****THE OFFICIAL BIG EAST BBALL THREAD****

[gangreenman]

Big East basketball season is HERE!!!

Gtown and Uconn started things off last night in a big fashion, with Gtown prevailing by 11.

Syracuse opens tonight against Seton Hall at home. Let the mayhem begin, and GO ORANGE!!!

[Jetsfan80]

Conference play is in full swing, yet this thread is STILL dead. Luckily, Jetsfan80 is to the rescue to revive it. My observations:

1) I think that Jay Wright's Villanova squad is ready for glory. Maybe not top 3 glory, but top 6 glory and a nice seed when they eventually reach the NCAA Tournament. Scottie Reynolds is good, real good, and in a guard's game, that's incredibly important.

2) Pittsburgh barely beat Rutgers, 78-72, to keep their undefeated mark alive. Does this: a) Speak ill of Pitt? Speak well of Rutgers? c) Speak to the league's parity? or d) All of the above? Not sure, but Georgetown is the team to beat by default.

3) Its insane that the league is inviting all 16 teams to the conference tourney. Asking a team to play 3 or 4 games in 4 days, as most leagues do it, to win a league title is bad enough, but 5 games in 5 days? Come on now, even 20-year old kids have limits.

4) Luke Harangody of Notre Dame is a BEAST. He looks kind of weird, but still, beastly. Not sure where NDU figures into the Big East this year, but my guess is 3rd or 4th.

5) I hate UCONN and I hate Jim Calhoun. I also hate Jim Boeheim. They've been exposed as whining crybabys and only just above average coaching minds, and its about time the Big East pounds the hell out of them to emphasize it.

6) Who's going to be that one unlucky head coach that has to explain to his AD why his team finished in 16th place this season? I'll go with Norm Roberts of St. John's.

[uart]

Ugh. Villanova is down 32-26 against Marquette at the Half.

[gangreenman]

Ugh. Villanova is down 32-26 against Marquette at the Half.

Three days in and conference play has already been crazy and fun to watch.

As to the comment about 'Nova's coach being ready... That defense is really going to need to step up. Especially considering they have no dominant big men to control the middle. They were killed by the open threes they gave up to Marquette today. This loss isn't that bad for 'Nova though. As the announcers pointed out at several points during the game, with how deep and tough the conference is this year, the reg. season champion will probably finish with three or four losses in conference. Better to get it over with and learn early, as opposed to late in February when every game will just mean that much more.

Pitt-Gtown should be a lot of fun to watch on Saturday. Haven't seen Pitt much this season, so Im looking forward to seeing how they match up with the Hoyas.

As for Calgoon and Boeheim, you can hate them and call them whiners all you want, but they are two of the winningest coaches in Big East and NCAA history. The JTIII, JB, JC coaching rivalry has always made Big East play that much more interesting, especially when the conference isn't as stacked as it is this year.

I'm going with either USF, SJU, or Cinci to finish last in the BE this season... By mid-January they'll most likely be playing mainly for pride. Not that they're particularly bad teams, but the BE is just THAT loaded this year.

[gangreenman]

BIG EAST PREDICTIONS:

Regular Season champion:

Pittsburgh -- Of all the great teams that are in the conference this year, they have the best all-around team in terms of big men, shooters, and experience. Pitt is my early pick to finish the regular season atop the Big East, and they're not going to be an easy out come tourney time either.

BE Tourney seeds:

1. Pittsburgh

2. Notre Dame

3. Georgetown

4. Uconn(victs)

5. Syracuse

6. Louisville

7. Villanova

8. Marquette

9. West Virginia

10. Rutgers

11. Seton Hall

12. Providence

13. St Johns

14. Depaul

15. Cincinatti

16. South Florida

NCAA Tournament teams (seedings):

Pittsburgh (1)

Uconn (2)

Georgetown (2)

Notre Dame (3)

Syracuse (4)

L'Ville (6)

'Nova (6)

Marquette (8)

West Virginia (10)

Biggest Surprise: Georgetown -- A team nobody was sure of coming in, they'll do well enough in conference play, and will earn themselves a top 3 seed in the NCAA tournament.

