Brandon Scherff

[TuscanyTile2]

Anyone follow that guy's career so far?  Just wondering if people think it wasn't a bad pick (over Williams) for the Redskins in hindsight.

[jetscrazey]

Good player, especially in the run game.  But I wouldn't say he's lived up to the expectations of a top 5 pick yet.

[dbatesman]

Taking Scherff over Williams was lunacy, and I don't know of any credible person who disagrees. The real question is whether we should have taken Beasley over Williams.

[KRL]

WAS taking Scherff at #5 meant they thought he was going to be their LT for the next 10+ years.  But

two years in he's at G, he may be playing well there but you don't spend a top 10 pick on a guard

[KRL]

24 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Taking Scherff over Williams was lunacy, and I don't know of any credible person who disagrees. The real question is whether we should have taken Beasley over Williams.

Beasley definitely had the better "sack stat" year but after watching him in the playoffs and SB he seems to be

a "two trick pony".  ATL did two things with him to get him his sacks:

- Putting him out on the extreme outside of the OT's shoulder and just letting him speed rush to the QB

- Stunting him from that outside position and looping him through the middle of the OLine allowing him to get "lost"

He wasn't very good against the run and he didn't play every down

 

[dbatesman]

1 hour ago, KRL said:

Beasley definitely had the better "sack stat" year but after watching him in the playoffs and SB he seems to be

a "two trick pony".  ATL did two things with him to get him his sacks:

- Putting him out on the extreme outside of the OT's shoulder and just letting him speed rush to the QB

- Stunting him from that outside position and looping him through the middle of the OLine allowing him to get "lost"

He wasn't very good against the run and he didn't play every down

 

Agreed, the guy who led the league in sacks is way overrated

[UnitedWhofans]

1 hour ago, KRL said:

Beasley definitely had the better "sack stat" year but after watching him in the playoffs and SB he seems to be

a "two trick pony".  ATL did two things with him to get him his sacks:

- Putting him out on the extreme outside of the OT's shoulder and just letting him speed rush to the QB

- Stunting him from that outside position and looping him through the middle of the OLine allowing him to get "lost"

He wasn't very good against the run and he didn't play every down

 

That seems to be the way with pure pass rushers. You can run directly at them and scheme against them. Deion Jones is a MUCH better player than Vic Beasley. It isn't even close. 

Beasley does seem to be a two trick pony. Plus of course, he could have picked off Brady in the endzone.

Beyond that, I prefer players that can do multiple things well. Williams can tackle and pass rush. 

[JustInFudge]

2 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Taking Scherff over Williams was lunacy, and I don't know of any credible person who disagrees. The real question is whether we should have taken Beasley over Williams.

 

25 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Agreed, the guy who led the league in sacks is way overrated

Taking Schreff was moronic. The Beasley situation is tough.  He was really a one trick pony coming out of school and Leo was considered the consensus best player in the draft.    Vic is basically useless vs. the run..see Super Bowl, they were running right at him every time he was in the game.  He only plays 60% of snaps as opposed to Leo who plays 90%.  Which you could argue actually makes his season that much more impressive considering the sacks #'s he put up.   He forced 6 FF which is beastly.  Leo forced 2.  The other factor is that 13 of Vic's sacks were when they were protecting a lead.  The Jets and Leo didnt have that luxury.  The Falcons faced the most pass attempts in the entire league, 655.  The Jets were 25 at 545.  So Vic had a lot more opportunity than Leo.

All in all, give me Leo all day, every day.  He's a 3 down player who can impact every aspect of the game.  Vic is a basically a situational pass rusher, albeit a very good one but he's a liability in every other aspect.

