Maybe Mr. Genius Mike Tannebaum is to blame for this mess

[RevisIsland610]

There are alot of people to blame for all of this- Sanchez, the O-line, Schotty, Rex Ryan, but the main "architect" of this team is Mr. T and he has created quite the mess. How does a team who has superbowl aspirations have so many issues with their personnel after 4 games. The offensive line is a complete and utter disaster without Mangold. Why? Shouldn't there have been more thought into to the utter lack of depth on such an important part or your team. Ducasse, Really? Colin Baxter as your starting center for 2 games? Really? Why did he let Woody go? Why would you think that Wayne Hunter could do the job? That's not the only problem, just the biggest. What about drafting a guy who could rush the passer? Did he address that need in the draft? No. They have to bring back a reject like Maybin because they are so desperate for a pass rush. His last 2 drafts have been poor with very few players making an impact. Sanchez and co. are going to get alot of sh*t this week, but I think the "genius" deserves alot of the blame.

[ylekram]

There are alot of people to blame for all of this- Sanchez, the O-line, Schotty, Rex Ryan, but the main "architect" of this team is Mr. T and he has created quite the mess. How does a team who has superbowl aspirations have so many issues with their personnel after 4 games. The offensive line is a complete and utter disaster without Mangold. Why? Shouldn't there have been more thought into to the utter lack of depth on such an important part or your team. Ducasse, Really? Colin Baxter as your starting center for 2 games? Really? Why did he let Woody go? Why would you think that Wayne Hunter could do the job? That's not the only problem, just the biggest. What about drafting a guy who could rush the passer? Did he address that need in the draft? No. They have to bring back a reject like Maybin because they are so desperate for a pass rush. His last 2 drafts have been poor with very few players making an impact. Sanchez and co. are going to get alot of sh*t this week, but I think the "genius" deserves alot of the blame.

be careful what you post around here. i posted something similair about the jets offensive line dept and tanny short sightedness during the pre season and was called a whiney pussy by all the internet, know it all dweebs around here

[sirlancemehlot]

**** Yeah!!!!

I mean, yes. I agree with you to some extent. Tanny might not be as good as hyped. This is a distinct possibility.

[#27TheDominator]

Be careful of nothing. If you believe it, post it. On the other hand, you guys should realize that you are bitching about a team that has super bowl aspirations. Realistic ones. You take chances every year. Some pan out and some don't.

IMO all the talk about offensive line depth is way ******* overblown. They were supposed to have Turner at G/C and Vlad at T. The main problem has been Hunter and Moore sucking, I didn't hear anybody expecting them to suck seeing how they didn't last year. Turner being hurt has killed us the last two weeks without Mangold, but that's nothing you can pin on Tannenbaum IMO since you generally don't have a quality 3rd stringer in the NFL and they picked up Baxter who hasn't even been a horror. You could bitch about Ducasse, but you can't expect him to challenge at RT just yet with the shortened camp and the fact that he has been forced to play plenty of guard after preparing to play T in the offseason.

[Il Mostro]

Agree with #27. Who could foresee Moore and Hunter taking big steps backwards -- both were solid last season. Turner's injury sucks. Vlad? I am guessing they saw him developing into a back-up guard. Aside from misjudging Vlad's ability, it is hard to fault the plan. There is a salary cap -- you cannot sign everyone or fill every area of need exactly as you wish.

[RutgersJetFan]

Why did he let Woody go?

I've often wondered the same thing. At the very least I think Tannenbaum could have threatened to kick Woody's a$$ for retiring. Always wondered why he didn't do that.

[ylekram]

Be careful of nothing. If you believe it, post it. On the other hand, you guys should realize that you are bitching about a team that has super bowl aspirations. Realistic ones. You take chances every year. Some pan out and some don't.

IMO all the talk about offensive line depth is way ******* overblown. They were supposed to have Turner at G/C and Vlad at T. The main problem has been Hunter and Moore sucking, I didn't hear anybody expecting them to suck seeing how they didn't last year. Turner being hurt has killed us the last two weeks without Mangold, but that's nothing you can pin on Tannenbaum IMO since you generally don't have a quality 3rd stringer in the NFL and they picked up Baxter who hasn't even been a horror. You could bitch about Ducasse, but you can't expect him to challenge at RT just yet with the shortened camp and the fact that he has been forced to play plenty of guard after preparing to play T in the offseason.

yes, turner being hurt sucks. but the silver lining resides in knowing that vlad ducasse is the new york jets back up right tackle.wait a second.he is also the back up left tackle.hell, i think he is the back up guards as well.oh well!!

but you are right about hunter and moore.i thought moore would have some problems due to the surgery and all,but that right side sucks

[#27TheDominator]

yes, turner being hurt sucks. but the silver lining resides in knowing that vlad ducasse is the new york jets back up right tackle.wait a second.he is also the back up left tackle.hell, i think he is the back up guards as well.oh well!!

but you are right about hunter and moore.i thought moore would have some problems due to the surgery and all,but that right side sucks

Ducasse was a project from day 1. To expect him to handle all those spots well is borderline insane. He may be a bust, but circumstance certainly hasn't been helping him to this point. FWIW, I see him as a RT and not a guard. Most people here seem to think he's better suited at guard because he's a mauler, but I like the way he uses his arms and I think he can develop into a solid tackle. That is CAN, not will. Time will tell, but being moved around rarely helps a project.

