big deal, Ferguson's further regression = no big deal, Carpenter = Winters/Aboushi, Mornhinweg = Gailey, Bowles = Ryan, 2014 Jets defense = 2015 Jets defense, and facing the 2015 Jets opponents = 2014 Jets opponents.

If one accepts every single one of those things as being true, then I guess things were almost exactly the same.

[JustInFudge]

Just now, Warfish said:

Geno just needs a fair chance, right?  Of course he does.

LOL - who knows really?  I think its fair to think he could play better under better circumstances.  Truth is, we really dont know because he went and got his jaw broke.

I mean, we saw a sh*tty journeyman QB have a career year in this system with these weapons...who's to say a 10x more talented athlete cant put it together in a new more QB friendly/conducive situation?

[JetBlue]

4 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Geno just needs a fair chance, right?  Of course he does.

No but at least get your facts straight.

[Warfish]

Just now, Sperm Edwards said:

Not that it therefore makes him a good QB, because it doesn't, but this is a pretty steep glossing-over.

It suggests that an injured Decker = a healthy Decker, Marshall = not a big deal, Ferguson's further regression = no big deal, Carpenter = Winters/Aboushi, Mornhinweg = Gailey, Bowles = Ryan, 2014 Jets defense = 2015 Jets defense, and facing the 2015 Jets opponents = 2014 Jets opponents.

If one accepts every single one of those things as being true, then I guess things were almost exactly the same.

Decker was hurt part of the year, not every game.  He had nicks this year too, albeit less.  Minor advantage Fitz.  

Marshall was a big ad vs. his predecessor.  Of course, ignored by the Geno side is that Fitz also gave Marshall by far his best year as a Pro WR.  All credit Marshall, no credit Fitz, right?

Ferguson was better for Geno than he was Fitz, advantage Geno.

Ivory and Powell were slightly healthier for Geno than Fitz, advantage Geno.

Carpenter was bad, Winter/Aboushi a bit better, advantage Fitz.

Morn and Gaily both made odd calls, but advantage Fitz primarily because of experience.

Ryan D better than Bowles D, advantage Geno.

This poor poor martye Geno thing is pure fantasy, he made the players around him worse.  Fitz made the players around him better.  It really is as simple as that.

 

[ylekram]

5 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Geno just needs a fair chance, right?  Of course he does.

ya, lets throw out what worked last year and give geno his 4th gifted starting gig. then we'll know for sure. nope, wait. no we wont. the brutal schedule, the weather, or some injury will be the new excuse. then we can gift him the 5th year because we wont truly know what we have

[Fibonacci]

I am not in love with Geno at all. What he showed us so far isn't really glamorous. But at the same time, he came from a spread offense and was thrown to wolves without sitting and learning the pro game. He already has 2 years of starting under his belt. He alsa was able to sit down and learn from Fitz and Gailey. 

If we can't bring in a better solution, I believe Mac is right to be excited to see what he can do. This really is a non story.

[Warfish]

Just now, ylekram said:

ya, lets throw out what worked last year and give geno his 4th gifted starting gig. then we'll know for sure. nope, wait. no we wont. the brutal schedule, the weather, or some injury will be the new excuse. then we can gift him the 5th year because we wont truly know what we have

Competition is over-rated.  Geno just needs to be treated fairly, so we can see what we have in him.  We should really want to see how he does with Decker this time, because it's different.  Geno is humble now, because of sitting, he's more mature.  He just needs a fair chance with weapons, and if we can't give that to him in 2016, we should resign him and give him more weapons in 2017, just to be sure.

[JetBlue]

1 minute ago, ylekram said:

ya, lets throw out what worked last year and give geno his 4th gifted starting gig. then we'll know for sure. nope, wait. no we wont. the brutal schedule, the weather, or some injury will be the new excuse. then we can gift him the 5th year because we wont truly know what we have

This is last year so one way or the other he will be gone next year. If Fitz doesn't return, or gets injured or doesn't play up to par, he will probably be replaced by Geno.   He will then move on and you guys can find someone else to sh*t on.  

