So if Casserley's prediction is true...

[TuscanyTile2]

9 minutes ago, Jetster said:

This is what I don't understand about the Watson bashers? His floor is Vince Young but many said that Young failed because he threw sidearm, was as dumb as a box of rocks, and was not a hard worker. 

So let's take a look at Watsons attributes relative to Youngs. Both were winners, and found ways to carry their teams. That's where it ends. Watson is also known as very intelligent, a student of the game, driven to get better, and an extremely hard worker & leader. I think Watsons upside is Donavon McNabb & after watching the sh*tshow I've witnessed at QB for this Jets team, if Macc takes Watson his pick I'll be a happy Jet fan.

Watson seems like he's a terrific kid with a great attitude but a weak arm (and apparently not the greatest accuracy) is not the formula for success as an NFL QB.  Then again, I'm usually wrong when it comes to evaluating QBs so if Macc likes him then I'm in on the guy.

[thadude]

6 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Watson's floor is what Vince Young was.  His ceiling is what Vince Young could have been. 

It's funny you gave him the poor man's Alex Smith label, because that is EXACTLY what Trubisky looks like to me.

I don't get the Trubisky hype at all

[thadude]

23 minutes ago, Jetster said:

This is what I don't understand about the Watson bashers? His floor is Vince Young but many said that Young failed because he threw sidearm, was as dumb as a box of rocks, and was not a hard worker. 

So let's take a look at Watsons attributes relative to Youngs. Both were winners, and found ways to carry their teams. That's where it ends. Watson is also known as very intelligent, a student of the game, driven to get better, and an extremely hard worker & leader. I think Watsons upside is Donavon McNabb & after watching the sh*tshow I've witnessed at QB for this Jets team, if Macc takes Watson his pick I'll be a happy Jet fan.

McNabb could throw downfield accurately.  Watson can't.  

 

At best he's a game manager who can throw to his first or second progressions on short and intermediate routes and be mobile.  Hence the Alex Smith comparison

 

[BCJet]

For the watson defenders, how are you able to overlook the lack of speed on his passes?  His intangibles are off the charts, I get that, but so were Tim Tebows.  I also completely realize you dont need an arm like matt stafford to succeed, but you do need to be able to throw from the hash mark to the opposite sideline with either enough speed or enough anticipation to complete that pass, otherwise defenses will ignore one side of the field and be given an enormous advantage.

I like watson as a college player, and leadership, etc absolutely matter, but an NFL QB has to have certain physical abilities (again - not saying arm strength is the #1 quality) but its something that matters and its one thing to be slightly below average in a particular skill set, but its another to be an extreme outlier like watson happens to be with his ball speed.

[LWC611]

Why is there no love for Howard from Alabama at 6?

[thadude]

2 minutes ago, LWC611 said:

Why is there no love for Howard from Alabama at 6?

Because he'd be the best pick and fit for our team but we're the jets we need to hoarde mediocre DB's in round 1

[LWC611]

Just now, thadude said:

Because he'd be the best pick and fit for our team but we're the jets we need to hoarde mediocre DB's in round 1

There it is.....

[NoBowles]

4 minutes ago, LWC611 said:

Why is there no love for Howard from Alabama at 6?

Something something 1st round value something something 

[LWC611]

1 minute ago, NoBowles said:

Something something 1st round value something something 

Sorry I am a little dense this morning, I am not sure what you are saying.  I think he is not over drafted at the 6th pick...

[FTL Jet Fan]

Who know what's true, everything at this time is usually BS. The analysts and draft guru's are usually wrong. We have no idea what Mac really wants to do, it would be great to trade down but it's not that easy. I know the rumors are we love Mitchell but given the history of the Jets drafting the players they should, (not saying they should draft Mitchell) I will wait until we make the pick. Then I will come here and enjoy rational discussions with my fellow Jets fans

[Stonehands]

I think Watson's ceiling is Tyrod Taylor and Taylor is worthless if not for his extreme efficiency and lack of turnovers.  Watson has not been able to avoid turnovers thus far, so that ceiling may never be reached.

[NoBowles]

43 minutes ago, LWC611 said:

Sorry I am a little dense this morning, I am not sure what you are saying.  I think he is not over drafted at the 6th pick...

