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Breer: The 2018 Veteran QB Market

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On 10/5/2017 at 9:18 AM, The Crusher said:

" Jay Cutler pretty average?" Child please!

Mac you dumbass. Should have signed Cutler not McCowan. We would have that precious #1 pick. ūü§ē

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On 10/5/2017 at 8:32 PM, Lil Woody said:

Cousins is either a Redskin or a 49er.

The rest of the options are just sh*t.

Can't wait to see which journeyman scrub we rally behind for 2018.  This carousel is ******* awesome...RIGHT?

Cousins is a 49'er in waiting. Signed sealed delivered.  That's another team off the list to draft a QB in 2018.  McCowan will start here next year - guaranteed- and we'll draft some QB with our #1. No way Mac signs an expensive free agent QB.  This team has mediocre talent and desperately needs upgrades everywhere. 

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, BigO said:

Cousins is a 49'er in waiting. Signed sealed delivered.  That's another team off the list to draft a QB in 2018.  McCowan will start here next year - guaranteed- and we'll draft some QB with our #1. No way Mac signs an expensive free agent QB.  This team has mediocre talent and desperately needs upgrades everywhere. 

This is not true.

Edited by AFJF

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I've been saying this since camp, name recognition does not equate to talent.
Stop rating this team according to whether you know a player's name or not.
The perfect example has been Revis and Mo Claibrone.  Even now media & fans
still know Revis name more than Claiborne's.  But Claiborne is a far superior
CB than Revis was over the last 1.5 years of his career

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6 hours ago, Greenseed4 said:

They picked Mahommes at #10. I think Alex Smith noticed.  

Yup. Alex Smith finally decided to become good because of the first round draft pick.  You got me.

Maybe he didn't. Maybe it's just a coincidence that they lost Maclin, Charles, and Ware and all of a sudden Smith has the league best QB rating. Prolly because of Tyreek Hill, Albert Wilson, Chris Conley and Kelce. Amirite?! Weaponz, right? 

Yeah you goober.  The great coaching staff has helped too, the one point you keep casually glancing over.  Andy Reid and his offensive staff are a world's difference from Todd f*cking Bowles.

There are at least 26 teams with MORE weaponz. Your argument is a joke.

The only joke here is that you think Alex Smith, after over a decade in the league, has finally become a Tom Brady type of QB who elevates everyone around him and is no longer the pathetic game manager he's been since Jim Harbaugh came in and made him something other than a massive bust.

But that's cause you're not a #realfan, right? You just want to complain about the sad state of the team because our young roster is winning games. 

No, I'm not a #realfan.  #RealFanz like you have been blowing their loads to the wins against the Dolphins, who just got shut out by the Saints defense (lol) 20-0, and the Jaguars, a team that might have a worse QB situation than us.

You want us to lose so we can can fit your agenda and draft Rosen, but guess what, if we are outside the top-5 we ain't getting Sam, or either of the Joshes.  Nobody should give a sh*t about your QB evals. 

I want us to lose so we can finally grab a franchise QB. Idgaf whether or not people want to read my evaluations.

Not just because you are stuck in 2016; when Rosen had six games worth of decent YouTube highlights and all Alex Smith did was lead his team to the playoffs. But because you're (1) discounting one of the most physically talented prospects (who plays in a pro style system, and has landed on every pundits' watch list) and (2) you're knocking Smith for being an accurate passer who "manages" games because he's careful with the ball, and last season he excelled at dinking-and-dunking--Newsflash: we run a dink-and-dunk offense.  

Anyone capable of having a coherent thought process knew about Rosen and his talent well before 2016.  I said that if he was fully healed up, he'd pass Sam before last f*cking summer.  Maybe people should actually listen to me because I got laughed at then, and now a lot of those same people are in my corner wondering what the hell happened to Darnold. 

Josh Allen f*cking sucks.  No one gives a f*ck about his billion dollar body because anyone with a clue knows the guy has a 1 cent brain.  Hackenberg still has all the tools in the world.  How has he done?  Lemme guess your response to this one :"hE's sTiLl YoUnG, wE sHoLdN't GiVe Up On HiM!!!1!"  Sounds to me like you're the one no one should listen too when it comes to QBs.  Alex "literally Peyton Manning" Smith and Josh Allen?  LOL.