[RevisIsland610]

Agree with #27. Who could foresee Moore and Hunter taking big steps backwards -- both were solid last season. Turner's injury sucks. Vlad? I am guessing they saw him developing into a back-up guard. Aside from misjudging Vlad's ability, it is hard to fault the plan. There is a salary cap -- you cannot sign everyone or fill every area of need exactly as you wish.

I've been worried about the depth on the offensive line for awhile. Hunter is a career backup and couldn't hold Woody's jock. Ducasse is a major bust in waiting. Poor job by Mr. T.

[T0mShane]

If Sanchez fails, Tannenbaum is out. Not before. Woody has given him five+ years, an open checkbook and two coaching regimes. You'd have to think those bills are coming due and it's Sanchez that they're counting on to pay them.

[RevisIsland610]

Oh, and I didn't even mention our backup QB situation. The way Sanchez is getting hit we could see the awesome Mark Brunell behind center pretty soon. What a treat that would be.

[Jets Voice of Reason]

Ducasse was a project from day 1. To expect him to handle all those spots well is borderline insane. He may be a bust, but circumstance certainly hasn't been helping him to this point. FWIW, I see him as a RT and not a guard. Most people here seem to think he's better suited at guard because he's a mauler, but I like the way he uses his arms and I think he can develop into a solid tackle. That is CAN, not will. Time will tell, but being moved around rarely helps a project.

Personally, I don't blame Ducasse for struggling. But taking a massive project with a 2nd round pick is what most people, including me, are upset about. I still can't believe the Jets considered taking him in the 1st round (assuming that story is true). The Jets have been successful drafting of late, but that one is still way out of left field for me.

[#27TheDominator]

Personally, I don't blame Ducasse for struggling. But taking a massive project with a 2nd round pick is what most people, including me, are upset about. I still can't believe the Jets considered taking him in the 1st round (assuming that story is true). The Jets have been successful drafting of late, but that one is still way out of left field for me.

The problem isn't his being a massive project, assuming the upside is that high. The problem is that Hunter sucks so bad this year that they seem to need him now. I will say this much, Beatty on the Giants was a similar pick and is starting now. He looked pretty bad in limited time the past couple of years.

[ylekram]

Ducasse was a project from day 1. To expect him to handle all those spots well is borderline insane. He may be a bust, but circumstance certainly hasn't been helping him to this point. FWIW, I see him as a RT and not a guard. Most people here seem to think he's better suited at guard because he's a mauler, but I like the way he uses his arms and I think he can develop into a solid tackle. That is CAN, not will. Time will tell, but being moved around rarely helps a project.

while i agree that ducasse has alot of potential and CAN POSSIBLY become a good player, he was a major reach by tanny. they see this guy play everyday and they know he is not nfl ready.they went into the league year with turner and ducasse as backups absolutely knowing that 1 of them was not ready.quite a gamble for a team with super bowl aspirations with a new right tackle and a right guard coming off hip surgery

[ylekram]

Organizational arrogance. Big athletic, raw kid? No problem--Calahan will fix him! Two slow safeties? No problem! Thurman'll make it work!

why do the jets even have safeties???the way the front seven is built,you would think they would use 4 corners to cover the tight ends and running backs

[Ghost]

I honestly wouldn't trade Rex for ANY coach right now other than BB. However, it is Rex's fault for not getting his own OC from the gate. He kept the biggest clown on our coaching staff and this falls on his shoulder 100%.

[#27TheDominator]

while i agree that ducasse has alot of potential and CAN POSSIBLY become a good player, he was a major reach by tanny. they see this guy play everyday and they know he is not nfl ready.they went into the league year with turner and ducasse as backups absolutely knowing that 1 of them was not ready.quite a gamble for a team with super bowl aspirations with a new right tackle and a right guard coming off hip surgery

You can blame the FO, but the fact is they are not suffering because Ducasse isn't ready. They are suffering because Hunter isn't and Turner got hurt. Were those things forseeable? Eh. I can't see blowing the FO up over this. They took a risk. It's a long season and they have gone through these losing streaks before. The took a risk replacing Ellis with Wilkerson we'll see what happens by the with that by end of the year.

