The only guy that should be safe

[Jetster]

Is Macc! Just for the rumor that he was trying to move up to get Carson Wentz alone.  I believe in our GM & everything else can change again for all I care. 

Have any of you noticed the defense the Eagles are playing? This is after sending off Maxwell & Alonzo mistakes by Chip Kelly. By the way, their DC is a very accomplished guy that's had success before in Schwartz. Our DC is another Coaches pal who has shown no ability to scheme, adapt or make halftime adjustments. 

Until we rid ourselves of the overpaid underachievers we'll continue to spin our wheels. Revis, Harris, Gilchrist & Skrine are all average or below average players taking a huge amount of our salary cap & none of them played well enough to force a QB to pump the ball or hold it long enough for our Dline to get to the QB. Harris is the only leader of the bunch but he's a shell of what he was and has become such a detriment on the field that the Henderson/Jenkins injuries are clearly hurting the defense overall.  Sutton proved yesterday you can scheme a team & take away what they've been successful with, fooling a 12 year journeyman, over & over again baiting him into double coverages.

All teams make mistakes, it's the teams that continue to make THE SAME mistakes without making changes who never get better. Macc knows where the problems are and what players have no future here like Revis, Harris, Fitz, even Mangold needs to be replaced over the next 2 years. He was completely worth his contract but not anymore. What makes the Pats winners is cutting bait before it's too late. 

With this young Dline, the most important moves Macc will make is the reconstruction of this Oline to protect whoever the next young QB will be next year. It's also time to draft a stud young RB to take some pressure off. Here we are treading water again but at least the cupboard isn't empty this time. Mo, Leo, Sheldon (I would try to trade him), Lee, Jenkins, Burris, Winters, Carpenter, (Clady, depending on salary), Pryor (strong safety), Enunwa, Anderson, J. Marshall, Peake. 

Right now we're like the Lions, Rams, Chargers, Texans, teams with some good players that play UP & DOWN from week to week, just good enough to make most games interesting but just bad enough to have some absolute STINKERS. The idea that we can sit a QB for 3 years is absurd & unrealistic in this day & age, as Jet fans will want NOTHING TO DO with Ryan Fitzpatrick in 2017. You want to see a lot of empty seats at MetLife try selling that to the fans. Macc has to know we're very close to Petty time after yesterday, such a shame he hurt his shoulder. If Hackenberg isn't competing for the starting QB spot in camp next year if Petty is not the answer than there's no way in hell that Macc doesn't take another stab in next years draft.  Macc needs at least 5 years, Bowles is replaceable from what I've seen so far, Gailey is ready for retirement & Kacey Rodgers can go back to coaching Dlines & LBs somewhere else for all I care. 

I think the one legacy of this regime from Woody consulting with Charley Casserly will be the hiring of Macc & his scouts. 

 

 

[Smashmouth]

Good Post the NFL is all about coaching and we have not had a competent coaching staff since Bill Parcells left.

[varjet]

Chan Gailey is a real coordinator.  You may not agree with how he calls a game, but he is a coordinator.  He was not successful as a HC.

Kacy Rodgers is a friend of the head coach/first time coordinator.  But Todd Bowles is a real defensive coordinator-he was coordinator of the year in 2014.

Teams often have to pay a really good coordinator to be Head Coach so they can poach them.  This is one of those times.  Todd Bowles needs to step up here and defensively coordinate, becase the Jets defense does not look coordinated.

[dbatesman]

Sweet merciful crap.

[Bleedin Green]

How is Maccagnan blameless when the players you cited as the team's problems were all signed to those big contracts by him?

[Jetster]

9 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Good Post the NFL is all about coaching and we have not had a competent coaching staff since Bill Parcells left.

If you look at what we're getting for our money from Fitz, Revis, and Harris it's not money well spent. 37 million. The Jets brass would obviously never publicly admit they have no chance while BB is in New England, they have to be realists. What Macc needs to do is continue adding young talent to this team and rebuild the Oline while continuing to find a QB. 

