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The Jets IMO have the beginings of a solid OL


Tinstar

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Yes, it can get better with better talent, but as it sits today, with Wesley Johnson as a RFA flanked by Carpenter and Winters, the middle is strong in run blocking and improving against the pass .  With a full year in the strength and conditioning program, Shell at the RT should continue to improve unless the Jets screw around with trying him at LT again . That leaves a gaping hole at LT and while resigning Ijalana would add insurance, a long term answer should be4 something this team is in the market for .

I never like the acquisition of Brick Ferguson because he couldn't block his way out of a paper bag on running play at the POA, but the one thing he did was provide stability along with Mangold  . Time to go back to the future and fix this .

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33 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

Yes, it can get better with better talent, but as it sits today, with Wesley Johnson as a RFA flanked by Carpenter and Winters, the middle is strong in run blocking and improving against the pass .  With a full year in the strength and conditioning program, Shell at the RT should continue to improve unless the Jets screw around with trying him at LT again . That leaves a gaping hole at LT and while resigning Ijalana would add insurance, a long term answer should be4 something this team is in the market for .

I never like the acquisition of Brick Ferguson because he couldn't block his way out of a paper bag on running play at the POA, but the one thing he did was provide stability along with Mangold  . Time to go back to the future and fix this .

Are you seriously questioning the Jets drafting a stalwart LT a decade ago who played not only well but for a very long time? Really? 

Also, the only above average offensive lineman the Jets have right now is Carpenter. The rest are jags and average players with very little youth and developing players drafted in the last few years. 

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3 minutes ago, CrazyCarl40 said:

Are you seriously questioning the Jets drafting a stalwart LT a decade ago who played not only well but for a very long time? Really? 

Also, the only above average offensive lineman the Jets have right now is Carpenter. The rest are jags and average players with very little youth and developing players drafted in the last few years. 

I'm not sold on this Oline, either. We might have a middle of the pack line. 

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11 hours ago, Tinstar said:

Yes, it can get better with better talent, but as it sits today, with Wesley Johnson as a RFA flanked by Carpenter and Winters, the middle is strong in run blocking and improving against the pass .  With a full year in the strength and conditioning program, Shell at the RT should continue to improve unless the Jets screw around with trying him at LT again . That leaves a gaping hole at LT and while resigning Ijalana would add insurance, a long term answer should be4 something this team is in the market for .

I never like the acquisition of Brick Ferguson because he couldn't block his way out of a paper bag on running play at the POA, but the one thing he did was provide stability along with Mangold  . Time to go back to the future and fix this .

i'm of the same opinion.  the key for these guys is to play together.  it used to take 3 seasons before an oline really started to get in synch. this groups except for carpenter and winters have been in and out and moving around.  once they get settled they will be much better.

as for brick, theirs no basis to diss him.  he was a great player for the jets. kind of left them in a lurch by retiring but at the same time he got out and shoud have a really great life going forward.

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14 hours ago, SenorGato said:

Anthony Garcia in the third seems like a good enough LT prospect 

 

He weighs in under 300lbs which is unheard of. I like his athleticism but think he'll get pushed around. I'm in favour of signing Andrew Whitworth to a 1yr deal and praying for a better draft class next year.

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4 hours ago, rangerous said:

i'm of the same opinion.  the key for these guys is to play together.  it used to take 3 seasons before an oline really started to get in synch. this groups except for carpenter and winters have been in and out and moving around.  once they get settled they will be much better.

as for brick, theirs no basis to diss him.  he was a great player for the jets. kind of left them in a lurch by retiring but at the same time he got out and shoud have a really great life going forward.

I wasn't dissing Brick, just stating how I felt at the time of that draft . Back then, we had no QB but we had a system, and I wanted to drafty Cutler, have him watch Chad for a year a take over . Instead we outsmarted our selves and drafted Clemens .  You need to have a plan, and the plan needs everyone on the same page and must be executed .             

