KRL Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Albert Breer with an article on what scouts have to say about the QB's right now: https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/10/17/2018-nfl-draft-quarterbacks-qb-rankings-sam-darnold-josh-rosen-lamar-jackson-josh-allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 I agree for the most part with those rankings, maybe Rudolph higher. I have not left the Darnold bandwagon at all this year. Despite some uneven performances he still does the things that a good pro needs to do. I have not seen his pocket play, his scrambling while keeping eyes downfield and some really good throws changing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadFan Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Isn't it "funny" how quickly a team's prospects can change after drafting a 1st round blue-chip QB prospect? And isn't it even more "funny" that some of the board still won't let that sink in? Goff. Wentz. Watson. Maybe even Trubisky? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nycdan Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Surprised to see Allen still a solid 3rd place. He could be the guy sitting there in the 8-12 range, maybe with Rudolph. Seems like much more high-risk, high-reward than the rest of the top-5, but I have to believe his projections are much higher than Hack's were. Will be interesting to see how this progresses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DMan77 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 There are going to be some really interesting choices around the league come draft day... Feels like anywhere between like 3 and 8 QBs could go in the 1st round, depending on which scouts/evaluators/etc you believe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peebag Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 It's a moot point. We draft defense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 17 minutes ago, peebag said: It's a moot point. We draft defense. As i said in another thread is nothing short of disgusting that the Dline which we have invested everything in over the years is total garbage right now and is in fact a legit position of need coming this off season when we cut mowilk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDL_JET Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 1 minute ago, Beerfish said: As i said in another thread is nothing short of disgusting that the Dline which we have invested everything in over the years is total garbage right now and is in fact a legit position of need coming this off season when we cut mowilk. If we stuck with a GM for a while, would we be having this problem. We've had Tannebaum, Idzik and now Mac and they've all drafted their own Dlineman in the first round. Almost want to stick with Bowles and Mac just for the reason of continuity and building. So we're not just canning each guy every 2-3 years and starting all over, wasting picks each year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Please let Rudolph fall into the Jets' lap! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Lonelyhearts Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 8 minutes ago, SenorGato said: Please let Rudolph fall into the Jets' lap! Warmer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 6 minutes ago, MDL_JET said: If we stuck with a GM for a while, would we be having this problem. We've had Tannebaum, Idzik and now Mac and they've all drafted their own Dlineman in the first round. Almost want to stick with Bowles and Mac just for the reason of continuity and building. So we're not just canning each guy every 2-3 years and starting all over, wasting picks each year. We had tanny for a long time, we had rex for a long time. idzik is the only guy that never really got a shot. Continuity is only good if the people there are showing promise and seeming to do the right thing. I for sure want Bowels gone, he is a poor coach and also seems rex like in that he is not improving on areas he was weak in. Mac, I would not be totally unhappy if he stayed ion longer but he has badly whiffed on early draft picks and his ignoring real positions of value on this team is just a huge fault. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy2020 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Where does McCown rank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SenorGato Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 17 minutes ago, Miss Lonelyhearts said: Warmer. Mayfield works too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 27 minutes ago, SenorGato said: Please let Rudolph fall into the Jets' lap! Ben Rudolph? A member of the Old Sack Exchange? Make it happen, Mac. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
section314 Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 4 minutes ago, SenorGato said: Mayfield works too From what I've seen this year, I would take him over both Darnold and Rosen. Haven't seen Allen play. Still intrigued by the Northwestern guy, Thorsen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warfish Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 2 hours ago, RoadFan said: Isn't it "funny" how quickly a team's prospects can change after drafting a 1st round blue-chip QB prospect? And isn't it even more "funny" that some of the board still won't let that sink in? Goff. Wentz. Watson. Maybe even Trubisky? I was a strong proponent of drafting Watson. I would have taken him at #6. And I would been happy to trade down and get him as low as #12 where he ended up being picked. So with that said, I'm also fine picking wherever we end up in 2018, and picking the best available QB prospect. Say we pick 12th, not unreasonable. It's very likely than Darnold and Rosen are gone (although not the sure thing some