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southtown24th

6 of the Jets Last 10 First Round Picks...

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16 hours ago, southtown24th said:

I got you but...I've watched this team on the edge of my seat in Giants Stadium and MetLife Stadium through the 90s and the 2000s and the 2010s...I got to a point this year where something had to change.  I was investing a great deal of money, time, energy, emotions, resources in this team and I was getting nothing, literally, nothing in return. Nada. Zip. Zilch. 0.  I relocated from NJ to LA in 2013 and the distance definitely took the edge off a bit but, it still hurt when I would tune in every Sunday to watch our beloved franchise blow it...again and again and again...This year, due to the lack of ROI over the past 10-15-20-25 years, I decided to step away from the franchise a bit, put a little distance between this team and myself, my emotions, my mind, my energy...it was time.  Like an abusive relationship, like a bad friend, like a cheating wife, put some distance...finally, take back the control. I missed all of Sunday's game in its entirety for the the very first time in 10-15 years (by design) and it felt good, it felt freeing, it felt liberating.  Now, I am here to discuss the "whys"...how did we get here? What made us get to this point? When and why did it get SO bad? Welp, look no further than our first round draft pick history over the past 10 years...you can start there...and that's exactly what I did...

Nice post

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17 hours ago, southtown24th said:

I got you but...I've watched this team on the edge of my seat in Giants Stadium and MetLife Stadium through the 90s and the 2000s and the 2010s...I got to a point this year where something had to change.  I was investing a great deal of money, time, energy, emotions, resources in this team and I was getting nothing, literally, nothing in return. Nada. Zip. Zilch. 0.  I relocated from NJ to LA in 2013 and the distance definitely took the edge off a bit but, it still hurt when I would tune in every Sunday to watch our beloved franchise blow it...again and again and again...This year, due to the lack of ROI over the past 10-15-20-25 years, I decided to step away from the franchise a bit, put a little distance between this team and myself, my emotions, my mind, my energy...it was time.  Like an abusive relationship, like a bad friend, like a cheating wife, put some distance...finally, take back the control. I missed all of Sunday's game in its entirety for the the very first time in 10-15 years (by design) and it felt good, it felt freeing, it felt liberating.  Now, I am here to discuss the "whys"...how did we get here? What made us get to this point? When and why did it get SO bad? Welp, look no further than our first round draft pick history over the past 10 years...you can start there...and that's exactly what I did...

Ya I hear you, and again I want to say that I completely understand why posts like yours need to be out here, and I respect them. I think in a way it is therapeutic to try and figure out why we're here now... But for me, and maybe it's just because I watch and read way too much, I've heard it all before... It's like listening to the radio that plays the same song every 5 minutes (which some do, oddly...). We get it. We know what's up. 

But still, I do understand it. I just know at this point I've absorbed just about every "why" and reasons (both clear or unclear) why things went down hill as fast as they did, and how we're currently set up... And I just know right now, all I want to do is look ahead... Because I don't see anything else of value behind me... That doesn't mean there wasn't any value in those lessons and in understanding what the hell happened. It's definitely important!... It's just that that can only take being a fan so far. At somepoint we need to shake it off and look ahead.

Mistakes were made. Mistakes were discussed. Time to keep moving forward! 

 

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Keller was a good player whose knee exploded on a low hit and it ended his career.  I wouldn't lump him in with the other busts.

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3 hours ago, DMan77 said:

Ya I hear you, and again I want to say that I completely understand why posts like yours need to be out here, and I respect them. I think in a way it is therapeutic to try and figure out why we're here now... But for me, and maybe it's just because I watch and read way too much, I've heard it all before... It's like listening to the radio that plays the same song every 5 minutes (which some do, oddly...). We get it. We know what's up. 

But still, I do understand it. I just know at this point I've absorbed just about every "why" and reasons (both clear or unclear) why things went down hill as fast as they did, and how we're currently set up... And I just know right now, all I want to do is look ahead... Because I don't see anything else of value behind me... That doesn't mean there wasn't any value in those lessons and in understanding what the hell happened. It's definitely important!... It's just that that can only take being a fan so far. At somepoint we need to shake it off and look ahead.

Mistakes were made. Mistakes were discussed. Time to keep moving forward! 

 

Agreed.