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1 hour ago, jeremy2020 said:

I see it's gone from "being great" by re-signing winters to the "beginnings of a solid OL"

i like the fact they signed winters but i' still concerned about his attitude.  not that he doesn't practice or execute right but he had that head butting incident that cost him a game with a concussion.  not real smart.  as for the oline, it was especially shaky this past season mainly because the two tackles and the center were out for much of the season and their replacements didn't measure.  that is until shell started coming on. they re-sign johnson and find a Lt and it will be sound barring injury.

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19 hours ago, Tinstar said:

Yes, it can get better with better talent, but as it sits today, with Wesley Johnson as a RFA flanked by Carpenter and Winters, the middle is strong in run blocking and improving against the pass .  With a full year in the strength and conditioning program, Shell at the RT should continue to improve unless the Jets screw around with trying him at LT again . That leaves a gaping hole at LT and while resigning Ijalana would add insurance, a long term answer should be4 something this team is in the market for .

I never like the acquisition of Brick Ferguson because he couldn't block his way out of a paper bag on running play at the POA, but the one thing he did was provide stability along with Mangold  . Time to go back to the future and fix this .

Solid up the middle, but big questions at the tackle spots.  If Shell is a starter, then have a pretty good OL, except for LT, of course.

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7 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

Solid up the middle, but big questions at the tackle spots.  If Shell is a starter, then have a pretty good OL, except for LT, of course.

For what we have to work with, solid is good enough for today . Like someone said , you have to start somewhere, and this is a start .   The 2 most important things for the Jets to fix is the QB position and the OL. 

We have to remember 1 very important thing. This team won 10 games with Ryan Fitzpatrick at QB and behind an OL with Winters who was not as good as he is today, Giacomini who was falling apart, a part time mangold and Ferguson who was a shell of his 1st round self . 

The key to all that was Fitzpatrick, a QB who never won a darn thing .

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5 hours ago, Lray said:

He weighs in under 300lbs which is unheard of. I like his athleticism but think he'll get pushed around. I'm in favour of signing Andrew Whitworth to a 1yr deal and praying for a better draft class next year.

Can't see Whitworth signing here.  35+ year old, 11-year veteran who has never won a playoff game.  If he leaves Cincy, I expect him to go to a team with a chance to win -- not a rebuilding Jets team as long as he has other options, and he is likely to have options.  On top of that, there are reports today that the Bengals are trying to re-sign him.  Unfortunately, it is a bad year to need a LT -- either in draft or FA.

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1 minute ago, bigalbarracuda said:

Haven't seen too much talk about Garett Bolles (Utah, proj Rd2), Roderick Johnson (FSU, proj Rd2-3),  or Adam Bisnowaty (Pitt, proj. Rd3).

I feel like these are the types of guys that the Steelers and Packers draft and turn into solid starters.

Agreed, if we need too, but what exactly is wrong with doubling down if you can .

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13 minutes ago, bigalbarracuda said:

Haven't seen too much talk about Garett Bolles (Utah, proj Rd2), Roderick Johnson (FSU, proj Rd2-3),  or Adam Bisnowaty (Pitt, proj. Rd3).

I feel like these are the types of guys that the Steelers and Packers draft and turn into solid starters.

Most mocks have him in top 25 or so picks. One knock, think he's like 25.

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My initial impression of this FA class is that there are some CBs (we know who) and a S or two (like Tony Jefferson). I don't necessarily see a FS, but John Johnson from BC could be good.

There are some developmental LTs and two good Cs-LSU and ND, for starters.

I think the Jets should fish in Rounds 2-4 for at least a C.  The T could be a reach.  In FA, definitely a CB or 2, and maybe let Beachum and Ijalana play LT until someone else can step up.

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Qvale, Ijalana (if signed) and Shell could play RT.

At this point it could be Qvale and Shell, with Ijalana and X playing left.

As the Giants found with Ereck Flowers and the Jaguars with Luke Jueckle, it is hard enough to pick a LT in the FIRST ROUND and have them work out.   For the Jets to be decent this year, they are going to have to rent a LT.   They need that to even try and develop a QB.  That is why Clady held out for more money-he thought he had the Jets over a barrel.

The T from Wisconsin would solve alot of problems.  The issue with him is really that 6 is too high.  It would be nice to trade down and get more picks.  If Watson is there at 6 (or even Trubitzky), someone will want to trade up.

