Sperm Edwards

Tuesday at 07:49 PM

4 minutes ago, johnnysd said:

I think that one thing people are not considering is that AVT is approaching All Pro level play after a bad week 1. So it is possible that Fant is having a career year because of that. Still, I think I might offer Fant an extension. He is reliable and stays healthy. Becton is a very large ? at this point. I could see him busting out when he comes back or learning from the injury and starting to take better care of himself and realizing his potential. I wouldnt want to bet either way,

I wouldn't. The Jets have a bajillion draft picks and I'm satisfied enough with the pleasant surprise of his pass blocking to just enjoy that much while the team's breaking in a rookie QB.

Last thing I'd bank on is someone's career year - in one aspect of his game, while still relatively failing at the other half - becoming the baseline for all years to come.

At this point it's between wait & see and take the money & run on Fant. It's not even a sure thing that he should be the starting LT next year, or even for the entire duration of this season yet, let alone anointing him for 2023 and beyond. Plus he's not going to come at any more of a discount to extend now (or at the end fo the season) than he'll be a year later.

There's no need to do anything with Fant until at least this time next year.

Tuesday at 07:30 PM

35 minutes ago, Paradis said:

i'm teasin' for a pleasin'

I hear what you're saying and it's grounded in sound managerial science. Those talking points are ones had a the round the table I'm sure...

but there is also a very valid case/argument for the other direction I spoke of. The nuances and undulations of an NFL team over the course of 12 months just isn't as static and obvious as you're stating. Things never go as predictably as it would be needed to make your musings to be the only path/consideration.

They were looking at their choice of 4 highly-rated QB prospects in 2021, weighed against not even knowing what the choices will be at their pick in 2022 (if Darnold didn't do a 180 on his career). As much as anything it's about picking one's own poison and, even if that choice is incorrect, to get it out of the way earlier since that gives the GM a better chance for another swing at the plate before he's terminated.

If he waits until 2022, then on top of that sits the QB behind a veteran - if they weren't picking high enough they'd have to have a credible stopgap veteran in place before the draft - and then if the 2022 draftee flops (in 2023), then said GM may get fired before he gets another opportunity; therefore he has to go 1 for 1 in drafting QBs (or has to get super lucky on his next James Morgan selection), and further has to take the best one that other teams left for him.

The past choice of Adams over Mahomes/Watson is only additive.

Tuesday at 05:38 PM

1 hour ago, Paradis said:

so summary - GMs also have to consider having egg on their face if they pass on Mahomes 2.0

You're economy of words is like the swiss bank... also, i don't think that's the kiss of death in and of itself. Can contribute to a decison to move on from a GM, but not solely.

That is not the summary; but lol fine, go with being you.

Tuesday at 05:35 PM

1 hour ago, #27TheDominator said:

I think the difference is the contracts. Because 2nd and 3rd QB contracts are so cost prohibitive there is a great deal of incentive to have these guys succeed right away. That is why the changes that untouchable mentions took place, part of the reason they adopted so many college concepts. In the olden days WFT would never have let Cousins go. It will be interesting to see if any of the guys that haven't succeeded turn out- Darnold, Trubisky. Teams have even moved on from guys on 2nd deals it will be interesting to see how that turns out - Tannehill, Goff.

I don’t know. The flip-side is if you go back just over 10 yrs ago the high 1st rounders like Wilson were already making $10MM+/year (when the league’s best still hadn’t eclipsed $20MM/yr). But among those mentioned were QBs (Mahomes the most notable) who didn’t even play right away.

I think when you’re looking at the last 5 years you lose the opportunity to see a QB’s second go-around (like Tannehill, whom you mention) as you’re only looking at that first stint.

Tuesday at 03:30 PM

1 hour ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I'm talking about the modern example. I don't think examples from 10 years ago are super relevant, let alone Brees, Brady, Rodgers etc.