[SenorGato]

Hey, hi, what's up. Just dropping in to remind you guys that there's actually 12 games left in the season. That's right, 12. 12 out of 16! 3/4s of the game are yet to be played.

The talent on the team is good enough to win.

[ylekram]

You can blame the FO, but the fact is they are not suffering because Ducasse isn't ready. They are suffering because Hunter isn't and Turner got hurt. Were those things forseeable? Eh. I can't see blowing the FO up over this. They took a risk. It's a long season and they have gone through these losing streaks before. The took a risk replacing Ellis with Wilkerson we'll see what happens by the with that by end of the year.

my biggest gripe with the fo is the fact that they have NO back up tackle.nodda one.that is quite risky and quite stupid.throw in the fact that if the oline doesnt start playing alot better, sanchez will miss time.not IF BUT WHEN.then you have a 45 year old back up qb. pretty risky fo moves to say the least

[Smashmouth]

While we were having obvious issues on the O-Line during the preseason we stood by while the Ravens Picked up 2 solid O-Lineman after cut downs . This is not just because Mangold is hurt that we are having these isues, sure him being out is just compounding the problem in a big way but this issue was staring us in the face during preseason and we did nothing while working our freakin way under the cap.

This is a win now SB caliber team and yes we did take care of some important business in the offseason but thats no excuse for leaving some glaring weaknesses that are totally inexcusable

SB windows do not stay open for long, I hope we didnt slam ours shut because I dont know how much O-Line help is actully out there now . Watching Sanchez get totally hammered everyweek sucks its getting to the point every pass he throws is under pressure and you cant ask anyone to do well under those circumstances.

Fans give Tanny way way to much credit, the guy does great things with the numbers but he relies heavily on the guys with the experience to make the personell calls. Mangini Built our core of players with Brick, Mangold, Revis, Harris, Not Tanny and not Rex if Mangini was not such a puss as a head coach on the sidelines with his prevent crap he probably would have done well as a head coach he certainly has a good eye for personell. Teams should look at him as a GM rather than a HC but thats another story

This team has done well the past few years due to our O-Line and Defense and right now the O-Line better get it turned around quick or this can get out of control. I hope they can do it because Im not sure how many more big hits our Young QB can take.

[stoicsentry]

Hey, hi, what's up. Just dropping in to remind you guys that there's actually 12 games left in the season. That's right, 12. 12 out of 16! 3/4s of the game are yet to be played.

The talent on the team is good enough to win.

Sanity is welcome. Thank you.

Everyone that's upset now, ok, I guess you have a reason to be. But wake me up as soon as we have a season where we don't make a run deep into the playoffs.... cause that hasn't happened the past two years, and obviously it hasn't happened this year either.

[jason423]

I've often wondered the same thing. At the very least I think Tannenbaum could have threatened to kick Woody's a$$ for retiring. Always wondered why he didn't do that.

They let him go when they did because the salary was too high and if I remember correctly he had an offsseason roster bonus due, so it was a move they had to make. After that though I was surprised that they didnt ask him back. I think he was partially a lockout casualty as he started getting more and more into the media end and realized he had a chance for quick life after the NFL. My guess is the final straw is when they were not going to give him a starting job if he came back. Clearly he wasnt upset about it, but they were going to have him compete with Hunter and Ducasse for the job, with Hunter being the guy they were paying more money too. It was enough to push him fully into retirement. Im sure the Jets were worried about injury as well.

Hes really the only guy they should have contemplated bringing back. The other guys---it was time to move on. Its a reason why I found the Aso thing even more strange. The moves the Jets made were not a team looking to win now. They were more of a team looking to hold the fort and then move on. They didnt really upgrade anywhere and came back with almost the exact same team, never a good recipe for success in the NFL unless you have one of those elites at QB. Alot of these guys will be bounced after this year if things dont turn around despite all the reports of the big deals (and yes that includes Cromartie)

[JetsFanInDenver]

Cannot blame him for a whole lot in the last few years in the top rounds other than Gholston and Ducasse pick hurts.

I think where the JETS have to be good at are later round picks.

[JonEJet]

The Gholston pick sucks, but we've made up for it with Maybin

Maybin for Gholston is a wash

Vlad, well he may bust, but you can't get every pick right

[sirlancemehlot]

Ducasse was a project from day 1. To expect him to handle all those spots well is borderline insane. He may be a bust, but circumstance certainly hasn't been helping him to this point. FWIW, I see him as a RT and not a guard. Most people here seem to think he's better suited at guard because he's a mauler, but I like the way he uses his arms and I think he can develop into a solid tackle. That is CAN, not will. Time will tell, but being moved around rarely helps a project.