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No front office worth their jobs can go into a season with Shell penciled in at anything.  He played very limited but defenses will have all offseason to find his weaknesses.  He was beyond terrible in PS.

I remember a few years ago when Wayne Hunter played well during a playoff run after Woody's late season injury.  Jets "penciled" Hunter in as a starter with no one else behind him and it ruined the season and could have ruined any chance Sanchez had.

Now if we want to draft a QB next season, then yes, pencil in Shell at RT, Johnson at C, and roll with it with Qvale as our swing G/T and Dozier backing up Johnson.

This quite possibly be the worst OL in the league.

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Based on how the Jets finished the season last yr, and what's on the roster presently, who would some of you say will start the OTA sessions along the OL .  Should the Jets managed to resign Ijalana who may price himself out of New York, he's going to be the starting LT until something better comes along . Personally, Mangold should retire and Wesley Johnson should be resigned and assigned the starting Center position until a better option surfaces , Carpenter and Winters are going to be starting at the OGs and Shell should be penciled into the RT position .

This is where it should start and the open competition should determined if it stays that way  The competition should and will be determined by who is added via Free agency and the Draft . It's a new system, and a new blocking scheme and hopefully, the best 5 will start . The reason I started this post was because all these kids have now had starting experience which means they all know what they need to work on and they all didn't stink up the joint .

Of the Players listed above, 2 of them are or will be 28 going finishing next season . Like I said, the Jets have the beginning of a solid OL.

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2 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

Based on how the Jets finished the season last yr, and what's on the roster presently, who would some of you say will start the OTA sessions along the OL .  Should the Jets managed to resign Ijalana who may price himself out of New York, he's going to be the starting LT until something better comes along . Personally, Mangold should retire and Wesley Johnson should be resigned and assigned the starting Center position until a better option surfaces , Carpenter and Winters are going to be starting at the OGs and Shell should be penciled into the RT position .

This is where it should start and the open competition should determined if it stays that way  The competition should and will be determined by who is added via Free agency and the Draft . It's a new system, and a new blocking scheme and hopefully, the best 5 will start . The reason I started this post was because all these kids have now had starting experience which means they all know what they need to work on and they all didn't stink up the joint .

Of the Players listed above, 2 of them are or will be 28 going finishing next season . Like I said, the Jets have the beginning of a solid OL.

If the offensive line in 2017 starts off how the offensive line of 2016 ended then Macc should be fired on the spot. Ijalana is a solid backup and could start at RT. He's not good enough to protect the blindside of any QB for an entire season. Carpenter is great. Johnson is a jag and he's easily upgradeable in the draft. I'd like to see Mangold retire a Jet because even at 75% of what he once was, he's still better than Johnson. Winters is average and coming off of a surgery, but they just gave him a bunch of money so he's sticking around. Shell looked okay in limited action because he was consistently getting help from tight ends and running backs. 

Maybe a new blocking scheme will help but both tackles are unsettled right now and the future of the center position needs to be addressed. Put Hack or Petty behind that line and they'll get killed. 

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1 hour ago, Big Blocker said:

 

I tend to agree.  It's hard to be optimistic about your OL when you have no idea who the LT is.

Your big worry is about the LT today when you don't know who your QB is ?  The title of this thread is the Jets have the beginnings of  a solid OL, not the Jets have a solid OL .   The implication then should be that the OL is not yet solid, but when all you allow yourself to see is doom and Gloom, that's all you will ever see .  4 of the potential starters will be 28 or under at the end of the 2017 season  and all have starting experience  at the highest level .  Every single player projected to start in this thread  has improved over the length of the 2016 season .

I prefer to see a solid projection, not gloom and doom .

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Can't see Whitworth signing here.  35+ year old, 11-year veteran who has never won a playoff game.  If he leaves Cincy, I expect him to go to a team with a chance to win -- not a rebuilding Jets team as long as he has other options, and he is likely to have options.  On top of that, there are reports today that the Bengals are trying to re-sign him.  Unfortunately, it is a bad year to need a LT -- either in draft or FA.