Looking at guys from the last five draft classes -- the guys who are good were good right away. The NFL has adopted college schemes and concepts and many of these spread concepts are run at the HS level. Simply put, guys are better prepared than ever before to play well instantly.

Mahomes say for a year, and maybe Wilson should have. But in his first season playing Mahomes was the MVP of the league. Wilson looks like the worst QB in the NFL.

There's just not a great track record of guys looking terrible their first years and turning into franchise QBs.

Sorry but that's beyond moving the goalposts. There is no "era" of 5 draft classes. 10 years ago are just as relevant as today's picks. Nothing magical happened between 6-10 years ago that makes QBing so much different for a 2021 prospect.

There's no "track record" at all when you're looking at such a small sample size. It's all statistical noise no matter which result side you're looking at. Those successes and failures are due to the individuals not some huge change in the NFL that began in 2016.

Tuesday at 01:11 PM

4 minutes ago, faba said:

have to worry about his size frame can he be in top condition after a layoff with that frame at any time

It’s a legit concern. I have to believe he’s working his way back and not just laying in bed waiting for the day the doctor says “OK, you’re healed” to only then get off his ass. He can work out with the team & be in on meetings; he just can’t practice with them until he’s off IR.

Maybe they take him off IR at least a week early, before he’s medically cleared to play a full game, just so he can take some snaps in practices; and not worry about the player who’d otherwise occupy the last (and anyway, inactive) roster spot. Even more so with the expansion of the practice squad.

At the same time, I’d think (hope) the team will factor his conditioning into the decision of when to put him back on the field as a starter, just as Fant’s pass-blocking thus far is going to make that decision harder as it is.

The most important thing right now is to protect the QB - not just to keep him upright, but to help things slow down for him as he’s developing - and in that regard the weak link in the chain isn’t presently at LT anyway.

Tuesday at 12:58 PM

8 hours ago, Paradis said:

it's not that static. Every new league year we see those "expected" outcomes rewritten.... but yes, you'd have to weigh in just how much you LOVE Wilson. If I was JD i would have made the O-staff sell me on why this guy is sooo good that we can't afford to pass on him for the betterment of the team.

A GM has to not just consider Wilson (or any of the other three that followed him). If one of them - particularly the one projected to go at #2 where we picked - pans out and he stuck with Darnold and drafted a TE (however talented) instead, he’d justifiably be under far more heat.

They didn’t figure to land a top 3 pick again if Darnold returned (the reason they’d bring Darnold back is they figured he’d be good, not playing like a raw rookie) so their options to upgrade at QB in the next draft become a lot more of an unknown.

What if next year’s QB class looks like 2013’s, and instead of Wilson you’ve drafted Geno Smith II (or EJ Manuel II) to take over for Darnold?
What if it’s like other classes that only have 1 -2 worthwhile QBs, where one of them goes #1 to a team desperate for a QB, and the other was a mid-round prospect among 9 other QB prospects? A QB-less team isn’t making that pick.
What if 2022 is like however-many other draft classes where you’d have to trade up to #3 to get rewarded with Blake Bortles, or pass on the top 3 QB prospects to bank on Derek Carr lasting to our pick in round 2 (or just as likely, there is no Derek Carr in round 2 after the first 3 underwhelming QBs).

This FO wouldn’t go another draft without drafting a QB early unless Darnold was a clear top 10-15 QB worthy of franchise tagging for 2022 (or guaranteeing him $20MM in 2021 before he clearly looked even top 25-30). A team (and a GM) can survive without a Pitts more than it can survive without a QB. Wilson may not be the man - we all hope he is - but I can better sympathize with taking a shot on their choice of four QB prospects now, over hoping for the only worthy QB of a future class to be sitting there at our pick (as a prospect deemed worthy of taking at that pick; not using hindsight to say we should’ve taken Prescott in round 1 over Darron Lee, true as that statement may be).

