varjet Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 It is not Ryan Fitzpatrick. As has been said before, he is what he is. He can go from best player in the Conference to worst in the league, week to week. But he needs coaching support. 1)Understanding that last year the Jets' coaches did have somewhat of an element of surprise, it does not appear that this year the coaches are bringing their A game. The team in games 1 and 3 seemed unprepared and put players in difficult positions. Defensively, they need to scheme better and not expose Revis and others. Offensively, the attack needs to be more balanced. The schedule is very difficult, and the Jets are facing teams that also have excellent personnel and good coaches. The coaches need to step it up. After 3 interceptions, the QB should be pulled. Its ok-its a bad day. They are supposed to have one of the NFL's most experienced and capable back up QBs. Why is Geno on the roster if he can't be used as a change of pace when Fitz is having a meltdown. They need to find a way to run more, to get Powell the ball more, and to keep J Marshall from fumbling. And if your CB1 is getting burned repeatedly, you change something. 2)The secondary to me just appears to be awful. They need to do something differently here. Perhaps bring up Martin and Middleton from the PS and send back down some TEs. They need to find a way to cover people better-this is a passing league. If Fitz is schemed better, and they don't fall behind, the Jets will play better. I think for the upcoming Seahawks game the challenge is on the coaches to deliver a game plan that everyone thinks is a winner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetdawgg Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 No TE, no FB means no running game. No protection from a QB meltdown. This week a TE. They may run a bit more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Any analysis of the Jets weaknesses that does not have Fitz as the number one problem is ridiculous.He is so limited that he makes the offensive coaching look bad.Half of the potential playbook gets thrown out because of him. There is no other "scheme" for Fitz. A decent QB would tear defenses apart with our offense, OC and weapons. Running more is difficult because Fitz does not force 2 deep and forcing the run leads to 3rd and long. And Fitz cant handle that. There is a reason Fitz is 7-37 against winning teams. Bowles is a big problem as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmajet Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 1 hour ago, varjet said: 2)The secondary to me just appears to be awful. They need to do something differently here. Perhaps bring up Martin and Middleton from the PS and send back down some TEs. They need to find a way to cover people better-this is a passing league. They need to mix it up more. Do some more blitzes. Keep their sub-package (swap out Harris for Lee, swap out pryor for CB) as a base defense. Never have Pryor and Harris on the field together unless it is short/goal line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 23 minutes ago, bostonmajet said: They need to mix it up more. Do some more blitzes. Keep their sub-package (swap out Harris for Lee, swap out pryor for CB) as a base defense. Never have Pryor and Harris on the field together unless it is short/goal line. Agree, but I don't think he'll ever swap out Harris for anyone as long as he's healthy. He's too stubborn. Having Harris cover a real receiving TE on obvious passing downs is mindless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustiniak Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 38 minutes ago, johnnysd said: Any analysis of the Jets weaknesses that does not have Fitz as the number one problem is ridiculous.He is so limited that he makes the offensive coaching look bad.Half of the potential playbook gets thrown out because of him. There is no other "scheme" for Fitz. A decent QB would tear defenses apart with our offense, OC and weapons. Running more is difficult because Fitz does not force 2 deep and forcing the run leads to 3rd and long. And Fitz cant handle that. There is a reason Fitz is 7-37 against winning teams. Bowles is a big problem as well this. that's why mccags drafted petty and hack, two big guys with strong arms to hopefully never have to use someone like fitz again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 The defense is the most disappointing part of this team, has been for two years. Worst part? No. Most to blame? No, but the most disappointing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 In no particular order.... 1. Defense is bad. Doesn't pass the eye test thus far, no matter what the stats or scores might say. DB's are near-sh*t level bad. 2. Quarterback. Fitz has taken a huge step backwards. Will it continue? Probably. 3. Marshall (the return man) can;t hold on and Marshall (the WR) can't either. WR's as a group have been underwhelming. 4. Running Game is stupid. No Powell/All Forte will only lead to a broken down Forte and Powell still getting hurt late, because that's what Powell does, he gets hurt late. 5. Bowles and Chan. Poor playcalling, poor gameplanning, and leaving Fitz in after INT #4 is a damn near firable offense no matter how much you dislike the #2. The team, overall, has been a huge disappointment thus far, even counting the Buffalo game. Another sh*t game or two and 2016 could be over before Week 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetster Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Beerfish said: The defense is the most disappointing part of this team, has been for two years. Worst part? No. Most to blame? No, but the most disappointing. I think Bowles is too gun shy to press because he's gotten smoked by 2 perfect passes. Dalton dropped a perfect pea right into Geens arms & Trod dropped a perfect pass right on Goodwins hands. Bowles is a scaredy cat coach. He should have tried to get a TD on 4th down vs the Bengals up 7-0. I guarantee you he was thinking back to the game last year at home vs the Bills when they tried 4th & 2 and failed. My thoughts on Bowles is that he's not a in the moment coach, he's a by the book bore. How he could not see he needed a relief pitcher in KC is beyond me. This team needed a wake up call & Geno stepping off the bench might have forced the offense to refocus. This idea that Fitz is untouchable is ridiculous. Your not benching Aaron Rogers, your benching the 28th best QB in the NFL, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snell41 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Wait wait..."yes Fitz can swing wildly from best to worst QB oF the week" but he's not our biggest problem?? Come on!!!! Nothing you saw against KC outside of Fitz matters one bit when your QB is apt to give the the WORST QB performance of all time. You guys go ahead and tend to the scratches and broken bones.....go ahead and fix those while the gushing arterial wound of 6 picks (3 in the end zone, one returned for a TD) is firing blood in your eyes like a fire hose. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snell41 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Wait wait..."yes Fitz can swing wildly from best to worst QB oF the week" but he's not our biggest problem?? Come on!!!! Nothing you saw against KC outside of Fitz matters one bit when your QB is apt to give the the WORST QB performance of all time. You guys go ahead and tend to the scratches and broken bones.....go ahead and fix those while the gushing arterial wound of 6 picks (3 in the end zone, one returned for a TD) is firing blood in your eyes like a fire hose. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIJetsFan Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 8 minutes ago, Jetster said: I think Bowles is too gun shy to press because he's gotten smoked by 2 perfect passes. Dalton dropped a perfect pea right into Geens arms & Trod dropped a perfect pass right on Goodwins hands. Bowles is a scaredy cat coach. He should have tried to get a TD on 4th down vs the Bengals up 7-0. I guarantee you he was thinking back to the game last year at home vs the Bills when they tried 4th & 2 and failed. My thoughts on Bowles is that he's not a in the moment coach, he's a by the book bore. How he could not see he needed a relief pitcher in KC is beyond me. This team needed a wake up call & Geno stepping off the bench might have forced the offense to refocus. This idea that Fitz is untouchable is ridiculous. Your not benching Aaron Rogers, your benching the 28th best QB in the NFL, lol. Totally agree with all except the TD early vs the Bengals; FG was the right call there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetster Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 12 minutes ago, LIJetsFan said: Totally agree with all except the TD early vs the Bengals; FG was the right call there I just felt that the momentum was all Jets, the place was going crazy & even if you fail their probably starting on offense from their own half yard line. Bad stuff happens a lot in the NFL backed up in the endzone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56mehl56 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 The redzone scoring has been a major issue so far this season. The fact that we had 7+ redzone attempts against Cinn/KC is encouraging. However, when you only convert 2 TD's out of all those attempts it greatly increases the chance of losing. This team was very good in the redzone last season , so its begs the question why is it bad so far this season: 1) Last season's success rate was attributable to the weak schedule. 2) Defensive coordinators have a year of game film on Fitz/Gailey and so far they're new wrinkles weren't introduced on O. 3) Its just a 12 year anomaly that Fitz struggles against winning teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 35 minutes ago, Warfish said: In no particular order.... 1. Defense is bad. Doesn't pass the eye test thus far, no matter what the stats or scores might say. DB's are near-sh*t level bad. 2. Quarterback. Fitz has taken a huge step backwards. Will it continue? Probably. 3. Marshall (the return man) can;t hold on and Marshall (the WR) can't either. WR's as a group have been underwhelming. 4. Running Game is stupid. No Powell/All Forte will only lead to a broken down Forte and Powell still getting hurt late, because that's what Powell does, he gets hurt late. 5. Bowles and Chan. Poor playcalling, poor gameplanning, and leaving Fitz in after INT #4 is a damn near firable offense no matter how much you dislike the #2. The team, overall, has been a huge disappointment thus far, even counting the Buffalo game. Another sh*t game or two and 2016 could be over before Week 5. Bad as it was to not pull him when you say, if not earlier, not pulling him after the 5th pick was 100x worse than not pulling him after the 4th. It's a 3-TD game with 3 minutes left, you have no timeouts, and your QB is completing more passes to the opposition than to his own team. The game is mathematically over, but the season is not. The only newsworthy thing that could occur at this point is Fitzpatrick getting seriously injured. In a way, the luckiest thing that could happen (for Bowles) was Fitz throwing that 6th pick. Put Geno out there and just let him hand the ball off if you just want the game to be over and done. You'd put a linebacker out there to snap the ball and take a knee before you send your starting QB back onto the field in a no-upside situation like that. That was a player's coach move, not a team's coach move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy2020 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 2 hours ago, johnnysd said: Any analysis of the Jets weaknesses that does not have Fitz as the number one problem is ridiculous.He is so limited that he makes the offensive coaching look bad.Half of the potential playbook gets thrown out because of him. There is no other "scheme" for Fitz. A decent QB would tear defenses apart with our offense, OC and weapons. Running more is difficult because Fitz does not force 2 deep and forcing the run leads to 3rd and long. And Fitz cant handle that. There is a reason Fitz is 7-37 against winning teams. Bowles is a big problem as well That's a very valid