AFJF Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Can't copy/paste right now....even if this was an article about somebody dying in a hospital while mast...oh, never mind. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/mark-sanchez-athletes-bilked-millions-dollars-article-1.2682986 Mark Sanchez among several athletes bilked out of millions of dollars in Ponzi scheme 21 Tweet email San Francisco Giants Jake Peavy Lost Millions In Alleged Ponzi Scheme CBS San Francisco HOUSTON (AP) — Several professional athletes, including San Francisco Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, Denver Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez and retired Houston Astros pitcher Roy Oswalt, were cheated out of more than $30 million by an investment adviser in a Ponzi-like scheme, federal investigators said Tuesday. In a lawsuit filed last month in Dallas federal court, the Securities and Exchange Commission alleges that Ash Narayan told his clients he was pursuing a low-risk investment strategy for their money but actually put more than $33 million of it into an Illinois-based online sports and entertainment ticket business, The Ticket Reserve, that had lost money for the last four years. It also says he didn’t tell them that The Ticket Reserve paid him nearly $2 million in finder’s fees for directing their money to the company. “Narayan exploited athletes and other clients who trusted him to manage their finances. He fraudulently funneled their savings into a money-losing business and his own pocket,” Shamoil T. Shipchandler, director of the SEC’s Fort Worth regional office, said in a statement. The SEC’s lawsuit alleges that Narayan, The Ticket Reserve, the ticket company’s CEO, Richard Harmon, and its chief operating officer, John Kaptrosky, violated antifraud provisions of federal securities laws and a related SEC antifraud rule, and accuses Narayan of violating the antifraud provisions of the Investment Advisers Act of 1940. Chicago bank accused of enabling hockey fraud scheme The SEC said Tuesday that it obtained a court order freezing the assets of Narayan, Harmon, and Kaptrosky. A receiver has also been appointed to manage the ticket business. No criminal charges have been filed. “Mr. Narayan has always sought to act in his clients’ best interests. Accordingly, he will continue to work with the SEC to ensure that this matter is resolved in the most favorable manner for those clients,” Howard M. Privette, Narayan’s attorney, said in an email. New Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez is entangled in a legal battle after being defrauded out of millions of dollars. (DAVID ZALUBOWSKI/AP) Court records did not list attorneys for Harmon and Kaptrosky. They did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment on the lawsuit left with The Ticket Reserve. Narayan worked out of Irvine, California, for a Dallas-based financial firm, RGT Wealth Advisors, from 1997 until earlier this year. In a statement, RGT said it fired Narayan after discovering what he had done. DraftKings CEO hopeful Andrew Cuomo signs DFS bill into law “These actions did not conform to RGT’s high standards of client service and our core values of integrity and professionalism,” RGT said. “We are outraged by this conduct, and are working hard to try to recoup invested funds for the clients involved.” According to court documents, Narayan directed more than $30.4 million into the ticket business from three current and former athletes: $15.1 million from Peavy; nearly $7.8 million from Sanchez; and nearly $7.6 million from Oswalt. In statements filed as part of the lawsuit, both Peavy and Sanchez said they believe Narayan forged their signatures to transfer money from their accounts to the business. Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, among other athletes, is also involved in the legal battle. (JEFF CHIU/AP) Peavy said he had been working to set aside $20 million for after his playing days were over. Mets owners to pay $16M Wednesday in Bernie Madoff mess “Between 2011 and 2016, Narayan invested approximately $15 million of my funds in (the ticket business) without my authorization. This represents the vast majority of the personal funds that Narayan managed for me. ... To date, I have yet to receive a return on any of my funds used to invest in” the ticket business, Peavy said. Before the Giants’ game Tuesday in Pittsburgh, Peavy said he can’t speak publicly on the SEC investigation. “We’re working through it best we can. Just have got to stay focused on this team and doing my job. ... There’s always outside distractions in what we do. This obviously has been one,” he said. All three athletes said they hired Narayan in part because he represented himself as a devout Christian involved in charitable causes and claimed to be a certified public accountant. The SEC says Narayan has never been a CPA. Mastros Auctions exec sentenced to prison in shill bidding scheme In his statement, Sanchez said he had agreed to make only a $100,000 investment in the online ticket company and “because it is such a risky investment, I would not have knowingly invested additional funds in (the business) — much less committed millions of dollars to that company.