If it wasn’t Darnold’s final contract year, and maybe if he’d had only two disappointing seasons instead of three, then perhaps they take that chance. Regardless, it’s doubtful a team with this many needs would’ve pulled the trigger on a TE at #2 overall (or #3 if they swapped with SF), let alone with a pick-hoarder like Douglas at the helm.

Tuesday at 12:17 PM

8 hours ago, David Harris said:

He’s doing his #1 job in protecting Zach but there is no question that Mekhi starts LT as soon as he’s ready to go. Mekhi is still a baby with crazy upside. Played very well last year. Could match Fant’s pass blocking and dominate the run game especially next to AVT. Start the future asap.

Moses is better than Fant on the right side. Put Fant on the bench, use him like Seattle did and use 3 tackles at times.

Fant is the 9th highest paid RT in the NFL which is insane until you realize he was signed to be a starting LT. His contract is up and someone will be happy to pay him just for his pass blocking at LT but it won’t be the Jets.

JD deserves a ton of credit for signing Morgan Moses. To have a backup plan the caliber of Fant rarely happens.

Fant’s contract isn’t up after this year. He’ll be about $10MM in new money next year (not guaranteed, though), plus another $1MM from his signing bonus hits the cap whether he’s on the team or not.

Also Seattle used him that way because he was dirt cheap. Nobody pays a backup/swing tackle $10MM (let alone while squeezing other starting players out of millions). The players are well aware how much each other makes.

6 hours ago, johnnysd said:

I think he is signed through next year.

Correct.

One problem with Becton’s injury is that he isn’t going to get back until the trade dealine has passed, so (barring a Becton trade) all three starting tackles, for two starting tackle positions, are going to be here this season. Moses I think is only on a 1-year deal. Fant has one more year, and Becton 2 more (plus an option yr for one more, which is a notch lower $ because he wasn’t a top 10 pick).

After this season they have a lot of options. The easiest is to just not re-sign Moses.

Or they could re-sign Moses & trade Fant. A veteran LT who’s been top-notch in pass blocking, whose contract is just under $10MM for the year, without a long-term committment required, would have some trade value.

The most versatile + efficient option is to have 2 starters for 2 positions: just let Moses go and just bring back Fant/Becton.

Let Fant/Becton battle it out for who plays which position.
Fant’s run-blocking is no less of a liability at RT than LT, so maybe he stays there if his current level of play continues.

The most injury-bulletproof option would be to bring back all 3 (as this year demonstrated firsthand).

However if Fant isn’t one of the two starters it rarely sits well among the players to have a $10MM player (whose contract wasn’t guaranteed in ‘22) backing up two $5MM starters.
A non-starting swing tackle isn’t a $10MM position, and it could be bad for morale to give him - yet another veteran starter - the Crowder treatment after waiting until everyone else already has their starting tackles in place.
It could be that money was the tie-breaker when Fant started over Moses opening day; the idea being that, while their individual strengths were different, overall neither was night & day better than the other & they wouldn’t have that lopsided $ arrangement. Plus Moses had playing time incentives.
With more options where to go in March, Moses may not want to return to a team where he isn’t effectively guaranteed a starting job, since he isn’t getting 2 guaranteed $ seasons from anyone.

With so much cap space, and so little clout for the GM & HC/OC to weather the excuses of an injured OT starter next year, their best option may be just to bring back all 3 in their current roles (whatever those will be when Becton returns lol), even if it’s a inefficient use of space, and maybe put a bit of a squeeze on Fant in late August if he doesn’t beat out both next year. I don’t love the squeeze practice, but if he gets beat out he’s put himself in that situation, and in late Aug he’s not getting a guaranteed $10MM from anyone else anyway (salaries become guaranteed once he makes that final cut for week 1).

Tuesday at 01:44 AM

5 hours ago, UntouchableCrew said:

I'm just being honest.

1) I don't like what I see. Kid has serious flaws.

2) How many QBs really struggle out the gate and end up being great these days? Josh Allen is really the only guy. Most of these kids (Mahomes, Watson, Lamar, Murray, Herbert, Burrow) can play immediately and the ones that can't (Trubisky, Darnold, Rosen, Jones, Haskins, Tua) usually don't get there. Baker looked good early but isn't looking like the guy.