point. Teams are too willing to let Fitz try to beat them deep because he's not at all accurate. It's a jump ball 90% of the time which favors the defense. FItz is a big problem, but...it's not like everyone didn't know his limitations before they brought him back. They went with Hackenberg in the 2nd as their only other move to address the issue. That is a front office problem. Not having a TE option (which previously Gailey has used in his schemes) is another front office issue. I think that trumps the fitz problem. If you know he's going to be an issue and you don't do something about it...well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Be_a_Jet Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Still think Fitz is better than the realistic options we had in the offseason though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varjet Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 To clarify my OP, I never said that Fitz was a great QB or even not the problem. But assuming he is the best QB the Jets have, the biggest issues preventing the Jets from performing up to or exceeding expectations this year are the coaching and the defensive secondary. With better coaching, Fitz' weaknesses are hopefully minimized. When a QB throws 6 interceptions, there are other guilty parties. With better coaching, the offense will get better field position. A better running game will make it easier for Fitz to complete passes. With better secondary play (which will be helped with better coaching), the Jets will stay in games more. A loss is a loss. The KC loss was an ugly loss, but a loss. The Cincinnati game they could have won. To beat Seattle, the coaches and secondary in particular need to step up. Fitz will be Fitz. If they want him to play his best, he needs to be put in a position to do that. Next year Fitz should either be a $4mm back up or not on the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyLV Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 12 minutes ago, varjet said: To clarify my OP, I never said that Fitz was a great QB or even not the problem. But assuming he is the best QB the Jets have, the biggest issues preventing the Jets from performing up to or exceeding expectations this year are the coaching and the defensive secondary. With better coaching, Fitz' weaknesses are hopefully minimized. When a QB throws 6 interceptions, there are other guilty parties. With better coaching, the offense will get better field position. A better running game will make it easier for Fitz to complete passes. With better secondary play (which will be helped with better coaching), the Jets will stay in games more. A loss is a loss. The KC loss was an ugly loss, but a loss. The Cincinnati game they could have won. To beat Seattle, the coaches and secondary in particular need to step up. Fitz will be Fitz. If they want him to play his best, he needs to be put in a position to do that. Next year Fitz should either be a $4mm back up or not on the team. The assumption he is the best option is very flawed. I do believe that Bowles thinks that, which is troubling because it is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varjet Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 Bowles does think that. Petty is more hurt than they think. One way to turn a team around is to change the QB. My guess is that most of the Jets opponents have already drawn up game plans to play Fitzpatrick. If he continues to play like he has, play Geno and they probably win a few more games Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 54 minutes ago, Be_a_Jet said: Still think Fitz is better than the realistic options we had in the offseason though. No way Nick Foles or Sam Bradford were far better options Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20andOut Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 2 hours ago, Warfish said: In no particular order.... 1. Defense is bad. Doesn't pass the eye test thus far, no matter what the stats or scores might say. DB's are near-sh*t level bad. 2. Quarterback. Fitz has taken a huge step backwards. Will it continue? Probably. 3. Marshall (the return man) can;t hold on and Marshall (the WR) can't either. WR's as a group have been underwhelming. 4. Running Game is stupid. No Powell/All Forte will only lead to a broken down Forte and Powell still getting hurt late, because that's what Powell does, he gets hurt late. 5. Bowles and Chan. Poor playcalling, poor gameplanning, and leaving Fitz in after INT #4 is a damn near firable offense no matter how much you dislike the #2. The team, overall, has been a huge disappointment thus far, even counting the Buffalo game. Another sh*t game or two and 2016 could be over before Week 5. Middle of the second half, after about six turnovers defense had only given up 10 points (plus TD given up by STs) and you say defense is #1 problem??????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FidelioJet Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Two biggest issues.. Quarterback and Quarterback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 2 minutes ago, FidelioJet said: Two biggest issues.. Quarterback and Quarterback QB and head coach I'm going with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRONX DUDE Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 5 hours ago, varjet said: It is not Ryan Fitzpatrick. As has been said before, he is what he is. He can go from best player in the Conference to worst in the league, week to week. But he needs coaching support. 1)Understanding that last year the Jets' coaches did have somewhat of an element of surprise, it does not appear that this year the coaches are bringing their A game. The team in games 1 and 3 seemed unprepared and put players in difficult positions. Defensively, they need to scheme better and not expose Revis and others. Offensively, the attack needs to be more balanced. The schedule is very difficult, and the Jets are facing teams that also have excellent personnel and good coaches. The coaches need to step it up. After 3 interceptions, the QB should be pulled. Its ok-its a bad day. They are supposed to have one of the NFL's most experienced and capable back up QBs. Why is Geno on the roster if he can't be used as a change of pace when Fitz is having a meltdown. They need to find a way to run more, to get Powell the ball more, and to keep J Marshall from fumbling. And if your CB1 is getting burned repeatedly, you change something. 