What you want is to have a proven coach look at the Jets as a GREAT OPPORTUNTY for success, based on the talent that has been assembled. Revis, Harris, Fitz, Mangold, Marshall maybe Decker are not going to be around for the Jets rebirth. It's easily 3 years away, maybe 2 if we get lucky at QB with Petty or Hack, or a pick next year, maybe a FA signing like Garapolo or the backup in Tampa? 

Based on what I've seen so far with Bowles, he's not the answer, as Chan Gailey is way too old & his hand picked DC is terrible. Maybe he stays if he makes staff changes but that's highly unlikely unless Macc forces the issue, but that never seems to end well. Jet fans might want to hang me for saying this but I think giving Josh McDaniel another chance would be a really smart move based on the fact that offense is so important in this league & having a tested young OC bringing a young QB along is the way to go. Jets have had enough DCs trying to be coaches, time for a change. Defenses built like the Jets & with these young LBs being integrated, the Big Dline, faster LBs, playing with leads makes defenses much tougher to deal with when they can take chances. 

Thats my take on it. I don't know how you guys feel, but I strongly feel Todd Bowles will have nothing to do with a NY Jets future resurgence.

 

[dbatesman]

19 minutes ago, Bleedin Green said:

How is Maccagnan blameless when the players you cited as the team's problems were all signed to those big contracts by him?

LETS GO BIG MACC

[Big Blocker]

Fact is it is too early to render judgment on Macc.  If either Petty or Hackenberg turns out to be dependable and average to above average Qb's, that would overcome the entire litany of complaints about him.

And ftr I do not think it fair to hang the Revis contract on him.  That has all the appearances of being a Woody move.

[ScarletKnight89]

I'm sorry but I'm not going to blame Todd Bowles for yesterday. Fitz played at a level that gave us no chance. The team had so many chances and Fitz threw 6 picks,

 

Jalin Marshall should probably be inactive for a week to send a message. Give Robbie Anderson and or Peake a chance. Marshall has talent but you can't keep putting the ball on the ground.

I guess where Bowles messed up was not pulling him from the game and giving Geno a chance to try and save it.

[joewilly12]

2 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

I'm sorry but I'm not going to blame Todd Bowles for yesterday. Fitz played at a level that gave us no chance. The team had so many chances and Fitz threw 6 picks,

 

Jalin Marshall should probably be inactive for a week to send a message. Give Robbie Anderson and or Peake a chance. Marshall has talent but you can't keep putting the ball on the ground.

I guess where Bowles messed up was not pulling him from the game and giving Geno a chance to try and save it.

Ironically no one else wanted Marshall so he wound up here Devin Smith another pick that puzzles me....

Bowles inserts Geno Smith he plays well we have a QB controversy on our hands and people start questioning Macc 

[ASH1962]

51 minutes ago, Smashmouth said:

Good Post the NFL is all about coaching and we have not had a competent coaching staff since Bill Parcells left.

Great point! We did have a competent HC for 15 minutes I recall when BP retired and BB was the HC of the NYJ for 15 M's LOL.

[slats]

The Jets hired a novice head coach and a novice GM. Both have made mistakes, but there's going to be growing pains. Bowles comes across as a genuinely smart guy, and obviously I'd like to see him demonstrate some learning on the job. So far, he seems a little too stubborn for me, a little too rigid. He does have a few rookies out there this year, including a couple undrafteds, so that's good to see. This is a team in transition, with a veteran QB who's supposed to be holding the fort rather than literally throwing away games. The roster isn't there yet, but it is going in the right direction. 

Fitz will bounce back from this worst ever performance, let's see how we all feel if they manage to get to 2-2. 

[RoadFan]

Cuts both ways.

Trying to trade up for Wentz does not excuse taking an "undraftable" Hack in the 2nd.