We run a West Coast Offense that, in a perfect world, would be identical to the WCO that Sean Payton runs.  It has a ton of deep stuff in it.  Our QBs f*cking suck.  That's the only problem that has left us a dink and dunk team.

If we can't draft one of the top-3 draft prospects, perhaps we should look into getting a decent QB in free agency.

This has definitely worked out well for us, and many others, in the past.  Screenshot_20171008-083041~2.png

Smith just happens to be one.  There are others. I imagine we'll explore those options as well.  If that's okay with you.  If not, perhaps you're the ridiculous delusional #nonfan. 

Smith f*cking blows.  The only QB that is remotely close to being interesting is Garoppolo because he was a great QB prospect himself and is in a unique situation that will allow him to shake free.  The only ridiculous people on this forum are the guys like you, who haven't learned a damn thing from Fitzpatrick and are stoked on beating the Dolphins and Jaguars.  We aren't going to the playoffs.  We aren't gonna surprise people.  We're gonna pick welllllllll ahead of #17.  We'll win today, but after that?  Get ready sunshine.

 

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10 hours ago, Paradis said:

Falk came out of the half swinging. Looking good.

Just caught up.  "Slow" start but, my goodness, did he respond well.  I want him.  I want him really bad.

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Just now, Mogglez said:

Yeah it is.

Only if you‚Äôre of the belief that any player who is not All-Pro must suck, because there‚Äôs no such thing as middle ground or ‚Äúgood‚ÄĚ players.

 

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13 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Only if you‚Äôre of the belief that any player who is not All-Pro must suck, because there‚Äôs no such thing as middle ground or ‚Äúgood‚ÄĚ players.

 

Middle ground would be considered "mediocre".  Most of our offensive weapons fall underneath that category.  I like Anderson, Stewart, ASJ, McGuire, and even Kearse.  I wanna see what Chad Hansen could do, but Bowles would rather trot out Kerley so it'll be a while before I can see that.

They are not enough to win a title and they are not remotely close to being the talent that someone like Smith needs to look competent.  At least not yet.  Our WR1 isn't on this roster if I had to guess.

This "hype" people have given some of these guys reminds me of 2013 when people thought that David Nelson was a "good" player.  Then 2014 happened and people realized, after Decker got hurt, that mayyyyyyybe David Nelson, Jeremy Kerley, and Chaz Schilens weren't the underrated studs they were making them out to be.

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2 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Middle ground would be considered "mediocre".  Most of our offensive weapons fall underneath that category.  I like Anderson, Stewart, ASJ, McGuire, and even Kearse.  

They are not enough to win a title and they are not remotely close to being the talent that someone like Smith needs to look competent.  At least not yet.

This "hype" people have given some of these guys reminds me of 2013 when people thought that David Nelson was a "good" player.  Then 2014 happened and people realized, after Decker got hurt, that mayyyyyyybe David Nelson, Jeremy Kerley, and Chaz Schilens weren't the underrated studs they were making them out to be.

ASJ, Powell, McGuire, Carpenter, Shell, Kearse, Anderson, Kerley, Winters, Stewart are just fine IMO. Could they add some players to improve the position groups?  Sure.  Do they have to replace all of them because none of them are talented?  I don’t think so.

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And we’re not even including Leggett who can’t block to save his life, but has a high ceiling as a pass catcher.

I get that fans are mad, but saying there‚Äôs no talent or there are ‚Äúholes everywhere‚ÄĚ is incorrect IMO.

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Just now, AFJF said:

ASJ, Powell, McGuire, Carpenter, Shell, Kearse, Anderson, Kerley, Winters, Stewart are just fine IMO. Could they add some players to improve the position groups?  Sure.  Do they have to replace all of them because none of them are talented?  I don’t think so.

Kerley is eh, I don't know if the Jets actually decide to keep Carp after this contract is up.  I love the guy, but we'll see.  It might cost a good chunk of change to re-sign him.  Everyone else on that list we can agree on.  However, my guess is that, again, our WR1 isn't on this roster.

