OLine > Franchise QB

[ASH1962]

1 hour ago, mtwarlock31 said:

On what planet are they arguing this?

The same planet guys like you are from who would pull Eli Manning a 2 time SB MVP, first ballot HOF QB that we WISH we had on our team, in favor of a stiff like Ryan Nassib last year, or loser Geno Smith this year. Hey in case you all haven't been keeping up on current events, the reason Manning struggles now is the same reason Andrew Luck is broken down already, NO OL.

That is what planet they are discussing this on. It is called the planet reality.

 

 

 

 

 

[UntouchableCrew]

1 hour ago, nico002 said:

Look I'm all for drafting a QB with this top 3 pick we are likely getting, but after that all of our resources need to go into building a dominant OLine.

Look at Giants, Packers, colts, Saints, and Seahawks. All teams with franchise QBs and/or elite weapons that literally can't move the ball because their OLines are total garbage. 

The leauge has moved past the stage of 5000 yard passers and crazy offenses. Defenses are getting to QBs and OLine is once again the most premium unit. 

Protecting your franchise QB is extremely important. But the idea that the line itself is more important than the QB is ludicrous. We've literally seen the ceiling of an offense with an elite o-line and no QB in 2009-10.

[68JET11]

2 hours ago, nico002 said:

Look I'm all for drafting a QB with this top 3 pick we are likely getting, but after that all of our resources need to go into building a dominant OLine.

Look at Giants, Packers, colts, Saints, and Seahawks. All teams with franchise QBs and/or elite weapons that literally can't move the ball because their OLines are total garbage. 

The leauge has moved past the stage of 5000 yard passers and crazy offenses. Defenses are getting to QBs and OLine is once again the most premium unit. 

+1000 been saying this forever...

[68JET11]

2 hours ago, nico002 said:

Look I'm all for drafting a QB with this top 3 pick we are likely getting, but after that all of our resources need to go into building a dominant OLine.

Look at Giants, Packers, colts, Saints, and Seahawks. All teams with franchise QBs and/or elite weapons that literally can't move the ball because their OLines are total garbage. 

The leauge has moved past the stage of 5000 yard passers and crazy offenses. Defenses are getting to QBs and OLine is once again the most premium unit. 

+1000 been saying this forever...

[HessStation]

1a and 1b nothing else should really matter.

you really don't need an elite #1 wr or early round RB or TE if you have a QB and OL. 

 

When i I take over the Jets I'll remember this

[Jetster]

55 minutes ago, BCJet said:

You mean a 5th round pick, right?  And our lack of a running game has nothing to do with the fact that our current starting RB looks like he is running in sand and hasnt been effective in 2 years, must be brandon shell's fault.

Instead lets replace him, while using valuable draft capital that could be used to solidify another position.   Players like Shell are how good teams are built - mid round picks, on low salaries that out perform their draft position.

So happy with Shell & obviously love his pedigree. Wait until Morton gets McGuire up to speed, got him some touches Sunday & he looked good. McGuire looks like hes shot out of a cannon compared to cement shoes Forte! Why in the hell are we even using Forte doing anything other than coming out of the backfield to catch passes? Handing off to Forte is a serious waste of a down & I think Morton knows that now & is trying to transition to Powell & McGuire. Problem is Powell always nicked up a bit.

I have McGuire sitting on my bench in fantasy as I think he'll get a lot of touches in the 2nd half of this year. If ASJ, Kearse, Stewart, Hansen, McGuire, Shell, Adams, Maye all improve as the year progresses Macc will be owed an apology,lol. We are way to quick to criticize. I don't know whats happening with Lee? Some, like Westhoff swear hes being utilized all wrong, so until I see a 2nd coaching staff get nothing out of him I wont call him a complete bust. Obviously 20 was too high but maybe there is a coach out there that can get enough out him as an OLB blitzer, follow the RB type of player in nickel & dime situations. 

[mtwarlock31]

1 hour ago, ASH1962 said:

The same planet guys like you are from who would pull Eli Manning a 2 time SB MVP, first ballot HOF QB that we WISH we had on our team, in favor of a stiff like Ryan Nassib last year, or loser Geno Smith this year. Hey in case you all haven't been keeping up on current events, the reason Manning struggles now is the same reason Andrew Luck is broken down already, NO OL.