[bostonmajet]

27 minutes ago, Jetster said:

If you look at what we're getting for our money from Fitz, Revis, and Harris it's not money well spent. 37 million. The Jets brass would obviously never publicly admit they have no chance while BB is in New England, they have to be realists. What Macc needs to do is continue adding young talent to this team and rebuild the Oline while continuing to find a QB. 

What you want is to have a proven coach look at the Jets as a GREAT OPPORTUNTY for success, based on the talent that has been assembled. Revis, Harris, Fitz, Mangold, Marshall maybe Decker are not going to be around for the Jets rebirth. It's easily 3 years away, maybe 2 if we get lucky at QB with Petty or Hack, or a pick next year, maybe a FA signing like Garapolo or the backup in Tampa? 

Based on what I've seen so far with Bowles, he's not the answer, as Chan Gailey is way too old & his hand picked DC is terrible. Maybe he stays if he makes staff changes but that's highly unlikely unless Macc forces the issue, but that never seems to end well. Jet fans might want to hang me for saying this but I think giving Josh McDaniel another chance would be a really smart move based on the fact that offense is so important in this league & having a tested young OC bringing a young QB along is the way to go. Jets have had enough DCs trying to be coaches, time for a change. Defenses built like the Jets & with these young LBs being integrated, the Big Dline, faster LBs, playing with leads makes defenses much tougher to deal with when they can take chances. 

Thats my take on it. I don't know how you guys feel, but I strongly feel Todd Bowles will have nothing to do with a NY Jets future resurgence.

 

Bowles is still young (and so is Rodgers); since Bowles moved on from the ST coach last year, I think if he thought he needed to he would move on from Rodgers. Gailey, has done pretty well considering what he had. At a minimum you don't move on from Gailey until Fitz is gone, but there is no reason why they can't be grooming his replacment if he is on the team as Gailey is older than dirt, but in reality (except for yesterday) he has been one of the better OCs we have had.

I think unless the wheels come off the bus (like more games like yesterday) Bowles is here at least another year.

As far as the money goes, that is money down the drain, or under the bridge. 2016 is here.

I would expect Harris (6.5 million) and Breno (4.5 million) are gone next year and that frees up 11 million.

Clady and Mangold make up for 10 million and 9 million respectively. You are going to have a hard time replacing Clady with a vet for much less than that (as it is top 12 money), but you might be able to move on from Mangold (top 3 money). The odds are slim, but if we finish low enough you could replace both with rookies and save another 19 million.

Revis has a cap savings of over 7 million. Again, depending on how he is playing, it will be hard to replace Revis with a comparable CB for 7, but he is gone after 2017 (unless he restructures for safety money).

Releasing Skrine only saves 3.5 million due to the restructuring this year. But, Gilchrist for over 5 might be a casualty.

You can also save 7.5 by releasing Marshall, but he would have to fall off of a cliff, or become a locker room problem to even consider that as he is still the best WR on the team.

I don't see the Cap being a huge problem for us next year as there are a lot of options moving forward.

[deucebag]

7 minutes ago, RoadFan said:

Cuts both ways.

Trying to trade up for Wentz does not excuse taking an "undraftable" Hack in the 2nd.

It just blows my mind he took Hack in the 2nd rnd - he may have been available in the 5th.  Meanwhile we watch Cody Kessler and Dak Prescott succeed.

Meanwhile, through two offseaons (drafts,trades and FA)  we still have ZERO game breakers on offense (yeah Devin Smith - whatever), no Franchise QB, no Franchise RB, no TE, a worse OL than when he arrived.  He overpaid horrifcly for Revis and Cro and then cut Cro but shud have cut both.  Still have zero edge rushers and he did not score any sleepers in either of his drafts.

Shud I have expected the team to be a contender in just two years?  No - but it has been done before.  He's far from the worst GM we've had, but I do not believe he has done anything to categorize him as "safe".

 

[Jetster]

14 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

Bowles is still young (and so is Rodgers); since Bowles moved on from the ST coach last year, I think if he thought he needed to he would move on from Rodgers. Gailey, has done pretty well considering what he had. At a minimum you don't move on from Gailey until Fitz is gone, but there is no reason why they can't be grooming his replacment if he is on the team as Gailey is older than dirt, but in reality (except for yesterday) he has been one of the better OCs we have had.

