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Ascending Jets Youngsters Face Biggest Challenge Against Oakland


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Earlier this week when we highlighted a handful of young Jets players who played well in the team’s 21-12 loss to the Buffalo Bills, a pair of second year players who made the list will have a difficult time repeating their week one performance as they prepare to face their toughest assignments since entering the league last season.

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Brandon Shell allowed just one pressure in the team’s week one loss.

It’s not as if anyone expects Shell or Burris to continue to play at the level they did against Buffalo. Burris didn’t allow a single reception an on 21 pass plays, and had an interception that would have gone for a 100+ yard TD if not for the fact that his own teammate was shoved in to him.

Shell, meanwhile, surrendered no sacks and allowed just one QB pressure according to pro football focus who graded him at 80.1 in the game.  That all likely to change this Sunday.

Instead of facing Jordan Matthews and Zay Jones in the secondary, Burris could find himself playing across from Amari Cooper or Michael Crabtree with Derek Carr delivering darts behind a stellar offensive line in place of a consistently scrambling Tyrod Taylor.  It will easily be Burris’ biggest test as a pro, and Shell will likely get more of the same on his side of the ball.

Despite having held his own against some of the best defensive linemen in the NFL as a rookie last season, Shell will now face All-World outside linebacker Khalil Mack, who has had his way with some of the best offensive tackles in the NFL.

Making a seasoned veteran look foolish is nothing for Mack, so one can only imagine what’s in store for Shell who struggled mightily in the pre-season when facing off against Giants defensive lineman Jason Pierre-Paul.

Should the two come out and once again hold their own, it will go a long way in showing fans and coaches that at least two more spots can be crossed off of Mike Maccagnan’s wish list when the team’s pending spending spree and NFL draft get under way just a few short months from now.

 

 

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Could easily include Jordan Jenkins in here but based on Oakland game plan, he may not see much of Marshawn to his side.  I'd imagine Oakland would run up the middle and toward Josh Martin's side most of the time.

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9 minutes ago, Joe Jets fan said:

Biggest challenge for young Jets players is the coach who only likes to play vets. 

Yup. Totally. It's one of the most maddening things he does. I can't stand watching young players ride the pine on an awful team while better teams draft guys and get them right out there. Stewart, Hansen, Leggett, Burris, Lee, McGuire, Petty, Hack, etc should all be seeing valuable time this year in important roles. There is no excuse for these guys not to get some seasoning in a lost year.

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34 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

Yup. Totally. It's one of the most maddening things he does. I can't stand watching young players ride the pine on an awful team while better teams draft guys and get them right out there. Stewart, Hansen, Leggett, Burris, Lee, McGuire, Petty, Hack, etc should all be seeing valuable time this year in important roles. There is no excuse for these guys not to get some seasoning in a lost year.

Leggett was injured and did not play last week, not that it would have mattered. Expect lots of Kerley running to the sidelines this week with those big bad Raiders chasing him...

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Just now, ASH1962 said:

Leggett was injured and did not play last week, not that it would have mattered. Expect lots of Kerley running to the sidelines this week with those big bad Raiders chasing him...

I know Leggett was hurt, i'm just talking about going forward. It's frustrating knowing a guy like Kerley, who while I don't hate, I don't see a need for, is going to cut into the time for a guy like Stewart.

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45 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

Yup. Totally. It's one of the most maddening things he does. I can't stand watching young players ride the pine on an awful team while better teams draft guys and get them right out there. Stewart, Hansen, Leggett, Burris, Lee, McGuire, Petty, Hack, etc should all be seeing valuable time this year in important roles. There is no excuse for these guys not to get some seasoning in a lost year.

Adams and maye are starting and Adams made a couple of big tackles late. Legget is hurt. Stewart caught a couple of balls. Burris had an INT. 

Personally, I want to see Petty/Hack starting, but I have patience and can wait until week 4. 

I agree with hansen and Mcguire. They may not deserve to start, but they should be seeing some action.  

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11 minutes ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Adams and maye are starting and Adams made a couple of big tackles late. Legget is hurt. Stewart caught a couple of balls. Burris had an INT. 

Personally, I want to see Petty/Hack starting, but I have patience and can wait until week 4. 

I agree with hansen and Mcguire. They may not deserve to start, but they should be seeing some action.  

Adams and Maye have to start.  Based on the published depth chart, the Jets have exactly four Safetys of which one (Miles) is still injured and the other (Brooks) was just picked up in a trade from the Eagle 3 weeks ago.  Can't play vets when you don't have any LOL.