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Kerley is eh, I don't know if the Jets actually decide to keep Carp after this contract is up.  I love the guy, but we'll see.  It might cost a good chunk of change to re-sign him.  Everyone else on that list we can agree on.  However, my guess is that, again, our WR1 isn't on this roster.

Could be the case with Carp if he becomes a deadline trade chip to add picks.

WR1 may not be on the roster, but nowadays, teams produce w/o one anyway.  If you have a few guys you can send out there to get some mismatches, you can win.

If ASJ and Stewart keep doing what they’re doing, those two and Robby will fall in to that category IMO. 

Then of course Bilal and for the longer-term, McGuire, who should be able to do that as well.

As much as I may get hell for it, I haven’t given up on Jalin Marshall either.  Could be a much better slot guy than Kerley over time.

Also, I don‚Äôt see any upgrades at safety being¬†necessaryūüėĀ

Edited by AFJF

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42 minutes ago, AFJF said:

ASJ, Powell, McGuire, Carpenter, Shell, Kearse, Anderson, Kerley, Winters, Stewart are just fine IMO. Could they add some players to improve the position groups?  Sure.  Do they have to replace all of them because none of them are talented?  I don’t think so.

 

39 minutes ago, AFJF said:

And we’re not even including Leggett who can’t block to save his life, but has a high ceiling as a pass catcher.

I get that fans are mad, but saying there‚Äôs no talent or there are ‚Äúholes everywhere‚ÄĚ is incorrect IMO.

Kerley and ASJ are up after this season. Powell, Carpenter, and Kearse are up after next season. I don't love PFF but for whatever it's worth, Shell is 63rd in the league in their tackle rankings. Leggett has played literally zero snaps this season.

When people say we have "holes everywhere," they mean that in addition to keeping up with this kind of attrition, we also have zero--literally zero--promising players at QB, LT, WR1, CB1, and edge rusher.

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55 minutes ago, AFJF said:

Could be the case with Carp if he becomes a deadline trade chip to add picks.

WR1 may not be on the roster, but nowadays, teams produce w/o one anyway.  If you have a few guys you can send out there to get some mismatches, you can win.

If ASJ and Stewart keep doing what they’re doing, those two and Robby will fall in to that category IMO. 

Then of course Bilal and for the longer-term, McGuire, who should be able to do that as well.

As much as I may get hell for it, I haven’t given up on Jalin Marshall either.  Could be a much better slot guy than Kerley over time.

Also, I don‚Äôt see any upgrades at safety being¬†necessaryūüėĀ

Like Dbates just mentioned ASJ is due up for a contract next year so, like with Carp, we'll see.

I'm not in love with Bilal and it isn't because of talent.  Let's see if he can stay healthy.  I love McGuire.

I'm not holding my breath on Jalin Marshall.  Guy pops Adderall like candy, but can't focus enough to catch the ball.  His suspension just got finished and the Jets didn't hesitate to keep him inactive.  Guys like that don't project well, but who knows.

I think it's safe to say (lol) we're good at safety.

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12 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Thanks.  I gotta catch up to him and Mayfield when I get home tonight.  Particularly Baker because of the upset.  Any insight on that guy too?

Please tell that me you are not even considering the thought of drafting Mayfield.

Falk as a developmental #2... sure I'd be on board with that.

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30 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

Like Dbates just mentioned ASJ is due up for a contract next year so, like with Carp, we'll see.

I'm not in love with Bilal and it isn't because of talent.  Let's see if he can stay healthy.  I love McGuire.

I'm not holding my breath on Jalin Marshall.  Guy pops Adderall like candy, but can't focus enough to catch the ball.  His suspension just got finished and the Jets didn't hesitate to keep him inactive.  Guys like that don't project well, but who knows.

I think it's safe to say (lol) we're good at safety.

With $90 mil in cap room, I don’t think ASJ is going anywhere if he plays well this season.  Jets will pay him.

My main point was that this team has a lot of good young players who don’t need to be replaced, but as I said earlier, upgrades can obviously be made overall, but what team can’t say that?