I think unless the wheels come off the bus (like more games like yesterday) Bowles is here at least another year.

As far as the money goes, that is money down the drain, or under the bridge. 2016 is here.

I would expect Harris (6.5 million) and Breno (4.5 million) are gone next year and that frees up 11 million.

Clady and Mangold make up for 10 million and 9 million respectively. You are going to have a hard time replacing Clady with a vet for much less than that (as it is top 12 money), but you might be able to move on from Mangold (top 3 money). The odds are slim, but if we finish low enough you could replace both with rookies and save another 19 million.

Revis has a cap savings of over 7 million. Again, depending on how he is playing, it will be hard to replace Revis with a comparable CB for 7, but he is gone after 2017 (unless he restructures for safety money).

Releasing Skrine only saves 3.5 million due to the restructuring this year. But, Gilchrist for over 5 might be a casualty.

You can also save 7.5 by releasing Marshall, but he would have to fall off of a cliff, or become a locker room problem to even consider that as he is still the best WR on the team.

I don't see the Cap being a huge problem for us next year as there are a lot of options moving forward.

I don't think our cap will be a problem at all. I'm just saying that guys like Gilchrist/Breno/Harris could be money better spent somewhere else next year. I would dump them all & look for some stud Olineman in both the draft & in Free Agency, I'm positive the Cowboys won't be able to keep their Oline intact. Now that Enunwa has come on its time to find a TE that you could pair with him. You've got guys like J.Marshall that can work the slot, Robbie Anderson who can take the top off the defense & they are grooming Peake too. I would also seriously look at Revis & whether or not he's a good veteran for this team going forward. 

Revis just does not look like he wants to play anymore? He had some really lame azz tackle attempts yesterday. This league is about HUNGER and hustle. When players lose that their useless, especially if your paying them Revis type of money. Look no further than up north in Foxboro. Butler is completely outplaying Revis in man press coverage. 

Macc just has to keep drafting best available studs & go from there. Lee is proving to be a very good super fast LB, if Jordan Jenkins is the real deal, you might be able to give Revis money to a stud FA veteran LB that shakes loose & complete your young LB trio. Jets are a stud edge rusher away. Burriss looks good so far too. 

[Jet Nut]

54 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

Great point! We did have a competent HC for 15 minutes I recall when BP retired and BB was the HC of the NYJ for 15 M's LOL.

Sort of a rewrite of history in at pretty much every Jets fan, radio show etc was killing the jets for promising BB the job given how bad they all thought he was at that time. 

[munchmemory]

57 minutes ago, ASH1962 said:

Great point! We did have a competent HC for 15 minutes I recall when BP retired and BB was the HC of the NYJ for 15 M's LOL.

But like me, in your heart, you know Bellicheat would have been a disaster as our HC.  For no other reason than we're the Jets.  And that is the "Jet way".

[JetBlue]

39 minutes ago, deucebag said:

It just blows my mind he took Hack in the 2nd rnd - he may have been available in the 5th.  Meanwhile we watch Cody Kessler and Dak Prescott succeed.

Meanwhile, through two offseaons (drafts,trades and FA)  we still have ZERO game breakers on offense (yeah Devin Smith - whatever), no Franchise QB, no Franchise RB, no TE, a worse OL than when he arrived.  He overpaid horrifcly for Revis and Cro and then cut Cro but shud have cut both.  Still have zero edge rushers and he did not score any sleepers in either of his drafts.

Shud I have expected the team to be a contender in just two years?  No - but it has been done before.  He's far from the worst GM we've had, but I do not believe he has done anything to categorize him as "safe".