That is what planet they are discussing this on. It is called the planet reality.

Guys like me represent 99% of the population. Eli Manning is not a top 3 quarterback. 

[BCJet]

4 minutes ago, Jetster said:

So happy with Shell & obviously love his pedigree. Wait until Morton gets McGuire up to speed, got him some touches Sunday & he looked good. McGuire looks like hes shot out of a cannon compared to cement shoes Forte! Why in the hell are we even using Forte doing anything other than coming out of the backfield to catch passes? Handing off to Forte is a serious waste of a down & I think Morton knows that now & is trying to transition to Powell & McGuire. Problem is Powell always nicked up a bit.

I have McGuire sitting on my bench in fantasy as I think he'll get a lot of touches in the 2nd half of this year. If ASJ, Kearse, Stewart, Hansen, McGuire, Shell, Adams, Maye all improve as the year progresses Macc will be owed an apology,lol. We are way to quick to criticize. I don't know whats happening with Lee? Some, like Westhoff swear hes being utilized all wrong, so until I see a 2nd coaching staff get nothing out of him I wont call him a complete bust. Obviously 20 was too high but maybe there is a coach out there that can get enough out him as an OLB blitzer, follow the RB type of player in nickel & dime situations. 

ASJ is a huge wildcard for this team.  He was an elite prospect coming out of college with ???? about his attitude and work ethic. Those issues came to fruition in TB, but there is absolutely no doubting his physical size and ability. 

If his life is together and his effort is 100%, he will open up a lot of things for this offense, starting tomorrow.

As for McGuire I agree with you, but rookie RBs, especially from small schools do take time to acclimate to pass protection, which may result in him being in that 5/7 touches per game through the first half of the season.  After that, I hope we can turn him loose and see how he does playing 3 downs and getting 15/17 touches.

I also think that moving to Petty, especially once ASJ is opening up the middle of the field, will allow the organization (and fans) to see what Robby Anderson is capable of.  He was consistently open vs the Raiders, with Mccown being unable to get him the ball.  

[BCJet]

Just now, BCJet said:

ASJ is a huge wildcard for this team.  He was an elite prospect coming out of college with ???? about his attitude and work ethic. Those issues came to fruition in TB, but there is absolutely no doubting his physical size and ability. 

If his life is together and his effort is 100%, he will open up a lot of things for this offense, starting Sunday

As for McGuire I agree with you, but rookie RBs, especially from small schools do take time to acclimate to pass protection, which may result in him being in that 5/7 touches per game through the first half of the season.  After that, I hope we can turn him loose and see how he does playing 3 downs and getting 15/17 touches.

I also think that moving to Petty, especially once ASJ is opening up the middle of the field, will allow the organization (and fans) to see what Robby Anderson is capable of.  He was consistently open vs the Raiders, with Mccown being unable to get him the ball.  

 

[Doggin94it]

2 hours ago, ASH1962 said:

The OP stole my thunder and is 100% right on. Take last nights game for example. The Giants have arguably one of the top 3 QB's in the NFL, an all time WR (who BTW I am so sick to death of looking at and hearing about), a decent rookie TE, and some decent complimentary WR's who I think are light years better than what we have, yet Manning got absolutely pounded and his team has actually scored less than we did in both games played, which is totally unbelievable to me. Would anyone have though the Jets would outscore the Giants through 2 weeks? LOL. 

The O Line makes the offense. Dallas is another example, Prescott is not that good but their OL is. Denver, Trevor Siemian? Come on he is not that good. Their OL makes him look good. Indy-no oline, and their franchise QB is all busted up. The O Line is the most important unit on a football team period.

I agree we need to draft a franchise QB with our top p[ick next year but we must draft a LT and a RT in round 2 if they are available now that we have 2 #2's.Then go and get some friggin speed to help on offense and ST's, and make sure they can catch a GD punt.

If you think Eli is one of the top 3 QBs in the NFL, you're smoking something.

