The emerging backup QB conundrum

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Matt39 said:

Geno has been quiet since the punch. No reason not to have him as a backup. I wouldnt care if he's the backup moving forward either.

He provides an inexpensive buffer so we don't have to force Hackenberg or Petty onto the field.  Agreed.  Unless we can find someone to cough up a 5th rounder or something to get him (extremely unlikely). 

[Larz]

4 hours ago, Powpow said:

Look how happy they are that Fitz is back. I mean cmon its quite telling.

 

awseome pic !

I was also struck by how lucky these dogs are to show up for work dressed like that, lol

[Jetsfan80]

I don't know that I support attempting to place Petty onto the PS and risk losing him.  A 4th round pick is a fairly substantial investment in a guy we knew was going to be a project.  Even a guy who never is anything more than a decent # 2 has value.  Why would we risk it after just 1 year?  I'd rather carry 4 QB's and potentially lose a quality special teamer than lose Petty. 

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I don't know that I support attempting to place Petty onto the PS and risk losing him.  A 4th round pick is a fairly substantial investment in a guy we knew was going to be a project.  Even a guy who never is anything more than a decent # 2 has value.  Why would we risk it after just 1 year?  I'd rather carry 4 QB's and potentially lose a quality special teamer than lose Petty. 

if they believe Petty can be a solid backup, then they should release Geno at the end of camp.  He clearly has no future here, the entire team is breathing a sigh of relief that Fitz is back and the gm has drafted 2 qbs the past 2 yrs who he clearly prefers to groom.  I'd rather not release a guy who could actually contribute down the road and keep Geno who seems destined to not be on the team come February.

[Rangers9]

4 minutes ago, Matt39 said:

Geno has been quiet since the punch. No reason not to have him as a backup. I wouldnt care if he's the backup moving forward either.

It will be interesting to see if he has anything to say about this. To me he's handled things with a lot of class. Of course we don't see or hear about the guy and know he relates to players behind the scenes. When I saw him on the sideline last year he seemed to be acting like a good teammate. Not playing but being involved and standing next to Fitz a lot. Seemingly trying to help him out and rooting for the team to win,. Not isolating himself like some guys who don't play do. 

[Jetsfan80]

1 minute ago, Augustiniak said:

if they believe Petty can be a solid backup, then they should release Geno at the end of camp.  He clearly has no future here, the entire team is breathing a sigh of relief that Fitz is back and the gm has drafted 2 qbs the past 2 yrs who he clearly prefers to groom.  I'd rather not release a guy who could actually contribute down the road and keep Geno who seems destined to not be on the team come February.

Oh definitely, but I don't think the coaching staff views Petty as ready to be the # 2 right now, and that's the risk if we cut Geno.  But if there's any QB to lose off this roster, of course it's Geno.  He's done here after 2016 for sure, and it's not like we'll get a great compensatory pick for him when he signs elsewhere. 

[BigRy56]

The best case scenario is Hackenberg brings his A game and claims the backup spot by the end of camp and Geno is cut.

If Petty continues to struggle he will be sent to the practice squad and Geno will ride out the rest of the season as back up.

[whodeawhodat]

3 hours ago, slats said:

Unless Petty passes Geno on the depth chart in camp, my guess would be they carry four QBs into the season opener and then cut Petty and slip him onto the practice squad. 

Would Petty be protected if we moved him to the PS? If not, I doubt we move him there unless he totally sh!ts the bed this preseason.

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Jetsfan80 said:

Oh definitely, but I don't think the coaching staff views Petty as ready to be the # 2 right now, and that's the risk if we cut Geno.  But if there's any QB to lose off this roster, of course it's Geno.  He's done here after 2016 for sure, and it's not like we'll get a great compensatory pick for him when he signs elsewhere. 

i think they need to make a decision on Petty.  Geno is not going to be here beyond 2016.  Petty needs to show he can be a legit backup.  He was 24 when drafted and had a red-shirt year last year.  It makes no good sense to keep 4 qbs when 2 of them haven't proven anything.  Keep one of them.

[whodeawhodat]

actually, espn just answered my question.  since Petty didnt play one down last year he is practice squad eligble meaning that if someone claimed him, he would need to be immediately placed on their active 53 man roster.  Not sure i like that route.

[Warfish]

There is no conundrum.

We are a win-now team.  A win-now team needs a capable #2 QB just in case.  Geno Smith may not be a starter, but he is an acceptable #2 QB.

Geno will be retained for 2016, he will not be cut.  he will be the #2 QB.

Petty will either be cut, or (if possible, I have no idea, but I believe he is due to lack of playing time) put on the practice squad.  

Hack will be the #3, obviously.