Biggest issue aside from QB IMO is Mo.  Getting $18 mil to mail it in every week is a killer.  He should be gone this off-season.  Then, oddly enough, the Jets won’t have much proven talent in the D-line.  Seems like a strange thought.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said:

Let it out. Let it all out. 

You should probably learn how to use the quote function properly before taunting others. 

Great retorts genius.  Enjoy that feel good win in Cleveland today you goober.

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13 hours ago, Greenseed4 said:

The weaponz you're touting as the next big thing were all found in the third round or later.

Part of the reason they're doing well is the man under center throwing to them.  

Hill was drafted late due to his domestic violence arrest and getting kicked out of Oklahoma St.

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Just now, Mogglez said:

You should probably learn how to use the quote function properly before taunting others. 

Great retorts genius.  Enjoy that feel good win in Cleveland today.

Taunting? I'll quote you and your misguided anger how I see fit. 

I like how you've lumped me in a category without knowing sh*t about me; like I post all the time or something.  I don't. Cause dummies like you keep putting your opinions on pedastals and bad mouthing others for theirs. 

I'm ALSO on board with signing Garrapolo, I'd prefer him to a Smith actually. Ans I was pRosen before his great "comeback" against Tex A&M, after that, I saw a QB with sloppy footwork that made Ill-advised Hack passes that defenders simply didn't make plays on. But none of that mattered once we won last weekend. Cause with two wins going into the Browns, we're no longer racing to #1. 

If you think you're miserable now, wait until we've played ourselves out of drafting position to draft our "savior" and have to resort to a mid-tier rookie and McCown. Cause that's better. 

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1 hour ago, NYJCAP2 said:

Please tell that me you are not even considering the thought of drafting Mayfield.

Falk as a developmental #2... sure I'd be on board with that.

If it were up to me, Hack and Petty would be playing this entire year, and if they sucked as bad as we all thought they would, we'd be drafting Darnold or Rosen.  Unfortunately Todd Bowles happened and we've, once again, likely screwed ourselves out of a top pick.  That means it's time to start looking at the other names whether we like it or not.

I have the rest of my board as Falk, Mayfield, Rudolph at 3, 4, 5 respectively (2, 3, 4 if Darnold pulls his name out).  Falk has everything other than the cannon that teams covet, but he throws with excellent anticipation to compensate and has more than enough arm strength to play in the league.  He deserves to be first round pick.  If Watson was a 1st, Falk will absolutely be there when it's all said and done.

It's also time that people start taking Mayfield seriously too.  He's improved from an already ridiculous season last year, and if it wasn't for his 6'1 (we'll see) height, would be a sure fire first.  He plays very similar to Russell Wilson and will probably go in the 2nd, but could sneak in the 1st round as the draft nears.  People aren't going to make the same mistake they made on a guy like Wilson in 2012.  He grades out well against the blitz, has shown the ability to go through progressions, can play very efficiently from the pocket, has faced top competition with great success, and is doing this all after losing top tier talent to the NFL.  That isn't a fluke.  I'm getting tired of people saying they're scared of him because of Manziel.  He isn't Manziel.  Manziel was a drug-addicted alcoholic.  Mayfield has his priorities straight and his head on right.  The older guys (not saying you but there are some who hate him for being a "loud whipper snapper") better get used to kids with the cocky attitudes of Cam Newton, Rosen, Mayfield, etc.  A ton of the younger generation of QB prospects have this type of attitude about em.  It's just like when Namath came around.  If you don't like these guys, you're gonna hate guys like Jacob Eason and Shae Patterson in a year or 2. 

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3 hours ago, Mogglez said:

Just caught up.  "Slow" start but, my goodness, did he respond well.  I want him.  I want him really bad.

Samesies 

 

Watched most of the OU game last night. I can't figure out how i feel about this Bakerfield fellow. He's throws with enough zip and accuracy that it's hard to overlook. He fires lots of eyebrow raising balls into tight windows... Yet there's a part of my brain that's always like "nope, too long". 3/4 of this game is taking place 3-5 seconds after the snap and you'll never have that luxury in the NFL. 

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24 minutes ago, Greenseed4 said:

Taunting? I'll quote you and your misguided anger how I see fit. 

