Outside of QB, Which Position is Most Important?

[DMan77]

I think we all know the most important positions are QB, LT, CB, and Edge Rusher... And punter, of course. (That's a joke)

But in what order would you put those for the NFL as a whole? Would that order be different for the Jets? If a genie showed up and said "Hello, you can have a hall of famer at one of the above positions", what would you choose? 

I'm picking LT, because I think a strong offensive line changes the entire game more than anything else... I really have nothing factual to back that up, but anything that helps the QB seems like the best option to me. Give even a mediocre QB time to throw, or open holes for even an average RB, and the whole dynamic changes. It might not be as flashy as a stud CB or a guy that picks up 20 sacks... But over the course of a whole season I think a big time LT helps the team the most. 

[Adoni Beast]

In order 

- You need the QB

- You protect the QB (LT)

- You rush and abuse the QB (EDGE)

- You defend/neutralize the QB's target (CB)

[Kleckineau]

1:  QB

2:  Back up QB

[Beerfish]

Tiny linebacker

[Sperm Edwards]

Doggystyle

[BurnleyJet]

31 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Tiny linebacker

3) Slow Safety, who takes bad angles.

[joewilly12]

LEGITIMATE PASS RUSHER. YES IM YELLING 

[Larz]

QB

LT

Pass rusher

its all about time to throw.  when buddy ryan was with the jets, he sat in on an offensive meeting, and was blown away by how much time they spent going over protecting the QB.  After that he made his defenses about rushing the QB

[rangerous]

2 hours ago, DMan77 said:

I think we all know the most important positions are QB, LT, CB, and Edge Rusher... And punter, of course. (That's a joke)

But in what order would you put those for the NFL as a whole? Would that order be different for the Jets? If a genie showed up and said "Hello, you can have a hall of famer at one of the above positions", what would you choose? 

I'm picking LT, because I think a strong offensive line changes the entire game more than anything else... I really have nothing factual to back that up, but anything that helps the QB seems like the best option to me. Give even a mediocre QB time to throw, or open holes for even an average RB, and the whole dynamic changes. It might not be as flashy as a stud CB or a guy that picks up 20 sacks... But over the course of a whole season I think a big time LT helps the team the most. 

how about center.  he's the first guy to touch the ball.  yeah i know, centers are maybe the 3rd or 4th ranked player on the oline but the question is most important.

[HessStation]

1 hour ago, BurnleyJet said:

3) Slow Safety, who takes bad angles.

Delicious. I want one in the 1st.

[The Crusher]

Reverse cowgirl. 

[southtown24th]

QB

[ASH1962]

Shrimp Salad

Shrimp Cocktail

Shrimp Gumbo

Shrimp Soup

Shrimp Stew

Shrimp Salad

 

Oh and besides shrimp boat captain and QB, LT is the most important position on a football field.

[section314]

Bartender.

[DMan77]

2 hours ago, rangerous said:

how about center.  he's the first guy to touch the ball.  yeah i know, centers are maybe the 3rd or 4th ranked player on the oline but the question is most important.

Ya you can definitely make an argument there too. These guys are usually looked at as the glue that holds things together. They're normally the ones pointing things out pre-snap... Can't over look them.

I think it all depends on the layout of the NFL... Right now edge rushers and hitting a QB from the outside is all the rage... But what if things shift in the next few years and suddenly what teams want are big NT bull rushers that plow their way through the guards and centers for interior pressure? Then all the sudden center leaps a few positions.

The dynamics do change in the NFL so who knows. 

[Villain The Foe]

Oline. It's a travesty what we've done to that unit. 

[SayNoToDMC]

Owner

[Tinstar]

11 hours ago, Villain The Foe said:

Oline. It's a travesty what we've done to that unit. 

Every regime in their own way have tried if not successfully to revitalize that unit . players have been chosen in just about every round except the 1st since Mangini drafted Ferguson and Mangold .

[Villain The Foe]

40 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

Every regime in their own way have tried if not successfully to revitalize that unit . players have been chosen in just about every round except the 1st since Mangini drafted Ferguson and Mangold .