OL is critical. But it doesn't require the same investment of draft capital that finding a franchise QB typically does.

[56mehl56]

2 hours ago, Tony MaC said:

What does the center market look like next year? Because if the Jets aren't getting one of those, I don't think we're doing much as far as addressing the O-line there.

The Guard spots seem relatively set, Carpenter is going into his last year and he's been a picture of stability for the franchise. Winters is guaranteed through next year I believe, so there's very little chance a guard is signed to a big deal. And Brandon Shell is actually doing pretty well at right tackle, might be best allocate elsewhere. 

As for the Left, we're screwed. Good left tackles don't get let go by teams. When Mac signed Clady last year and Beachum this year he honestly got the best he could. You have to draft a LT, most likely in round one. 

Actually I feel Wesley Johnson has played pretty well over the last two seasons.  I think the big ?? is LT . This line has the abiilty to gel and gain cohesiveness , if they can somehow wrangle a LT out of next years draft, FA or via a trade , the line can become very good.

[56mehl56]

13 minutes ago, mtwarlock31 said:

Guys like me represent 99% of the population. Eli Manning is not a top 3 quarterback. 

Not even close. I wouldn't even put him in the top 15. 

[nicg4360]

The benefits of building an elite OL do not just benefit a rookie QB. It opens up a running game as well. If you have a competent RB and a decent QB things really start to open up....anyone see KC absolutely destroy the Pats. NE had no chance against KC's OL and KC had a field day.

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[Philc1]

How about in addition to drafting Sam Darnold we hire a real GM who uses rounds 2-7 plus free agency to rebuild our O-line?

 

 

[Philc1]

6 minutes ago, 56mehl56 said:

Actually I feel Wesley Johnson has played pretty well over the last two seasons.  I think the big ?? is LT . This line has the abiilty to gel and gain cohesiveness , if they can somehow wrangle a LT out of next years draft, FA or via a trade , the line can become very good.

I can live with Wesley Johnson at Center.  We desperately need help at both Left and Right tackle.  Thanks Macc for passing on Cam Robinson.

[Jetster]

10 minutes ago, BCJet said:

ASJ is a huge wildcard for this team.  He was an elite prospect coming out of college with ???? about his attitude and work ethic. Those issues came to fruition in TB, but there is absolutely no doubting his physical size and ability. 

If his life is together and his effort is 100%, he will open up a lot of things for this offense, starting tomorrow.

As for McGuire I agree with you, but rookie RBs, especially from small schools do take time to acclimate to pass protection, which may result in him being in that 5/7 touches per game through the first half of the season.  After that, I hope we can turn him loose and see how he does playing 3 downs and getting 15/17 touches.

I also think that moving to Petty, especially once ASJ is opening up the middle of the field, will allow the organization (and fans) to see what Robby Anderson is capable of.  He was consistently open vs the Raiders, with Mccown being unable to get him the ball.  

Completely agree with you on ASJ & how him pulling defenders into the middle of the field would help the WRs like Anderson. Thought the same thing about McGuire & his blitz pickups. Kearse is actually better than Brandon Marshall of 2016, hes playing his azz off & was probably embarrassed used as trade bait. If Morton sticks to this plan, the oline can gel & we actually move to Petty at some point we could enjoy a fun 2nd half of the season! Would be the best offensive team Petty has EVER played behind with speed (Anderson), an actual NFL TE (ASJ), a sure handed WR that knows how to find holes in zones (Kearse), and hopefully 2 backs that can run & catch in Powell and McGuire, along with some youngsters coming along in Stewart/Peake/Hansen. I want them to keep an offensive system in place for once in my life! Hoping Sean Payton shakes free, keeps Morton & Bates, and gets the best available DC.

[Maddog45]

2 hours ago, ASH1962 said:

The OP stole my thunder and is 100% right on. Take last nights game for example. The Giants have arguably one of the top 3 QB's in the NFL, an all time WR (who BTW I am so sick to death of looking at and hearing about), a decent rookie TE, and some decent complimentary WR's who I think are light years better than what we have, yet Manning got absolutely pounded and his team has actually scored less than we did in both games played, which is totally unbelievable to me. Would anyone have though the Jets would outscore the Giants through 2 weeks? LOL. 