You don't cut your #2 in a win-now year for a mid-round prospect QB when you just spent a 2nd Rounder on your actual "QB of the Future".

i.e. there is no conundrum.  

[slats]

2 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

Would Petty be protected if we moved him to the PS? If not, I doubt we move him there unless he totally sh!ts the bed this preseason.

I'm not sure if the Jets have the right to bring him up if someone makes a claim on him. The only other moves are going with four QBs. or mysteriously landing Petty or Hack on the IR list. I'm frankly not so sure that teams would jump to dump their own #3 QB so quickly, or add a #3 QB when they were only previously carrying two, for the services of Bryce Petty. 

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

There is no conundrum.

We are a win-now team.  A win-now team needs a capable #2 QB just in case.  Geno Smith may not be a starter, but he is an acceptable #2 QB.

Geno will be retained for 2016, he will not be cut.  he will be the #2 QB.

Petty will either be cut, or (if possible, I have no idea, but I believe he is due to lack of playing time) put on the practice squad.  

Hack will be the #3, obviously.

You don't cut your #2 in a win-now year for a mid-round prospect QB when you just spent a 2nd Rounder on your actual "QB of the Future".

i.e. there is no conundrum.  

i object to the 'win now' mode this team is continually characterized as.  They have a few veterans, all teams do.  I believe marshall, revis, decker and mangold all have a few real good years left.  the team probably will go to a real young qb next season.  the defense is young except for revis and harris.  qbs play into their late 30s, there are a lot of teams with veteran qbs like the giants who are not considered 'win now'.  why are the jets?  

[Warfish]

Just now, Augustiniak said:

i object to the 'win now' mode this team is continually characterized as.

Your objection is utterly irrelevant.  This is clearly a win-now team, moving like a win-now team, and the entire professional NFL analyst population describes us as a win-now team.

Failure to win this year likely means we dump a number of expensive veterans for cheap kids or new draft picks, change QB to a kid, and have at least a temporary "rebuild" year in 2017.  

 

[Powpow]

24 minutes ago, Joe Jets fan said:

The love for Geno Smith on these forums is just shocking to me.  He is a terrible QB and an a$$ hole of a person.  I can not wait till the day comes and he is no longer a NYJ.  I hope it comes today.   

How others in this forum can't see this is ludicrous and just waters down any credibility they have.  Now for some fun: Geno's media meltdown to come. Stay tuned for the arrogant, immature, caustic, self indulgent, insulting, toxic crapola that will soon emerge from his pea brain. But of course, he will be consoled because the media 'egged' him on. 

[Augustiniak]

1 minute ago, Warfish said:

Your objection is utterly irrelevant.  This is clearly a win-now team, moving like a win-now team, and the entire professional NFL analyst population describes us as a win-now team.

Failure to win this year likely means we dump a number of expensive veterans for cheap kids or new draft picks, change QB to a kid, and have at least a temporary "rebuild" year in 2017.  

 

then i disagree with the characterization.  i think it's absurd to consider a team with a 34 year old journeyman as a qb who has never made the playoffs as 'win now'.  the only 2 vets who will be difficult to replace are revis and marshall.  mangold has a few good years left.  harris is still good but he can and will be replaced by a more athletic lb and the defense will still be good, and for all we know milliner may actually contribute which would be a huge bonus.  this team is not in 'win now' any more than teams like the pats, giants, packers, cowboys, ravens, falcons, chargers, steelers, chiefs, lions, saints and cardinals who all have expensive veteran qbs.  this team is not in 'win now' any more than the dolphins, vikings, bengals, texans and redskins, who either underachieve or have questions about their starting qbs.   

[drdetroit]

9 hours ago, HessStation said:

I'm going to just guess, Petty to practice squad. Gene gone next year and you have Hackenberg or Petty...or FA or draft pick to choose from...

This 

[C Mart]

Just now, drdetroit said:

This 

Petty will never clear waivers. 

[darkprime]

The RAMS might be in the market for a backup quarterback now.

[C Mart]

37 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

Would Petty be protected if we moved him to the PS? If not, I doubt we move him there unless he totally sh!ts the bed this preseason.

You just can't move a guy to the PS. They first must be placed on & then clear waivers. IF that happens he can sign to any teams PS. Once on a PS ANY team can then sign him to their 53 throughout the season. To sign to a 53 from PS requires the NFL minimum salary for 3 weeks whether they remain on that teams 53 man roster for those 3 weeks or not. 

I believe I have this all correctly. 

[whodeawhodat]

1 hour ago, C Mart said:

You just can't move a guy to the PS. They first must be placed on & then clear waivers. IF that happens he can sign to any teams PS. Once on a PS ANY team can then sign him to their 53 throughout the season. To sign to a 53 from PS requires the NFL minimum salary for 3 weeks whether they remain on that teams 53 man roster for those 3 weeks or not. 