Biggest Disappointment: Lousiville - A year when people were predicting a possible final four. They come out losing three OOC games, and fall to a 6th seed in the BE tournament due to a strong second half of conference play. They earn a 6 spot in the NCAA's for their late run in the reg season and BE tourney.

Sleeper team: Seton Hall -- Nobody expects anything from Seton Hall, but they came out with a strong win over USC early in the OOC schedule. No, they're not at a level with the top 8 or 9 in the conference, but a couple big wins in the reg. season (they'll have plenty of opportunities) and a couple wins in the BE Tourney, and hey, you never know...

Thoughts?

[Jetsfan80]

I'll go with:

1. Pittsburgh

2. Georgetown*

3. Notre Dame

4. UCONN

5. Villanova

6. Marquette

7. Louisville

8. Syracuse

------------------ Teams above line reach NCAA Tournament

9. Rutgers

10. West Virginia

11. Seton Hall

12. Providence

13. DePaul

14. Cincinnati

15. South Florida

16. St. John's

* = Big East Tournament Champion

[uart]

As to the comment about 'Nova's coach being ready... That defense is really going to need to step up. Especially considering they have no dominant big men to control the middle. They were killed by the open threes they gave up to Marquette today. This loss isn't that bad for 'Nova though. As the announcers pointed out at several points during the game, with how deep and tough the conference is this year, the reg. season champion will probably finish with three or four losses in conference. Better to get it over with and learn early, as opposed to late in February when every game will just mean that much more.

As a 2006 grad, you all should know how apathetic I feel about dominant big men... Dante Cunningham, btw, is a beast, even if he isn't 7-feet tall.

That said, you're damn right about the open 3s. We've been doing that all season. It isn't something we seem to have adjusted to very well.

As for Scottie Reynolds, it seems that he's taking a step backwards this year. I'm very unimpressed with our guard play, actually. Reynolds has been very mediocre as a PG this year, and a very streaky shooter as well. Fisher is still learning the ropes and will either have a huge night, or disappear from the box score. None of our guards are really very good at controlling the pace of the game.

We need to handle the ball better and get it to Stokes and Cunningham more often. We need to play better defense against the outside shot. As good as Cunningham and Pena have been in the paint this season so far, we can't rely on them to dominate against guys like Thabeet, so we should at least try to minimize the threat of their guards.

Is Nova a tournament team? Sure, we should still make it.

Final Four? Not this year, maybe next, best shot is about two years away.

Will Scottie Reynolds play in the NBA? It's looking less and less likely these days, actually.

[uart]

My Picks:

1. Pittsburgh

2. Notre Dame

3. Georgetown

4. UCONN

5. Marquette

6. Syracuse

T7. Villanova

T7. Louisville

9. West Virginia

10. Seton Hall

11. Rutgers

12. Providence

13. St. John's

14. DePaul

15. Cincinnati

16. South Florida

I'll give Syracuse a little boost here. I think it is foolish to assume that USF won't be in last place. Rutgers is recruiting well at the moment, they should beat up on the bottom-1/3 of the conference without much trouble though.

I think we could get 9 teams in. Certainly 8 though.

[gangreenman]

As a 2006 grad, you all should know how apathetic I feel about dominant big men... Dante Cunningham, btw, is a beast, even if he isn't 7-feet tall.

That said, you're damn right about the open 3s. We've been doing that all season. It isn't something we seem to have adjusted to very well.

As for Scottie Reynolds, it seems that he's taking a step backwards this year. I'm very unimpressed with our guard play, actually. Reynolds has been very mediocre as a PG this year, and a very streaky shooter as well. Fisher is still learning the ropes and will either have a huge night, or disappear from the box score. None of our guards are really very good at controlling the pace of the game.

We need to handle the ball better and get it to Stokes and Cunningham more often. We need to play better defense against the outside shot. As good as Cunningham and Pena have been in the paint this season so far, we can't rely on them to dominate against guys like Thabeet, so we should at least try to minimize the threat of their guards.

Is Nova a tournament team? Sure, we should still make it.

Final Four? Not this year, maybe next, best shot is about two years away.

Will Scottie Reynolds play in the NBA? It's looking less and less likely these days, actually.