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1 hour ago, JoJoTownsell1 said:

Adams and maye are starting and Adams made a couple of big tackles late. Legget is hurt. Stewart caught a couple of balls. Burris had an INT. 

Personally, I want to see Petty/Hack starting, but I have patience and can wait until week 4. 

I agree with hansen and Mcguire. They may not deserve to start, but they should be seeing some action.  

I know Leggett is is hurt but I have a feeling he'll see a small role upon return. That's the problem with this coach. Same thing with Stewart, once Kerley is ready for game action he's going to cut into Stewarts snaps.

I have no problem sacrificing a season to gut the roster and rebuild the team the right way. But I don't want to watch this team lose with Josh McCown handing the ball off to Matt Forte and throwing it to Jermaine Kearse, Jeremy Kerley, and Will Tye. That's my fear.

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53 minutes ago, ScarletKnight89 said:

I know Leggett is is hurt but I have a feeling he'll see a small role upon return. That's the problem with this coach. Same thing with Stewart, once Kerley is ready for game action he's going to cut into Stewarts snaps.

I have no problem sacrificing a season to gut the roster and rebuild the team the right way. But I don't want to watch this team lose with Josh McCown handing the ball off to Matt Forte and throwing it to Jermaine Kearse, Jeremy Kerley, and Will Tye. That's my fear.

Kearse is only 27 and Tye is 25.  Just because we didn't draft them doesn't mean their not potentially part of the rebuild.  In fact, Kerley is only 28 although it seems he should be older.  But no matter, I like Kearse's first game and have no issue with him getting thrown to.  It's who does the throwing I have the issue with.

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9 hours ago, Jet_Engine1 said:

Dak Prescott is "ascending". We have a bunch of guys right now. Nothing more. Its hard to ascend when you're mired in the muck.

I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree.  I don't think ascending should only apply to those players on the cusp of joining the elite.

If you're trending upwards, IMO, you are ascending.

Going from unknown commodity who has ridden the pine, to a player who has played a handful of games and played quality football is an upward trend.  You're not sitting on the bench, and you're on the field playing well against some very good players.  Again, just my opinion, but I think that's a move upward.

Either way, let's pretend the article just said "Shell and Burris to face biggest challenge yet"...then what would your opinion be in the importance of who they'll be facing head-to-head this Sunday?  Worried if they bomb?  Expect them to bomb against a couple of elite players?  Impressed if they hold their own?

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8 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

I want to see some examples over the next few weeks, before using "Ascending". I want to see they can play a little, even at a Jag level.

In four pro starts, Shell has yet to allow a sack against some very good D-linemen.  I'd call that better than Jag level.

Does it put him in Canton?  Nope

Does it mean he sucks? Nope

Does it mean he's worked his way from bench player to capable starter with the possibility of becoming a very good player?  Yup

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The notion that Bowles doesn't like to play young players is a fallacy. In week 1 vs Buffalo here are the snap counts. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyj/2017-snap-counts.htm  Take note of the 1st and second year players.  Look at the Snap counts for O, D and ST --- yes ST -- there were 26 ST plays in game 1 and only 3 were extra points. 

The first and second year O players saw plenty of action except for Peake and McGuire. But Peake was beaten out for playing time on O by Anderson, Stewart, and Hansen, but played 20 ST snaps. McGuire had 6 ST snaps but none on O. The Jets have to play Forte in the hope that he does something that will warrant another team wanting him in a trade, and Fans have a hairy fit unless Powell is the focus of the O. So, it was tough to fit McGuire in especially since he is a poor pass blocker right now. But, rest assured, by seasons end, he'll have had his share of snaps because RB's wear down.

4 of the 11 starters on D are first or second year players, and Burris played 39% of the D snaps. Dylan Donahue even got 7 snaps despite the crowd at that OLB spot and Kon Ealy doing so well.

Honestly, I am hard pressed to say that -- other than McGuire -- the Jets did a bad job of getting rookies and second year guys experience in game 1. And I bet that by seasons end the Jets lead the league in snaps by rookies and second year players .......  and losses.

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We have a lot of young guys we need to find out about, that's my agenda. Obviously it's not Todd Bowles agenda, but he'll have no choice when we know we can't even finish at .500

I can't wait to see more of McGuire, Hansen, Leggette (when healthy). We can find out if they can play this year. It will only help us in 2018 if we can give these young guys some playing time to get acclimated to the NFL. 