People are getting wrapped up with him being a TE and saying there is no value in picking a TE at 6 in the draft. I think we desperately need playmakers, particularly offensive ones, and he fits the bill. Id rather see a trade back, but if not, I would be happiest with him at 6.

[nj meadowlands]

10 hours ago, bitonti said:

Last year the Browns passed on Carson Wentz. Traded him away. he starts hot 4-1. 

Meanwhile, this year, they've got Cody Kessler and Brock Osweiler 1-2 on the depth chart. 

But yeah the Browns are dumb and everyone else is smart. 

Trade down every year, never have the balls to make a pick, that's no way to go through life 

 

 

 

Carson Wentz might suck.

[jack48]

I just do not want to go safety at 6.  The first pick we make should be an edge guy---wherever that pick is.  Sit the QB on his ass

[RichardTodd27]

14 hours ago, Dcronin said:

A CLE-JAX trade, for #4, to get Trubisky, what do we do? Still try to trade back later into round 1, or stay put and take Fournette?

Still pretty sure the thing to do in this draft is move back, back, back.

DC

Unless we're trying to win now, I don't want Fournette. We need to build this team the right way.

[Lupz27]

9 hours ago, thadude said:

Watson is going to be a poor man's Alex Smith

I'll go one step further, Trubisky's Ceiling is Alex Smith.

[Tinstar]

9 hours ago, thadude said:

Nothing.

 

simply just try to pick the best players

Yes, but what but determines the best player  ?

[flgreen]

10 hours ago, TuscanyTile2 said:

Paul Depodesta calculating what it will take to trade up to #6.

That's and easy one x= 6=12+52

[Tinstar]

12 hours ago, T0mShane said:

I'm gonna say that Watson can throw it harder than has been reported. I've never watched him and thought his arm was weak. 

If you're being chased, you would be shocked how fast you can run .In the heat of the moment, that kid has proven to have what it takes . I would take him and not think twice about it. I still prefer Trubisky .

[#27TheDominator]

12 hours ago, Jetscode1 said:

JN has a resident NFL expert?  Confused...

More than one.

12 hours ago, Gen X Jet said:

Other than screwing the Jets 2 years ago, Charley Casserly hasn't been relevant since Dexter Manley and the 'Hogs. 

I thought his pronunciation of LaDainian was pretty relevant, but that was also more than half a decade ago.

13 hours ago, mphtrilogy said:

Coughlin aint a spring chicken, hes in win now mode..

he's going fournette, no trade down

One thing about old guys.  They don't realize they are old.  

1 hour ago, BCJet said:

For the watson defenders, how are you able to overlook the lack of speed on his passes?  His intangibles are off the charts, I get that, but so were Tim Tebows.  I also completely realize you dont need an arm like matt stafford to succeed, but you do need to be able to throw from the hash mark to the opposite sideline with either enough speed or enough anticipation to complete that pass, otherwise defenses will ignore one side of the field and be given an enormous advantage.

I like watson as a college player, and leadership, etc absolutely matter, but an NFL QB has to have certain physical abilities (again - not saying arm strength is the #1 quality) but its something that matters and its one thing to be slightly below average in a particular skill set, but its another to be an extreme outlier like watson happens to be with his ball speed.

I am not a huge Watson supporter, but I think the Tebow comparisons are unfair.  Anybody watching Tebow in college saw his motion and said "that doesn't look right".  Many of us thought it wouldn't play in the NFL.  Probably most.  I was shocked he got drafted when he did.  The excuse was "he just wins."  Watson throws the ball well and won games with his arm.  If he has enough arm for the NFL is still in question, but it isn't obvious that he has to completely revamp his motion like Tebow.

58 minutes ago, NoBowles said:

People are getting wrapped up with him being a TE and saying there is no value in picking a TE at 6 in the draft. I think we desperately need playmakers, particularly offensive ones, and he fits the bill. Id rather see a trade back, but if not, I would be happiest with him at 6.