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSTON (AP) — Several professional athletes, including San Francisco Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, Denver Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez and retired Houston Astros pitcher Roy Oswalt, were cheated out of more than $30 million by an investment adviser in a Ponzi-like scheme, federal investigators said Tuesday. In a lawsuit filed last month in Dallas federal court, the Securities and Exchange Commission alleges that Ash Narayan told his clients he was pursuing a low-risk investment strategy for their money but actually put more than $33 million of it into an Illinois-based online sports and entertainment ticket business, The Ticket Reserve, that had lost money for the last four years. It also says he didn’t tell them that The Ticket Reserve paid him nearly $2 million in finder’s fees for directing their money to the company. “Narayan exploited athletes and other clients who trusted him to manage their finances. He fraudulently funneled their savings into a money-losing business and his own pocket,” Shamoil T. Shipchandler, director of the SEC’s Fort Worth regional office, said in a statement. The SEC’s lawsuit alleges that Narayan, The Ticket Reserve, the ticket company’s CEO, Richard Harmon, and its chief operating officer, John Kaptrosky, violated antifraud provisions of federal securities laws and a related SEC antifraud rule, and accuses Narayan of violating the antifraud provisions of the Investment Advisers Act of 1940. Chicago bank accused of enabling hockey fraud scheme The SEC said Tuesday that it obtained a court order freezing the assets of Narayan, Harmon, and Kaptrosky. A receiver has also been appointed to manage the ticket business. No criminal charges have been filed. “Mr. Narayan has always sought to act in his clients’ best interests. Accordingly, he will continue to work with the SEC to ensure that this matter is resolved in the most favorable manner for those clients,” Howard M. Privette, Narayan’s attorney, said in an email. New Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez is entangled in a legal battle after being defrauded out of millions of dollars. (DAVID ZALUBOWSKI/AP) Court records did not list attorneys for Harmon and Kaptrosky. They did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment on the lawsuit left with The Ticket Reserve. Narayan worked out of Irvine, California, for a Dallas-based financial firm, RGT Wealth Advisors, from 1997 until earlier this year. In a statement, RGT said it fired Narayan after discovering what he had done. DraftKings CEO hopeful Andrew Cuomo signs DFS bill into law “These actions did not conform to RGT’s high standards of client service and our core values of integrity and professionalism,” RGT said. “We are outraged by this conduct, and are working hard to try to recoup invested funds for the clients involved.” According to court documents, Narayan directed more than $30.4 million into the ticket business from three current and former athletes: $15.1 million from Peavy; nearly $7.8 million from Sanchez; and nearly $7.6 million from Oswalt. In statements filed as part of the lawsuit, both Peavy and Sanchez said they believe Narayan forged their signatures to transfer money from their accounts to the business. Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, among other athletes, is also involved in the legal battle. (JEFF CHIU/AP) Peavy said he had been working to set aside $20 million for after his playing days were over. Mets owners to pay $16M Wednesday in Bernie Madoff mess “Between 2011 and 2016, Narayan invested approximately $15 million of my funds in (the ticket business) without my authorization. This represents the vast majority of the personal funds that Narayan managed for me. ... To date, I have yet to receive a return on any of my funds used to invest in” the ticket business, Peavy said. Before the Giants’ game Tuesday in Pittsburgh, Peavy said he can’t speak publicly on the SEC investigation. “We’re working through it best we can. Just have got to stay focused on this team and doing my job. ... There’s always outside distractions in what we do. This obviously has been one,” he said. All three athletes said they hired Narayan in part because he represented himself as a devout Christian involved in charitable causes and claimed to be a certified public accountant. The SEC says Narayan has never been a CPA. Mastros Auctions exec sentenced to prison in shill bidding scheme In his statement, Sanchez said he had agreed to make only a $100,000 investment in the online ticket company and “because it is such a risky investment, I would not have knowingly invested additional funds in (the business) — much less committed millions of dollars to that company.”
Flushing Roots Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Anyone shocked? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Just now, Flushing Roots said: Anyone shocked? Not fair. Could've happened to anyone. That firm was regulated by the federal government. I feel bad for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kleckineau Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Mark Sanchez among several athletes bilked out of millions of dollars in Ponzi scheme 17 Tweet email New Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez is entangled in a legal battle after being defrauded out of millions of dollars. (DAVID ZALUBOWSKI/AP) HOUSTON (AP) — Several professional athletes, including San Francisco Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, Denver Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez and retired Houston Astros pitcher Roy Oswalt, were cheated out of more than $30 million by an investment adviser in a Ponzi-like scheme, federal investigators said Tuesday. In a lawsuit filed last month in Dallas federal court, the Securities and Exchange Commission alleges that Ash Narayan told his clients he was pursuing a low-risk investment strategy for their money but actually put more than $33 million of it into an Illinois-based online sports and entertainment ticket business, The Ticket Reserve, that had lost money for the last four years. It also says he didn’t tell them that The Ticket Reserve paid him nearly $2 million in finder’s fees for directing their money to the company. “Narayan exploited athletes and other clients who trusted him to manage their finances. He fraudulently funneled their