Ducasse was a project from day 1? No he wasn't. That was an after-the-fact excuse for his suckage. Ducasse was slated to be our starting left guard from day one. but Slauson beat him in camp. And Slauson wasn't very good good at the time either, if you'll look back objectively.

He's been moved around a lot? Sure has. I coach pee wee football. You know who we move around? The kids we try to hide. That way the other team doesn't key on our weaker players and run them over. The kids that are solid earn solid positions. Same in the NFL.

Better at tackle than guard? You may be onto something there. Tackles need athleticism, guards need brains. Guards need to know when to pull, trap, block down, blitz pickups, when to post and go to the backer, when to chip and when to double ...a lot of thinking at the guard spot. Ducasse is not good at thinking, it would appear. Most likely he sucks and washes out of the league in a year or so. If not, he's more likely a tackle than a guard, I think.

[RutgersJetFan]

They let him go when they did...

I like you dude, but you need to lighten up sometimes. That was really just a joke.

He's as much to blame as anyone. It's been nothing but lateral moves for the most part on offense since Rex took over. This team is not better than it was at the beginning of 2009. It's actually both worse and thinner. That is unquestionably on the GM.

[Larz]

the cap makes depth really hard to find, but not being agressive in getting a replacement when turner went down is inexcusable !!!

fans here were expressing concern over o-line and linebacker depth this summer

fans !!!!

[CTM]

Tanny only gets credit for the positives around here... just the way it is..

edit: overall, he's done an above average job so some of his internet teflon status is earned

[T0mShane]

I really should be enjoying this flagellation of Tannenbaum, but I'm not. I can't. I...I...I <sigh>

[THE ILK]

Maybe???

[#27TheDominator]

Ducasse was a project from day 1? No he wasn't. That was an after-the-fact excuse for his suckage. Ducasse was slated to be our starting left guard from day one. but Slauson beat him in camp. And Slauson wasn't very good good at the time either, if you'll look back objectively.

He's been moved around a lot? Sure has. I coach pee wee football. You know who we move around? The kids we try to hide. That way the other team doesn't key on our weaker players and run them over. The kids that are solid earn solid positions. Same in the NFL.

Better at tackle than guard? You may be onto something there. Tackles need athleticism, guards need brains. Guards need to know when to pull, trap, block down, blitz pickups, when to post and go to the backer, when to chip and when to double ...a lot of thinking at the guard spot. Ducasse is not good at thinking, it would appear. Most likely he sucks and washes out of the league in a year or so. If not, he's more likely a tackle than a guard, I think.

You may be right that they are moving him because he hasn't been successful and they want to find a spot, but you are absolutely wrong that he wasn't a project. He went to UMass. That is the definition of project right there. He's a Haitan kid that didn't play until he was something like a junior in high school. Project. The fact that he was a project is a reason to be down on Tannenbaum. They got cute going for big upside because when they drafted him the team already had two solid tackles and Turner as a fall back at guard. Boom or bust. They took a chance, but ANY player from a school that small is a project.

The problem is that offensive linemen, like QBs, aren't useful unless they are starter worthy. Backup RBs and WRs can be used on a play here or there, but not linemen. Same thing with any defensive player. Westerman is a much better player than Maybin, but you will see a million posts on here talking up Maybin while we have a ton of Westerman sucks threads. If Maybin were on the field on first and second down he'd look like he was on rollerskates.

[#27TheDominator]

I really should be enjoying this flagellation of Tannenbaum, but I'm not. I can't. I...I...I <sigh>

Old age has made you soft, both figuratively and literally.

[Jetsfan80]

He's as much to blame as anyone. It's been nothing but lateral moves for the most part on offense since Rex took over. This team is not better than it was at the beginning of 2009. It's actually both worse and thinner. That is unquestionably on the GM.

How is that even close to true?

Beginning of 2009

RB: Thomas Jones, Leon Washington

WR: Jerricho Cotchery, Chansi Stuckey, David Clowney, Brad Smith

2011

RB: Shonn Greene, LaDainian Tomlinson

WR: Santonio Holmes, Plaxico Burress, Derrick Mason, Jeremy Kerley

No one could possibly argue we'd be any better off right now talent-wise with Jones/Washington and that sh**y receiving corps. I only see upgrades at the two positions that have had changes (Sanchez and Keller were here in 2009, of course).

Now, you could say Sanchez & Schottenheimer don't know how to use the talent handed them. You could also say the O-line has declined, but its for reasons largely unknown. But Tannenbaum has absolutely done what he could to upgrade the offense.

[#27TheDominator]

Sanity is welcome. Thank you.

Everyone that's upset now, ok, I guess you have a reason to be. But wake me up as soon as we have a season where we don't make a run deep into the playoffs.... cause that hasn't happened the past two years, and obviously it hasn't happened this year either.

Aren't you the one person here that should be saying I told you so?