The Pats Cheated

[JonEJet]

Team of decade? Some Pittsburgh players feel cheated

By F. Dale Lolley, Staff writer dlolley@observer-reporter.com

This article has been read 1691 times.

PITTSBURGH - Forget the team of the 1960s vs. the team of the '70s talk with the Green Bay Packers and Pittsburgh Steelers. The Steelers wonder why they're not considered the most dominant team of the last 10 years.

Perhaps, if the Steelers can win their third Super Bowl in six seasons when play the Packers Feb. 6 in Dallas in Super XLV, that will happen.

Until then, however, they Steelers know they'll still play second fiddle to the New England Patriots, who won three Super Bowls early in this decade and played in another at the end of the 2007 season.

With another Super Bowl win, the Steelers - they won in 2005 and 2008 - will match what the Patriots have done in the last 10 seasons.

The Steelers also have been to five AFC Championships during that time, losing to the Patriots in 2001 and 2004. That remains a sore spot for the four players who were with the Steelers in 2001 - nose tackle Casey Hampton and Chris Hoke, defensive end Aaron Smith, and wide receiver Hines Ward.

"Three in six years. We've been to five AFC Championships," Hampton said. "The two we didn't win and go to the Super Bowl, (New England) cheated."

Hampton was referring to Spygate. It was learned in 2007 that the Patriots had been videotaping opposing sidelines for several years in an effort to learn the opponent's defensive signals, a clear violation of NFL rules.

Included in the allegations were a videotape turned into the league from the Steelers' 24-17 loss in the AFC Championship in January 2002. New England went on to win its first Super Bowl following that victory.

The Patriots were eventually fined $250,000 and docked a first-round draft pick in 2008, and coach Bill Belechick was fined $500,000 for the violation.

But that doesn't mean the Steelers have forgotten.

"You talk about the Patriots and the run they went on, but we've been right there with them," Ward said. "(We've been to) five AFC Championship games, two Super Bowls and heading to our third. They don't mention us in that category."

A victory over the Packers would ease some of the pain from those two playoff losses.

"We could be looking at a whole lot more if that didn't happen," Hampton said. "You never know what could have been."

Odds and end zones

Safeties Troy Polamalu (ankle) and Will Allen (knee), center Maurkice Pouncey (ankle), wide receiver Emmanuel Sanders (foot) and tackle Jonathan Scott (ribs) did not practice Thursday. ... Defensive end Aaron Smith (triceps) was limited. ... Linebackers Erik Walden (ankle) and Frank Zombo (knee) did not practice for Green Bay.

[Vudu]

And the sky is blue.

[T0mShane]

You know who's convinced the Pats cheated? Marshall Faulk. He said on the FAN a few weeks back that the Pats basically either had to be psychic or they taped the Rams practices, because they knew where Faulk was going to line up every single time, even on plays they had put in that week. I usually pish-posh the "Pats cheated" whining, but I think Faulk is a pretty measured, very fair guy who doesn't seem prone to wild accusation.

[Larz]

the pats cheated

clemens is a goner

the defense had a let down

got it

[JustInFudge]

You know who's convinced the Pats cheated? Marshall Faulk. He said on the FAN a few weeks back that the Pats basically either had to be psychic or they taped the Rams practices, because they knew where Faulk was going to line up every single time, even on plays they had put in that week. I usually pish-posh the "Pats cheated" whining, but I think Faulk is a pretty measured, very fair guy who doesn't seem prone to wild accusation.

Agreed. I saw him doing a one on one thing with Ervin and they were discussing if the Pats could be stopped. Faulk said, "sure they can, as long as they dont the cliff notes".

Everyone knows they cheated. Most players echo this sentiment. But whatever, nobody's taking their rings away.

[THE ILK]

What else is new?

[JetsFanInDenver]

Agreed. I saw him doing a one on one thing with Ervin and they were discussing if the Pats could be stopped. Faulk said, "sure they can, as long as they dont the cliff notes".

Everyone knows they cheated. Most players echo this sentiment. But whatever, nobody's taking their rings away.

Culprits like the Pats get away with a slap to the wrist to avoid taint on the goose that lays the golden egg!

But this cheating has a lot of impact on lot many players career. This cheating will get Brady to Hall of Fame on first ballot for having 3 rings when he shouldn't have even one. And deserving hard working guys like Marshall Faulk and Kurt Warner who won a Super Bowl based on pure blood, sweat and sheer guts and should have won another one may never be considered, may never get in at all or have to wait a few years before they get into the Hall of Fame. Who knows what this duo could have accomplished in St Louis had they won a 2nd Super Bowl together. We will never know.

