Gas2No99

Back To The Future: What If Hackenberg Is Actually Good?

160 posts in this topic

4 minutes ago, gEYno said:

Well, yes, most bad college players continue to be bad.  Stephen Hill is just a recent, palpable, example of the point... Even more so when you consider that both of these players have a significant limitation in their game that history doesn't have great precedent of working itself out in the pros.

I'm eagerly awaiting your list of poor college QBs who went on to be good though... Eagerly.

Tom Brady, Warren Moon, Roger Staubach, Joe Flacco, Kurt Warner, Tony Romo . Is that list ok for you .

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1 hour ago, 56mehl56 said:

Tom Brady, Warren Moon, Roger Staubach, Joe Flacco, Kurt Warner, Tony Romo . Is that list ok for you .

It's inaccurate, for sure

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bottom line we have 16 games to figure it out

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1 hour ago, RJIII said:

What if grandma had balls?


Sent from my iPhone using JetNation.com mobile app

Wait - is that a Mahomes joke or something :P

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17 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

Tom Brady, Warren Moon, Roger Staubach, Joe Flacco, Kurt Warner, Tony Romo . Is that list ok for you .

He won the Heisman trophy. They give that to bad players? 

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2 hours ago, section314 said:

He won the Heisman trophy. They give that to bad players? 

Ok so cross off Staubach . Still there are 5 Qb's who weren't great in college and went on to be great NFL QB's. I'm sure If I dug enough I'd come up with more. 

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21 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

Tom Brady, Warren Moon, Roger Staubach, Joe Flacco, Kurt Warner, Tony Romo . Is that list ok for you .

Brady - was actually a very good player his problem was Lloyd Carr recruited too many qb's and he got lost in the shuffle at times.

Moon - was a good college player and good in the CFL he played at a time when there was a racist perception that Black Players couldn't play QB.

Staubach - 68% and 66% completion percentages his first two years at Navy.  So I'm scratching my head at what you are talking about.

Flacco, Warner, Romo - good players in college they just played at small schools.

 

Hack - sucks

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50 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Ok so cross off Staubach . Still there are 5 Qb's who weren't great in college and went on to be great NFL QB's. I'm sure If I dug enough I'd come up with more. 

Hack was so awful in TC and preseason last year he was wearing plain clothes up until like week 16 and Geno and Petty were both injured.  Macc's reputation is invested in Hack being good yet he and Bowles were so scared by Hack in practice they didn't even have him on the playing roster as a backup for 90% of the season.

Christian Hacknberg is absolutely horrible.  Won't be in the NFL in 2018

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On 5/18/2017 at 9:39 AM, RoadFan said:

OP is asking the wrong question. The better question is "What exactly is Hackenberg good at?"

Accuracy? No.

Decision-making? No.

Mechanics? No.

Footwork? No.

One could certainly make a case for durability.  But other than that....what else?

Crap post. He was actually exceptional at decision making. Someone did a really in depth analysis of how good his decision making, adjustments and command of the offense were.

 

The other three are all the same and it is all about his footwork

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10 hours ago, thadude said:

Hack was so awful in TC and preseason last year he was wearing plain clothes up until like week 16 and Geno and Petty were both injured.  Macc's reputation is invested in Hack being good yet he and Bowles were so scared by Hack in practice they didn't even have him on the playing roster as a backup for 90% of the season.

Christian Hacknberg is absolutely horrible.  Won't be in the NFL in 2018

"What can men do against such reckless hate?"

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Hackenberg's not good behind a bad OL. You could see this in the preseason. But when protected he can pick a defense apart. Also was evident last preseason in the first drive against the Giants. People seem to forget that the Jets said he was sitting all year soon after they picked him in the draft last year. They also seem to forget that he just turned 22 years old not so long ago. I swear the beat writers can write made up trash and half the Jets fans will buy it every time. Just like this time last year they were writing about Hackenberg's throwing mechanics. His throwing mechanics were never the issue. It is footwork and throwing under pressure that were the issue. He needs a clean pocket to step into his throws or his accuracy is horrible. Both issues are really common problems for even pro bowl QB's.