 

But for me, this 2017-2018 has 0 to do with looking forward.  I, personally, will be able to begin "looking forward" once a franchise QB is DRAFTED, in place and starting games...then and only then will I be able to turn the mental/emotional page and get back to the couch on Sundays so I can see the bright future (hopefully) the young QB has in store for us.  This year is a complete wash for me.  April 26th, 2018 can not get here soon enough...anything between now and then is a waste of my time and energy, personally.

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3 minutes ago, southtown24th said:

Agreed.

 

But for me, this 2017-2018 has 0 to do with looking forward.  I, personally, will be able to begin "looking forward" once a franchise QB is DRAFTED, in place and starting games...then and only then will I be able to turn the mental/emotional page and get back to the couch on Sundays so I can see the bright future (hopefully) the young QB has in store for us.  This year is a complete wash for me.  April 26th, 2018 can not get here soon enough...anything between now and then is a waste of my time and energy, personally.

I get that feeling, for sure!

Here's a suggestion... I know it's tough, but I think you should maybe try to pick a couple players and let yourself follow them much more closely than you would in a "normal" season... It's worth a shot!...

That's sort of where I am... I just can't wash over this season and shut down. I'm going to follow football, there's no getting away from it!...

So I've turned my focus off the record, the score, the disastrous overal roster, and instead put my focus on a few guys that I want to follow and see how well they grow and develop... I read stories just about them. Watch their specific highlights, etc... 

It's difficult! But it's at least making me be able to read some stories every now and then about certien guys, while at the same time stay disconnected and even-keeled about the season as a whole.

But if that's not your style, then maybe dive deeper into the college games. Thinking about the future and finding 'your' guys will help keep hope alive a little too... And it's a lot of fun to watch!

 

 

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20 minutes ago, DMan77 said:

I get that feeling, for sure!

Here's a suggestion... I know it's tough, but I think you should maybe try to pick a couple players and let yourself follow them much more closely than you would in a "normal" season... It's worth a shot!...

That's sort of where I am... I just can't wash over this season and shut down. I'm going to follow football, there's no getting away from it!...

So I've turned my focus off the record, the score, the disastrous overal roster, and instead put my focus on a few guys that I want to follow and see how well they grow and develop... I read stories just about them. Watch their specific highlights, etc... 

It's difficult! But it's at least making me be able to read some stories every now and then about certien guys, while at the same time stay disconnected and even-keeled about the season as a whole.

But if that's not your style, then maybe dive deeper into the college games. Thinking about the future and finding 'your' guys will help keep hope alive a little too... And it's a lot of fun to watch!

 

 

OK...so which few guys?

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5 hours ago, sirlancemehlot said:

Leo is good, not great.  He gets way too much love for his production on the field.  This is what happens when a team is utterly devoid of talent.  A decent player gets suddenly elevated to star status.  Fact is, he was a high draft pick at a position in which we were already stacked.  It could be argued that his acquisition led to the release of Snacks, who is a far superior player and likely an all-pro in the making.  So, in retrospect, drafting Leo was a dumbass move and a wasted pick.  he'll eventually demand more money than snacks due to his elevated draft position and overrated production, just like Wilkerson.  Mac's BAP at all costs mentality is mind-numbingly myopic in this situation.  Given he added a good player to lose a great one, and spent a pick he could've used elsewhere whit more value to the team, I would argue against those who gush over his pick of Leo.  

Fair point.  And if anything he was simply the consensus BAP on the board by a long shot so I'm not saying taking him was genius, but he does look like he will be a very productive player in the NFL for a long time based on what we see so far.  Maybe not Khalil Mack / Vic Beasley productive but possibly close and he does have a pro bowl under his belt already for what that's worth.  

I'm not sure you can tie letting Harrison walk to drafting Leo.  I think it was more Harrison/Wilkerson since they may not have wanted to commit big money to two DL in the same year.  If they saw Leo as a replacement for Snacks, they probably would not have picked up McClendon.  Again, just my musing on the subject.

Looking back, you could easily argue Beasley would have been a better pick.  But people here were also intrigued by Kevin White and Todd Gurley and an argument could have been made for passing on Williams because of positional depth/need just like the 5 teams ahead of us did.   Gurley might have worked out well but White looks like a bust.  If you could tie losing Harrison to drafting Leo, then you are correct and it was a bad move, but if not, I think it was solid.  I guess the next  2-3 years will tell more.

 

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22 hours ago, southtown24th said:

Are out of the NFL...