I'm not giving up on him at all. I hope he works out and I think we're locked into him for three full seasons. I just don't get a good feeling about him based on these first few games.

Mahomes didn’t play immediately. Reid sat his ass all season long until one garbage time game.

Ditto Rodgers. Alex Smith, drafted ahead of Rodgers, sucked for years.

Tannehill’s first 5 games he had 3 TDs and 6 picks and they weren’t installing a new offense & he didn’t have nearly as many free rushers nor dropped passes nor a rookie OC.

Stafford 3 TDs 7 INTs in his first 5 starts, and 3 of his next 5 games after that were atrocious (including throwing 9 picks in 2 of them).

Brady barely made the roster as a rookie. Brees saw action in 1 game. Both were healthy as rookies. Both threw 80,000 regular season passing yards.

The goal is to succeed in the face of adversity, not use it as an excuse forever, but he’s a rookie in a crap situation none of the above had to contend with. Let’s see what he does as things start to calm down a bit.

No one’s going to want to give him 3 years of chances. Few will want to see him get even 2 if he looks like this all season long.

Monday at 06:31 PM

3 hours ago, Wit said:

Mike is literally a white flag. Not a better option. We weren’t making the playoffs this year with our QB, so why win meaningless games without him? I want to win this year WITH Zach so he can develop. If he’s out, it’s a worthless year. If you want him to sit with a clipboard, let it be with an elder statesman with actual playoff/super bowl experience that he can learn from, not younger guys that want to steal his job.

I know rivers is retired, but theoretical paying him big money to sit on his ass to support those nine kids may be something he would have done

Here's where I disagree with that idea. That tally of wins/losses without the starter aside, what another QB buys is credibility, and not throwing in the towel on developing other players.

This is a young team, not just a team with a young QB. If Wilson goes out there's still a need to assess what else the team has and what it doesn't. It's hard enough with a rookie who's mostly struggled thus far; it'd be harder still with White, who's not an NFL QB. He's not even a #2 QB. It's debatable that he's even a roster-worthy #3 QB seeing how long it took him to hold off Morgan, who's temporarily surviving by the skin of his teeth on the Panthers' PS.

In the upcoming spring, there's no reason to have to guess at how badly we need to re-draft this or that position because everybody got a mulligan while the team trotted out far worse than Geno/Petty. Actually Geno's a good example of someone who does still allow assessment of the rest of the team because, while he's not a winner, he clearly can throw a football and has experience practicing in this system for some time.

I can get behind not signing Minshew/Trubisky, but honestly I thought the bleh-meh veteran they'd bring in was Beathard (2 yrs $5MM from Jax) or Mullens (signed then waived by Phi, and now on Cleveland's PS). Both were >60% passers last year, can complete passes over 7 yards, and have multiple games starting experience in this offense not just pretending to go through the motions like Luke Falk. The cost differential to White is negligible (i.e. there isn't a player they won't be able to afford because they spent ~$2.5MM on the QB2 instead of ~$1MM for this one season.

And yes, while it's the job of the QBC to coach the QB, it is a help for a rookie to have a QB room with experienced teammates instead of someone who knows & has experienced even less than the rookie.

Monday at 05:48 PM

Just now, kevinc855 said:

Wilson threw 4 INTS in that game....

Darnold's never thrown 4 INTs in a game.

Also never happened against NE with a QB rating of 3.6 a season after he got his rookie lumps in.

Never happened. Never.

Monday at 05:43 PM

1 minute ago, FidelioJet said:

Because Sam was always so good against BB....

Monday at 04:15 AM

13 hours ago, T0mShane said:

He’s garbage, I know, but I’m just referring to the fact that he could have put up 50 tonight if he threw it at Jamal Adams and I would have had a much better time.