2)The secondary to me just appears to be awful. They need to do something differently here. Perhaps bring up Martin and Middleton from the PS and send back down some TEs. They need to find a way to cover people better-this is a passing league. If Fitz is schemed better, and they don't fall behind, the Jets will play better. I think for the upcoming Seahawks game the challenge is on the coaches to deliver a game plan that everyone thinks is a winner. Just End the Season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 3 hours ago, Warfish said: In no particular order.... 1. Defense is bad. Doesn't pass the eye test thus far, no matter what the stats or scores might say. DB's are near-sh*t level bad. 2. Quarterback. Fitz has taken a huge step backwards. Will it continue? Probably. 3. Marshall (the return man) can;t hold on and Marshall (the WR) can't either. WR's as a group have been underwhelming. 4. Running Game is stupid. No Powell/All Forte will only lead to a broken down Forte and Powell still getting hurt late, because that's what Powell does, he gets hurt late. 5. Bowles and Chan. Poor playcalling, poor gameplanning, and leaving Fitz in after INT #4 is a damn near firable offense no matter how much you dislike the #2. The team, overall, has been a huge disappointment thus far, even counting the Buffalo game. Another sh*t game or two and 2016 could be over before Week 5. Wait, you want to bench the leader of the team because he's having a bad day ? Do you not understand the ramifications of such a move ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 7 minutes ago, Tinstar said: Wait, you want to bench the leader of the team because he's having a bad day ? Do you not understand the ramifications of such a move ? Leader LOL we are in worse shape than anyone thought if a 2nd year player is the leader over Mangold,Harris or Revis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 1 minute ago, joewilly12 said: Leader LOL The captain of the titanic was a leader beloved . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 1 minute ago, Tinstar said: The captain of the titanic was a leader beloved . That ship sank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetdawgg Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 QB is the problem. The FO went out and got some very capable WR's this off season. Concurrently, Fitz held out and never developed any feel for them. The Jets then signed him for too much money and under developed the roster in certain areas like TE. Not all the fault of this FO as Amaro just could not beat out anyone else on the roster. The failure to use Geno on Sunday is huge. If he cannot be used in a debacle like that, then when? Just more roster mismanagement. Petty must really be injured badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 Just now, joewilly12 said: That ship sank Yes, but he was still the leader . He led a bunch of folks to their death, but that doesn't take away the tittle . Custer was a leader . Patton was a Leader . Hitler was a leader . What you have to determine for yourself is who you going to follow . The Jets as a team decided they wanted Fitzpatrick as their QB . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joewilly12 Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, Tinstar said: Yes, but he was still the leader . He led a bunch of folks to their death, but that doesn't take away the tittle . Custer was a leader . Patton was a Leader . Hitler was a leader . What you have to determine for yourself is who you going to follow . The Jets as a team decided they wanted Fitzpatrick as their QB . Players play the game and management and coaches decide which players are members of the team when players start choosing friends and favorites there is a problem this isn't kickball or dodge ball this is the NFL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tinstar Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 3 minutes ago, Jetdawgg said: QB is the problem. The FO went out and got some very capable WR's this off season. Concurrently, Fitz held out and never developed any feel for them. The Jets then signed him for too much money and under developed the roster in certain areas like TE. Not all the fault of this FO as Amaro just could not beat out anyone else on the roster. The failure to use Geno on Sunday is huge. If he cannot be used in a debacle like that, then when? Just more roster mismanagement. Petty must really be injured badly. You cannot bench Ryan Fitzpatrick yet . It's that simple . If he threw Ints on every single series, you can't bench him unless you're willing to admit that a mistake was made and the end of the Fitzpatrick error becomes official . Yes, I spelled error the way I wanted . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
56mehl56 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 22 minutes ago, Tinstar said: You cannot bench Ryan Fitzpatrick yet . It's that simple . If he threw Ints on every single series, you can't bench him unless you're willing to admit that a mistake was made and the end of the Fitzpatrick error becomes official . Yes, I spelled error the way I wanted . That's ridiculous. He should have been benched after the 4th pick and he should be the starter this coming week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetdawgg Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 24 minutes ago, Tinstar said: You cannot bench Ryan Fitzpatrick yet . It's that simple . If he threw Ints on every single series, you can't bench him unless you're willing to admit that a mistake was made and the end of the Fitzpatrick error becomes official . Yes, I spelled error the way I wanted . Mistakes are always made. They have to corrected when possible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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