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7 hours ago, RSJ said:

Hackenberg's not good behind a bad OL. You could see this in the preseason. But when protected he can pick a defense apart. Also was evident last preseason in the first drive against the Giants. People seem to forget that the Jets said he was sitting all year soon after they picked him in the draft last year. They also seem to forget that he just turned 22 years old not so long ago. I swear the beat writers can write made up trash and half the Jets fans will buy it every time. Just like this time last year they were writing about Hackenberg's throwing mechanics. His throwing mechanics were never the issue. It is footwork and throwing under pressure that were the issue. He needs a clean pocket to step into his throws or his accuracy is horrible. Both issues are really common problems for even pro bowl QB's.

Game. Set. Match. I mean there's not much else to say. This is the Hack situation.

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1 hour ago, Scott Dierking said:

Here is the issue with Hackenberg, you can comp his numbers all that you want against other qb's in the history of college football that were drafted, but you cannot duplicate what his program experienced as he committed to the program:

-PSU was limited to 15 scholarships a year, and 60 scholarships on the team in total in any given year. An unsanctioned program has 85 schollies as a full allotment.

   Guess what, this has an impact on what and who you recruit. O'Brien went after skill positions. He totally ignored the offensive line. Not criticizing him, but it was the approach he took, and some areas had to be ignored. 

   On top of that, PSU had a number of injuries on the offensive line during this time period.

   So,I will leave it up to you to guess what the state of the PSU line was during Hack's tenure.

-The NCAA saw fit to allow other NCAA teams to immediately poach PSU players (I understand this-punish the program, not the players). 15 players took them up on that offer, as some schools camped out on the PSU campus, poaching. 

   Guess what that does to your depth, and more so, team morale?

-As you can imagine, this also made PSU a rather less than desirable destination for high school star athletes. Really, who would want to walk into that?

So, if we wanted to put an NFL equivalency to these penalties, it may be equal to:

-Placing your franchise in Cleveland

-Allowing all your free agents to leave, without you having an opportunity to bid on them

-Taking your first 3 rounds of draft picks away for 4 years.

Now, you tell me how that team will compete, and how the players will have opportunity to grow.

 

Does any of this mean that Hackenberg will succeed as an NFL qb? Of course not. But, don't take a mindless approach of "comping performance', and pretend that this experience was similar to others in college ball.  That is just lazy analysis. No college QB ever had that experience.

 

 

 

Dude, at least cite your sources:

 

IMG_0545.JPG

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Just now, T0mShane said:

Dude, at least cite your sources:

 

IMG_0545.JPG

Tell me where my facts are wrong? 

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So much talk based on so little.

Relax folks. We'll see for ourselves soon enough if Hack sucks or Hack has potential. O the NFL field, where it matters.

No need to rush it, Hack is a Jet in 2017. He will get his shot, and we'll all see it.

There is no need or cause to decide what Hack is now, today. Let it play out.

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16 minutes ago, Warfish said:

So much talk based on so little.

Relax folks. We'll see for ourselves soon enough if Hack sucks or Hack has potential. O the NFL field, where it matters.

No need to rush it, Hack is a Jet in 2017. He will get his shot, and we'll all see it.

There is no need or cause to decide what Hack is now, today. Let it play out.

This. I truly don't understand why everyone is so distraught right now... chill. 

Worst case scenario is we still have no QB, which means ZERO adjustment to Jet fan expectations. Best case, we do. Only good thing come from this. But yea, let's go on the internet and plaster our neurosis all over the place for sh*ts and giggles.

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2 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

Here is the issue with Hackenberg, you can comp his numbers all that you want against other qb's in the history of college football that were drafted, but you cannot duplicate what his program experienced as he committed to the program:

-PSU was limited to 15 scholarships a year, and 60 scholarships on the team in total in any given year. An unsanctioned program has 85 schollies as a full allotment.

   Guess what, this has an impact on what and who you recruit. O'Brien went after skill positions. He totally ignored the offensive line. Not criticizing him, but it was the approach he took, and some areas had to be ignored. 

   On top of that, PSU had a number of injuries on the offensive line during this time period.