savings into a money-losing business and his own pocket,” Shamoil T. Shipchandler, director of the SEC’s Fort Worth regional office, said in a statement. The SEC’s lawsuit alleges that Narayan, The Ticket Reserve, the ticket company’s CEO, Richard Harmon, and its chief operating officer, John Kaptrosky, violated antifraud provisions of federal securities laws and a related SEC antifraud rule, and accuses Narayan of violating the antifraud provisions of the Investment Advisers Act of 1940. Follow the Daily News Sports on Facebook. "Like" us here. The SEC said Tuesday that it obtained a court order freezing the assets of Narayan, Harmon, and Kaptrosky. A receiver has also been appointed to manage the ticket business. No criminal charges have been filed. “Mr. Narayan has always sought to act in his clients’ best interests. Accordingly, he will continue to work with the SEC to ensure that this matter is resolved in the most favorable manner for those clients,” Howard M. Privette, Narayan’s attorney, said in an email. Court records did not list attorneys for Harmon and Kaptrosky. They did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment on the lawsuit left with The Ticket Reserve. Narayan worked out of Irvine, California, for a Dallas-based financial firm, RGT Wealth Advisors, from 1997 until earlier this year. In a statement, RGT said it fired Narayan after discovering what he had done. “These actions did not conform to RGT’s high standards of client service and our core values of integrity and professionalism,” RGT said. “We are outraged by this conduct, and are working hard to try to recoup invested funds for the clients involved.” Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, among other athletes, is also involved in the legal battle. (JEFF CHIU/AP) According to court documents, Narayan directed more than $30.4 million into the ticket business from three current and former athletes: $15.1 million from Peavy; nearly $7.8 million from Sanchez; and nearly $7.6 million from Oswalt. In statements filed as part of the lawsuit, both Peavy and Sanchez said they believe Narayan forged their signatures to transfer money from their accounts to the business. Peavy said he had been working to set aside $20 million for after his playing days were over. “Between 2011 and 2016, Narayan invested approximately $15 million of my funds in (the ticket business) without my authorization. This represents the vast majority of the personal funds that Narayan managed for me. ... To date, I have yet to receive a return on any of my funds used to invest in” the ticket business, Peavy said. Before the Giants’ game Tuesday in Pittsburgh, Peavy said he can’t speak publicly on the SEC investigation. “We’re working through it best we can. Just have got to stay focused on this team and doing my job. ... There’s always outside distractions in what we do. This obviously has been one,” he said. All three athletes said they hired Narayan in part because he represented himself as a devout Christian involved in charitable causes and claimed to be a certified public accountant. The SEC says Narayan has never been a CPA. In his statement, Sanchez said he had agreed to make only a $100,000 investment in the online ticket company and “because it is such a risky investment, I would not have knowingly invested additional funds in (the business) — much less committed millions of dollars to that company.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HOUSTON (AP) — Several professional athletes, including San Francisco Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, Denver Broncos quarterback Mark Sanchez and retired Houston Astros pitcher Roy Oswalt, were cheated out of more than $30 million by an investment adviser in a Ponzi-like scheme, federal investigators said Tuesday. In a lawsuit filed last month in Dallas federal court, the Securities and Exchange Commission alleges that Ash Narayan told his clients he was pursuing a low-risk investment strategy for their money but actually put more than $33 million of it into an Illinois-based online sports and entertainment ticket business, The Ticket Reserve, that had lost money for the last four years. It also says he didn’t tell them that The Ticket Reserve paid him nearly $2 million in finder’s fees for directing their money to the company. “Narayan exploited athletes and other clients who trusted him to manage their finances. He fraudulently funneled their savings into a money-losing business and his own pocket,” Shamoil T. Shipchandler, director of the SEC’s Fort Worth regional office, said in a statement. The SEC’s lawsuit alleges that Narayan, The Ticket Reserve, the ticket company’s CEO, Richard Harmon, and its chief operating officer, John Kaptrosky, violated antifraud provisions of federal securities laws and a related SEC antifraud rule, and accuses Narayan of violating the antifraud provisions of the Investment Advisers Act of 1940. Follow the Daily News Sports on Facebook. "Like" us here. The SEC said Tuesday that it obtained a court order freezing the assets of Narayan, Harmon, and Kaptrosky. A receiver has also been appointed to manage the ticket business. No criminal charges have been filed. “Mr. Narayan has always sought to act in his clients’ best interests. Accordingly, he will continue to work with the SEC to ensure that this matter is resolved in the most favorable manner for those clients,” Howard M. Privette, Narayan’s attorney, said in an email. Court records did not list attorneys for Harmon and Kaptrosky. They did not immediately return a phone message seeking comment on the lawsuit left with The Ticket Reserve. Narayan worked out of Irvine, California, for a Dallas-based financial firm, RGT Wealth Advisors, from 1997 until earlier this year. In a statement, RGT said it fired Narayan after discovering what he had done. “These