[Augustiniak]

Just now, Warfish said:

Competition is over-rated.  Geno just needs to be treated fairly, so we can see what we have in him.  We should really want to see how he does with Decker this time, because it's different.  Geno is humble now, because of sitting, he's more mature.  He just needs a fair chance with weapons, and if we can't give that to him in 2016, we should resign him and give him more weapons in 2017, just to be sure.

i don't even think he would beat out hackenberg in a fair competition.  hack is just naturally better in a pro offense and has better tools.  

[JustInFudge]

11 minutes ago, ylekram said:

yea, matt forte was a monster for the jets last year

Hey!!!!  You responded before my edit.  

[JetBlue]

4 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Decker was hurt part of the year, not every game.  He had nicks this year too, albeit less.  Minor advantage Fitz.  

Marshall was a big ad vs. his predecessor.  Of course, ignored by the Geno side is that Fitz also gave Marshall by far his best year as a Pro WR.  All credit Marshall, no credit Fitz, right?

Ferguson was better for Geno than he was Fitz, advantage Geno.

Ivory and Powell were slightly healthier for Geno than Fitz, advantage Geno.

Carpenter was bad, Winter/Aboushi a bit better, advantage Fitz.

Morn and Gaily both made odd calls, but advantage Fitz primarily because of experience.

Ryan D better than Bowles D, advantage Geno.

This poor poor martye Geno thing is pure fantasy, he made the players around him worse.  Fitz made the players around him better.  It really is as simple as that.

 

Straight up bullsh*t. You are pulling this stuff our of your ass because NO ONE knows how he would performed with that team in and in those circumstances.   

[JustInFudge]

12 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Lol, you forgot Derelle Revis, Buster Skrine, Leonard Williams, etc.  Yeah the defense makes a difference too when it comes to field position, etc. In the beginning of the year we were turning over teams at almost a record pace and Fitz was the beneficiary of that.  The previous two years we like last in forcing turnovers....  But none of that makes a difference I suppose.

100%.  We had the worst secondary in the league that year.  Not to mention, Colon was literally destroying drives with his presnap penalties, holds and personal fouls.  Cant remember how many 3 and longs the OL created for Geno that season.  It was digusting. 

[JetBlue]

5 minutes ago, Fibonacci said:

I am not in love with Geno at all. What he showed us so far isn't really glamorous. But at the same time, he came from a spread offense and was thrown to wolves without sitting and learning the pro game. He already has 2 years of starting under his belt. He alsa was able to sit down and learn from Fitz and Gailey. 

If we can't bring in a better solution, I believe Mac is right to be excited to see what he can do. This really is a non story.

I agree. It is only an issue to those who are pathologically against ever seeing Geno start another Jets game, lol. 

[ylekram]

1 minute ago, JetBlue said:

This is last year so one way or the other he will be gone next year. If Fitz doesn't return, or gets injured or doesn't play up to par, he will probably be replaced by Geno.   He will then move on and you guys can find someone else to sh*t on.  

the only way I want to see geno smith under center for the ny jets is

#1 an injury

#2 geno actually earns the starting job with real competition

geno gets sh*t on for a reason. so far, he sucks.

[Warfish]

2 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Straight up bullsh*t. You are pulling this stuff our of your ass because NO ONE knows how he would performed with that team in and in those circumstances.   

But Geno fans do, right?  Better than Fitz, right?  

It's sad really, if only we had given Geno a fair chance, he's be an all-pro today.

We're so unfair.

[ylekram]

5 minutes ago, JiF said:

Hey!!!!  You responded before my edit.  

yes. yes I did

[JustInFudge]

13 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Decker was hurt part of the year, not every game.  He had nicks this year too, albeit less.  Minor advantage Fitz.  

Marshall was a big ad vs. his predecessor.  Of course, ignored by the Geno side is that Fitz also gave Marshall by far his best year as a Pro WR.  All credit Marshall, no credit Fitz, right?