I don't like him.  He didn't seem like as great an athlete as he is.  TE is not a premium position IMO.  What makes him a playmaker?  He wasn't a playmaker in college.  I think Gronkowski had more TDs each year in college than Howard had as a 4 year starter at 'bama.  I think Howard will be a legit day 1 starter that will last a decade.  I don't know that he is a "playmaker."

8 minutes ago, Tinstar said:

If you're being chased, you would be shocked how fast you can run .In the heat of the moment, that kid has proven to have what it takes . I would take him and not think twice about it. I still prefer Trubisky .

I don't understand this logic.  People run faster because they are being chased?  They try harder?  Then why do football players get caught?  All the fear in the world isn't going to make you get away from a faster man. 

[prime21]

Swap picks and get the 1st pick in the second round and take it if you can't get another pick thrown in.  The Titans could be more flexible in a trade with Cleveland while the Jets try to hold off  for more.  

[NoBowles]

17 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

 

I don't like him.  He didn't seem like as great an athlete as he is.  TE is not a premium position IMO.  What makes him a playmaker?  He wasn't a playmaker in college.  I think Gronkowski had more TDs each year in college than Howard had as a 4 year starter at 'bama.  I think Howard will be a legit day 1 starter that will last a decade.  I don't know that he is a "playmaker."

 

Very fair, and this is why I would rather not take him or anyone at 6. I am projecting a bit because I don't think Alabama used him properly, and I see him as a mismatch nightmare for opposing defenses. I project him as a playmaker based on his size, speed and what I saw of him, but its very fair to say there are plenty of question marks on him.

[jdeacon]

2 hours ago, LWC611 said:

Why is there no love for Howard from Alabama at 6?

This is the only pick in the first round I would truly be excited about. I would be fine with Adams, Williams and even Hooker to an extent at the sixth pick but Howard is the only one that would get me optimistic on a future offensive weapon.

Howard just screams beast in the NFL and pairing him with Enunwa would be a dynamic matchup nightmare for slot corners and linebackers. Come on Mac make it happen

[UntouchableCrew]

Trubisky's floor is Blaine Gabbert and his ceiling is Ryan Tannehill.

Watson's floor is Alex Smith and his ceiling is Russell Wilson.

Just MHO.

 

[thadude]

1 hour ago, Tinstar said:

Yes, but what but determines the best player  ?

Not drafting an ok at best safety at 6 overall

[thadude]

4 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Trubisky's floor is Blaine Gabbert and his ceiling is Ryan Tannehill.

Watson's floor is Alex Smith and his ceiling is Russell Wilson.

Just MHO.

 

Watson is not the thrower Wilson is not even close

[thadude]

7 minutes ago, jdeacon said:

This is the only pick in the first round I would truly be excited about. I would be fine with Adams, Williams and even Hooker to an extent at the sixth pick but Howard is the only one that would get me optimistic on a future offensive weapon.

Howard just screams beast in the NFL and pairing him with Enunwa would be a dynamic matchup nightmare for slot corners and linebackers. Come on Mac make it happen

Not only is Howard going to be an excellent receiver in the NFL he's also a tremendous blocker.  He was able to block Myles Garrett by himself on occasion 

 

Macc will pass on Howard for a safety and when he does I'm thinking about becoming a Giants fan I can't take this stupidity anymore

[Integrity28]

8 minutes ago, thadude said:

Not only is Howard going to be an excellent receiver in the NFL he's also a tremendous blocker.  He was able to block Myles Garrett by himself on occasion 

 

Macc will pass on Howard for a safety and when he does I'm thinking about becoming a Giants fan I can't take this stupidity anymore

You seem fully at home embroiled in stupidity.

[Greenseed4]

Why the Browns should trade with the Jaguars:

1. The Jets might be frontin' and take Trubisky for themselves. 

2. A team (like the Bills) might trade up to #5 to prevent the Jets from drafting him.

3. The trade (chart) value of moving up to #4 from #12, is only 100 points more than moving to #6.  (This is the equivalent of #33 and then getting BACK the Jacksonville fourth rounder)...in comparison, Macc want the #33 and the CLE fourth rounder. 