actions did not conform to RGT’s high standards of client service and our core values of integrity and professionalism,” RGT said. “We are outraged by this conduct, and are working hard to try to recoup invested funds for the clients involved.” Giants pitcher Jake Peavy, among other athletes, is also involved in the legal battle. (JEFF CHIU/AP) According to court documents, Narayan directed more than $30.4 million into the ticket business from three current and former athletes: $15.1 million from Peavy; nearly $7.8 million from Sanchez; and nearly $7.6 million from Oswalt. In statements filed as part of the lawsuit, both Peavy and Sanchez said they believe Narayan forged their signatures to transfer money from their accounts to the business. Peavy said he had been working to set aside $20 million for after his playing days were over. “Between 2011 and 2016, Narayan invested approximately $15 million of my funds in (the ticket business) without my authorization. This represents the vast majority of the personal funds that Narayan managed for me. ... To date, I have yet to receive a return on any of my funds used to invest in” the ticket business, Peavy said. Before the Giants’ game Tuesday in Pittsburgh, Peavy said he can’t speak publicly on the SEC investigation. “We’re working through it best we can. Just have got to stay focused on this team and doing my job. ... There’s always outside distractions in what we do. This obviously has been one,” he said. All three athletes said they hired Narayan in part because he represented himself as a devout Christian involved in charitable causes and claimed to be a certified public accountant. The SEC says Narayan has never been a CPA. In his statement, Sanchez said he had agreed to make only a $100,000 investment in the online ticket company and “because it is such a risky investment, I would not have knowingly invested additional funds in (the business) — much less committed millions of dollars to that company.”
Kleckineau Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Gotta love the devout christian comment. So many crooks hide behind a pius mask Isnt Marks brother his agent / manager?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no psls Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Who cares ; he's not our problem anymore ; we have our own problems .... GENO !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
munchmemory Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Noodle brain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 The "30 for 30" show about broke athletes was instructive. Bart Scott,by the way, came off as a very sharp guy. Too many young guys expect they're gonna make some crazy investment and make a ridiculous return instead of simply getting a nice return in boring basic investments like stocks, bonds real estate. Or worse, invest in a bar or restaurant or some relative or hanger on's dumb business idea. Simply amazed though how many smart people get sucked into Ponzi schemes. Had educated clients who were connected to some very famous politicians you would know. They sunk piles of cash with some outwardly respectable guy who had a great line of sheet-until they needed money to buy a house. And he took a lot of people in, because he was giving them statements that looked good, and was always taking people out to dinner, to big sports events, concerts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Mark has bilked several NFL teams out of millions as well, so what goes around, comes around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UnitedWhofans Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 I sense a new episode of American Greed coming! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 One of the many reasons why I dont hand over my money to foundations/donations/investment brokers that I dont know. Crooks will play on your greed and your generosity. The company was even regulated by the SEC from my understanding...yet it meant nothing when it came to Sanchez losing millions. You have know clue where your money is actually going until you realize that you're not getting it back and the Associated Press reports about it with your face on the front. Feel bad for him though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 7 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: One of the many reasons why I dont hand over my money to foundations/donations/investment brokers that I dont know. The company was even regulated by the SEC from my understanding...yet it meant nothing when it came to Sanchez losing millions. You have know clue where your money is actually going until you realize that you're not getting it back and the Associated Press talks about it. Feel bad for him though. I am a CFP and manage quite a bit of money. I can tell you , all the credentials in the world wont save you from a bad advisor. The majority of people "fukked out of money" is from an advisor they know. He's Dads college buddy, he helped my Aunt, I went to church with him etc. If you cant explain the investment to a 12 year old, there is a problem. Thats Warren Buffet. Annuities, variable Products etc... almost entirely are bull crap. In my office we use Vanguard Funds 90 percent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Crusher Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 That sucks for him but winning the Lombardi this year in Denver will quell the pain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 21 minutes ago, southparkcpa said: I am a CFP and manage quite a bit of money. I can tell you , all the credentials in the world wont save you from a bad advisor. The majority of people "fukked out of money" is from an advisor they know. He's Dads college buddy, he helped my Aunt, I went to church with him etc. If you cant explain the investment to a 