And they've done a poor job since that time. Since drafting Vlad Ducasse in the 2nd round in 2010 the highest draft pick the Jets used on a OL is Brian Winters in 2013 which was the 3rd round. The majority of picks designated to the Oline since 2006 have mostly been between the 4th and 6th rounds. Thats a 10 year span. Whats worse is that history would tell us that the Jets success at the Oline has been drafting guys who are ready to start day 1 (D'Brick/Mangold) and not guys that could be future players but needs development (Brian Winters is the only drafted player to receive a contract after his rookie deal). 

 

Yeah, players have been chosen in just about every round, but we can say the same thing about the QB position as well. We've drafted a QB in 8 of our last 10 drafts, including two 2nd round picks (Geno & Hackenberg) and a top 5 pick (Sanchez). How do you invest this highly in QB's repeatedly yet completely ignore investing highly in the Oline during the same timespan given that the majority of OL draft picks are 4th round picks or lower? 

The Jets are doing it backwards. The jets will try to develop Christian Hackenberg but that wont matter if he doesnt have an Oline in front of him. There arent too many QB's in the league to where you can completely ignore the Oline and expect to still have success from the QB. Not every QB is Russell Wilson, and even he is now having trouble given injuries to his ankles and constant pressure since he's now also running for his life. 

The Jets need to draft an Olineman that they consider is a "Day 1" starter. That's a 1st round pick, maybe 2nd round since we're picking so high. Think about it, the last time the Jets were football relevant they had one of the best Oline's in the league. Jets fans constantly say that "It was the defense that carried Sanchez to the AFCCG's", I'd beg to say that it was that offensive line complete with two 1st round picks in their primes in Brick/Mangold and other Veteran guys who succeeded in this league at the highest level which would be Woody/Faneca. 

We have James Carpenter as our Veteran, we lucked up and finally developed an Olineman in Winters, but where the hell are our 1st round pick "day one starters" in their prime on the Oline? 

 

The Jets need to stop bullsh*tting and seriously invest in the best Olineman this season. Everyone loves Fournette, but just 15 minutes ago Jets fans were talking about how Bowles didnt even use Powell, a guy who averaged 5.5 yards per carry this past season. We dont need Fournette as badly as we need an Olineman that can compliment both our current RB and any QB that decides to stand behind a Jets OL that can be comparable to a f'ing firing squad at this point. 

 

Sorry for the rant.  

[JohnnyLV]

14 minutes ago, Villain The Foe said:

And they've done a poor job since that time. Since drafting Vlad Ducasse in the 2nd round in 2010 the highest draft pick the Jets used on a OL is Brian Winters in 2013 which was the 3rd round. The majority of picks designated to the Oline since 2006 have mostly been between the 4th and 6th rounds. Thats a 10 year span. Whats worse is that history would tell us that the Jets success at the Oline has been drafting guys who are ready to start day 1 (D'Brick/Mangold) and not guys that could be future players but needs development (Brian Winters is the only drafted player to receive a contract after his rookie deal). 

 

Yeah, players have been chosen in just about every round, but we can say the same thing about the QB position as well. We've drafted a QB in 8 of our last 10 drafts, including two 2nd round picks (Geno & Hackenberg) and a top 5 pick (Sanchez). How do you invest this highly in QB's repeatedly yet completely ignore investing highly in the Oline during the same timespan given that the majority of OL draft picks are 4th round picks or lower? 

The Jets are doing it backwards. The jets will try to develop Christian Hackenberg but that wont matter if he doesnt have an Oline in front of him. There arent too many QB's in the league to where you can completely ignore the Oline and expect to still have success from the QB. Not every QB is Russell Wilson, and even he is now having trouble given injuries to his ankles and constant pressure since he's now also running for his life. 

The Jets need to draft an Olineman that they consider is a "Day 1" starter. That's a 1st round pick, maybe 2nd round since we're picking so high. Think about it, the last time the Jets were football relevant they had one of the best Oline's in the league. Jets fans constantly say that "It was the defense that carried Sanchez to the AFCCG's", I'd beg to say that it was that offensive line complete with two 1st round picks in their primes in Brick/Mangold and other Veteran guys who succeeded in this league at the highest level which would be Woody/Faneca. 