Ferguson was better for Geno than he was Fitz, advantage Geno.

Ivory and Powell were slightly healthier for Geno than Fitz, advantage Geno.

Carpenter was bad, Winter/Aboushi a bit better, advantage Fitz.

Morn and Gaily both made odd calls, but advantage Fitz primarily because of experience.

Ryan D better than Bowles D, advantage Geno.

This poor poor martye Geno thing is pure fantasy, he made the players around him worse.  Fitz made the players around him better.  It really is as simple as that.

 

Are you playing the opposite game? 

[JetBlue]

3 minutes ago, Augustiniak said:

i don't even think he would beat out hackenberg in a fair competition.  hack is just naturally better in a pro offense and has better tools.  

Here we go again.... can PLEASE let the kid sit of a while before we rush him out there? Have not learned anything yet? Have we not damaged the pysche of enough young quarterbacks??   Granted he started out in a Pro style offense but the last two years he kind of regressed because of spread type offense he was forced to pay and change in foot work.  Not to mention playing for the worst offensive line in college football.  As a result he picked up a few bad habits that he has to work on.  I have no doubt that he will be able to regain his form from is freshman year; the only question is how long it will take.  No need to rush him at this point and at the very least he should be expected to start this year (unless of injury or other circumstances).  Let him sit, watch, work on his mechanics and get him ready for next year or depending on how the season goes, get him some action in the second half of the season. 

 

[slats]

7 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Competition is over-rated.  Geno just needs to be treated fairly, so we can see what we have in him.  We should really want to see how he does with Decker this time, because it's different.  Geno is humble now, because of sitting, he's more mature.  He just needs a fair chance with weapons, and if we can't give that to him in 2016, we should resign him and give him more weapons in 2017, just to be sure.

Exactly no one is saying the bold, but I recognize your need to introduce a strawman to help bolster your argument. 

Gailey has gotten career years out of guys like Fitz, Kordell, and Thigpen; it's really not out of the question that he could get a lot out of Geno with this supporting cast. I wouldn't expect the Jets to have any interest in resigning Geno unless he has some kind of Drew Brees renaissance being that they've drafted two QBs of their own over the last two years. I just think it's highly questionable that Fitz would play so much better than Geno that's it's worth $7-8M (or more, if some had their wish) against the cap, plus a mid-round comp pick in 2018. Especially given that the Jets don't even have enough money to sign their draft picks right now. 

[ylekram]

9 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

I agree. It is only an issue to those who are pathologically against ever seeing Geno start another Jets game, lol. 

not at all. if the jets sign fitz and geno takes the starting job from him and plays well, I will root for geno as much or if not more than I root for fitz. I want geno to earn his starting gig. a lot of you want to make excuses and gift geno the starting gig. there is a difference

[JetBlue]

5 minutes ago, Warfish said:

But Geno fans do, right?  Better than Fitz, right?  

It's sad really, if only we had given Geno a fair chance, he's be an all-pro today.

We're so unfair.

Geno has only one year left; if Fitz is not resigned he will most likely win the starting job for quarterback.  All anyone has said is it will be interesting to see what he does with a better all around team and competent, quarterback friendly OC like Gailey, especially since he has had  year to sit and learn.  There is little to no chance he is resigned so I still don't get why you have this bug up your ass about the kid.  You can engage in all the straw man arguments you want (who said Geno is better than Fitz or will be all pro???) I am not going to fall for that nonsense.  

[cant wait]

9 minutes ago, Warfish said:

But Geno fans do, right?  Better than Fitz, right?  

It's sad really, if only we had given Geno a fair chance, he's be an all-pro today.

We're so unfair.

[Mike135]

I really hope they don't blow 7mil+ on Fitz just because Bowles is worried about job security.  As much as I believe it's obvious we should let Fitz walk, it was just as obvious Geno should've been put back in after the bye last season.

My only guess is, Bowles being a rookie head coach, he decided to stay with the "safe" choice.  Not wanting to risk blowback from fans and media.  Only gripe on Bowles so far (though it is a big one).