My observation of 'Nova's defense is that they help too much. There were points in the game yesterday where there was one man on the ball and four men in the paint area watching. Allowed for easy catch and shoot opportunities on the perimeter. Point being, if you don't have any dominant big men, or shot blockers in the middle, the bigger teams are going to score some in the paint. The last thing you want to do as an undersized defense is get beat on the perimeter, because you WILL get beat in the paint against a lot of bigger teams. The way 'Nova played defense yesterday would concern me when my team has yet to face the Syracuse's Georgetown's and Pitt's of the Big East. Teams that can control the middle AND shoot from outside. Hopefully for 'Nova fans your coach will take this loss as a learning experience and tighten up that D on the permiter...Otherwise you could be looking at a loong conf. season IMO.

[gangreenman]

Wow. What a weekend.

Pitt looks good, real good. Dismantling GTown at Gtown by 16, impressive all around.

SJU upset ND, and, as already discussed, Marquette beat Villanova earlier this week.

Makes a 2-0 BE start look good for Syracuse. Even if it was ugly against USF.

[uart]

I'm very pessimistic about Nova this year, actually. We're just not playing well. I think Scottie Reynolds has regressed as a PG, and Fish just isn't there yet either.

And yeah, we're not defending the outside shot well at all.

It is also interesting that in each of our losses this season, Antonio Pena has clocked less than 10 minutes.

[CrazyCarl40]

Big win for ND bouncing back from the St. John's loss. G'Town now 1-2 in the Big East. Crazy.

[gangreenman]

Big win for ND bouncing back from the St. John's loss. G'Town now 1-2 in the Big East. Crazy.

Im telling you the team that wins the BE will finish with three or four losses in conference. The Big East is just too loaded for that not to be the case.

[nyjunc]

Im telling you the team that wins the BE will finish with three or four losses in conference. The Big East is just too loaded for that not to be the case.

It has a bunch of good teams, no great teams. I expected alot more out of the BE but they had a disappointing non-conf showing.

[CrazyCarl40]

It has a bunch of good teams, no great teams. I expected alot more out of the BE but they had a disappointing non-conf showing.

Really? I thought the BE faired pretty well all things considered. Doesn't matter until March anyway.

[nyjunc]

Really? I thought the BE faired pretty well all things considered. Doesn't matter until March anyway.

SU did a decent job. Beat some big name programs who are medicore teams and lost to a bad team at home.

Pitt is undefetaed but played no one in the non conf and nearly lost to FSU

UConn beat Gonzaga in OT who has fallen apart and nearly lost to Buffalo

Marquette lost twice, barely beat NC State and didn't beat any good teams.

WVU lost to unranked teams UK and Davidson, had a nie win over overrated OSU who isn't ranked anymore.

ND got thrashed by the Heels, beat Texas, lost to OSU

GU lost by double digits to UT and didn't beat a currently ranked team.

UL lost to W. Ky, Minny and UNLV

Villanova lost to the only decent team they played.

I expected the top of the BE to be amazing and they haven't shown that in non-conf play. They have a bunch of really good teams but the league is not nearly as good as I expected.

[gangreenman]

SU did a decent job. Beat some big name programs who are medicore teams and lost to a bad team at home.

Pitt is undefetaed but played no one in the non conf and nearly lost to FSU

UConn beat Gonzaga in OT who has fallen apart and nearly lost to Buffalo

Marquette lost twice, barely beat NC State and didn't beat any good teams.

WVU lost to unranked teams UK and Davidson, had a nie win over overrated OSU who isn't ranked anymore.

ND got thrashed by the Heels, beat Texas, lost to OSU

GU lost by double digits to UT and didn't beat a currently ranked team.

UL lost to W. Ky, Minny and UNLV

Villanova lost to the only decent team they played.

I expected the top of the BE to be amazing and they haven't shown that in non-conf play. They have a bunch of really good teams but the league is not nearly as good as I expected.

Gonzaga was a top 10 team when Uconn played them, and they didn't start falling apart till after that loss. Lville has been a huuuge disappointment this season losing those 3 games and barely beating Kentucky on a buzzer beater.