 

[T0mShane]

5 minutes ago, JiF said:

 

Taking Schreff was moronic. The Beasley situation is tough.  He was really a one trick pony coming out of school and Leo was considered the consensus best player in the draft.    Vic is basically useless vs. the run..see Super Bowl, they were running right at him every time he was in the game.  He only plays 60% of snaps as opposed to Leo who plays 90%.  Which you could argue actually makes his season that much more impressive considering the sacks #'s he put up.   He forced 6 FF which is beastly.  Leo forced 2.  The other factor is that 13 of Vic's sacks were when they were protecting a lead.  The Jets and Leo didnt have that luxury.  The Falcons faced the most pass attempts in the entire league, 655.  The Jets were 25 at 545.  So Vic had a lot more opportunity than Leo.

All in all, give me Leo all day, every day.  He's a 3 down player who can impact every aspect of the game.  Vic is a basically a situational pass rusher, albeit a very good one but he's a liability in every other aspect.

 

If the Jets see passing on Beasley as a mistake, I wonder if that makes them think about Tim Williams at 6

[JustInFudge]

5 minutes ago, T0mShane said:

If the Jets see passing on Beasley as a mistake, I wonder if that makes them think about Tim Williams at 6

Basically the same player.  Fast twitch athlete who rockets out of their stance.  Just dont ask him to do anything else. 

The drugs and guns makes him a scary selection at #6 overall though. 

I do like that he played all 4 years and decided to stay for his Senior year.  That said, I'm sure he didnt plan to regress.  I think he only started like 2 games and he had .5 less sacks...not like that a big deal but still.  I think he was trying to solidify his draft status and he might have hurt it. 

[T0mShane]

40 minutes ago, JiF said:

Basically the same player.  Fast twitch athlete who rockets out of their stance.  Just dont ask him to do anything else. 

The drugs and guns makes him a scary selection at #6 overall though. 

I do like that he played all 4 years and decided to stay for his Senior year.  That said, I'm sure he didnt plan to regress.  I think he only started like 2 games and he had .5 less sacks...not like that a big deal but still.  I think he was trying to solidify his draft status and he might have hurt it. 

I don't think Williams will test like Beasley, but if we're not gonna draft someone who will score TDs, then we should get someone to at least annoy Tom Brady. I don't care about the drugs and guns. All good pass rushers are drug addicts. 

[PepPep]

2 hours ago, dbatesman said:

Agreed, the guy who led the league in sacks is way overrated

YES! LOL. I mean, to an extent. Yes, Beasley had a fantastic year and if he keeps it up you really can't argue that he is overrated, and you COULD argue that he would have been the better pick. But last year he played 16 games and had 4 sacks. This is a sack specialist. 4 sacks in 16 games. So let's not get carried away with Beasley, even if we are just looking at his impact as a pass rusher.  

But the point is, I would rather have a guy that was a consistently dominant force, could play vs the run and pressure the QB, anchoring the D-line but not lead the league in sacks or tackles or any category (Leo) than a guy who leads the league in sacks, is taken out b/c he is a liability vs the run and does not put up big sack numbers year in year out.   

[dbatesman]

1 hour ago, JiF said:

 

Taking Schreff was moronic. The Beasley situation is tough.  He was really a one trick pony coming out of school and Leo was considered the consensus best player in the draft.    Vic is basically useless vs. the run..see Super Bowl, they were running right at him every time he was in the game.  He only plays 60% of snaps as opposed to Leo who plays 90%.  Which you could argue actually makes his season that much more impressive considering the sacks #'s he put up.   He forced 6 FF which is beastly.  Leo forced 2.  The other factor is that 13 of Vic's sacks were when they were protecting a lead.  The Jets and Leo didnt have that luxury.  The Falcons faced the most pass attempts in the entire league, 655.  The Jets were 25 at 545.  So Vic had a lot more opportunity than Leo.

All in all, give me Leo all day, every day.  He's a 3 down player who can impact every aspect of the game.  Vic is a basically a situational pass rusher, albeit a very good one but he's a liability in every other aspect.

 

Point well taken on the pass attempts. There's something to be said for both sides, but Williams gives me a boner so I'm certainly not complaining.