12 year old, there is a problem. Thats Warren Buffet. Annuities, variable Products etc... almost entirely are bull crap. In my office we use Vanguard Funds 90 percent. People need to learn how to manage their own finances, because its easy enough to explain it to a 12 year old. This is why when I see people lose 7-8 million dollars I SMH because they gave someone 7-8 million of their dollars to potentially lose. Certain things in your life I would say is better being done by you. The first place to start, is learning "What is time and what is money". You never get time back, and that money represented his time and effort. He gave it to someone who didnt have a problem not taking into consideration his time and effort. No one will take your time and effort more seriously than yourself. I've had people laugh as me and call me a jackass for some of the things that I do with my money. 7 years later, I have yet to say that someone robbed me or took advantage of me. Im content with that. I learned by doing, gaining, losing, understanding. I've taught myself that the best game is the long haul, and doing it yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 21 minutes ago, Bugg said: The "30 for 30" show about broke athletes was instructive. Bart Scott,by the way, came off as a very sharp guy. Too many young guys expect they're gonna make some crazy investment and make a ridiculous return instead of simply getting a nice return in boring basic investments like stocks, bonds real estate. Or worse, invest in a bar or restaurant or some relative or hanger on's dumb business idea. Simply amazed though how many smart people get sucked into Ponzi schemes. Had educated clients who were connected to some very famous politicians you would know. They sunk piles of cash with some outwardly respectable guy who had a great line of sheet-until they needed money to buy a house. And he took a lot of people in, because he was giving them statements that looked good, and was always taking people out to dinner, to big sports events, concerts. If you read the article, Sanchez claims he agreed to invest only $100K in that business because it was high risk. The rest he lost in that investment may have come from the investor forging his signature, and he didn't know until after that he had so much money in it. The bulk of the money from all of them was he opposite of your accusation: it was supposed to be in low risk investments. Most people use someone, and probably just some mgr the investment house assigned. But to your presumed point, these guys are so rich the only thing that should materially affect their futures is losing it all. Basically these guys should just go with a reputable firm's assigned acct mgr - with their account sizes they're not going to get low rung, inexperienced sh*tkickers - and tell him they want ultra low risk investments, since they have enough to keep their grandchildren taken care of if they merely kept up with inflation and don't buy expensiv sh*t for every hanger-on leech. This way if it is invested improperly, in accordance with the investment strategy, they'd have a firm to sue instead of trying to chase a lone broke/bankrupt scumbag. The sad thing is, in Mark's case, he wanted this lower risk, and his money was essentially stolen. At least that's what the article suggests. All 3 of these guys were just trying to keep their money safe, and were not trying to make it yield unrealistic returns. It's terrible, and they didn't deserve it or have it coming to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 5 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: If you read the article, Sanchez claims he agreed to invest only $100K in that business because it was high risk. The rest he lost in that investment may have come from the investor forging his signature, and he didn't know until after that he had so much money in it. The bulk of the money from all of them was he opposite of your accusation: it was supposed to be in low risk investments. Most people use someone, and probably just some mgr the investment house assigned. But to your presumed point, these guys are so rich the only thing that should materially affect their futures is losing it all. Basically these guys should just go with a reputable firm's assigned acct mgr - with their account sizes they're not going to get low rung, inexperienced sh*tkickers - and tell him they want ultra low risk investments, since they have enough to keep their grandchildren taken care of if they merely kept up with inflation and don't buy expensiv sh*t for every hanger-on leech. This way if it is invested improperly, in accordance with the investment strategy, they'd have a firm to sue instead of trying to chase a lone broke/bankrupt scumbag. The sad thing is, in Mark's case, he wanted this lower risk, and his money was essentially stolen. At least that's what the article suggests. All 3 of these guys were just trying to keep their money safe, and were not trying to make it yield unrealistic returns. It's terrible, and they didn't deserve it or have it coming to them. But it reads as if the guy was part of some legitimate firm. I don't have any real legal knowledge, but shouldn't the firm that employed him be responsible for the money, should it be proven that he acted improperly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdetroit Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 36 minutes ago, UnitedWhofans said: I sense a new episode of American Greed coming! That show is great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdetroit Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 8 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: If you read the article, Sanchez claims he agreed to invest only $100K in that business because it was high risk. The rest he lost in that investment may have come