1. Gholston

2. Keller

3. Wilson

4. Milliner

5. Coples

6. Revis (for the sake of this exercise, he is out of the league)

 

What does this say about this organization? 6 yes 6 of the last 10 years worth of First Round Picks ARE NO LONGER PLAYING PROFESSIONAL FOOTBALL.  That has to be some sort of record.

The Average NFL career is what, 3 years?

But yes, we're a sh*t drafting team and have been for quite some time.  It's not only our #1 picks that are spotty at best (or elsewhere now), it's picks all down through the rounds.

We are a team who wants to build right, via the draft.  We simply suck at the draft, and suck at developing draft picks, so we suck as a team.

Personally, I think we have had too many GM's suffering from "smarter than everyone else" ego syndrome, who seem compelled to overdraft workout warriors and to pick players who no one else wants at that draft round spot instead of picking players generally considered universal consensus guys at those draft round spots.  It seems like it's not enough to draft good players, Jets GM's feel like they have to draft good players only THEY knew about.  They're simply wrong alot on those players.

Frankly, the Jets would be better off with using the Mel Kiper Big Board and a Fan Consensus "Positions of Need/Priority" List vs. what we've been doing.  And that is seriously sad. 

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14 minutes ago, Warfish said:

Personally, I think we have had too many GM's suffering from "smarter than everyone else" ego syndrome, who seem compelled to overdraft workout warriors and to pick players who no one else wants at that draft round spot instead of picking players generally considered universal consensus guys at those draft round spots. 

This gets compounded by the Jets having several administrations that have no understanding of positional value within rounds on a team-by-team basis. A few examples:

- The 2nd round is the worst round to draft quarterbacks and the Jets have done it 3 times in 10 years.

- While severely lacking in skill positions they use first round picks on linebackers and safeties. That is not a luxury you get when you don't have receivers, corners, pass rushers, blindside protectors, and a damn QB. Those positions are what build rosters and win games. The first three rounds are where you find skill players (excepting QB), and over a three year span, the Jets have used 5 of 9 picks in those rounds on LB and S.

- And right before that, 4 years ago Idzik loads up on picks for a loaded draft class and blows his first and second rounders on S and TE. Come on.

- Not to mention that overlapping all of this, the Jets were drafting the same exact position in the first for 4 out of 5 straight years.

- A preposterous refusal to draft any offense in the first has led to year after year of eye-gouging football. Unconditionally going BAP is ******* stupid.

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23 hours ago, southtown24th said:

Are out of the NFL...

1. Gholston

2. Keller

3. Wilson

4. Milliner

5. Coples

6. Revis (for the sake of this exercise, he is out of the league)

 

What does this say about this organization? 6 yes 6 of the last 10 years worth of First Round Picks ARE NO LONGER PLAYING PROFESSIONAL FOOTBALL.  That has to be some sort of record.

Slouch

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8 minutes ago, southtown24th said:

OK...so which few guys?

I mean I think it's all about what sort of stands out to you. What positions do you favor? What kind of person or play-style interests you? What are your thoughts on how to build a team?... There's no right answer there; it's all what you're drawn too.

There's obvious ones like Petty, Hack, Leonard Williams,  pretty much every single rookie - Maye, Stewart, Hanson, etc... And there's nothing wrong with "adopting" a rookie and seeing how they grow! Those guys will be fun to watch.

But I also like picking out interesting stories or backgrounds, or looking at pieces that can help solidify a team in the future at the positions I think are important.

I'm watching Brandon Shell because I was impressed towards the end of last year and would love to see him build off that. I think OT is such a huge and important position; so having a piece of that figured out for years to come would feel great. Keeping an eye on Wesley Johnson for the same reason. If he grows into a solid center as the season goes on, that's a big deal. Suddenly even though the line might look bad as a whole, maybe you have 1 or 2 pieces to actually work with.

I'm watching Lorenzo Mauldin to see if he can establish himself as a more disruptive OLB... If they can get some sort of pass rush from him, that's one less "must have" they need... I also like the Kony Early signing. He's only 25, so it's interesting to watch and see if he can become an important piece going forward... Dylan Donahue also seems like an interesting guy who could be a heck of a later round pick. So I like watching his progress.

I'll watch Austin Seferian-Jenkins when he returns, because he's another young guy that could help anchor that position, and it's not crazy to think he will.

Justin Burris is an interesting CB who I think has made great strides so far, so it'll be fun to watch his progress. 