[detectivekimble]

2 hours ago, JiF said:

Basically the same player.  Fast twitch athlete who rockets out of their stance.  Just dont ask him to do anything else. 

The drugs and guns makes him a scary selection at #6 overall though. 

I do like that he played all 4 years and decided to stay for his Senior year.  That said, I'm sure he didnt plan to regress.  I think he only started like 2 games and he had .5 less sacks...not like that a big deal but still.  I think he was trying to solidify his draft status and he might have hurt it. 

I don't think Williams is nearly as explosive as Beasley.

[detectivekimble]

2 hours ago, JiF said:

 

Taking Schreff was moronic. The Beasley situation is tough.  He was really a one trick pony coming out of school and Leo was considered the consensus best player in the draft.    Vic is basically useless vs. the run..see Super Bowl, they were running right at him every time he was in the game.  He only plays 60% of snaps as opposed to Leo who plays 90%.  Which you could argue actually makes his season that much more impressive considering the sacks #'s he put up.   He forced 6 FF which is beastly.  Leo forced 2.  The other factor is that 13 of Vic's sacks were when they were protecting a lead.  The Jets and Leo didnt have that luxury.  The Falcons faced the most pass attempts in the entire league, 655.  The Jets were 25 at 545.  So Vic had a lot more opportunity than Leo.

All in all, give me Leo all day, every day.  He's a 3 down player who can impact every aspect of the game.  Vic is a basically a situational pass rusher, albeit a very good one but he's a liability in every other aspect.

 

If he's Kris Jenkins, yes.  If he's Muhammad Wilkerson, no.  

[nycdan]

36 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

I don't think Williams is nearly as explosive as Beasley.

It's all about intangibles here.  Leo is loaded with them.

 

Honestly, though, the Jets have so many past picks you could laugh at for being so horrible.  Leo is definitely NOT one of them.  He has all the makings of a 10-year starter on the DL who will be either at the top of the game, or very close to it.  Beasley was no sure thing to be the next Von Miller and still may not be. 

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, T0mShane said:

I don't think Williams will test like Beasley, but if we're not gonna draft someone who will score TDs, then we should get someone to at least annoy Tom Brady. I don't care about the drugs and guns. All good pass rushers are drug addicts. 

 

27 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

I don't think Williams is nearly as explosive as Beasley.

Williams is pretty damn explosive.  He's eaten the Gators OL up (which isnt say much) the past 2 years.  A couple of times he shot out so fast he was 5 yards behind the QB having to come back to the ball.  

How he tests will be interesting.  I agree that Beasley will probably have the edge in the testing dept and is probably the better overall athlete but I feel like when I've watched the two play, Williams has a little more to offer and is a little more diverse.  I think he can throw a little more at you than Beasley.  Then again, Bama has so many studs all over the field it's hard to judge really.   There are some games I've watched, I swear Ryan Anderson looked like the best player on the field. 

[JustInFudge]

1 hour ago, dbatesman said:

Point well taken on the pass attempts. There's something to be said for both sides, but Williams gives me a boner so I'm certainly not complaining.

Williams is a stud.  Love the kid.  By far my favorite player on the team.  I wouldnt be the least bit surprised to see him get double digit sacks next season.

39 minutes ago, detectivekimble said:

If he's Kris Jenkins, yes.  If he's Muhammad Wilkerson, no.  

I think it's safe to say that Leo is going to have the better career.  Which is saying something because Mo Wilk is really ******* good.

 

[detectivekimble]

4 hours ago, nycdan said:

It's all about intangibles here.  Leo is loaded with them.

 

Honestly, though, the Jets have so many past picks you could laugh at for being so horrible.  Leo is definitely NOT one of them.  He has all the makings of a 10-year starter on the DL who will be either at the top of the game, or very close to it.  Beasley was no sure thing to be the next Von Miller and still may not be. 

I meant Tim Williams.