He did throw it right at Adams, on their past possession of regulation. Adams had a perfect pick opportunity right there, which at that point probably seals the win before OT. Inexcusable for him to not catch that one. See the difference what an elite-paid defender did with his opportunities in the other side (Watt).

Adams adds more losses than he adds wins for them (still more considering the 3-4 extra starters he cost to acquire add extend). Yummy.

Friday at 10:12 PM

8 hours ago, Integrity28 said:

Would this be as a coach? Or as the veteran mentor player bridge?

Veteran mentor bridge player

Friday at 05:23 PM

42 minutes ago, Jetsfan80 said:

I like you better when you're posting dad joke puns. Your snark game is quite repetitious these days.

He called us geniuses.

It's a compliment, genius.

Friday at 04:27 PM

4 hours ago, kevinc855 said:

Ok the next time we win; if we do this year, if they aren’t against super bowl contenders I will remind you of that as well.

What a garbage post. In the NFL a W is a W

Losing to an 0-11 team is the reason one can and should factor in strength of opponents instead of mindlessly saying a win is a win.

Just like the 8-8 2013 Jets weren't as good as a team as the 8-8 2008 Chargers. Only a great fool would attest otherwise.

Friday at 04:18 PM

4 hours ago, T0mShane said:

This is encouraging because we have a bunch of very winnable games coming up against pretty week competition. Thoroughly looking forward to Saleh going on his own upcoming 6-2 run that we can outright dismiss in a few years.

If you're searching for a "Saleh can do no wrong" Jets fan, you're barking up the wrong tree.

But in judging in hindsight later on, it also depends if we just beat a bunch of weak teams as part of some continued growth, or did we just beat some weak teams only to see the team regress back down to the garbage we knew it was once those tomato can opponents weren't the norm.

Friday at 04:15 PM

6 hours ago, BP said:

Yep, he wasn’t a 3-4 defensive lineman. That defense was all smoke and mirrors anyways for 3 years.

off the top of your head lol who was the Jets best talent evaluator and drafter of all time? Jim Kensil?

Regardless of how he drafted they went from the laughing stock of the nfl and the consistent butt of jokes on espn to being respected in his first year and super bowl contenders the next two.

one thing I’ll never forget about him was his first game as jets coach against Seattle in august 1997 the Jets had like a 24-0 lead at halftime and he was asked coming out for the second half of the running game was going to be focused on, he said “no, we will continue to attack, no lead is safe” that’s the kind of sh*t I haven’t heard from a jets coach in almost 25 years. Before the jax playoff game in January 1999 he said “we have to score at least 30 points to have a chance”, none of this bs about ball control lol.

He wasn’t perfect but we ain’t finding anybody like him in todays game to save our franchise again.

oh and keep the reply short with limited bullet points, Spermy. I don’t want your wife walking by calling you a loser again

To your last point...meh, some things are bound to happen no matter what

October 15

Just now, #27TheDominator said:

Ooooh! Ooooh! Now do 2008!

If we're going to do this in sequence as we go back, we first have to stop in 2015 on the way

October 15

KevinJamesPornhub, we hardly knew ye

Obvious troll is obvious

October 15

On 10/14/2021 at 11:32 AM, kevinc855 said:

At the same Time you dismiss a 6-2 finish (one or the best in the league) your credibility takes a shot when you point to the loss of a passing game coordinator as apparently the fatal hole in the staff. If the staff was designed to be so weak that losing their passing game coordinator be fatal to the staff then you have weak leaders and a poorly designed staff

Personally? Yeah I absolutely dismiss that 6-2 finish.