think). It's also possible that by #12, that Allen is gone as well. Such is life. I don't see another QB going before pick #12. So at #12 we would have the option of selecting from Baker Mayfield, Luke Falk, Mason Rudolph, or Lamar Jackson. If we end up worse than I expect, and pick at say, #6, you could very well add back John Allen to the list of available QB's. I'm ok with picking from that lot if that's how it plays out. Pick the best one and do your best to surround him (and Petty, and Hack) with talent, and get to it. And I (like the Redskins) would not be opposed to taking a mid-round pick on a second QB prospect should a good one fall (very possible with so many prospects this draft). In point of fact, it's not outside the realm of possibility that the Jets could select Baker Mayfield at say, #12, and select Luke Falk (who is very possible to fall well into round 2 or 3) in the Third Round. I would not cry going into 2018 with no veteran, Hack the #1 (for good or bad), Petty the #2 (or vice versa) with Mayfield and Falk at the backups, and carry four QB's. When you've been as bad as we are, developing the maximum QB's possible is no sin. All I'm saying is, we could (and should) have a good, new, talented, young, first round prospect QB in the mix next year. Hack will get whatever chance he's going to get next year as well (I expect him to be the #1 QB next year, for what it's worth, and no, not because I believe in him that much). Petty may stick as the #2. And the rookie will be #3 for a year to learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangerous Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 seems like the 1-2-3 order hasn't changed since last spring. and there's a huge drop off between 3 and 4. still you have to wonder if these guys are all being grading highly because they "can make all the throws" as opposed to having the football instincts a qb must have to really shine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogglez Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 We're trading the Seahawks 2nd to KC for Alex Smith and drafting Minkah Fitzpatrick. You know it, I know it, even Jon Snow knows it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogglez Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 And Josh Allen still sucks. Mayfield, Rudolph, and Falk are all better but, you know, "traits" and stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennington Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Mogglez said: And Josh Allen still sucks. Mayfield, Rudolph, and Falk are all better but, you know, "traits" and stuff. You couldn't be more wrong about Josh Allen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Warfish said: I would not cry going into 2018 with no veteran, Hack the #1 (for good or bad), Petty the #2 (or vice versa) with Mayfield and Falk at the backups, and carry four QB's. When you've been as bad as we are, developing the maximum QB's possible is no sin. I don't disagree with your wish, but IMO carrying 4 QBs means developing zero. Especially for this administration. If they can't tell who is better between 2 rookies and the guys they already have, shame on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogglez Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 27 minutes ago, Pennington said: You couldn't be more wrong about Josh Allen. Oh this should be fun. Go ahead. Enlighten me as to how I'm wrong. Show me the light that is Josh Allen. Please, tell me how the one read, inaccurate QB, who is awful against big competition, with pitiful accuracy, poor footwork, and mechanics is actually a good prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beerfish Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Baker Mayfield in my mind is getting way over hyped on these forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoot-Face Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 2 hours ago, MDL_JET said: If we stuck with a GM for a while, would we be having this problem. We've had Tannebaum, Idzik and now Mac and they've all drafted their own Dlineman in the first round. Almost want to stick with Bowles and Mac just for the reason of continuity and building. So we're not just canning each guy every 2-3 years and starting all over, wasting picks each year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 9 minutes ago, Beerfish said: Baker Mayfield in my mind is getting way over hyped on these forums. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennington Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 23 minutes ago, Mogglez said: Oh this should be fun. Go ahead. Enlighten me as to how I'm wrong. Show me the light that is Josh Allen. Please, tell me how the one read, inaccurate QB, who is awful against big competition, with pitiful accuracy, poor footwork, and mechanics is actually a good prospect. He played very well last season against the best teams in the Mountain West when he had some talent around him. This season he has basically high school level talent around him and that is why he had no chance against teams like Iowa and Oregon. Allen is the most talented QB in the country. He has great arm strength and is a tremendous athlete. He is definitely a high risk/high reward prospect but the reward is a potential Brett Favre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennington Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 21 minutes ago, Beerfish said: Baker Mayfield in my mind is getting way over hyped on these forums. I agree but the guy getting the most undeserved attention is Luke Falk who is a career backup at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jetrider Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Darnold is the real deal and there's a huge gap between #1 and #2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sourceworx Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Mogglez said: And Josh Allen still sucks. Mayfield, Rudolph, and Falk are all better but, you know, "traits" and stuff. The same can be said for Darnold. He's always looking downfield.....and then throws the ball to the other team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Everything wrong about scouting QBs, in one clause: "If Mayfield was a few inches taller, he'd be..