And these guys have every right to call the cheats out!

[KSJets]

I'm surprised Garb hasn't come in yet with her standard BS defending anything the Pats do

[NYJ37/12]

Ask Hampton about the gift SB against the Seahawks. How fixed did that look? Worst officiated game I ever watched. The Steelers always get the calls, someone tell him to shut the hell up.

[PFSIKH]

Hey Casey,

[Jetfan13]

Hey Casey,

Exactly the response I would expect from a cheater backer.

[NYJ37/12]

Hey Casey,

you should lay low also. nothing to be proud about. the pats are still cheating by the way.

[Integrity28]

Pittsburgh Steelers and steroids go hand-in-hand.

Ed Hocculi says "hi" by the way.

Pot. Kettle.

[SoFlaJets]

the NFL is like a small town-everyone knows what everyone else is doing...everyone knows they cheated and no one not ONE player or coach has ever come to their defense from the accusations. All I know is could you guys imagine if it were the Jets who had done this and won super bowls doing so? Whenever the Jets are involved in some kind of controversy rules get changed and heavy fines are levied. Think about Vinny's phantom TD against Seattle...Sal Alosi and the sh*tstorm that created...hey ya know what I could care less anymore it is what it is and was what it was...I'm just glad it isn't "our" team that has to live with a stained legacy. We might only have one trophy but at least it was won honestly.

[RutgersJetFan]

You know, few things in life piss me off more right now than people who count 2010 as part of the '00's. A decade is 10 years. 10! Not 11. It's a new damn decade. It's like half the planet is celebrating Newmannium.

[T0mShane]

the NFL is like a small town-everyone knows what everyone else is doing...everyone knows they cheated and no one not ONE player or coach has ever come to their defense from the accusations. All I know is could you guys imagine if it were the Jets who had done this and won super bowls doing so? Whenever the Jets are involved in some kind of controversy rules get changed and heavy fines are levied. Think about Vinny's phantom TD against Seattle...Sal Alosi and the sh*tstorm that created...hey ya know what I could care less anymore it is what it is and was what it was...I'm just glad it isn't "our" team that has to live with a stained legacy. We might only have one trophy but at least it was won honestly.

Every coaching staff cheats. The Pats cheated better.

[SoFlaJets]

You know, few things in life piss me off more right now than people who count 2010 as part of the '00's. A decade is 10 years. 10! Not 11. It's a new damn decade. It's like half the planet is celebrating Newmannium.

yea I know RJF...I sit here wondering the same thing-it's like anything after 2000 up until the 2020's will be "the last decade"

[SoFlaJets]

Every coaching staff cheats. The Pats cheated better.

maybe but where are the instances cited anywhere that says any other team filmed the way New England did back then? I haven't read about even one case

[PFSIKH]

maybe but where are the instances cited anywhere that says any other team filmed the way New England did back then? I haven't read about even one case

Really? In all the years Jet Nation has been whining about it and the Patriot Nation has been defending it...whatever.

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/sports/rap_sheet/index.php/2008/02/23/jimmy-johnson-thinks-spygate-is-overblown/

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs07/news/story?id=3230854

[GimmeShelter]

Every coaching staff cheats. The Pats cheated better.

It still has to suck for them though in that their legacy takes a bit of a hit. Not winning any play-off games since getting busted doesn't help the old "everbody is doing it so nothing is gained" argument either. Every staff also did not continue to do it after a league wide memo was distributed and basically intended to let NE know that the league was on to them.

I don't think cheating was completely responsible for their early success this decade but no one other than NE fans will compare them to the Steelers, Niner or Cowboys dominance in prior decades.

[SenorGato]

The Steelers are a very innocent franchise.

[Larz]

The Steelers are a very innocent franchise.

**cough** cough** mike webster **cough** cough**

[T0mShane]

It still has to suck for them though in that their legacy takes a bit of a hit. Not winning any play-off games since getting busted doesn't help the old "everbody is doing it so nothing is gained" argument either. Every staff also did not continue to do it after a league wide memo was distributed and basically intended to let NE know that the league was on to them.

I don't think cheating was completely responsible for their early success this decade but no one other than NE fans will compare them to the Steelers, Niner or Cowboys dominance in prior decades.

