2017 RE-DRAFT

[CanadaSteve]

3 hours ago, Powpow said:

IMO this was a horrendous draft. A fellow poster called it a train wreck. totally agree. Mac, again, displays he's over his head.

RE-DRAFT just because it will make me feel better.. And I'm looking at who was available where we picked and where other players were taken. 

1- Adams S   2- Cook RB   3- Pat Ellflein C   3- Traded 4 & 6    4- Carl Lawson OLB    5- Desmond King S      6- Adam Bistnowaty T    6-Bucky Hodges TE   7- Zane Gonzalez K

Without all the up and down trades that watered down the positional talent this is what I came up. Add yours Scrutinize, revitalize, just don't compromise.

 

 

WOW....JUST WOW.....A 1017 redraft before one player even puts a helmet on.

This is why Jets fans are looked upon the way they are.

 

[Skeptable]

6 minutes ago, Powpow said:

nobody said not getting Cook was a disaster. Getting a S with the 2nd round pick was dumb. Especially with Rontez Miles on the roster and so many holes to fill. And Maye isn't even a true FS which is what you really need to compliment Adams.

Adams can play all db positions maye can play both safety positions and if i watch another play with a ball fly over miles head or another wr run free because of the wrong assignment i might choke... it wasn't just pryor that played bad last year... just watch the games

[Powpow]

6 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

WOW....JUST WOW.....A 1017 redraft before one player even puts a helmet on.

This is why Jets fans are looked upon the way they are.

 

yea well call it Jetintuiton

[HessStation]

10 minutes ago, CanadaSteve said:

WOW....JUST WOW.....A 1017 redraft before one player even puts a helmet on.

This is why Jets fans are looked upon the way they are.

 

If he didn't make it so negative it'd could have been a fun excerise. When I started trying to do my own Howard was the only player I'd have picked before Adams and really, Adams was a much higher ranked prospect. I love the potenential tandem maybe more or just as much as a huge risk on and off the field w Maye and Cook

And the more you try to find some hidden value behind these picks you realize there isn't that much there. 

[Powpow]

7 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

Adams can play all db positions maye can play both safety positions and if i watch another play with a ball fly over miles head or another wr run free because of the wrong assignment i might choke... it wasn't just pryor that played bad last year... just watch the games

Adams and Maye are SS. Desmond King would have been a better pick as he is a FS. That would have freed up the #2 pick to fill a more desperate need.

[20andOut]

3 hours ago, Powpow said:

 3- Traded 4 & 6

So you called some GMs and locked this deal up?

[Powpow]

2 minutes ago, 20andOut said:

So you called some GMs and locked this deal up?

LOL I was just trying to stay true to the trade Mac made- just changed the players chosen

[Skeptable]

3 minutes ago, Powpow said:

Adams and Maye are SS. Desmond King would have been a better pick as he is a FS. That would have freed up the #2 pick to fill a more desperate need.

They both can play both positions. .. as seen by adams playing time and the fact that most teams projected maye as a FS

[Skeptable]

6 minutes ago, Powpow said:

Adams and Maye are SS. Desmond King would have been a better pick as he is a FS. That would have freed up the #2 pick to fill a more desperate need.

And you had no idea that king would slip to the 5th he was projected in the 3rd

[Powpow]

Just now, Skeptable said:

They both can play both positions. .. as seen by adams playing time and the fact that most teams projected maye as a FS

FS are hard to come by. Hooker is a classic free safety in the mold of HOF Reed.  That's what I'm talking about.

[bealeb319]

Honestly, we passed on Cook bc he has a list of red flags longer than the Nile. Seriously think of a category, there's a check next to him. 
Injury red flag, check
Potential chronic physical traits, check
Character red flag, check
Trouble with the law history, check
domestic abuse history, check
entourage, check
poor combine, check
 
...just saying.

Let's not forget his fumble problems...he would have added to the long list of ongoing second round busts hopefully maye breaks the trend

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app

[Powpow]

4 minutes ago, Skeptable said:

And you had no idea that king would slip to the 5th he was projected in the 3rd

True that BUT I would not have forced the issue by taking a player like Maye after taking a similar player in Adams. for that trade out of the first and take maye in the 2nd or take Adams and trade out of the 2nd. Obviously numerous scenarios exist. Just find it redundant to take 2 very similar skilled set players in your first 2 rounds.  

[bealeb319]

nobody said not getting Cook was a disaster. Getting a S with the 2nd round pick was dumb. Especially with Rontez Miles on the roster and so many holes to fill. And Maye isn't even a true FS which is what you really need to compliment Adams.

...rontez miles? Really? The udfa with one career interception who barely made our roster last year, the same last year where our secondary was handing out free touchdowns to any receiver able to crawl? I like to remain hopeful for our players also and I am one of the more optimistic fans on the site but you don't hold back on drafting a player because you already have a rontez miles on the roster....