It will be interesting to see what Morton & Bates can do with this offense. I have no problem seeing boring offense if it means teaching these players the fundamentals of the WCO so everyone can complete their tasks blindfolded. WCO is done like building blocks. We need to stick to this offense & stop changing our offense & who teaches it OVER & OVER. 

Ive said this before, Bowles has shown very little on the defensive side of the ball (his supposed expertise) than any other DC that's bounced around from team to team. Look at Zimmer in Minny, that team keeps adding talent on the offense after building the defense, the difference is as soon as Zimmer became their HC the defense has been VERY GOOD.

Our Jets? Mediocre, making the same mistakes since he's arrived. 33 games is enough time to critique his defense. Not impressed.

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24 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

The notion that Bowles doesn't like to play young players is a fallacy. In week 1 vs Buffalo here are the snap counts. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyj/2017-snap-counts.htm  Take note of the 1st and second year players.  Look at the Snap counts for O, D and ST --- yes ST -- there were 26 ST plays in game 1 and only 3 were extra points. 

The first and second year O players saw plenty of action except for Peake and McGuire. But Peake was beaten out for playing time on O by Anderson, Stewart, and Hansen, but played 20 ST snaps. McGuire had 6 ST snaps but none on O. The Jets have to play Forte in the hope that he does something that will warrant another team wanting him in a trade, and Fans have a hairy fit unless Powell is the focus of the O. So, it was tough to fit McGuire in especially since he is a poor pass blocker right now. But, rest assured, by seasons end, he'll have had his share of snaps because RB's wear down.

4 of the 11 starters on D are first or second year players, and Burris played 39% of the D snaps. Dylan Donahue even got 7 snaps despite the crowd at that OLB spot and Kon Ealy doing so well.

Honestly, I am hard pressed to say that -- other than McGuire -- the Jets did a bad job of getting rookies and second year guys experience in game 1. And I bet that by seasons end the Jets lead the league in snaps by rookies and second year players .......  and losses.

We let so many veterans go he's forced to play more young guys. It's all he's got,lol. Without McCown, Jets are one of the youngest teams in the league now by age on their 53 man roster. Kerley won't be here next year, Kearse? Maybe, maybe not, depends on Hansen & Stewarts progress this year.

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4 hours ago, BurnleyJet said:

I'm not knocking them before without evidence. I want to see they can play before proclaiming them ascending.

Good for Shell, if he's that good at pass blocking, why not try him at Left Tackle?

Wouldn't be shocked if he's moved over to the left side at some point in his career, but not sure his feet are quick enough to handle elite OLBs/DE's.  We'll see where he stands this weekend against Mack/Irvin.

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30 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

The notion that Bowles doesn't like to play young players is a fallacy. In week 1 vs Buffalo here are the snap counts. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/nyj/2017-snap-counts.htm  Take note of the 1st and second year players.  Look at the Snap counts for O, D and ST --- yes ST -- there were 26 ST plays in game 1 and only 3 were extra points. 

The first and second year O players saw plenty of action except for Peake and McGuire. But Peake was beaten out for playing time on O by Anderson, Stewart, and Hansen, but played 20 ST snaps. McGuire had 6 ST snaps but none on O. The Jets have to play Forte in the hope that he does something that will warrant another team wanting him in a trade, and Fans have a hairy fit unless Powell is the focus of the O. So, it was tough to fit McGuire in especially since he is a poor pass blocker right now. But, rest assured, by seasons end, he'll have had his share of snaps because RB's wear down.

4 of the 11 starters on D are first or second year players, and Burris played 39% of the D snaps. Dylan Donahue even got 7 snaps despite the crowd at that OLB spot and Kon Ealy doing so well.

Honestly, I am hard pressed to say that -- other than McGuire -- the Jets did a bad job of getting rookies and second year guys experience in game 1. And I bet that by seasons end the Jets lead the league in snaps by rookies and second year players .......  and losses.

Defense. I don't know about anyone else but I've always said Bowles will not play young guys on offense. Especially anyone who is going to touch the ball.

He doesn't understand offense and he just thinks that if you don't turn the ball over then that's just great. He loves that statistical anomaly that says you win if you win the turnover battle.

He takes crazy chances on defense trying to force turnovers and is sickeningly conservative on offense as a result.   