Yet for all the bad losses, you also have to factor in the nice and unexpected wins. i.e, Seton Hall over USC, WVU over OSU, technically both UF and Kansas were ranked ahead of SU when they played early in the season, and both were favored to beat SU, and SU beat them both.

I agree there have been some disappointments, but all considered, I think the BE has done pretty damn well in the OOC portion.

[gangreenman]

SU did a decent job. Beat some big name programs who are medicore teams and lost to a bad team at home.

Pitt is undefetaed but played no one in the non conf and nearly lost to FSU

UConn beat Gonzaga in OT who has fallen apart and nearly lost to Buffalo

Marquette lost twice, barely beat NC State and didn't beat any good teams.

WVU lost to unranked teams UK and Davidson, had a nie win over overrated OSU who isn't ranked anymore.

ND got thrashed by the Heels, beat Texas, lost to OSU

GU lost by double digits to UT and didn't beat a currently ranked team.

UL lost to W. Ky, Minny and UNLV

Villanova lost to the only decent team they played.

I expected the top of the BE to be amazing and they haven't shown that in non-conf play. They have a bunch of really good teams but the league is not nearly as good as I expected.

Speaking of bad losses...

Harvard just beat BC by double digits tonight. Yes, Ill say it again... HARVARD just beat BC by double digits... first time EVER that Harvard beat a top 25 team.

And you say the BE has disappointed in OOC play? Seriously?

[ECURB]

Not a college BBall fan... but...

GO UCONN!

[CrazyCarl40]

I'd like to see an ND/UNC rematch with a healthy Harangody. Just sayin'.

[nyjunc]

Gonzaga was a top 10 team when Uconn played them, and they didn't start falling apart till after that loss. Lville has been a huuuge disappointment this season losing those 3 games and barely beating Kentucky on a buzzer beater.

Yet for all the bad losses, you also have to factor in the nice and unexpected wins. i.e, Seton Hall over USC, WVU over OSU, technically both UF and Kansas were ranked ahead of SU when they played early in the season, and both were favored to beat SU, and SU beat them both.

I agree there have been some disappointments, but all considered, I think the BE has done pretty damn well in the OOC portion.

Gonzaga WAS, they lost 2 games to bad teams after UConn barely bat them.

SH over USC isn't a big deal.

WVU beating OSU was a good win.

UF and Kansas were ranked b/c of name. Those were nice wins but overblown b/c of the name. neither one of those teams is very good.

The BE has been OK in non-conf, I expecte done of the best years ever for the top teams and they haven't played like it so far.

Speaking of bad losses...

Harvard just beat BC by double digits tonight. Yes, Ill say it again... HARVARD just beat BC by double digits... first time EVER that Harvard beat a top 25 team.

And you say the BE has disappointed in OOC play? Seriously?

The only reason BC was ranked was b/c they upset the heels. They are a lower tier ACC team. it's like providence losing to Northeastern or St. John's beating ND and losing to... Boston College.

I'd like to see an ND/UNC rematch with a healthy Harangody. Just sayin'.

Harangody was more healthy than hansbrough. That was just a poor excuse when he got dominated. His illness didn't seem to bother him the night before against texas. he got the Hansbrough flu and that game wasn't nearly as close as the 15 point margin as McAlarney went crazy in garbage time to make the score look closer.

[CrazyCarl40]

Harangody was more healthy than hansbrough. That was just a poor excuse when he got dominated. His illness didn't seem to bother him the night before against texas. he got the Hansbrough flu and that game wasn't nearly as close as the 15 point margin as McAlarney went crazy in garbage time to make the score look closer.

He didn't have any kind of flu. He had pneumonia. Which is a bit worse than the flu.

Trust me, another match-up would be much closer.

[nyjunc]

He didn't have any kind of flu. He had pneumonia. Which is a bit worse than the flu.

Trust me, another match-up would be much closer.

The "hansbrough flu" was a joke that he was scared of Hansborugjh but whetaver he ahd he was fine the night before. he was badly outpkayed by hansbrough he was barely playing at the time b/c of his injury. The game wasn't nearly as close as the final score indicated thanks to McAlarney going crazy in garbage time. if they meet again it will likely be a bigger blowout.