 

Dude Robby Anderson and Charone Peake can't play themselves; both of them are potential playmakers.  Devin Smith was having an outstanding camp until he got injured and missed all of the preseason and struggled when he came back (like any rookie would do who missed that many reps) started to play better but unfortunately got injured again.  The fact that Fitzpatrick can't throw deep is not his fault.   As much as people hate on Hack, I strongly doubt he would have been around in the 5th.  It is entirely possible he might have been taken before we picked in the third.   The game plan was from day one to red shirt him.  There is NO way Cody Kessler or Dak Prescott would be starting if they were drafted. If anything, we may have cut Geno and they would have competed with Petty for the number 2 spot.  Please stop with the revisionist history.   If Hack is the quarterback the FO thinks he can be, then we will have found our Franchise quarterback.    You say he didn't score any sleepers, yet he gets Peake with a 7th round pick and Anderson as an undrafted FA.  

He has overpaid for a couple of players but the one that had me scratching my head was David Harris when it was obvious that he was already a liability in coverage and getting worse.    Tell me what team has a franchise running back?  Are you serious?  Who is Denver's running back?  How about the Pats?   We have one of the best running backs in football in Matt Forte and you are complaining about our running backs?     

My biggest grip with Macc is caving in and resigning Fitzpatrick instead of allowing Petty and Smith to battle it out for the starting position.  Now they are committed to play this stiff come hell or high water.   

[HessStation]

Another season, another sh*tfest.

[deucebag]

3 minutes ago, HessStation said:

Another season, another sh*tfest.

Yes, another "refurbishing year"  we are back to the Joe Walton style of things trying to put cheap band aids to cover our flaws hence rarely ever exceeding mediocrity.  Fitz is our newest version of Richard Todd - a wimpy armed QB who may be smart and athletic but does not play that way. 

[Jetster]

2 hours ago, Bleedin Green said:

How is Maccagnan blameless when the players you cited as the team's problems were all signed to those big contracts by him?

Because he had to fill the roster & spend up to the cap. None of these contracts are future cap breakers, that's what he did! He held the line on Fitz too, and gave him a freaking deadline that forced him to make sure he wasn't late.

Macc has changed the way the Jets front office does business.

[bostonmajet]

29 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Dude Robby Anderson and Charone Peake can't play themselves; both of them are potential playmakers.  Devin Smith was having an outstanding camp until he got injured and missed all of the preseason and struggled when he came back (like any rookie would do who missed that many reps) started to play better but unfortunately got injured again.  The fact that Fitzpatrick can't throw deep is not his fault.   As much as people hate on Hack, I strongly doubt he would have been around in the 5th.  It is entirely possible he might have been taken before we picked in the third.   The game plan was from day one to red shirt him.  There is NO way Cody Kessler or Dak Prescott would be starting if they were drafted. If anything, we may have cut Geno and they would have competed with Petty for the number 2 spot.  Please stop with the revisionist history.   If Hack is the quarterback the FO thinks he can be, then we will have found our Franchise quarterback.    You say he didn't score any sleepers, yet he gets Peake with a 7th round pick and Anderson as an undrafted FA.  

He has overpaid for a couple of players but the one that had me scratching my head was David Harris when it was obvious that he was already a liability in coverage and getting worse.    Tell me what team has a franchise running back?  Are you serious?  Who is Denver's running back?  How about the Pats?   We have one of the best running backs in football in Matt Forte and you are complaining about our running backs?     

My biggest grip with Macc is caving in and resigning Fitzpatrick instead of allowing Petty and Smith to battle it out for the starting position.  Now they are committed to play this stiff come hell or high water.   

Don't forget our punter another late round grab.

I do think we need a big strong young RB; someone to put in the backfield for short yardage plays, wear down the defense at the end of the game and put in the backfield with Forte (not sure why they don't put Forte AND Powell in the backfield at the same time). Or a real burner. Either way, we can get those later on in the draft.

Let's hope Petty is good enough to start next year and Hack the year after that. If we can get some quality play out of one of those 2 it will be great. Many thought it would take at least 3 years to restock the team; let's see what Mac does next year.