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26 minutes ago, Larz said:

Pleasantly surprised with shell, he looked stiff and slow and confused in preseason

They did give him a lot of help. Never left him to pass block on his own. They had Qvale in as an extra TE on a bunch of plays, and there were quite a few times that he had no assignment. IE the center had a man and Shell was the extra to help out whichever lineman needed it. 

That's the disclaimer. He did do well, and I think he probably didn't need all that help. I really liked his drive in the run game, but he missed some blocks at the second level.

I think he's going to be a good one by mid season. I don't think he's a LT though. 

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19 minutes ago, NYs Stepchild said:

Defense. I don't know about anyone else but I've always said Bowles will not play young guys on offense. Especially anyone who is going to touch the ball.

He doesn't understand offense and he just thinks that if you don't turn the ball over then that's just great. He loves that statistical anomaly that says you win if you win the turnover battle.

He takes crazy chances on defense trying to force turnovers and is sickeningly conservative on offense as a result.   

statistical anomaly? Are you saying turnovers have no relationship to your chances of winning or losing? 

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3 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

statistical anomaly? Are you saying turnovers have no relationship to your chances of winning or losing? 

It's causation. Team's that are losing tend to take more chances with the ball. 

It's the same as rushing attempts. Teams that rush the ball more tend to have the lead. 

You have to score points to win.

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1 hour ago, NYs Stepchild said:

It's causation. Team's that are losing tend to take more chances with the ball. 

It's the same as rushing attempts. Teams that rush the ball more tend to have the lead. 

You have to score points to win.

That makes sense. Hearing in my head --- "The NFL is a passing league" -- I checked the 2016 numbers and the top teams for pass attempts included only 3 teams that did well last year - GB, Pitt, Oak - The Pats had the same number of pass attempts as the Jets, 550, tied for 23d in the league.

It would be nice if someone tracked turnover margin and score by quarter.

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6 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

That makes sense. Hearing in my head --- "The NFL is a passing league" -- I checked the 2016 numbers and the top teams for pass attempts included only 3 teams that did well last year - GB, Pitt, Oak - The Pats had the same number of pass attempts as the Jets, 550, tied for 23d in the league.

It would be nice if someone tracked turnover margin and score by quarter.

The Pats dink and dunk, and run you to death because if you cheat up they will make you pay for it. That's the difference between a 3 yard reception and 6 yards. Teams become willing to give up those yards and hope they make a mistake.

On defense the Pats take away your bread and butter and most coaches in the league are going to stick to their game plan come hell or high water. They make it too easy. That is what the Bills did to us and we made them pay twice then never played off of those two TE seem passes. It was a perfect opportunity to start making them adjust.  

I think the most important thing is to see what the defense is doing to you and make them pay for it. Stop them from cheating. Make them play base, then if you lose man up then you lose.

What drives me crazy is an obstinate coach that is going to stick to his plan even if they know it's coming. 

The Packers are just better than their competition. I don't think they really need a game plan. 

The Steelers just beat you down physically. Again no need to out smart you.  

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41 minutes ago, Sonny Werblin said:

That makes sense. Hearing in my head --- "The NFL is a passing league" -- I checked the 2016 numbers and the top teams for pass attempts included only 3 teams that did well last year - GB, Pitt, Oak - The Pats had the same number of pass attempts as the Jets, 550, tied for 23d in the league.

It would be nice if someone tracked turnover margin and score by quarter.

I guess I kind of missed your point. 

I don't think you can use the best teams as an example for statistics. The Pats are never going to try and run out the clock. 

Those win/loss per turnovers are from middling teams which there are a lot more of.

They show a stark difference in run/pass ratio from their wins and losses. the stupid thing is that it is them that change their play calling depending on the score but they cannot seem to connect the dots.

They run more when they are ahead and take less chances. They know that. Why can't they see that that invalidates the theory?

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On 9/14/2017 at 3:06 PM, nycdan said:

Kearse is only 27 and Tye is 25.  Just because we didn't draft them doesn't mean their not potentially part of the rebuild.  In fact, Kerley is only 28 although it seems he should be older.  But no matter, I like Kearse's first game and have no issue with him getting thrown to.  It's who does the throwing I have the issue with.

Fair point. I definitely don't hate Kearse. I always thought he was underutilized in Seattle because they have so much talent. It's more so that I just want to see guys that we drafted like Stewart, Hanson, McGuire, Petty etc get a chance. It's only been 1 week though and Stewart saw a good amount of snaps.

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