We have James Carpenter as our Veteran, we lucked up and finally developed an Olineman in Winters, but where the hell are our 1st round pick "day one starters" in their prime on the Oline? 

 

The Jets need to stop bullsh*tting and seriously invest in the best Olineman this season. Everyone loves Fournette, but just 15 minutes ago Jets fans were talking about how Bowles didnt even use Powell, a guy who averaged 5.5 yards per carry this past season. We dont need Fournette as badly as we need an Olineman that can compliment both our current RB and any QB that decides to stand behind a Jets OL that can be comparable to a f'ing firing squad at this point. 

 

Sorry for the rant.  

Dont agree on your opinion of Glennon, but the entire Jets philosophy is completely updside down. I am not even sure the list at the beginning is correct. I would say in todays NFL it might go something like this: QB>>>>>LT>>>RT>=Pass Rusher>>WR>=DT, Center>=CB, S, OG

[Jetster]

Vlad Ducasse,lol.  I was in absolute shock when we took him. It's like the Jets just throw away 2nd round picks. 

[joewilly12]

9 minutes ago, Jetster said:

Vlad Ducasse,lol.  I was in absolute shock when we took him. It's like the Jets just throw away 2nd round picks. 

It certainly seems that way,dont forget Stephen Hill. 

[chirorob]

Left tackle or Right DE/ OLB

It's about protecting and hitting the QB.   If you can get some pass rushers on the D Line, you can protect your corners with a good pass rush.   If your left tackle can really handle a DE one on one, you don't have to chip and help, so you can get more people out in patterns.

[Tinstar]

1 hour ago, Villain The Foe said:

And they've done a poor job since that time. Since drafting Vlad Ducasse in the 2nd round in 2010 the highest draft pick the Jets used on a OL is Brian Winters in 2013 which was the 3rd round. The majority of picks designated to the Oline since 2006 have mostly been between the 4th and 6th rounds. Thats a 10 year span. Whats worse is that history would tell us that the Jets success at the Oline has been drafting guys who are ready to start day 1 (D'Brick/Mangold) and not guys that could be future players but needs development (Brian Winters is the only drafted player to receive a contract after his rookie deal). 

 

Yeah, players have been chosen in just about every round, but we can say the same thing about the QB position as well. We've drafted a QB in 8 of our last 10 drafts, including two 2nd round picks (Geno & Hackenberg) and a top 5 pick (Sanchez). How do you invest this highly in QB's repeatedly yet completely ignore investing highly in the Oline during the same timespan given that the majority of OL draft picks are 4th round picks or lower? 

The Jets are doing it backwards. The jets will try to develop Christian Hackenberg but that wont matter if he doesnt have an Oline in front of him. There arent too many QB's in the league to where you can completely ignore the Oline and expect to still have success from the QB. Not every QB is Russell Wilson, and even he is now having trouble given injuries to his ankles and constant pressure since he's now also running for his life. 

The Jets need to draft an Olineman that they consider is a "Day 1" starter. That's a 1st round pick, maybe 2nd round since we're picking so high. Think about it, the last time the Jets were football relevant they had one of the best Oline's in the league. Jets fans constantly say that "It was the defense that carried Sanchez to the AFCCG's", I'd beg to say that it was that offensive line complete with two 1st round picks in their primes in Brick/Mangold and other Veteran guys who succeeded in this league at the highest level which would be Woody/Faneca. 

We have James Carpenter as our Veteran, we lucked up and finally developed an Olineman in Winters, but where the hell are our 1st round pick "day one starters" in their prime on the Oline? 

 

The Jets need to stop bullsh*tting and seriously invest in the best Olineman this season. Everyone loves Fournette, but just 15 minutes ago Jets fans were talking about how Bowles didnt even use Powell, a guy who averaged 5.5 yards per carry this past season. We dont need Fournette as badly as we need an Olineman that can compliment both our current RB and any QB that decides to stand behind a Jets OL that can be comparable to a f'ing firing squad at this point. 

 

Sorry for the rant.  

You're preaching to the choir beloved . My preference in the 1st round will always be the Best QB , LT Edge Rusher or NT that's 1st round rated on my board  .  I could care less if the top rated Safety or WR or whoever else is higher rated than the player at either of those positions . Those are the positions I go after in the 1st round, as long as they have 1st round value .