The O Line makes the offense. Dallas is another example, Prescott is not that good but their OL is. Denver, Trevor Siemian? Come on he is not that good. Their OL makes him look good. Indy-no oline, and their franchise QB is all busted up. The O Line is the most important unit on a football team period.

I agree we need to draft a franchise QB with our top p[ick next year but we must draft a LT and a RT in round 2 if they are available now that we have 2 #2's.Then go and get some friggin speed to help on offense and ST's, and make sure they can catch a GD punt.

Siemian the next elite qb out of the new bunch of qb , the guy is actually really good look at the stats

[Philc1]

1 minute ago, Maddog45 said:

Siemian the next elite qb out of the new bunch of qb , the guy is actually really good look at the stats

Siemian is killing it.  Broncos are quietly the second best team in the NFL after the Chiefs

[Jetster]

4 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

I can live with Wesley Johnson at Center.  We desperately need help at both Left and Right tackle.  Thanks Macc for passing on Cam Robinson.

Shell has graded out excellent! You do know Mack is considered a f*cking monster in NFL circles right? They need a stud LT, and if possible an upgrade over Wesley Johnson but even that's not critical. They can take a great college center that also grades out at guard for depth next year in a mid round. 

[ScarletKnight89]

We've been putting off rebuilding the line for many years. James Carpenter is really the only player we have on the line who I wouldnt be looking to replace. Shell has potential and hopefully can grow into a quality right tackle. But we need to add it least 3 lineman to this team for next year.

[Jetster]

4 minutes ago, Philc1 said:

Siemian is killing it.  Broncos are quietly the second best team in the NFL after the Chiefs

With all of the injuries piling up on the Pats & their lack of depth this year Chiefs, Broncos, Raiders & Steelers are better all around teams this year. Been a very long time before you could make that claim. Nobodies fooled by beating the 32nd ranked Saints defense. Texans & Panthers defenses are not gonna go easy on Tom Brady the next 2 weeks. Pats will probably win 1 of them but they will get beat up even more.

[Philc1]

4 minutes ago, Jetster said:

With all of the injuries piling up on the Pats & their lack of depth this year Chiefs, Broncos, Raiders & Steelers are better all around teams this year. Been a very long time before you could make that claim. Nobodies fooled by beating the 32nd ranked Saints defense. Texans & Panthers defenses are not gonna go easy on Tom Brady the next 2 weeks. Pats will probably win 1 of them but they will get beat up even more.

The Pats are still going 12-4 thanks to the AFC East being a sh_tshow as usual.  This Broncos defense knows how to beat Brady and they have already done it.

[nicg4360]

With all of the injuries piling up on the Pats & their lack of depth this year Chiefs, Broncos, Raiders & Steelers are better all around teams this year. Been a very long time before you could make that claim. Nobodies fooled by beating the 32nd ranked Saints defense. Texans & Panthers defenses are not gonna go easy on Tom Brady the next 2 weeks. Pats will probably win 1 of them but they will get beat up even more.

Looking forward to seeing that happen. It was a phenomenal sight watch KC embarrassing the Pats please let me see another.

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[Philc1]

8 minutes ago, nicg4360 said:

Looking forward to seeing that happen. It was a phenomenal sight watch KC embarrassing the Pats please let me see another.

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Pats defense looked slow in that game.  Kareem Hunt is good but they made him look like Gayle Sayers

[nicg4360]

Pats defense looked slow in that game.  Kareem Hunt is good but they made him look like Gayle Sayers

Let's just hope it wasn't just an anomaly. It's the Pats and likely they will bounce back. I'm not basing them being all good by the win they had against the Saints. They are really bad this year offence and defence. If the Pats lost that game wow...I'm thinking the Saints are going to be vying for a top 5 pick they look that bad. Brees looks like age is setting in.

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[Jetster]

28 minutes ago, nicg4360 said:

Looking forward to seeing that happen. It was a phenomenal sight watch KC embarrassing the Pats please let me see another.