 

Why the Browns should trade with the Jets:

1. I think they can negotiate to keep their #33, and instead trade their #52 and mid-round change (top of the fourth/top of the fifth)

2. Fairly confident the Browns could also net Sheldon Richardson in this deal. 

 

PS, it would be funny if all this hullabaloo was a CLE smokescreen to get OJ Howard

 

[Dcat]

2 hours ago, RichardTodd27 said:

Unless we're trying to win now, I don't want Fournette. We need to build this team the right way.

If Fournette is available at #6, Mac should be able to find a trade-back partner who covets him.  Same for Trubisky and Watson.  Shame on Mac if he can't find a way to trade down to the mid teens - low 20's.  

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, NoBowles said:

Very fair, and this is why I would rather not take him or anyone at 6. I am projecting a bit because I don't think Alabama used him properly, and I see him as a mismatch nightmare for opposing defenses. I project him as a playmaker based on his size, speed and what I saw of him, but its very fair to say there are plenty of question marks on him.

I wouldn't say there are "plenty of questions"  The only questions are value at the very top.  I think prospect-wise he is among the closest to a sure thing.  Still don't want him at 6.

1 hour ago, thadude said:

Not only is Howard going to be an excellent receiver in the NFL he's also a tremendous blocker.  He was able to block Myles Garrett by himself on occasion 

 

Macc will pass on Howard for a safety and when he does I'm thinking about becoming a Giants fan I can't take this stupidity anymore

I think it is funny that you rag on safety as a non-premium position, but want to draft a TE with 7 TDs in 4 years.  Do you think he was misused at Alabama too? Kyle Brady was a 13 year starter and the public wants to crucify him. 

[Tinstar]

53 minutes ago, UntouchableCrew said:

Trubisky's floor is Blaine Gabbert and his ceiling is Ryan Tannehill.

Watson's floor is Alex Smith and his ceiling is Russell Wilson.

Just MHO.

 

I wish I was this smart, but since I'm not I won't make comments like this . Here's what I will say thou .

Mitchell Trubisky did exactly what I am looking for in a franchise QB and has the skill set that I would want in a franchise QB .  The rest is up to him and the ownership of the team that signs him . The 1st part of my statement is simply that the kid sat behind a starting QB in an offensive scheme, learned the scheme and when it was his time to start, he went out and put up 30TDs against I believe 6 ints  . What that tells me is the kid paid attention, studied and mastered  what was asked of him . He has the arm talent to make every single throw that's required in the NFL and the mobility accuracy and pocket awareness that was evident in his game tape at UNC .The second part of my statement is simply that if ownership will be patient and allow these kids to develop in a scheme instead of rushing to judgment and forcing them into learning  scheme after scheme .

The Jets are about to unveil a new scheme with a young fresh OC who hopefully should be around for a few years until he makes his name . That OC has with him another young offensive mind as his QBs coach who has had experience in the league as a coordinator and as a QBs coach . There's a great opportunity here for continuity and growth as an offensive team but it will require patience .

The key is, will Ownership allow what needs to happen to happen .

[RichardTodd27]

50 minutes ago, Dcat said:

If Fournette is available at #6, Mac should be able to find a trade-back partner who covets him.  Same for Trubisky and Watson.  Shame on Mac if he can't find a way to trade down to the mid teens - low 20's.  

Hope you're right about Fournette. But not sure how "coveted" any of these QB's are, where a team would be willing to trade up for them. I have a feeling these QB's will hang around for awhile.

[NoBowles]

18 minutes ago, #27TheDominator said:

I wouldn't say there are "plenty of questions"  The only questions are value at the very top.  I think prospect-wise he is among the closest to a sure thing.  Still don't want him at 6.

 

My question is whether his production was limited by Alabama, or that they used him that way because it is what he is. To me, that is a big question for 6. If he is the real deal, and a playmaker who can create huge mismatches on every play, 6 is not too early for him IMO regardless of what position he plays. If he is not a playmaker, but more of a traditional TE who can block, move the chains here and there, then 6 is way too early. I think he has a pretty high floor, I just don't know how high his ceiling is.

[Fantasy Island]

16 hours ago, Gangrene said:

If Casserly's prediction is true he's finally got something right after having been a consultant in the hiring of Mike MacCagnan and Todd Bowles.

Post of the year!!!!!!!!!