That said, Ryan Ramczyk is my choice for the 1st round provided he can start the preseason on the field and not recovering from hip surgery and Trubisky is gone .My  2nd round pick is going to be the best Edge rusher I can add and rign now, that player looks to be the kid from K-State Jordan Willis .

I can see the Jets drafting Deshaun Watson thou .

[JetPotato]

Once you acquire a legit, star QB, you no longer need an All-Pro caliber anything on the offensive line. What elite o-linemen has Brady had? Rodgers? There are several advantages an elite QB lends you that allows you to dominate with only an average o-line. Quick decision/release requires less time in pass protection, and it also means you can throw 50 times a game, and use it to set up the run, rather than the old style of vice versa. And to maybe an even bigger extent, that release and the "Jordan Rules" of the current NFL mean your blockers have a lot more leeway to get away with illegal blocks/holds etc. Watch any Pats game.

Frankly, the 2nd most important position in an organization behind QB is the head coach. After that, give me a pass rusher and an elite WR. What single players outside of QB affect the outcome of the most games? Guys like Watt and Miller and Julio Jones and Antonio Brown. End of story.

[Tinstar]

8 minutes ago, JetPotato said:

Once you acquire a legit, star QB, you no longer need an All-Pro caliber anything on the offensive line. What elite o-linemen has Brady had? Rodgers? There are several advantages an elite QB lends you that allows you to dominate with only an average o-line. Quick decision/release requires less time in pass protection, and it also means you can throw 50 times a game, and use it to set up the run, rather than the old style of vice versa. And to maybe an even bigger extent, that release and the "Jordan Rules" of the current NFL mean your blockers have a lot more leeway to get away with illegal blocks/holds etc. Watch any Pats game.

Frankly, the 2nd most important position in an organization behind QB is the head coach. After that, give me a pass rusher and an elite WR. What single players outside of QB affect the outcome of the most games? Guys like Watt and Miller and Julio Jones and Antonio Brown. End of story.

Go tell that to Andrew Luck

[Villain The Foe]

32 minutes ago, JetPotato said:

Once you acquire a legit, star QB, you no longer need an All-Pro caliber anything on the offensive line. What elite o-linemen has Brady had? Rodgers? There are several advantages an elite QB lends you that allows you to dominate with only an average o-line. Quick decision/release requires less time in pass protection, and it also means you can throw 50 times a game, and use it to set up the run, rather than the old style of vice versa. And to maybe an even bigger extent, that release and the "Jordan Rules" of the current NFL mean your blockers have a lot more leeway to get away with illegal blocks/holds etc. Watch any Pats game.

Frankly, the 2nd most important position in an organization behind QB is the head coach. After that, give me a pass rusher and an elite WR. What single players outside of QB affect the outcome of the most games? Guys like Watt and Miller and Julio Jones and Antonio Brown. End of story.

This is the problem here imo. You start off by talking about a "Legit, star QB" then make a comparative point by using two QB's that will go down as top 5 in the history of the sport. 

C'mon. These guys arent even just "elite", they're f'ing legendary in the sport. 

 

If you want to really make a comparison, look at all the problems Andrew Luck is having out there in Indy. People love to talk Andrew Luck up as a franchise/future of the NFL/Elite QB, but look at the year he just had behind an Oline filled with rookies (finally) because they've waited so long to even address the line. Now, im not talking about stats. Stats dont tell the story of the hardship Luck has had because of that line. He's in a division that he's dominated since leaving Stanford simply because it was the easiest division in football, now that they have some competition these guys are getting exposed for being "just Andrew Luck". Luck couldnt even finished the 2015 season because he was too busy on his back looking up at the stars, in 2016 that didnt change, he was sacked 41 times...2nd most in the league only behind Tyrod Taylor (sacked 42 times) who isnt a pocket passer. 

Andrew Luck is the poster child of what it is to be a legit star QB yet cant meet your full potential because management left you and your "magic arm" out to dry because of refusing to provide an offensive line. 

Another guy who was sacked 41 times (tied with Luck)? Russell Wilson...and look at the injuries he had to deal with this season. Dude practically played on 1 friggin leg when we played them this year. 