In the meantime, our season isn't completely lost yet. Let's hope yesterday was the abnormality and not the bills game. If so, we can have a fun season rooting for our team. if we are don't by the 10th game, we will get to see what potential Petty might have. Either way, it should be an interesting year.

[JetBlue]

2 minutes ago, bostonmajet said:

Don't forget our punter another late round grab.

I do think we need a big strong young RB; someone to put in the backfield for short yardage plays, wear down the defense at the end of the game and put in the backfield with Forte (not sure why they don't put Forte AND Powell in the backfield at the same time). Or a real burner. Either way, we can get those later on in the draft.

Let's hope Petty is good enough to start next year and Hack the year after that. If we can get some quality play out of one of those 2 it will be great. Many thought it would take at least 3 years to restock the team; let's see what Mac does next year.

In the meantime, our season isn't completely lost yet. Let's hope yesterday was the abnormality and not the bills game. If so, we can have a fun season rooting for our team. if we are don't by the 10th game, we will get to see what potential Petty might have. Either way, it should be an interesting year.

Losing Khiry Robinson was a huge blow. I was looking forward to what he could contribute in the run game.  

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, JetBlue said:

Losing Khiry Robinson was a huge blow. I was looking forward to what he could contribute in the run game.  

Who did Macc sign to replace him?  Why are we still holding onto Breno? 

[bostonmajet]

2 minutes ago, JetBlue said:

Losing Khiry Robinson was a huge blow. I was looking forward to what he could contribute in the run game.  

Agreed

[whodeawhodat]

2 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Sweet merciful crap.

^^^^my sentiments reading most of this board today lol

[JetBlue]

4 minutes ago, joewilly12 said:

Who did Macc sign to replace him?  Why are we still holding onto Breno? 

Not sure; I think we have someone on the PS. 

[joewilly12]

1 minute ago, JetBlue said:

Not sure; I think we have someone on the PS. 

We could obviously use another RB on the active roster 

[bealeb319]

I think our DC needs to go, our defense is way more talented than they have played in the passed year and change. If we fire him at the end of the season i hear this guy up in buffalo will probably be looking for a Job, heard he knows how to run a defense.

[jack48]

2 hours ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

I'm sorry but I'm not going to blame Todd Bowles for yesterday. Fitz played at a level that gave us no chance. The team had so many chances and Fitz threw 6 picks,

 

Jalin Marshall should probably be inactive for a week to send a message. Give Robbie Anderson and or Peake a chance. Marshall has talent but you can't keep putting the ball on the ground.

I guess where Bowles messed up was not pulling him from the game and giving Geno a chance to try and save it.

Yesterday is on Fitz.  But a defensive game plan that gives Alex Smith the short pass is worse than dumb---it is pathetic.

[Savage69]

3 hours ago, Smashmouth said:

Good Post the NFL is all about coaching and we have not had a competent coaching staff since Bill Parcells left.

That staff minus the Tuna went to the Pats..

[Smashmouth]

Just now, Savage69 said:

That staff minus the Tuna went to the Pats..

yep ... I wonder what the real story was behind Belichick not wanting to coach here.

[Ken Schroy]

2 hours ago, RoadFan said:

Cuts both ways.

Trying to trade up for Wentz does not excuse taking an "undraftable" Hack in the 2nd.

Well Hack was drafted, so I guess he wasn't undraftable. But I don't want to spoil all the whining on the here.

[Ex-Rex]

3 hours ago, Jetster said:

Until we rid ourselves of the overpaid underachievers we'll continue to spin our wheels. Revis, Harris, Gilchrist & Skrine are all average or below average players taking a huge amount of our salary cap & none of them played well enough to force a QB to pump the ball or hold it long enough for our Dline to get to the QB.

IMO Calvin Pryor is a main reason for the lack of coverage skills in Jets secondary. He can't cover ANYONE in space and can't tackle in space. He - for one - has got to go. I'm not saying cut him right now, but definitely draft or sign his replacement next season. He was another wasted first round pick by Rex.