[JetBlue]

2 minutes ago, ylekram said:

not at all. if the jets sign fitz and geno takes the starting job from him and plays well, I will root for geno as much or if not more than I root for fitz. I want geno to earn his starting gig. a lot of you want to make excuses and gift geno the starting gig. there is a difference

Who said anything about giving him the job?????  I swear I don't know where this stuff comes from.....  

[Sperm Edwards]

54 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Decker was hurt part of the year, not every game.  He had nicks this year too, albeit less.  Minor advantage Fitz.  

Marshall was a big ad vs. his predecessor.  Of course, ignored by the Geno side is that Fitz also gave Marshall by far his best year as a Pro WR.  All credit Marshall, no credit Fitz, right?

Ferguson was better for Geno than he was Fitz, advantage Geno.

Ivory and Powell were slightly healthier for Geno than Fitz, advantage Geno.

Carpenter was bad, Winter/Aboushi a bit better, advantage Fitz.

Morn and Gaily both made odd calls, but advantage Fitz primarily because of experience.

Ryan D better than Bowles D, advantage Geno.

This poor poor martye Geno thing is pure fantasy, he made the players around him worse.  Fitz made the players around him better.  It really is as simple as that.

 

He had a bad hammy into November. It's a huge difference.

I'm not on "the Geno side" I'm on the Jets' side.

Yes, Ferguson was a little better a year earlier. I didn't say Geno was good. But dumping the ball immediately is far more Fitzpatrick's game than Geno's. But there's good and bad with that, not just good.

Powell was barely used last year so I don't know what you're talking about. They split Ivory and CJ. CJ was mostly lousy (hit or miss, but usually miss) when the Jets were on that losing streak, and he didn't block at all. But the way they did it Mornhinweg made it obvious when they were running (Ivory in) and when they were more likely passing (CJ was in) just by the personnel. Never mind the rift CJ created when he wasn't the bellcow.

Carpenter was most definitely not bad. I don't know where you get the idea that Winters/Aboushi were better. Particularly since the only reason Aboushi went in there in the first place is they had to bench Winters after 6 games. A year later, mopping up for Colon, he was dramatically better than he was in his first 2 seasons.

Morn and Gailey both made bad calls but Mornhinweg was clearly worse. 

Ryan's D was decidedly not better than Bowles' D. We had a LB/S starting at corner. Effectively there was no secondary last year. Except for the great Kyle Wilson, of course.

You're also glossing over the ridiculous schedule disparity as though playing Jacksonville is the same as playing 10 games against teams with winning records, including Denver, KC, the early-season Chargers, etc., not to mention 12 of 16 against teams .500 or better, without significant injuries, is the same as facing Washington with no secondary, NE missing half its secondary, Indianapolis without most of its secondary, the Jaguars, Giants, Eagles, Browns, etc.

I didn't say "poor Geno" since there's no shortage of damage done by his own hand, but the idea that the situations were nearly identical is pretty ridiculous. 

 

[jetrider]

 

[Sperm Edwards]

34 minutes ago, JiF said:

Exact same minus -  Todd Bowles, Chan Gailey, James Carpenter, Brandon Marshall, Devin Smith, Kenbrell Tompkins, Quincy Enuwa and now Matt Forte and Khiry Robinson. 

Obviously the team spent well over $100M in new contracts in free agency and trades last year just to bring back the exact same 2014 roster.  

[Big Blocker]

1 hour ago, JetBlue said:

This is the kind of sh*t that pisses me off.  I mean no mention of the lack of receiving talent around him his first two years, especially his rookie season or how he improved after coming off his benching in year two.   I mean they talk about Fitz having the best season of his career and yet no mention of Marshall and Decker and the influence of Gailey.  We really don't know how Geno would have done, with those receivers and OC Gailey drawing up the plays. (And before any one  brings up the Oakland game, I don't know what could have been expected with him coming in cold off the bench, missing all preseason and against a team that was playing some inspired football... he still had a statistically, decent game.)