 

Using 2 of the top 5 greatest ever (arguably) is kinda stretching it, especially when I have to also believe that those guys are nothing more than just "legit star QB's" and nothing more. 

[Villain The Foe]

19 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

Go tell that to Andrew Luck

I was literally writing about Luck when you wrote this. lol. 

[JetPotato]

This is the problem here imo. You start off by talking about a "Legit, star QB" then make a comparative point by using two QB's that will go down as top 5 in the history of the sport. 
C'mon. These guys arent even just "elite", they're f'ing legendary in the sport. 
 
If you want to really make a comparison, look at all the problems Andrew Luck is having out there in Indy. People love to talk Andrew Luck up as a franchise/future of the NFL/Elite QB, but look at the year he just had behind an Oline filled with rookies (finally) because they've waited so long to even address the line. Now, im not talking about stats. Stats dont tell the story of the hardship Luck has had because of that line. He's in a division that he's dominated since leaving Stanford simply because it was the easiest division in football, now that they have some competition these guys are getting exposed for being "just Andrew Luck". Luck couldnt even finished the 2015 season because he was too busy on his back looking up at the stars, in 2016 that didnt change, he was sacked 41 times...2nd most in the league only behind Tyrod Taylor (sacked 42 times) who isnt a pocket passer. 
Andrew Luck is the poster child of what it is to be a legit star QB yet cant meet your full potential because management left you and your "magic arm" out to dry because of refusing to provide an offensive line. 
Another guy who was sacked 41 times (tied with Luck)? Russell Wilson...and look at the injuries he had to deal with this season. Dude practically played on 1 friggin leg when we played them this year. 
 
Using 2 of the top 5 greatest ever (arguably) is kinda stretching it, especially when I have to also believe that those guys are nothing more than just "legit star QB's" and nothing more. 

Actually, you seem to be the one that missed the point. I clearly stated you can survive with an average o-line. I didn't say with a bad one, like Luck has and has had. Huge difference. The point of this thread is the 3 MOST important positions on the field, and no single offensive lineman is one of those if you have the QB. Again, what all pro o-linemen have the elite QBs had? When was the last time an offensive lineman was in contention for MVP or Super Bowl MVP?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using JetNation.com mobile app

[Villain The Foe]

7 minutes ago, JetPotato said:

 

Actually, you seem to be the one that missed the point. I clearly stated you can survive with an average o-line. I didn't say with a bad one, like Luck has and has had. Huge difference. The point of this thread is the 3 MOST important positions on the field, and no single offensive lineman is one of those if you have the QB. Again, what all pro o-linemen have the elite QBs had? When was the last time an offensive lineman was in contention for MVP or Super Bowl MVP?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using JetNation.com mobile app
 

 

True, but you also said a legit star QB then used two of the all-time greats as an example. 

 

I guess we both stretched that. 

[CrazyCarl40]

Weird. No responses have said running back and people are still advocating for one in the first round. Laughable. 

[slats]

18 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Weird. No responses have said running back and people are still advocating for one in the first round. Laughable. 

Biggest need doesn't necessarily have to equal the best value in the draft. It's nice if they match up, but if they don't, I prefer the best value - especially at #6. Not saying that Fournette is the guy, either, just that I won't throw a fit if they decide he is. 

[BRONX DUDE]

Coach

[TuscanyTile2]

Nobody talks about the value of having a left-handed QB.  Obviously the main thing that matters is having a good QB.  But if he's left-handed then you're really set because it makes the blind-side tackle the RT instead of the LT.  There is always a run on premium LT talent.  It's easier to get a premium RT because there's less competition.  Having a quality left handed QB allows you to solve the 2nd most important position more easily.

[adb280z]

11 minutes ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Nobody talks about the value of having a left-handed QB.  Obviously the main thing that matters is having a good QB.  But if he's left-handed then you're really set because it makes the blind-side tackle the RT instead of the LT.  There is always a run on premium LT talent.  It's easier to get a premium RT because there's less competition.  Having a quality left handed QB allows you to solve the 2nd most important position more easily.

The top tackles play LT for a reason, if you had a top LT and drafted a left-handed QB you'd just switch the LT to RT.