[CrazyCarl40]

If there are more games in the Big East like ND/Louisville tonight, I am not certain any of the teams will make it through conference play alive to make it to March.

ND always struggles with Ville. Damn lanky, athletic teams. Should beat Cuse though, as they are frauds.

[gangreenman]

If there are more games in the Big East like ND/Louisville tonight, I am not certain any of the teams will make it through conference play alive to make it to March.

ND always struggles with Ville. Damn lanky, athletic teams. Should beat Cuse though, as they are frauds.

:rl:

[CrazyCarl40]

:rl:

They will lose to G'Town. And if the play zone (and they will) against ND, ND will shoot them out of the building. Just like last year.

[gangreenman]

They will lose to G'Town. And if the play zone (and they will) against ND, ND will shoot them out of the building. Just like last year.

If they play zone against Gtown they will probably win, just like they did when the two teams played last year. That zone renders the entire Gtown, princeton style offense, useless. They are really taken out of their element when matched up against a zone.

As for ND, this is a team I actually see JB going to a man-to-man matchup. They are in no way, shape, or form more athletic than Syracuse, nor are they deeper. JB has played a lot of man this season actually and I can't see how he doesn't use it against Notre Dame.

BTW: Syracuse is both lankier, and possibly more athletic, than LVille this season. So LOL at the entirety of that comment about Cuse being frauds.

[CrazyCarl40]

Go ahead and play man. Gody will eat Arinze's lunch.

[gangreenman]

Go ahead and play man. Gody will eat Arinze's lunch.

right..

[CrazyCarl40]

right..

Thanks for the intellectual debate.

[gangreenman]

Thanks for the intellectual debate.

You state, with no backup, that Syracuse is a bunch of fraud's who will lose to Georgetown and Notre Dame, and now you're accusing me of not being intellectual enough? LMAO.

If we (Syracuse) plays man to man against ND, Andy Rautins/Paul Harris are both good enough defenders to shut down Macalarney's(sp?) outside shot. It will come down to Luke Harangody vs. a combination of Arinze Onuaku, Rick Jackson, Kris Joseph, and possibly Kristof Ongeaneat. Harangody will get some good looks on offense, but will really be tested on defense. Onuaku is I believe 2nd in the nation in FG %, and considering our depth down low, Syracuse will be able to stay fresh throughout the game and not have to worry too much about foul trouble.

On the other hand, who on Notre Dame is capable of stopping Jonny Flynn, Paul Harris, Andy Rautins (leading the nation in 3pt % the past 3 weeks) and Eric Devendorf, who is now coming off the bench? Syracuse is the more athletic team and the deeper team. So if they go man for the game, I really don't see Syracuse losing it.

[CrazyCarl40]

You state, with no backup, that Syracuse is a bunch of fraud's who will lose to Georgetown and Notre Dame, and now you're accusing me of not being intellectual enough? LMAO.

If we (Syracuse) plays man to man against ND, Andy Rautins/Paul Harris are both good enough defenders to shut down Macalarney's(sp?) outside shot. It will come down to Luke Harangody vs. a combination of Arinze Onuaku, Rick Jackson, Kris Joseph, and possibly Kristof Ongeaneat. Harangody will get some good looks on offense, but will really be tested on defense. Onuaku is I believe 2nd in the nation in FG %, and considering our depth down low, Syracuse will be able to stay fresh throughout the game and not have to worry too much about foul trouble.

On the other hand, who on Notre Dame is capable of stopping Jonny Flynn, Paul Harris, Andy Rautins (leading the nation in 3pt % the past 3 weeks) and Eric Devendorf, who is now coming off the bench? Syracuse is the more athletic team and the deeper team. So if they go man for the game, I really don't see Syracuse losing it.

They can shut down McAlarney? Is that why he lit them up for 30 points last year? And if you pay too much attention to him you have to deal with Ayers, Jackson, and others.

Harangody has been tested by a lot better big men than Syracuse will throw out there, and he was the Big East's player of the year last year. And probably will be again this season.