I believe I have this all correctly. 

I heard on ESPN this morning that since Petty had not played a snap last year, in order for someone to pick him up off our practice squad, petty would need to go directly to that new teams 53 man active roster.

[Bruce Harper]

11 hours ago, HessStation said:

I'm going to just guess, Petty to practice squad. Gene gone next year and you have Hackenberg or Petty...or FA or draft pick to choose from...

I agree with this.  Does anyone have any thoughts on whether Petty is highly regarded enough to get snatched off of the practice squad?

[Dcat]

8 hours ago, Jetsplayer21 said:

Ha no.. Geno is making peanuts, and is 100% more capable #2 than hack or petty ( at least for this yr ) 

Correct.  Geno is not being cut this year.  He is the back up.  The Jets would save zero cap money by cutting him now and would put their season at risk by having to trot out Petty or Hack.

Geno will be a Jet through the end of the season and I bet we'll need him out there more than once when Ryan gets knocked around.

[Bruce Harper]

2 hours ago, Warfish said:

There is no conundrum.

We are a win-now team.  A win-now team needs a capable #2 QB just in case.  Geno Smith may not be a starter, but he is an acceptable #2 QB.

Geno will be retained for 2016, he will not be cut.  he will be the #2 QB.

Petty will either be cut, or (if possible, I have no idea, but I believe he is due to lack of playing time) put on the practice squad.  

Hack will be the #3, obviously.

You don't cut your #2 in a win-now year for a mid-round prospect QB when you just spent a 2nd Rounder on your actual "QB of the Future".

i.e. there is no conundrum.  

Agreed.  This all seems pretty straightforward to me.  I would be highly surprised if anything else happens.

[j4jets]

11 hours ago, jetscrazey said:

With Fitz solidly in place as the starter and Hackenberg and Petty both waiting in the wings as guys with tremendous upside if they can figure it out mentally, Geno Smith is caught in limbo.  It's becoming apparent that he has little chance of a future as the long-term starting QB here.  If Hack/Petty were at all ready to be a 2nd stringer I'd say just trade or release Geno.  However, I don't think either of them will be ready to play in 2016.  I saw Petty as a 2-3 year project when he was drafted and Hack probably needs at least a year as well.  This leaves Geno as the backup, however it puts the team in a tough position to either keep 4 QBs or park either Hack or Petty on the practice squad and expose them to another team signing them to their active roster.  I think if it happens, it'll happen to Petty, not Hack.  However, when they invested a pick in Petty last year, they knew that he was not a 1 year project either, and Petty's special arm gives him significant upside if he can figure it out mentally.  It might not be the best idea to expose him either on the practice squad in that case.  If Petty really stinks in the preseason the decision will be easier to make, but if he shows development they might have to just bite the bullet and keep 4 QBs this year in order to keep their options open.

Geno isn't going anywhere. With Fitz' playing style, you need a QB that can step in n play (better than Fitz). Petty n Hack aren't ready. Not yet. Hack will need possibly one more year on the bench. Petty is the odd man out but we will most likely go with 4QBs this year.  Releasing Petty, we will have Hack as the only QB under contract next season. Can't make that mistake either. 

[C Mart]

23 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

I heard on ESPN this morning that since Petty had not played a snap last year, in order for someone to pick him up off our practice squad, petty would need to go directly to that new teams 53 man active roster.

 

24 minutes ago, whodeawhodat said:

I heard on ESPN this morning that since Petty had not played a snap last year, in order for someone to pick him up off our practice squad, petty would need to go directly to that new teams 53 man active roster.

Correct. Before he can even go on any teams PS he must first clear waivers i.e. Not be claimed by a team, which means they would assume his contract and on their 53 man roster. 

I believe this is the process for any non-vested player whether they play one snap or not. To be vested I believe must be on a 53 man for 3 yrs maybe 4 yrs. 

[j4jets]

1 hour ago, C Mart said:

You just can't move a guy to the PS. They first must be placed on & then clear waivers. IF that happens he can sign to any teams PS. Once on a PS ANY team can then sign him to their 53 throughout the season. To sign to a 53 from PS requires the NFL minimum salary for 3 weeks whether they remain on that teams 53 man roster for those 3 weeks or not. 

I believe I have this all correctly. 

I've wondered about this myself but quick question: does the team have any control over the guy on their practice squad from keeping him from signing elsewhere?

From what I understand, PS is the same as FA, except with a PS player, you pay them 3wks salary at the min. 

[jfmckenna]

My prediction: Geno spends the next several weeks moping and sulking and forces the Jets to cut him.

Jets sign a vet back-up.