from the investor forging his signature, and he didn't know until after that he had so much money in it. The bulk of the money from all of them was he opposite of your accusation: it was supposed to be in low risk investments. Most people use someone, and probably just some mgr the investment house assigned. But to your presumed point, these guys are so rich the only thing that should materially affect their futures is losing it all. Basically these guys should just go with a reputable firm's assigned acct mgr - with their account sizes they're not going to get low rung, inexperienced sh*tkickers - and tell him they want ultra low risk investments, since they have enough to keep their grandchildren taken care of if they merely kept up with inflation and don't buy expensiv sh*t for every hanger-on leech. This way if it is invested improperly, in accordance with the investment strategy, they'd have a firm to sue instead of trying to chase a lone broke/bankrupt scumbag. The sad thing is, in Mark's case, he wanted this lower risk, and his money was essentially stolen. At least that's what the article suggests. All 3 of these guys were just trying to keep their money safe, and were not trying to make it yield unrealistic returns. It's terrible, and they didn't deserve it or have it coming to them. Ponzi schemes are everywhere Madoff was the chairman of Nasdaq at one point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 24 minutes ago, southparkcpa said: I am a CFP and manage quite a bit of money. I can tell you , all the credentials in the world wont save you from a bad advisor. The majority of people "fukked out of money" is from an advisor they know. He's Dads college buddy, he helped my Aunt, I went to church with him etc. If you cant explain the investment to a 12 year old, there is a problem. Thats Warren Buffet. Annuities, variable Products etc... almost entirely are bull crap. In my office we use Vanguard Funds 90 percent. No doubt, but if he went with a large/reputable/famous investment house - like one attached to an ultra-large bank the govt would never allow to go bankrupt - and it's clear it was not invested in accordance with the client's desired risk/strategy (like what allegedly happened here), they could sue and could recover the improperly-invested losses. An individual clown making promises? Lol best of luck in hoping he has enough to pay it back. It's gone. These guys have so much already, and still make so much, that they don't need the promises of wild returns. They just need to not lose it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 16 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: If you read the article, Sanchez claims he agreed to invest only $100K in that business because it was high risk. The rest he lost in that investment may have come from the investor forging his signature, and he didn't know until after that he had so much money in it. The bulk of the money from all of them was he opposite of your accusation: it was supposed to be in low risk investments. Most people use someone, and probably just some mgr the investment house assigned. But to your presumed point, these guys are so rich the only thing that should materially affect their futures is losing it all. Basically these guys should just go with a reputable firm's assigned acct mgr - with their account sizes they're not going to get low rung, inexperienced sh*tkickers - and tell him they want ultra low risk investments, since they have enough to keep their grandchildren taken care of if they merely kept up with inflation and don't buy expensiv sh*t for every hanger-on leech. This way if it is invested improperly, in accordance with the investment strategy, they'd have a firm to sue instead of trying to chase a lone broke/bankrupt scumbag. The sad thing is, in Mark's case, he wanted this lower risk, and his money was essentially stolen. At least that's what the article suggests. All 3 of these guys were just trying to keep their money safe, and were not trying to make it yield unrealistic returns. It's terrible, and they didn't deserve it or have it coming to them. 10 minutes ago, gEYno said: But it reads as if the guy was part of some legitimate firm. I don't have any real legal knowledge, but shouldn't the firm that employed him be responsible for the money, should it be proven that he acted improperly. I think what Sperm wrote and gEYno's response are both good. This is the problem with investments houses imo. You're dealing with people that you essentially cant trust, not because they may be flatout lying to you, but because "low risk/high risk" can be very subjective. 7 million is alot of money, whether its was given to the guy for investment or stolen through forgery. Im assuming that whatever the situaiton is, Sanchez is going to have to "prove it" in a court of law which will cost more money...money he may not receive if he loses or if the firm finds some way to make this the sole problem/responsibility of the individual(s) Sanchez dealt with. This entire situation is crazy. Thats alot of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 9 minutes ago, drdetroit said: Ponzi schemes are everywhere Madoff was the chairman of Nasdaq at one point ^^^^^ That says alot! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 8 minutes ago, gEYno said: But it reads as if the guy was part of some legitimate firm. I don't have any real legal knowledge, but shouldn't the firm that employed him be responsible for the money, should it be proven that he acted improperly. Yes, if he was. Not personally, thankfully, but I know of that exact thing happening. In that case, though, the acct mgr was an employee of the bank/investment house, so there is no finger pointing at another to shift blame. They're pretty thorough and will make you sign a form that states the risk you're comfortable with. If you say or "check the box" that says minimal risk/exposure, and your money gets put into one of the things southparkcpa alluded to, it's easier to recover one's losses later than the uphill (if not pre-lost) battle Mark now faces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 20 minutes ago, Sperm Edwards said: No doubt, but if he went with a large/reputable/famous investment house - like one attached to an ultra-large bank the govt would never allow to go bankrupt - and it's clear it was not invested in accordance with the client's desired risk/strategy (like what allegedly happened here), they could sue and could recover the improperly-invested losses. An individual clown making promises? Lol best of luck in hoping he has enough to pay it back. It's gone. These guys have so much already, and still make so much, that they don't need the promises of wild returns. They just need to not lose it. The fraud aside... the LARGE houses you speak of have some of the worst advisors. Young, aggressive, commission driven. They use funds recommended by the firm. the firm receives back door fees from these fund companies. I would add, any mutual fund with an expense ratio above .65 should be avoided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 24 minutes ago, drdetroit said: Ponzi schemes are everywhere Madoff was the chairman of Nasdaq at one point No doubt, but as I understand it, what made him a magnet to wealthy investors wasn't so much the promise of security, but rather the promises of significantly or always beating the market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 43 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said: People need to learn how to manage their own finances, because its easy enough to explain it to a 12 year old. This is why when I see people lose 7-8 million dollars I SMH because they gave someone 7-8 million of their dollars to potentially lose. Certain things in your life I would say is better being done by you. The first place to start, is learning "What is time and what is money". You never get time back, and that money represented his time and effort. He gave it to someone who didnt have a problem not taking into consideration his time and effort. No one will take your time and effort more seriously than yourself. I've had people laugh as me and call me a jackass for some of the things that I do with my money. 7 years later, I have yet to say that someone robbed me or took advantage of me. Im content with that. I learned by doing, gaining, losing, understanding. I've taught myself that the best game is the long haul, and doing it yourself. I agree with that but as a CFP, I manage money for a LOT of very smart people. they simply want a plan of attack, a second set of eyes. many people (not all) doing it themselves are in and out of the market, missing the upside etc... no idea when to collect social security, understand tax liability etc. But in general we agree. I stand on the statement that if ALL, EVERY PENNY of a persons invest-able dollars were in the Vanguard Balanced Index Fund and you NEVER moved it until you were 65 you would outperform 85 percent of all advisors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 1 hour ago, southparkcpa said: I am a CFP and manage quite a bit of money. I can tell you , all the credentials in the world wont save you from a bad advisor. The majority of people "fukked out of money" is from an advisor they know. He's Dads college buddy, he helped my Aunt, I went to church with him etc. If you cant explain the investment to a 12 year old, there is a problem. Thats Warren Buffet. Annuities, variable Products etc... almost entirely are bull crap. In my office we use Vanguard Funds 90 percent. so why pay you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 2 minutes ago, Lizard King said: so why pay you? Because I outperform most other advisors who are using high cost funds, we put a written plan together inclusive of 401K, Deferred comp, retirement, estate planning etc. We meet at least twice a year, many I see quarterly and they come to me usually from a large bank where they underperformed, had a relatinship with someone they barely knew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 44 minutes ago, drdetroit said: Ponzi schemes are everywhere Madoff was the chairman of Nasdaq at one point He was offered it, and turned it down. Probably because he knew the scrutiny of his finances would have exposed him in about 10 minutes of a federal background check. Gave him another decade or so of fraud. Does appear this guy committed forgery to draw on these guys' accounts. At a loss though how they weren't smart enough to see millions going goodbye without making a phone call about what the hell this guy was doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drdetroit Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 1 minute ago, Sperm Edwards said: No doubt, but as I understand it, what made him a magnet to wealthy investors wasn't so much the promise of security, but rather the promises of significantly or always beating the market. But the guy I gave $10 million cash to invest for me seemed so nice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 1 minute ago, southparkcpa said: Because I outperform most other advisors who are using high cost funds, we put a written plan together inclusive of 401K, Deferred comp, retirement, estate planning etc. We meet at least twice a year, many I see quarterly and they come to me usually from a large bank where they underperformed, had a relatinship with someone they barely knew. So you work for free, and only with friends and family? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugg Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 25 minutes ago, Lizard King said: so why pay you? During tax time see a lot of statements from all different size investment companies. Some of the bigger Wall Street firms do in fact clearly churn accounts to generate fees, and you try to explain to people that there isn't any rhyme or reason to the trades other than their fees. Have a family member who worked with a guy who took his CFP work as a retirement job, and frankly while he has been affiliated with various big brokers since, hasn't done dick for him other than taking him to a ballgame or 2.Could've simply bought the same mutual funds and gotten the same middling returns without the CFP's fees . And most of the other trades the guy made were losers. we have an annual discussion about this, which has never been pleasant. I hope SPA does that well for his clients. But if you're gonna buy blue chip mutual funds, doesn't seem much reason to pay a brokerage fee on top of their fees when you coud do that yourself on line for a fraction of the cost. Who ever you are, you need to understand how your money is invested and if it's working for you rather than for your CFP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southparkcpa Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 5 minutes ago, Lizard King said: So you work for free, and only with friends and family? no, I develop a relationship with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Just now, southparkcpa said: I agree with that but as a CFP, I manage money for a LOT of very smart people. they simply want a plan of attack, a second set of eyes. many people (not all) doing it themselves are in and out of the market, missing the upside etc... no idea when to collect social security, understand tax liability etc. But in general we agree. I stand on the statement that if ALL, EVERY PENNY of a persons invest-able dollars were in the Vanguard Balanced Index Fund and you NEVER moved it until you were 65 you would outperform 85 percent of all advisors. Someone should have recommended you to Sanchez then! I dont know how smart or dumb people are. I know for example that im not the smartest, I just know that if there's something that I want/need to do thats important, I go find out and read up on it. I've stuck my toes into the stock market at one time, but I did it in the beginning once I started taking my finances/savings more seriously. It didnt go well given the emotion and wanting to watch the price every 15 minutes. Buying on the highs, selling on the lows etc. You know how it goes. It took a couple years to control that impulse, but the more I learned the more I realized that for me, that type of market simply wasnt a place for me at all. I dont like to give my money anywhere and not have something of value in return during the transaction. But I would say that these things are very easy to learn if you simply learn about a particular company and product and how it be implemented into society. And Im not great at all with those exotic investments that made guys like Hank Paulson filthy rich. I do however look into companies involved in tech. I've trained myself however never to give my money without receiving something of value in exchange. Because of that I forgo certain investments like stocks. A company I've been looking into (for fun) is AMD. The company took over the gaming console market owning the chips in every major gaming console unit. They've been advertising their new 14 nanometer GPU chip Polaris and from reports, the power wattage is 2.8 times better than the previous 28 nanometer config, runs cooler and is aimed at the 84% of the market who buys "budget GPU's". The greatest thing about this new GPU is that it gives similar performance to the current-gen GPU's (GTX 980's $600) for a fraction of the price $230 as well as wattage. What was more impressive is that yesterday I just seen someone overclock one of these GPU's by 26%. The price-to-wattage-to-performance ratio is insane on this config. AMD also just confirmed that they've won the chip rights for the next-gen console systems again, which mean developers will be creating their engines around the AMD chip standard. In the last 2 months I've seen the stock of this company go from $2.50 to $5.40 today. Many people are sleeping because AMD doesnt have the "NVIDIA" name/branding in the industry, but their tech is quickly taking over the market while NVIDIA cant compete in the console market so their basically regulated to the "high end" GPU market which makes up the other 16% of the market. AMD is now developing their ZEN CPU at the very same time that Intel has made it publicly known that they're looking to get out of the gaming CPU business. As for me though, though I can understand things like this ^^^ with a little bit of homework on the company/industry, I've learned from a few people that its not about the price, especially if you're not looking to cash out, but about ratio's and margin's. Once I fully understood that, I've made my little bit work for me. Now I stop looking at the price in terms of value, but to the ratio's and margins. The moment I started doing it, thats when I began to see my savings grow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lizard King Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 6 minutes ago, southparkcpa said: no, I develop a relationship with them. That's important but my question is, if you use lowcost vanguard fund, how do you get compensated. don't understand it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Villain The Foe Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 4 minutes ago, Lizard King said: That's important but my question is, if you use lowcost vanguard fund, how do you get compensated. don't understand it Possibly client fees? Similar to a broker I would assume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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