 Add in the fact that he has sat for a year, watching and learning from the sidelines; how could any OBJECTIVE person not be at least interested in what he could do?  Lastly consider the fact that he is going into his final contract year and can see the writing on the wall as far is the Jets are concerned, he has to be super motivated to show another team that he can be a starter in this league.    If folks can just take off the GeNO glasses for a second, they might see why the GM is "excited" to see what Geno could do.... 

I don't see how any objective person who likes the Jets would want to waste a roster spot on Smith. 

First of all, Macc is the GM, and it's fair to say most GM's calculate what they say in terms of the intended effect it will have.  Here he made those comments in the middle of a negotiation with a Qb he clearly hopes to be able to play ahead of Smith, assuming the price is acceptable. 

Next, Decker played for the Jets in 14.  And in his second year Smith was benched twice due to poor play.

Next you have no idea whether Smith learned anything last season. 

You also ignore his off the field issues and lack of leadership. 

As for the claim he is "super motivated" now, are you suggesting he has need been impressive so far due to lack of motivation before?  That makes no sense.

Having said all that, I suppose it is possible Macc might actually be some kind of fan of Smith's.  If he is, I fear for the future of this franchise more than otherwise.

[JustInFudge]

4 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

I really hope they don't blow 7mil+ on Fitz just because Bowles is worried about job security.  As much as I believe it's obvious we should let Fitz walk, it was just as obvious Geno should've been put back in after the bye last season.

My only guess is, Bowles being a rookie head coach, he decided to stay with the "safe" choice.  Not wanting to risk blowback from fans and media.  Only gripe on Bowles so far (though it is a big one).

Just about any QB can help him miss the playoffs every year for job security reasons. 

[ylekram]

3 minutes ago, Mike135 said:

I really hope they don't blow 7mil+ on Fitz just because Bowles is worried about job security.  As much as I believe it's obvious we should let Fitz walk, it was just as obvious Geno should've been put back in after the bye last season.

My only guess is, Bowles being a rookie head coach, he decided to stay with the "safe" choice.  Not wanting to risk blowback from fans and media.  Only gripe on Bowles so far (though it is a big one).

yea, that's it. the safe choice

geno smith 2014- 2500 yds-13 td's-13-int-8 fumbles-238 yds rushing-1 rushing td-4-12 record-1 brocken jaw

ryan Fitzpatrick 2015-3900 yds-31 td's-15 int-5 fumbles-270 yds rushing-2 rushing td's-10-5 record-1 brocken thumb

 

[slats]

Also on the comp pick thing, the Jets could get another one next year if one of the other 31 NFL teams had any interest in adding the 4000 yard, 31 TD superstar that is Ryan Fitzpatrick. How is it that not a single one of them sees the Fitzmagic?

[Augustiniak]

14 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Here we go again.... can PLEASE let the kid sit of a while before we rush him out there? Have not learned anything yet? Have we not damaged the pysche of enough young quarterbacks??   Granted he started out in a Pro style offense but the last two years he kind of regressed because of spread type offense he was forced to pay and change in foot work.  Not to mention playing for the worst offensive line in college football.  As a result he picked up a few bad habits that he has to work on.  I have no doubt that he will be able to regain his form from is freshman year; the only question is how long it will take.  No need to rush him at this point and at the very least he should be expected to start this year (unless of injury or other circumstances).  Let him sit, watch, work on his mechanics and get him ready for next year or depending on how the season goes, get him some action in the second half of the season. 

 

i wrote in a fair competition.  as it stands, even if hack looks better in TC he would likely not be ahead of geno to start the season, to protect him.

[JustInFudge]

1 minute ago, slats said:

Also on the comp pick thing, the Jets could get another one next year if one of the other 31 NFL teams had any interest in adding the 4000 yard, 31 TD superstar that is Ryan Fitzpatrick. How is it that not a single one of them sees the Fitzmagic?

He's offended by their non-offers and now is contemplating retirement.