Petty is eventually cut, unfortunately.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Augustiniak]

Just now, jfmckenna said:

My prediction: Geno spends the next several weeks moping and sulking and forces the Jets to cut him.

Jets sign a vet back-up.

Petty is eventually cut, unfortunately.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

i think the qb playing time allocation in preseason will be interesting.  will they be playing geno a lot or giving petty and hack as much as they can?

[C Mart]

21 minutes ago, j4jets said:

I've wondered about this myself but quick question: does the team have any control over the guy on their practice squad from keeping him from signing elsewhere?

From what I understand, PS is the same as FA, except with a PS player, you pay them 3wks salary at the min. 

No control per se. If the Jets wanted to sign a guy from say NEs PS, NE can't stop it from happening. NE could just promote the guy to their 53 thus preventing Jets from signing him. Or NE could tell him he's better off sitting/learning on NE PS but not many players are going to pass up 3 minimum salary checks vs weekly PS checks of approx $5K. 

This is why, rumored, Jets late last yr promoted Taiwan Jones from PS to 53. Rumor was another team was looking to sign Jones. 

[Jetsplayer21]

5 hours ago, Dcat said:

Correct.  Geno is not being cut this year.  He is the back up.  The Jets would save zero cap money by cutting him now and would put their season at risk by having to trot out Petty or Hack.

Geno will be a Jet through the end of the season and I bet we'll need him out there more than once when Ryan gets knocked around.

I think it wouldn't be a bad thing if Fitz got hurt and geno got a chance with this much improved O and OC.. Looking ahead to 17, I highly doubt mac will want to go into next yr with a petty/hackenberg competition.. Mac is not going to go through this crap again with fitz, he is gone after this yr.. I think geno would be much more reasonable.. He won't have a ton of options.. Let him battle it out with hac next summer.. I can't see us going better than 8-8, 9-7 with this schedule.. Fitz won't repeat same numbers.. I know we shouldn't think about 17 already but Brady is getting old.. Next yr could be the yr the tammy goes downhill..

[JetBlue]

7 hours ago, Augustiniak said:

then i disagree with the characterization.  i think it's absurd to consider a team with a 34 year old journeyman as a qb who has never made the playoffs as 'win now'.  the only 2 vets who will be difficult to replace are revis and marshall.  mangold has a few good years left.  harris is still good but he can and will be replaced by a more athletic lb and the defense will still be good, and for all we know milliner may actually contribute which would be a huge bonus.  this team is not in 'win now' any more than teams like the pats, giants, packers, cowboys, ravens, falcons, chargers, steelers, chiefs, lions, saints and cardinals who all have expensive veteran qbs.  this team is not in 'win now' any more than the dolphins, vikings, bengals, texans and redskins, who either underachieve or have questions about their starting qbs.   

Excellent post.

[Mainejet]

There's no problem here whatsoever........ This is so simple. There's only one of two scenarios that could possibly happen at this point:

1) Geno manages to last another season on the roster because Bryce Petty is not ready to take the backup role. The Jets own personal cockroach infestation.....Thanks John Idzik.

2) OR, and this is what I am really, really, really, really, hoping for.... Bryce Petty plays great in the preseason and the CS decides he is ready to be promoted to the back up role. Geno gets canned. The Jets finally hired Orko.

 

[RSJ]

1 hour ago, Mainejet said:

There's no problem here whatsoever........ This is so simple. There's only one of two scenarios that could possibly happen at this point:

1) Geno manages to last another season on the roster because Bryce Petty is not ready to take the backup role. The Jets own personal cockroach infestation.....Thanks John Idzik.

2) OR, and this is what I am really, really, really, really, hoping for.... Bryce Petty plays great in the preseason and the CS decides he is ready to be promoted to the back up role. Geno gets canned. The Jets finally hired Orko.

 

Yeah I kind of see either of these options happening too. Geno has a disadvantage because he only has one year left on his contract. If Petty is close to performing like he is second string and Geno still is playing like an idiot, it's really an easy decision. However, if Geno is lights out, PUP list or IR are more likely than practice squad. Unless of course Petty is awful.

[C Mart]

24 minutes ago, RSJ said:

Yeah I kind of see either of these options happening too. Geno has a disadvantage because he only has one year left on his contract. If Petty is close to performing like he is second string and Geno still is playing like an idiot, it's really an easy decision. However, if Geno is lights out, PUP list or IR are more likely than practice squad. Unless of course Petty is awful.

PUP isn't an option once you practice 

 

A player who, as a result of football-related injuries, is unable to take part in training camp practices may be assigned to the preseason PUP list. Players can be moved off the PUP list to the active roster at any time, even after one practice. A player cannot be placed on the PUP list, however, once he has taken the field for a practice, even if only for a few minutes.