Also maybe a little silly but I like watching our special teams too... It's one area that's always overlooked, but if the Jets can come out of this season with a strong special teams unit going forward, that's a bigger bonus than people will give it credit for. So watching Edwards as well as a few of the basic special teams/coverage guys we have is interesting as well.

Look, I know it doesn't sound like the greatest time of your life... I know it hardly compares with rooting on a winning team... But it lets me get my football fix and learn more about the team, but still allows me to stay pretty unattached to the game to game outcomes... 

 

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2 hours ago, DMan77 said:

I mean I think it's all about what sort of stands out to you. What positions do you favor? What kind of person or play-style interests you? What are your thoughts on how to build a team?... There's no right answer there; it's all what you're drawn too.

There's obvious ones like Petty, Hack, Leonard Williams,  pretty much every single rookie - Maye, Stewart, Hanson, etc... And there's nothing wrong with "adopting" a rookie and seeing how they grow! Those guys will be fun to watch.

But I also like picking out interesting stories or backgrounds, or looking at pieces that can help solidify a team in the future at the positions I think are important.

I'm watching Brandon Shell because I was impressed towards the end of last year and would love to see him build off that. I think OT is such a huge and important position; so having a piece of that figured out for years to come would feel great. Keeping an eye on Wesley Johnson for the same reason. If he grows into a solid center as the season goes on, that's a big deal. Suddenly even though the line might look bad as a whole, maybe you have 1 or 2 pieces to actually work with.

I'm watching Lorenzo Mauldin to see if he can establish himself as a more disruptive OLB... If they can get some sort of pass rush from him, that's one less "must have" they need... I also like the Kony Early signing. He's only 25, so it's interesting to watch and see if he can become an important piece going forward... Dylan Donahue also seems like an interesting guy who could be a heck of a later round pick. So I like watching his progress.

I'll watch Austin Seferian-Jenkins when he returns, because he's another young guy that could help anchor that position, and it's not crazy to think he will.

Justin Burris is an interesting CB who I think has made great strides so far, so it'll be fun to watch his progress. 

Also maybe a little silly but I like watching our special teams too... It's one area that's always overlooked, but if the Jets can come out of this season with a strong special teams unit going forward, that's a bigger bonus than people will give it credit for. So watching Edwards as well as a few of the basic special teams/coverage guys we have is interesting as well.

Look, I know it doesn't sound like the greatest time of your life... I know it hardly compares with rooting on a winning team... But it lets me get my football fix and learn more about the team, but still allows me to stay pretty unattached to the game to game outcomes... 

 

Jeez. You are a much better man than I.  I am nowhere near as diligent/interested/dedicated to single piece developments and a micro level approach of this team--God Bless You! I am a big picture fan and observer and I like to see a decent product on the field--on all sides of the ball.

 

In full disclosure: my overall interest in the NFL has waned over the past 2-3 years so that is also a contributing factor to my lack of interest in the Jets this year--I also have very little interest in the NFL.

 

There are two solid college teams here in LA, USC and UCLA, with two big time QBs who I am watching closely...I am also an avid domestic/international soccer fan so I have plenty of diversions.

 

Get us a franchise QB and I will start to pay more attention to the Jets again...I've been waiting too long...

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While I am at it, I am 32, we started attending games as STH in 1988...I would say my first real memories of Jets games would be the 1992 season as a 7 year old...if we turn back the clock and take a look at the QB position between 1992 and 2017, this is what we see as observers of the Jets:

Browning Nagle

Ken OBrien

Boomer Esiason--I was a fan

Neil O'Donnell

Frank Reich

Glenn Foley

Vinny Testaverde--I was a fan

Chad Pennington--I was a fan

Brooks Bollinger

Kellen Clemens

Brett Favre--exciting addition, never panned out

Mark Sanchez--crash landing

Geno Smith

Ryan Fitzpatrick

Josh McCown

 

THIS is a problem. This is THE problem for me.  Can we finally get an NFL caliber starting QB who we can build the franchise around for 8-10-12 years?!?!?! Is that so much to ask? This is really what irks me.  We have had 24 starting QBs since I started really watching in 1992 (For comparison, the Patriots have had 11--7 before 2001).  That's a downright shame.  I am desperate for a franchise QB who is going to carry this franchise for years to come...that is something I can really get behind.

 

 

 

 

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