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app

[ASH1962]

1 hour ago, Maxman said:

The 2nd pick reminded me of when they went Keyshawn round one and Alex Van Dyke (I think that was his name in round two). I don't like double dipping position wise (that sounds dirty). But if they get them both right all will be forgiven.

If...

[Powpow]

2 minutes ago, bealeb319 said:

...rontez miles? Really? The udfa with one career interception who barely made our roster last year, the same last year where our secondary was handing out free touchdowns to any receiver able to crawl? I like to remain hopeful for our players also and I am one of the more optimistic fans on the site but you don't hold back on drafting a player because you already have a rontez miles on the roster....

Sent from my LGUS991 using JetNation.com mobile app
 

Not saying Miles is the long term answer. Just that we could have taken a player to fill a much higher need kie TE, RB, Edge. Ju Ju, Cook, Curtis, S Jones , Awie, Sheehan, Q Jones, Everett*(6.3 rating) and a few others in round 2 all would have been a better pick

[Beerfish]

2 hours ago, HessStation said:

Honestly, we passed on Cook bc he has a list of red flags longer than the Nile. Seriously think of a category, there's a check next to him. 

Injury red flag, check

Potential chronic physical traits, check

Character red flag, check

Trouble with the law history, check

domestic abuse history, check

entourage, check

poor combine, check

 

...just saying.

Think of this two years from now when this guy is tearing it up and is real weapon and the jets are wondering why their qb looks so bad with no weaponzzzzz

[Powpow]

15 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Think of this two years from now when this guy is tearing it up and is real weapon and the jets are wondering why their qb looks so bad with no weaponzzzzz

thinking of it when he tears us up.

[HighPitch]

2 hours ago, HessStation said:

Honestly, we passed on Cook bc he has a list of red flags longer than the Nile. Seriously think of a category, there's a check next to him. 

Injury red flag, check

Potential chronic physical traits, check

Character red flag, check

Trouble with the law history, check

domestic abuse history, check

entourage, check

poor combine, check

 

...just saying.

You forgot cruelty to animals. Check

[HessStation]

57 minutes ago, Powpow said:

Adams and Maye are SS. 

from different scouting reports:

"Maye was a starter at safety and nickel..." 

Maye "Interchangeable safety with the instincts of a free safety and the physicality of a box player..." 

Maye "operates effectively from both single-high and two-deep looks."

Maye "Single-high safety potential"

Maye "Can play deep zone coverage"

"Maye was one of the most impressive, illustrating a skill set that should translate really well to the passing-driven NFL"

"Maye has the potential to be a real asset for pass coverage in the NFL"

"For the NFL, Maye could be flexible to play strong or free safety. He has the versatility to be an interchangeable safety who flips his responsibilities pre-snap. Teams love that kind of safety."

"In the 2017 NFL Draft, Maye is likely to be a second-round pick..."

Maye "As of right now, he’s an early second-round pick."

"Maye is a true three down player" Rang

"Listed at 6'0/207, Maye can play FS, SS, and nickel in certain situations. He can be trusted as a single-high or near the line of scrimmage."

" Marcus Maye is another member from that secondary who could be off the board by the end of Day 2."

Maye "Experience playing all over the field including nickel"

Maye " He can play both the strong safety and free safety positions."

Adams " Interchangeable safety"

Adams " Interchangeable safety capable of playing both near the line of scrimmage and deep in coverage. Can also play in the slot or cover tight ends."

Adams "Looks like a cornerback when playing “off” coverage. Has some analysts intrigued that he’s capable of converting to a cornerback full-time if needed."

"Former LSU safety Jamal Adams has garnered plenty of pre-draft hype in recent months. Add NFL.com’s Bucky Brooks to the long list of admirers. While many have pegged former Texas A&M defensive end Myles Garrett as the top prospect in the upcoming draft, Brooks believes that it’s actually Adams."

"Adams is just as instinctive in coverage. His easy athleticism allows him to drop down and play nickel corner, covering slot receivers while keeping his eyes on the quarterback."

" Adams is the prototype at safety -- the agility of a cornerback and the aggression and instincts of a linebacker"

"Adams is an all-around safety."

Adams "Versatile safety. Has the size and power to play in the box as well as the range to play the deep half or even center field. Can also hold up in man coverage."

[HessStation]

29 minutes ago, Beerfish said:

Think of this two years from now when this guy is tearing it up and is real weapon and the jets are wondering why their qb looks so bad with no weaponzzzzz

Should have cut your post after, "from now, " the rest is your imagination. 

[Powpow]

22 minutes ago, HessStation said:

from different scouting reports:

"Maye was a starter at safety and nickel..." 

Maye "Interchangeable safety with the instincts of a free safety and the physicality of a box player..." 