Beat Washington, who finished the season 3-13.
Beat the Giants, who finished the season 4-12 (2 of those 4 wins coming against 3-win Washington).
Beat Oakland, who was a paper tiger anyway. Hadn't beaten any good team; just barely beat Cincinnatti the week before; and the Jets loss was just one of five losses over their last 6 games.
But before getting too excited about that one, then lost to the 0-11 Bengals (who'd then lose the next 3 after beating us).
Beat 5-11 Miami on a ticky-tack DPI call. They also lost to the Giants a week later.
Got destroyed by the Ravens; the only serious team we faced and it was a bloodbath.
Eked one out vs Pittsburgh amid their musical chairs/QBs between Delvin Hodges and Mason Rudolph. Delvin Hodges started for them at QB and made doody in his pants for the first half; when he was relieved, Mason Rudolph looked like Peyton Manning against us, but luckily Pittsburgh's receivers were doing their impression of the 2021 Jets (4 of his 6 incomplete passes were drops).
Barely beat Buffalo's backups & practice squadders as the Bills rested their starters against us. We gave up 180 receiving yards to Duke Williams and Tommy Sweeney, on the receiving end of the great Matt Barkley, and against these non-NFLers Gase's Jets were actually losing this game as it entered the 4th quarter.

This was not some half-season of prowess or even building blocks. The Jets sucked, and beat some teams that were either just as bad, worse, or a couple that may have been marginally better but still sucked themselves.

October 15

4 hours ago, BP said:

Hugh Douglas gained almost 30lbs during the bye week under kotites strict discipline lol I’ll never forget that.

and everybody…I mean everybody had pulled hamstrings.

famous kotite quote at a presser “we gotta get back on track” derp reporter: “coach, when has the team been on track?” Derpa dee derp

”I’m not fired and I’m not quitting, I’m just walking away”

And even then, Douglas had his worst season under Parcells, who misused Douglas for a season and then traded him for a 2nd and a 5th. With a subsequent trade-down in round 2, the net result was

Hugh Douglas

for

Dorian Boose
Kevin Williams
Eric Bateman
Casey Dailey

Joe Douglas has some big shoes to fill in terms of terrible drafting in his first few seasons as GM of the Jets. Who knows how his tenure here would've seemed if Belichick didn't plead & ultimately convince him to sign Testaverde.

...also f*** Kotite, whose birthday was yesterday lol

October 14

34 minutes ago, Fantasy Island said:

Is that Elijah Moore?

I think so, but can't remember if it was just before or just after he got ousted from the Lollipop Guild for nutting in Glenda's eye.

(ok that was uncalled for; I admit I feel dirty)

October 14

On 10/12/2021 at 9:42 PM, Maynard13 said:

I met this obnoxious chic who was a service rep and every other word out her mouth was basically. I thus responded, so basically you're telling me your entire vocabulary and thought process basically centers around the word basically. Generally? So sometimes? Most of the time? No. All the time. Zach is stuck with a guy whose better euipped with leading Omega Theta Pi than the OC of the NY Jets. JD and Saleh better wake up and fast. Either LaFleuer has a remarkable epiphany and figures this all out or he can star in Animal House 2. If Zach continues in this downward spiral and doesn't show signs of progress, LaFleur will be held responsible for taking them all down. While the defense has not been 'all that', it has adapted in the 2nd half of each game and played better, in each game. Credit that to Saleh. The offense has played one good half in 5 games. The offense, generally speaking, has not adapted AT ALL. Generally.

So basically, the offensive coaching hasn’t been up to par?

Asking for a friend, who basically works as a phone rep.

October 14

On 10/12/2021 at 7:58 PM, doitny said:

90% of this is on Wilson.

just curious what they consider a dropped pass?

a ball thrown at Carter feet where he get a finger on it is a drop pass?

or a ball thrown behind Davis that he turns all crooked and gets one hand on it a dropped pass?

I forget after which game, but remember looking at the recorded drops stats right after the game & they seemed low; as in there were other passes, that most/all would agree should have been caught, that weren’t counted in the drops tallies.

If anything, receiver-drops stats are overboard conservative, the opposite of expecting a really great, acrobatic catch on the receiver’s part should have been made.

Maybe someone has the time & inclination to go over each incomplete pass thrown thus far (both those that fell to the turf and those intercepted). That person isn’t me lol.

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