   So,I will leave it up to you to guess what the state of the PSU line was during Hack's tenure.

-The NCAA saw fit to allow other NCAA teams to immediately poach PSU players (I understand this-punish the program, not the players). 15 players took them up on that offer, as some schools camped out on the PSU campus, poaching. 

   Guess what that does to your depth, and more so, team morale?

-As you can imagine, this also made PSU a rather less than desirable destination for high school star athletes. Really, who would want to walk into that?

So, if we wanted to put an NFL equivalency to these penalties, it may be equal to:

-Placing your franchise in Cleveland

-Allowing all your free agents to leave, without you having an opportunity to bid on them

-Taking your first 3 rounds of draft picks away for 4 years.

Now, you tell me how that team will compete, and how the players will have opportunity to grow.

 

Does any of this mean that Hackenberg will succeed as an NFL qb? Of course not. But, don't take a mindless approach of "comping performance', and pretend that this experience was similar to others in college ball.  That is just lazy analysis. No college QB ever had that experience.

 

 

 

Excited to see the Jets version of this list seven months from now.

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5 minutes ago, dbatesman said:

Excited to see the Jets version of this list seven months from now.

Are you suggesting the Jets will be sanctioned? Maybe that is the way to go.

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4 hours ago, Scott Dierking said:

Here is the issue with Hackenberg, you can comp his numbers all that you want against other qb's in the history of college football that were drafted, but you cannot duplicate what his program experienced as he committed to the program:

-PSU was limited to 15 scholarships a year, and 60 scholarships on the team in total in any given year. An unsanctioned program has 85 schollies as a full allotment.

   Guess what, this has an impact on what and who you recruit. O'Brien went after skill positions. He totally ignored the offensive line. Not criticizing him, but it was the approach he took, and some areas had to be ignored. 

   On top of that, PSU had a number of injuries on the offensive line during this time period.

   So,I will leave it up to you to guess what the state of the PSU line was during Hack's tenure.

-The NCAA saw fit to allow other NCAA teams to immediately poach PSU players (I understand this-punish the program, not the players). 15 players took them up on that offer, as some schools camped out on the PSU campus, poaching. 

   Guess what that does to your depth, and more so, team morale?

-As you can imagine, this also made PSU a rather less than desirable destination for high school star athletes. Really, who would want to walk into that?

So, if we wanted to put an NFL equivalency to these penalties, it may be equal to:

-Placing your franchise in Cleveland

-Allowing all your free agents to leave, without you having an opportunity to bid on them

-Taking your first 3 rounds of draft picks away for 4 years.

Now, you tell me how that team will compete, and how the players will have opportunity to grow.

 

Does any of this mean that Hackenberg will succeed as an NFL qb? Of course not. But, don't take a mindless approach of "comping performance', and pretend that this experience was similar to others in college ball.  That is just lazy analysis. No college QB ever had that experience.

 

 

 

I am well aware that he was not in a good situation.  But as you say, it doesn't mean he'll succeed.  And, one could argue that simply accepting all of his excuses would be an equally mindless or lazy approach.  Because, I'm not worried about how Hackenberg and Penn State competed in the wins/losses column.  I'm concerned with the fact that he greatly struggled to complete passes, at a level that's generally unprecedented for QBs who turn out to be successful in the NFL.

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4 minutes ago, gEYno said:

I am well aware that he was not in a good situation.  But as you say, it doesn't mean he'll succeed.  And, one could argue that simply accepting all of his excuses would be an equally mindless or lazy approach.  Because, I'm not worried about how Hackenberg and Penn State competed in the wins/losses column.  I'm concerned with the fact that he greatly struggled to complete passes, at a level that's generally unprecedented for QBs who turn out to be successful in the NFL.

Awful hard to complete passes when your literally running for your life on every snap. Ask David Carr how that scenario plays out.

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I am getting a little sick and tired of hearing about David Carr.  We have to redshirt our 2nd rounder because... David Carr?  David Carr completed 60% of his passes as a Texan.  68+% his last year there.  Hackenberg never completed 59% in college and he got worse every year.   I know, I know,  James Franklin FTMFW!

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