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogglez Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 25 minutes ago, Pennington said: He played very well last season against the best teams in the Mountain West when he had some talent around him. This season he has basically high school level talent around him and that is why he had no chance against teams like Iowa and Oregon. Allen is the most talented QB in the country. He has great arm strength and is a tremendous athlete. He is definitely a high risk/high reward prospect but the reward is a potential Brett Favre. 1. This year isn't the only year he struggled against big competition and it's not like he's barely squeaking by, he's being obliterated by the bigger schools. 2. Look at any of his tape from last year and you'll see "played well" by being the best athlete in a weak conference and a large majority of his "wow" plays are throws across his body, off his back foot, to wide open guys. When he's forced to play from the pocket, he struggles heavily. He doesn't get off his 1st read well, he can't diagnose a blitz, and he is fooled very easily by more complex defenses. Allen also makes mind numbingly stupid decisions and has never completed more than 56% of his passes. This was his "good" year, and right now he's on pace to heavily regress from that after teams were given film on him to game plan around. That's a gigantic red flag. 3. "Has all the physical tools, doesn't have weapons, might defy all logical thinking and become the next Brett Favre" Gee, where have I heard that before...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogglez Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 16 minutes ago, sourceworx said: The same can be said for Darnold. He always keeps eyes looking down the field.....and then throws the ball to the other team. I think Darnold needs another year of seasoning and have said that plenty of times throughout this college season. That being said, he still is a far better prospect than Allen. His pocket presence, accuracy, and ability to move within the pocket are great. These are all things that are NEEDED at the next level and that Allen doesn't possess. When you watch Darnold's film, you see a guy who is trying to play hero ball because of injuries to his o-line and too much young/raw talent around him. He also needs to adjust to the fact that teams have adjusted to his tendencies so the fault also lies with him. The way Sam carved up Stanford should show you all you need to put these guys on totally different platforms. He can be great, but it's up to him. Their struggles are similar but their strengths aren't and that is the big difference between them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pcola Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 2 hours ago, Mogglez said: And Josh Allen still sucks. Mayfield, Rudolph, and Falk are all better but, you know, "traits" and stuff. The ONLY way Allen makes it is if a team with an already established star QB drafts him. That way they can give him a lobotomy to forget everything he thinks he knows about about being a QB and take three years to re teach him. While I have all the faith in the world in Morton and Bates, the Jets don't have a legit starter and need someone to take over at some point next season. Now if we can get someone like Rudolph, Mayfield, or Finley and then we use our 5th rounder on Allen, I can live with that. But if Allen is truly the third best QB in this draft, we are screwed. Because it looks like we won't be anywhere near high enough to get Darnold or Rosen. Because IMO, Allen isn't an option for this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RESNewYork Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 Since I don't watch college ball I used to try and read up on prospects when all the draftniks and fans start writing about prospects at the end of the season. And I've come to realize that nobody knows anything about scouting the QB position. Payed professionals get it wrong, down to "draftniks" down to fans. If they were right about one prospect, then they were wrong about 5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sourceworx Posted October 17, 2017 Share Posted October 17, 2017 1 hour ago, Mogglez said: I think Darnold needs another year of seasoning and have said that plenty of times throughout this college season. That being said, he still is a far better prospect than Allen. His pocket presence, accuracy, and ability to move within the pocket are great. These are all things that are NEEDED at the next level and that Allen doesn't possess. When you watch Darnold's film, you see a guy who is trying to play hero ball because of injuries to his o-line and too much young/raw talent around him. He also needs to adjust to the fact that teams have adjusted to his tendencies so the fault also lies with him. The way Sam carved up Stanford should show you all you need to put these guys on totally different platforms. He can be great, but it's up to him. Their struggles are similar but their strengths aren't and that is the big difference between them Darnold being less sh!tty than Allen doesn't make him a good player. Maybe he'll be a good player down the road. I don't know. But right now he sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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