IMO, in twenty years SpyGate will be nothing but a footnote. Every great team has something. Hell, the 70's Steelers (allegedly) introduced steroid use to the NFL. The Niners circumvented the salary cap so hard it made a mockery of the system. But no one remembers those things. You put the rings on the fingers, people only remember the rings.

[GimmeShelter]

IMO, in twenty years SpyGate will be nothing but a footnote. Every great team has something. Hell, the 70's Steelers (allegedly) introduced steroid use to the NFL. The Niners circumvented the salary cap so hard it made a mockery of the system. But no one remembers those things. You put the rings on the fingers, people only remember the rings.

Yeah. Forgot about how bad the Niners were with that before finally getting fined in the late 90's.

[RutgersJetFan]

But no one remembers those things.

Lol at the thought of Jet fans actually not bitching about this into at least the 2050's.

[Gainzo]

The Steelers have been bitching about this for a long time. I think Tomshane brought up the '70's Steelers, who were so pumped up with steroids that most of them are dead. The 49ers and Broncos cheated on the salary cap in their Super Bowl years. Shouldn't you guys be pissed at the 1998 Broncos as they were paying Elway and Davis under the table?

Taping something that 70,000 people can see is cheating? If the Defensive Coordinator doesn't change his signals after each game he should be fired.

[PFSIKH]

It still has to suck for them though in that their legacy takes a bit of a hit. Not winning any play-off games since getting busted doesn't help the old "everbody is doing it so nothing is gained" argument either. Every staff also did not continue to do it after a league wide memo was distributed and basically intended to let NE know that the league was on to them.

I don't think cheating was completely responsible for their early success this decade but no one other than NE fans will compare them to the Steelers, Niner or Cowboys dominance in prior decades.

GS fair points.

First, they were a miraculous catch from being 19-0 and a Superbowl champion since being caught. So they have won playoff games.

Second, I doubt their legacy takes a hit. Again, it is the camera usage that the Patriots were busted for. Not for stealing signals. Goodell, coaches and players alike openly admit to it being a part of the game and trying to do this. No one has been punished for stealing signals. Only using a camera and given the technology available is kind of ridiculous.

Last, the Patriots lack of success since being caught, i.e. a championship, has more to do with the D. There are only 2 starters and Tully Banta-Cain who were on the field that day in Jacksonville. They are 52-16 since that game against the Jets, so the impact of being caught has had little impact. They are not as good on defense.

[PatriotReign37]

Lol at the thought of Jet fans actually not bitching about this into at least the 2050's.

Can somebody sticky this thread please?

[Sperm Edwards]

IMO, in twenty years SpyGate will be nothing but a footnote. Every great team has something. Hell, the 70's Steelers (allegedly) introduced steroid use to the NFL. The Niners circumvented the salary cap so hard it made a mockery of the system. But no one remembers those things. You put the rings on the fingers, people only remember the rings.

At most, though, SF would have one tainted ring from '94. For their prior rings there was no salary cap (or even free agency). But in 1994 they signed an impressive bunch of FA names (to put it mildly) when it began and "fit" them under the cap. Just looking it up now, it's laughable:

1994 San Fran FA starter signings:

Deion Sanders (1993 PB)

Ken Norton, Jr. (1993 PB)

Richard Dent (1993 PB)

Bart Oates (1993 PB)

Rickey Jackson (1993 PB)

Gary Plummer

...and signed these FA's in 1994 just to be backups:

Charles Mann (former 4x pro bowler was still starting for Washington)

Tim Harris (17 sacks in 1992; hardly played for Philly in 1993 due to that elbow injury)

Toi Cook (had been full-time starter in NO for the previous 5 straight seasons)

Ed McCaffrey (former 3rd round pick the Giants simply gave up on)

All while retaining veterans:

Steve Young

Jerry Rice

John Taylor

Brent Jones

Jesse Sapolu

Tim McDonald (who they only acquired the prior season)

Merton Hanks

Steve Wallace

Eric Davis

And, all the while, carrying salaries for 5 first round picks and 4 second round picks from their 1992-1994 drafts.

I had to look all this up as I'd long since forgotten just how many players that '94 team had on it and how many they'd acquired. You put it well; it was a ridiculous mockery.

[THE ILK]

IMO, in twenty years SpyGate will be nothing but a footnote. Every great team has something. Hell, the 70's Steelers (allegedly) introduced steroid use to the NFL. The Niners circumvented the salary cap so hard it made a mockery of the system. But no one remembers those things. You put the rings on the fingers, people only remember the rings.