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This is the downfall year, not too bad, but Gronk is already nicked up, another concussion for Amendola that might be it, Hogan is nicked up, Hightower, Birkhead, bunch of guys & it doesn't get easier this Sunday & next week playing 2 physical defenses in Texans & Panthers. Panthers held McCoy to 9 yards,lol, we could get a hand on him.

I'm hoping Brady takes a beating!

[Philc1]

Just now, Jetster said:

This is the downfall year, not too bad, but Gronk is already nicked up, another concussion for Amendola that might be it, Hogan is nicked up, Hightower, Birkhead, bunch of guys & it doesn't get easier this Sunday & next week playing 2 physical defenses in Texans & Panthers. Panthers held McCoy to 9 yards,lol, we could get a hand on him.

I'm hoping Brady takes a beating!

Brady got lucky they were facing a bottom 2 defense in a dome last week

[Jetster]

Just now, Philc1 said:

Brady got lucky they were facing a bottom 2 defense in a dome last week

Other than Cameron Jordan they have NOTHING. Lets hope Watt & Clowney plant him this week. 

[nicg4360]

This is the downfall year, not too bad, but Gronk is already nicked up, another concussion for Amendola that might be it, Hogan is nicked up, Hightower, Birkhead, bunch of guys & it doesn't get easier this Sunday & next week playing 2 physical defenses in Texans & Panthers. Panthers held McCoy to 9 yards,lol, we could get a hand on him.
I'm hoping Brady takes a beating!

Should have retired on a high note! The curse is real. Go Madden!

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[NYs Stepchild]

You need a competent Oline and a great QB. 

the QB needs to sense blitzers and keep the Dline off balance with his snap count, and you need a decent running game to keep them from teeing off, and open up play action.

You also need a TE, and RB that can pass protect and a QB that can move around in the pocket...Can you say Darnold? 

Our line looks like it could be okay. We'll know by the end of the year.

I'm going to guess we need a new center, and hope Beachum rounds back into form. He was starting to look pretty damn good in the 2nd half on Sunday. 

Shell could be a diamond, and Dozier should have gotten the starting job over Winters who should have been let go for a comp pick. the run blocking really seemed to come together once Winters went out with his tummy ache. 

Yes the Giants look horrible but their line is one of the worst in history. I mean you have to slow them up a little. 

[greenwave81]

5 hours ago, nico002 said:

Look I'm all for drafting a QB with this top 3 pick we are likely getting, but after that all of our resources need to go into building a dominant OLine.

Look at Giants, Packers, colts, Saints, and Seahawks. All teams with franchise QBs and/or elite weapons that literally can't move the ball because their OLines are total garbage. 

The leauge has moved past the stage of 5000 yard passers and crazy offenses. Defenses are getting to QBs and OLine is once again the most premium unit. 

While I agree with you, sometimes you have to take what you can get, when you can get it.  If you're drafting top 3, you take a QB...later in the first round?  whomever has more promise.

[Philc1]

1 hour ago, Jetster said:

Other than Cameron Jordan they have NOTHING. Lets hope Watt & Clowney plant him this week. 

Alex Anzalone is like the worst LB in the NFL at coverage beside Darron Lee but he is such a drama queen always flopping around with that long hair.

[#27TheDominator]

1 hour ago, NYs Stepchild said:

Shell could be a diamond, and Dozier should have gotten the starting job over Winters who should have been let go for a comp pick. the run blocking really seemed to come together once Winters went out with his tummy ache. 

I think this is one of the dangers of watching a sh*tty team.  Down 21-10 in the 2nd half and you are trying to establish the run?  Teams are going to let you.  Especially when you are playing an extra lineman at TE.  There is hope for these guys, BUT there is a pretty good chance that some of them will suck when the money is on the line.  

Oh, and Dozier and Johnson are both FAs.  Hurray!

[Philc1]

It would be so Jets if the Giants got to draft Darnold instead of us.

[Philc1]

Just now, #27TheDominator said:

Oh, and Dozier and Johnson are both FAs.  Hurray!

Luckily both are JAGs