Unfortunately I agree


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21 hours ago, Pcola said:

No front office worth their jobs can go into a season with Shell penciled in at anything.  He played very limited but defenses will have all offseason to find his weaknesses.  He was beyond terrible in PS.

I remember a few years ago when Wayne Hunter played well during a playoff run after Woody's late season injury.  Jets "penciled" Hunter in as a starter with no one else behind him and it ruined the season and could have ruined any chance Sanchez had.

Now if we want to draft a QB next season, then yes, pencil in Shell at RT, Johnson at C, and roll with it with Qvale as our swing G/T and Dozier backing up Johnson.

This quite possibly be the worst OL in the league.

I don't really disagree with this, but I would prefer to have the worst OL in the league than to do what we did with the secondary.  I agree, that optimism about Wesley Johnson and Shell is overstated.  I think Winters is meh and Carpenter has been good, but has been dinged up quite a bit.  I still would rather save money than throw cash at guys that are known quality starters.  Get a bunch of cheap guys in and let them fight it out.  Mangold is great, but they pay him way too much.  They could have rolled with guys like Will Montgomery and Godwin who both were almost free and also played center in the NFL for around a decade. 

I agree there was a problem with some of the offensive lines the Jets trotted out there.  In 2007, they did not properly prepare for dumping Kendall late and tried damn near everything.  I actually like Montgomery there at that point, but Adrien Clarke and Jacob Bender were disasters.  I think the Wayne Hunter year they were counting on Ducasse stepping up.  A mid-level vet that played well in limited time as a floor and a 2nd year 2nd round pick out of a small school seems like the correct way to handle a position,  Of course, in practice it was a disaster. 

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14 minutes ago, Lray said:


Unfortunately I agree


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Exactly what are you looking for, a player who goes to the pro bowl in his 1st year or one who could be a pro bowler for 10 years . IMO, Ramczyk  has the potential to be a better player than Brick was . He may not play as often or as long, but he can run block and Pass block which would allow the Jets to use both sides of the OL on running plays .  Brick was a presence here for 10 years, but the Jets were a predominately right side running team during that time unless it was a sweep when he could use his athletic ability . 

Has it ever crossed the mind of anyone here why the Jets have been a terrible short yardage team for as long as they can remember ?

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Exactly what are you looking for, a player who goes to the pro bowl in his 1st year or one who could be a pro bowler for 10 years . IMO, Ramczyk  has the potential to be a better player than Brick was . He may not play as often or as long, but he can run block and Pass block which would allow the Jets to use both sides of the OL on running plays .  Brick was a presence here for 10 years, but the Jets were a predominately right side running team during that time unless it was a sweep when he could use his athletic ability . 
Has it ever crossed the mind of anyone here why the Jets have been a terrible short yardage team for as long as they can remember ?

Ideally we could get a player who's an instant starter with longevity but I don't see it in this draft class. Ramczyk hasn't got the athleticism to be a perennial pro bowler. Bolles is the best T imo but won't be available in the 2nd. We were a pretty good short yardage team with Shonn Greene and Alan Faneca. I'm not sure what LT has to do with short yardage situations though.


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Quick question regarding the past two regimes: Is anything ever going to actually be good? Because the last 4-5 years have been filled with a lot of people offering a lot of long winded explanations on how said player or unit on the team is going to be awesome. Just wondering if the resident experts could give some sort of expectation as to when that might happen.

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Wesley johnson is a frigging jag, I have no clue how people are so happy with this guy.  His two snap gaffs resulted in an embarrassing everyone except the center offsides and in Petty betting destroyed by wake an suh,

Our guards are decent, Shell made huge improvements in his game, C and LT are huge ?????

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23 minutes ago, RutgersJetFan said:

Quick question regarding the past two regimes: Is anything ever going to actually be good? Because the last 4-5 years have been filled with a lot of people offering a lot of long winded explanations on how said player or unit on the team is going to be awesome. Just wondering if the resident experts could give some sort of expectation as to when that might happen.

Brian Winters was apparently good enough to earn 4/$30M with $15M guaranteed!

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