Notre Dame will do enough on defense to shut down Syracuse, who are probably more athletic and deeper. Notre Dame is not a very deep team. What they do have is a dynamic point guard who will test Jonny Flynn all game long. They also have 4 guys on the court at all times that nail 3-pointers at will, which doesn't bode well for Cuse's 2-3 defense, which they may not play. If they do play man, it's not their better defense and Notre Dame can run an offense well against man defense.

I expect a hard fought game between the two, but I expect Syracuse to be exposed by a better the team.

[gangreenman]

They can shut down McAlarney? Is that why he lit them up for 30 points last year? And if you pay too much attention to him you have to deal with Ayers, Jackson, and others.

Harangody has been tested by a lot better big men than Syracuse will throw out there, and he was the Big East's player of the year last year. And probably will be again this season.

Notre Dame will do enough on defense to shut down Syracuse, who are probably more athletic and deeper. Notre Dame is not a very deep team. What they do have is a dynamic point guard who will test Jonny Flynn all game long. They also have 4 guys on the court at all times that nail 3-pointers at will, which doesn't bode well for Cuse's 2-3 defense, which they may not play. If they do play man, it's not their better defense and Notre Dame can run an offense well against man defense.

I expect a hard fought game between the two, but I expect Syracuse to be exposed by a better the team.

Last year was completely different. We had a 6 man rotation pretty much all season, and our 6th man last year is not even on the active roster this season because he is redshirting. We didn't have the depth to go man to man at all last year because it would tire out the players more and risk getting them into foul trouble. This season we have had a 7-8 man rotation all year long, and have our two best 3 point shooters (Rautins and Devendorf) back after they both missed all of last season with knee injuries. ND's PG may be dynamic, but he is nowhere near the level of Jonny Flynn, who is probably the best all-around PG in the nation. I dont see that Notre Dame is the better team this year. And I also do not believe Gody will be player of the year in this years BE. Great player, but the conference is full of them this season. And I think there are many (Flynn, Monroe, Price) to name a few, that are all better candidates for the award than Gody IMHO.

[CrazyCarl40]

Last year was completely different. We had a 6 man rotation pretty much all season, and our 6th man last year is not even on the active roster this season because he is redshirting. We didn't have the depth to go man to man at all last year because it would tire out the players more and risk getting them into foul trouble. This season we have had a 7-8 man rotation all year long, and have our two best 3 point shooters (Rautins and Devendorf) back after they both missed all of last season with knee injuries. ND's PG may be dynamic, but he is nowhere near the level of Jonny Flynn, who is probably the best all-around PG in the nation. I dont see that Notre Dame is the better team this year. And I also do not believe Gody will be player of the year in this years BE. Great player, but the conference is full of them this season. And I think there are many (Flynn, Monroe, Price) to name a few, that are all better candidates for the award than Gody IMHO.

So the guy who will lead the league in scoring and rebounding won't be the player of the year? Georgetown's coach already called him the MVP. He's dominating this year again. He will probably be player of the year. Again.

Jonny Flynn is a good point guard, but I have heard many commentators call Tory Jackson the best PG in the Big East, but that's debatable.

Notre Dame is the better team and they will prove it on Saturday.

[gangreenman]

So the guy who will lead the league in scoring and rebounding won't be the player of the year? Georgetown's coach already called him the MVP. He's dominating this year again. He will probably be player of the year. Again.

Jonny Flynn is a good point guard, but I have heard many commentators call Tory Jackson the best PG in the Big East, but that's debatable.

Notre Dame is the better team and they will prove it on Saturday.

I've heard many commentators and read many articles claiming that Jonny Flynn and Ty Lawson are the two best PG's in the nation, and there's a big drop off from there to whoever the third best is. Jackson may be one of the better (top 5) in the Big East, but I would take Jonny Flynn, AJ Price, and Fields on my team before I take Ty Jackson.

As for 'Gody winning the POTY award, the award is sort of like an MVP award... It goes to the most influential player on a great team. It is yet to be seen if Notre Dame is a great team. As you mentioned, they lack in both athleticism and depth compared to many BE teams, and that definitely has potential to cause damage later on in the season. There's a chance he gets it, as he is a really good player, but I doubt ND finishes high enough in the BE for him to receive it, IMHO.