I like how you've lumped me in a category without knowing sh*t about me; like I post all the time or something.  I don't. Cause dummies like you keep putting your opinions on pedastals and bad mouthing others for theirs. 

I'm ALSO on board with signing Garrapolo, I'd prefer him to a Smith actually. Ans I was pRosen before his great "comeback" against Tex A&M, after that, I saw a QB with sloppy footwork that made Ill-advised Hack passes that defenders simply didn't make plays on. But none of that mattered once we won last weekend. Cause with two wins going into the Browns, we're no longer racing to #1. 

If you think you're miserable now, wait until we've played ourselves out of drafting position to draft our "savior" and have to resort to a mid-tier rookie and McCown. Cause that's better. 

All I need to know about you to understand that you have absolutely no clue as to what you're talking about is watching you double down on this stupidity.

Screenshot_20171008-114420.png

Rosen, for all his own "flaws", is universally considered to be the soundest mechanical QB prospect in a very long time.  Head to toe. His delivery and footwork are flawless.  Allen is universally considered to be a wreck in this department.  Stop talking about this stuff.  You're absolutely clueless.  You fell off the Rosen wagon after he, by himself, pulled one of the greatest comeback victories in college football history?  Bold strategy cotton, let me know how that pays off for you.  You tout Josh Allen but are calling Rosen out for making "Hack" throws?  Seriously?  You're wondering why I'm attacking your position on this?  It's an absolute mockery to anyone with a clue.

L. O.  L. 

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7 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Samesies 

 

Watched most of the OU game last night. I can't figure out how i feel about this Bakerfield fellow. He's throws with enough zip and accuracy that it's hard to overlook. He fires lots of eyebrow raising balls into tight windows... Yet there's a part of my brain that's always like "nope, too long". 3/4 of this game is taking place 3-5 seconds after the snap and you'll never have that luxury in the NFL. 

Those are really the only questions I'm having too.

What I keep seeing though is him having to take longer than last year and I'm left wondering if the holding on to the ball is because of the aforementioned talent lost to the NFL.  Yesterdays game reaaaallly showed how hard it is for some of the guys he has to get open.  It really has been mostly his show this year at OU.  Everything else is there.  Like Falk, he would be an excellent fit for our WCO and I think a guy like Mayfield would develop quite well in that system.

Falk is so far ahead of everyone else as my #3 (maybe even #2 at this point) but I don't think Baker is a bad option either.

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6 minutes ago, Mogglez said:

All I need to know about you to understand that you have absolutely no clue as to what you're talking about is watching you double down on this stupidity.

Screenshot_20171008-114420.png

Rosen, for all his own "flaws", is universally considered to be the soundest mechanical QB prospect in a very long time.  Head to toe. His delivery and footwork are flawless.  Allen is universally considered to be a wreck in this department.  Stop talking about this stuff.  You're absolutely clueless.  You fell off the Rosen wagon after he, by himself, pulled one of the greatest comeback victories in college football history?  Bold strategy cotton, let me know how that pays off for you.  You tout Josh Allen but are calling Rosen out for making "Hack" throws?  Seriously?  You're wondering why I'm attacking your position on this?  It's an absolute mockery.

L. O.  L. 

"Universally", yes. 

Thats all I need to know about your position. Carry on. 

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Just now, Greenseed4 said:

"Universally", yes. 

Thats all I need to know about your position. Carry on. 

Dude, seriously. You said Rosen has nothing on Allen because footwork... 

 

1156.jpg

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5 minutes ago, Paradis said:

Dude, seriously. You said Rosen has nothing on Allen because footwork... 

 

1156.jpg

I literally said, "he looks better to me".

To me. 

I don't like how Rosen doesn't keep his feet moving or step into throws. Conversely, Allen has beautiful footwork when dropping back.  But apparently I'm the only one in the universe who sees that, so I must be wrong. 

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1 minute ago, Greenseed4 said:

I literally said, "he looks better to me".

To me. 

I don't like how Rosen doesn't keep his feet moving or step into throws. Conversely, Allen has beautiful footwork when dropping back.  But apparently I'm the only one in the universe who sees that, so I must be wrong. 

Yeah you are.  Probably because it's, quite literally, the exact opposite for both of those guys.

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