Maye "operates effectively from both single-high and two-deep looks."

Maye "Single-high safety potential"

Maye "Can play deep zone coverage"

"Maye was one of the most impressive, illustrating a skill set that should translate really well to the passing-driven NFL"

"Maye has the potential to be a real asset for pass coverage in the NFL"

"For the NFL, Maye could be flexible to play strong or free safety. He has the versatility to be an interchangeable safety who flips his responsibilities pre-snap. Teams love that kind of safety."

"In the 2017 NFL Draft, Maye is likely to be a second-round pick..."

Maye "As of right now, he’s an early second-round pick."

"Maye is a true three down player" Rang

"Listed at 6'0/207, Maye can play FS, SS, and nickel in certain situations. He can be trusted as a single-high or near the line of scrimmage."

" Marcus Maye is another member from that secondary who could be off the board by the end of Day 2."

Maye "Experience playing all over the field including nickel"

Maye " He can play both the strong safety and free safety positions."

Adams " Interchangeable safety"

Adams " Interchangeable safety capable of playing both near the line of scrimmage and deep in coverage. Can also play in the slot or cover tight ends."

Adams "Looks like a cornerback when playing “off” coverage. Has some analysts intrigued that he’s capable of converting to a cornerback full-time if needed."

"Former LSU safety Jamal Adams has garnered plenty of pre-draft hype in recent months. Add NFL.com’s Bucky Brooks to the long list of admirers. While many have pegged former Texas A&M defensive end Myles Garrett as the top prospect in the upcoming draft, Brooks believes that it’s actually Adams."

"Adams is just as instinctive in coverage. His easy athleticism allows him to drop down and play nickel corner, covering slot receivers while keeping his eyes on the quarterback."

" Adams is the prototype at safety -- the agility of a cornerback and the aggression and instincts of a linebacker"

"Adams is an all-around safety."

Adams "Versatile safety. Has the size and power to play in the box as well as the range to play the deep half or even center field. Can also hold up in man coverage."

I can find an equal number of reviews detailing their weaknesses in pass coverage for both players. In reality, they are two sides of the same coin. Hooker and Maye are a better combo than Adams and Maye. But you don't pass on Adams. So Adams and the Jets could have waited to find a better pairing and used that 2nd rounder on a more pressing need.

Pro Football Focus

13. Marcus Maye, S, Florida

Maye is a solid box defender, as he finished second among SEC safeties in run-stop percentage in 2016. Off the line of scrimmage he is not as effective, however, as he has speed and agility limitations that hurt him in coverage

[HessStation]

7 hours ago, Powpow said:

I can find an equal number of reviews detailing their weaknesses in pass coverage for both players. In reality, they are two sides of the same coin. Hooker and Maye are a better combo than Adams and Maye. But you don't pass on Adams. So Adams and the Jets could have waited to find a better pairing and used that 2nd rounder on a more pressing need.

Pro Football Focus

13. Marcus Maye, S, Florida

Maye is a solid box defender, as he finished second among SEC safeties in run-stop percentage in 2016. Off the line of scrimmage he is not as effective, however, as he has speed and agility limitations that hurt him in coverage

The entire NFL is predicated on disguising pre snap reads. They got two Safties whose biggest traits are "interchangeable" both have played nickel and both are considered good enough to play cornerback. Both are considered about as tough and hard hitting as it gets too. 

Hooker /is a great looking FS prospect, but he's one year production, possible durability issues and not a hitter or considered a great tackler.

 

im not saying one will be better than other, just saying who knows and EVERY one of these guys have pros and cons.

 

having two interchangeable S who can do both about as good as any other S prospects in the draft could be a blessing.

[Scott Dierking]

I guess that the OP doesn't realize that once you change the Jets 2nd round choice, that then creates a chain of events that change the course of many other picks. Quite possibly affecting his other "great" picks, that now may or may not be there.

I recommend watching the series "back to the Future" this afternoon.

[Jet Life]

8 minutes ago, HessStation said:

The entire NFL is predicated on disguising pre snap reads. They got two Safties whose biggest traits are "interchangeable" both have played nickel and both are considered good enough to play cornerback. Both are considered about as tough and hard hitting as it gets too. 

Hooker /is a great looking FS prospect, but he's one year production, possible durability issues and not a hitter or considered a great tackler.

 

im not saying one will be better than other, just saying who knows and EVERY one of these guys have pros and cons.

 

having two interchangeable S who can do both about as good as any other S prospects in the draft could be a blessing.

Per pff Adams was the top graded safety and played FS 41%, CB 32%, SS 13% and LB 14%. Maye also graded out positively in coverage and had the 2nd lowest catch rate (31%) of all safetys and missed 1 tackle all season. Our secondary sucks so I'm glad Macc grabbed 2 great players here who can hit/cover and are leaders as well.