In 20 years will Monica remember how she got that white stain on her dress?

[LWC611]

Agreed. I saw him doing a one on one thing with Ervin and they were discussing if the Pats could be stopped. Faulk said, "sure they can, as long as they dont the cliff notes".

Everyone knows they cheated. Most players echo this sentiment. But whatever, nobody's taking their rings away.

Well the team buys them the rings so the players can keep them. The League provides the Lombardi.....They should be stripped of the Super Bowl Trophies and they should be offered to the losing team of the superbowl. If the losing team does not want them, then that year the winner should be blank.

[Klecko73isGod]

IMO, in twenty years SpyGate will be nothing but a footnote. Every great team has something. Hell, the 70's Steelers (allegedly) introduced steroid use to the NFL. The Niners circumvented the salary cap so hard it made a mockery of the system. But no one remembers those things. You put the rings on the fingers, people only remember the rings.

Not for nothin', but there's a huge difference between circumventing the salary cap and what the Pats did.

The 49ers broke salary cap rules to pay better players. The players then went out and tried to win the games in an honest manner.

The Pats, in effect, tried to fix games in their favor by giving themselves an unfair competitive advantage by knowing exactly what their opponent was going to do on every play. They were essentially trying to turn games into glorified scrimmages.

[Klecko73isGod]

GS fair points.

First, they were a miraculous catch from being 19-0 and a Superbowl champion since being caught. So they have won playoff games.

Second, I doubt their legacy takes a hit. Again, it is the camera usage that the Patriots were busted for. Not for stealing signals. Goodell, coaches and players alike openly admit to it being a part of the game and trying to do this. No one has been punished for stealing signals. Only using a camera and given the technology available is kind of ridiculous.

Last, the Patriots lack of success since being caught, i.e. a championship, has more to do with the D. There are only 2 starters and Tully Banta-Cain who were on the field that day in Jacksonville. They are 52-16 since that game against the Jets, so the impact of being caught has had little impact. They are not as good on defense.

Completely untrue.

This is a myth that Pats fans have been desperately clinging to. You don't get docked 1st round draft picks for illegal camera usage. You don't get hit with the largest fine in league history for camera usage.

As long as the Pats fail to win a title with Brady and BB since being caught there will be a major stain on their legacy and the question of their championship legitimacy will always be valid. Not to mention that Brady's stats in the postseason specifically have been horrid since they were caught. They are 2-3 in postseason games and Brady has performed poorly in 4 of those 5 games. Coincidence? Maybe.

But I also love how when it comes to this one issue, Pats fans suddenly forget that they have anointed their coach as a genius and try to pretend they are more knowledgable than their hero by ignoring a simple fact - there is no way Belichick would have done this for so long if he didn't feel he gained a significant competitive advantage from it.

In the four years since they were caught, not one Pats fan has ever addressed this and one other simple reality - if, as they claim, "everybody does it" then why has not only no one else been caught, but no one else has been so much as accused of doing this? The closest they come to addressing this is by pointing out that Jimmy Johnson, Bill Belichick's offseason fishing buddy, claimed that "everybody does it." No, Jimmy Johnson wouldn't lie to protect his friend.

I'll take Marshall Faulk's word over anyone else's. I'll also take Kurt Warner's word over anyone else's. Both of them felt there was something odd that happened that day.

[NYJ37/12]

Not for nothin', but there's a huge difference between circumventing the salary cap and what the Pats did.

The 49ers broke salary cap rules to pay better players. The players then went out and tried to win the games in an honest manner.

The Pats, in effect, tried to fix games in their favor by giving themselves an unfair competitive advantage by knowing exactly what their opponent was going to do on every play. They were essentially trying to turn games into glorified scrimmages.

And they succeeded. The "experts" now refer to that team as a dynasty and team of the decade. Imagine, you are booted out of college for looking at your notes during an exam, but rewarded in the NFL for the same thing. Funny what money does.

[JustInFudge]

Well the team buys them the rings so the players can keep them. The League provides the Lombardi.....They should be stripped of the Super Bowl Trophies and they should be offered to the losing team of the superbowl. If the losing team does not want them, then that year the winner should be blank.

Never will happen. The NFL doesnt want that stain, so they will never do it. There's a reason why the destroyed all evidence. Clearly they wanted to push this under the rug.

The Patriots and BB cheated the game. Their integrity will always be questioned, by players, fans, coaches, media...you name it. But the NFL isnt going to strip them of their trophies.