Fair assessment of Hack

[Tinstar]

After 4 preseason Games, Hackenberg gets a grade of (D) from this poster . He now stands squarely behind Bryce Petty in my QB rotation . 

[SMC]

This situation reminds me of an interview with an old-time baseball scout.  The scout mentioned his talk with parents of high school baseball players and his simple statement to them: "You can't hide talent."  Bad coaches, bad teammates, etc. can't hide your son's talent.  If your son is good, everyone will see it.

Being able to make professional throws on occasion isn't the answer.  Hack's talent should have shown through by now, and it hasn't.  Will it later?  Who knows, but by now after this considerable time as a professional, it is concerning that we have not.

Also, we can't ignore the fact that Hack was bad the last 2 years in college.  There is reason to believe that his freshman year was an aberration, not the rule.

[varjet]

I think where we are today is a symptom of many miscues by the Jets organization.  

Macc tried to get cute with Hack.  He thought he could draft a tremendous raw talent and have him develop under Fitz for 3 years.   I guess someone should have explained that his contract was only 4 years, and 2nd round draft picks get paid more than lower rounds.  

There is no reason why that plan cannot continue, with McCown not Fitz.  for the record, under the desired Fitz plan he would have received 3 years at 24 million, with incentives.  The Jets are paying Fitz and McCown $18mm for last year and this year.  My guess is that with the incentives Fitz would have gotten paid we are around the same budget.

But I don't think the original plan assumed the Jets will be as bad as they are, and that we would be picking as high as we did last year and will likely this year.  The Jets also seem to have a QB evaluation problem-both at evaluating what they have, and who they can pick.  The Jets thought going into this year that Hack could have been developed to compete for the starting job.  He is obviously not ready to play real NFL football.  Some good qualities, but he is not ready.  Given the way that NFL teams are run today, not drafting Mahomes or Kizer was a mistake, in my book, that could be proven wrong if they draft someone better next year and the safeties are both good and impactful.

But unless they were willing to throw him away, playing Hack as much as they did made complete sense.  He needed the experience and for the coaches to figure out what to work on.  Now he goes back to the shop-I think the odds are greater than not that he stays on the 53 and sees time, potentially disasterously, toward the end of the year.  That has an element of honestly to it, as it will assure that the Jets draft where they are supposed to.

Petty is a good guy and has made great progress.  That progress is even further evidence that Hack can improve.   But I think he is currently viewed as a long term back up, correctly or incorrectly.  I think next year he either bridges the high draft pick, backs up the high draft pick, or gets traded.

But I don't think Mac's cute plan ends up working, and a high pick must be used next year for a QB.   We should not be carrying ANY expensive one year veterans.  McClendon, Skrine, Ealy, Richardson-send them on.  We need a high pick QB, and we do not have the currency to trade up for one.  Our young defenders should be playing hard.  We don't need old, temporary defenders winning us games.

I thought to myself picking Hack in the second round is no big deal, second round bust qbs happen all the time, etc.  Then I looked up NFL Draft History.  With one BIG exception, GMs that drafted flopped QBs in the 1st and 2nd rounds did not end up well.  Over the last 10 drafts, you have Lynch (1-I am calling it early), Manziel (1), (spotting Bortles (1), Manuel (1), Geno (2), Breeden (1), Tebow (1), Osweiler and Clausen (2), Sanchez and Freeman (1), Pat White (2), Locker, Ponder and Gabbert (1), Brohm and Henne (late bloomer)(2).  Elway saved himself by signing Manning and picking that defense (I think that is Matt Russell), because otherwise his QBs are not pretty.  Smart NFL teams nowadays wait until usually the 4th round to take good qbs who need development.  Those stories appear to be going better.  I have not decided whether Buffalo is going to out tank us, or if Peterman is going to make Macc resign on the spot.  Maybe both.

Hack's rightful place is the practice squad, and the Jets need a practice squash QB who could compete with Hack for QB 3 next year.   I don't know whether the Jets have the nerve to do that.   I also think that people overestimate the desire of another NFL team to sign Hack to the 53 given the disaster that he is currently.  That is not to say that he would not have been picked by someone in the lower rounds and still be on their 53, but he would have been drafted by a team that had a real coaching staff last year, and otherwise better run.  Now he is toxic until he can be detoxified.  

Hack will continue to be an enigma, which is why he was overdrafted.  If Petty continues to develop, he will be a long-term NFL employee, like Kellen Clemens.  Hack will need to get the game better to have that opportunity.

But for now, I think the writing is on the wall, and I think the Jets can be in a good long term QB spot.  There are 5 QBs that sound great next year.  i would like to see us not have to pay for a backup, and hopefully Petty or Hack are good enough next year so the new FQB does not start right away.  That should also get us a better draft pick in 2019, right before the push to competiveness.

 

[56mehl56]

2 hours ago, SMC said:

This a thousand times.

Hack has been a professional football player for over a year, went through 2 NFL training camps, 1 full NFL offseason with OTAs, has been to every meeting, participated in every practice, etc.  The notion that Hack is essentially a rookie is ridiculous.

Yes 2 NFL training camps with different OC's, QB coaches and a different offensive philosophy WCO , so yes he's physically been here two years but in essence he's a rookie.

[glenn31]

On 9/1/2017 at 6:47 AM, Kleckineau said:

Once was more than enough. The Sandusky "joke" is needless and beyond poor form.

[jgb]

On 9/1/2017 at 0:52 PM, batman10023 said:

Were you top 100 in your field at 22 years old?

were you the best in your field coming out of high school?

even if he continues to be terrible he's had more success than most in his line of work 

 

So the barometer for NFL QB success is whether you are better at throwing a football than a random JN poster is at unclogging toilets. Man talk about a self-defeating argument.

[batman10023]

On 9/1/2017 at 6:29 AM, Ghost said:

No, I have not. Teaching is my passion. I like to think I'm really good at it, and I actually enjoy it. He may make more money than I am, but I'm more successful at mine than he is with his "career." 

 

The only reason he's on the roster now is because we are the only franchise that would invest a 2nd rounder in him. 

You said he should retire and do something he is good at.  I am sure your students love your positive encouragement that you give to them. 

[batman10023]

On 9/1/2017 at 1:42 PM, Jet_Engine1 said:

At 22 years old, I was able to perform the job I was in at the time proficiently. Was I "top 100"? No not even close. I'd reserve that kind of status for the Special Ops guys lol. But I was proficient and dependable, and able to perform my duties in a high stress, dangerous environment at a high skill level. 

 

I didnt go to the Desert, sh*t my pants, start crying, and forget how to operate my M-249. 

 

16 minutes ago, jgb said:

So the barometer for NFL QB success is whether you are better at throwing a football than a random JN poster is at unclogging toilets. Man talk about a self-defeating argument.

My point wasn't to defend hack. He hasn't looked good this preseason.  But to tell him to retire and do something he's good at is just a snarky thing to say.  

[jgb]

11 minutes ago, batman10023 said:

 

My point wasn't to defend hack. He hasn't looked good this preseason.  But to tell him to retire and do something he's good at is just a snarky thing to say.  

You better hire a staff if you're planning to defend us against snark all season long

[Joejet]

I think we should have 2 or 3 more Hack threads so that both sides can repost all of their "thoughts", again and again and again!

[SMC]

23 hours ago, 56mehl56 said:

Yes 2 NFL training camps with different OC's, QB coaches and a different offensive philosophy WCO , so yes he's physically been here two years but in essence he's a rookie.

No, he's not.  Different OCs means different playbooks, but has nothing to do with how to read an NFL defense, how to throw an NFL pass, how to train, how to study, etc.