[Scott Dierking]

Just now, Jet Life said:

Per pff Adams was the top graded safety and played FS 41%, CB 32%, SS 13% and LB 14%. Maye also graded out positively in coverage and had the 2nd lowest catch rate (31%) of all safetys and missed 1 tackle all season. Our secondary sucks so I'm glad Macc grabbed 2 great players here who can hit/cover and are leaders as well.

If these moves solve the problem of slots and TE's running free in the seams, I will be happy. If it doesn't , then not so much.

[j4jets]

Dalvin Cook was a 1st round talent and a position of need. No way on earth Mayes was BPA. F*** those that defend Mac's BS BPA philosophy. 

[HessStation]

11 minutes ago, Jet Life said:

Per pff Adams was the top graded safety and played FS 41%, CB 32%, SS 13% and LB 14%. Maye also graded out positively in coverage and had the 2nd lowest catch rate (31%) of all safetys and missed 1 tackle all season. Our secondary sucks so I'm glad Macc grabbed 2 great players here who can hit/cover and are leaders as well.

This is not only the best post of the thread but best post of the draft.

[Copernicus]

11 hours ago, HessStation said:

Honestly, we passed on Cook bc he has a list of red flags longer than the Nile. Seriously think of a category, there's a check next to him. 

Injury red flag, check

Potential chronic physical traits, check

Character red flag, check

Trouble with the law history, check

domestic abuse history, check

entourage, check

poor combine, check

 

...just saying.

All the experts here , who are smarter than Mac , would rather ignore your post. They'd rather have taken Cook and then cry three years later after he blows up the locker room and we can't trade him for far less value during the 2020 draft.

[Jet Life]

3 minutes ago, HessStation said:

This is not only the best post of the thread but best post of the draft.

People just seem to be mad we didn't address every need which was impossible. Corner can be addressed in free agency and the draft next year. We will have tons of cap space. This isn't an overnight rebuild ! 

[roscoeword]

When I see these scouting  reports lauding the attributes of our safeties, I take it with a grain of salt because I'm sure they wrote great things about Pryor too. 

[slats]

11 hours ago, HessStation said:

Honestly, we passed on Cook bc he has a list of red flags longer than the Nile. Seriously think of a category, there's a check next to him. 

Injury red flag, check

Potential chronic physical traits, check

Character red flag, check

Trouble with the law history, check

domestic abuse history, check

entourage, check

poor combine, check

 

...just saying.

 

Yeah, I was gonna say this Cook kid might be a nice player until he gets hurt trying to hang himself in prison. 

[Copernicus]

9 hours ago, Beerfish said:

Think of this two years from now when this guy is tearing it up and is real weapon and the jets are wondering why their qb looks so bad with no weaponzzzzz

Orrrrrrrr, think of it two years from now when he blows up the team locker room and we're kicking ourselves for taking another player with questionable background who was not worth the headache. We will be complaining that  Mac learned nothing from Sheldon Richardson and Calvin Pryor . 

[varjet]

19 minutes ago, j4jets said:

Dalvin Cook was a 1st round talent and a position of need. No way on earth Mayes was BPA. F*** those that defend Mac's BS BPA philosophy. 

There was no way the Jets were spending a premium pick on Cook or Mixon.  Not with their roster holes, not with their locker room, not with their other issues.

And for running backs that last 3-4 years, it's a bit early for the Jets to take one.

Based on the above, I agree with the Jets on this one.    Thought Maye could have been a corner, Stewart, Elfein.  

[HessStation]

Just now, Jet Life said:

People just seem to be mad we didn't address every need which was impossible. Corner can be addressed in free agency and the draft next year. We will have tons of cap space. This isn't an overnight rebuild ! 

There were ALOT of people who seemed to understand this team was/is a 2-4 win team until the draft. 10 years ago NOBODY even paid attention to the draft. Now it's like the expectations are off the charts. This thing is definitely a 2-3 year work in progress. I like what he's trying to do with the character and attitude of prospects he's bringing in. Whether it will work or not will eventually be predicated on the eventual QB. Yeah, they probably/almost def need one but they need the right one. Glad he didn't reach on any of those guys just for the sake of it. 

[HessStation]

24 minutes ago, roscoeword said:

When I see these scouting  reports lauding the attributes of our safeties, I take it with a grain of salt because I'm sure they wrote great things about Pryor too. 

Meh, I can remember this and Pryor was considered much more a liability in coverage. More of a strictly in the box guy. He was a second/third round guy who could lay the wood. 

With Adams and Maye there are actual analytics that are backing up their interchangeability.

yeah, granted nothing is a sure thing including every other prospect

Adams and Maye are both faster, bigger and and much better in coverage  coming out than Pryor. Both these guys played Nickle during their careers bc they can cover. 

We'll see how it turns out. Just trying to remain fair and reasonable and maybe a little optimistic.