T0mShane Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Such a blown Tommy Boy opportunity. :throws tomato: It's impossible to live up to your expectations, D. I'm just a man. I'm just a man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Cap room also created to sign a legit backup QB? Like who? No "capable" backup wants to come here because he knows the Jets are committed to Sanchez. Whoever comes will have no chance to compete with Sanchez, nor even give him a scare. It's time to get Mario Williams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 This team loves misery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonEJet Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 It's impossible to live up to your expectations, D. I'm just a man. I'm just a man. Who would make Tommy happy running this team besides you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Well then Sanchez is eating up $13M of our cap in 2013 to be the backup QB, which is twice as much space as was created in this one season by the guarantee. Oh yeah, and he costs another $5M to cut before the 2014 season. So if he got beat out by Henne, in your example, then the Jets just signed on for $18M in cap space from 2013-2014 for Sanchez to be the backup in 2013. This is ONLY a good move is Sanchez suddenly becomes an excellent QB next season. 13 million? PFT has it as 8 million. "In 2013, Sanchez will receive a fully-guaranteed base salary of $8.25 million." Believe me, I dont fully understand this deal right now. But in no way does this guarantee Sanchez is our starter the next 2 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 McNabb received a 5yr/78 mill extension from the Redskins during the 2010 season. After he was benched, no less. Never even started a game for the Redskins in 2011. Cut and signed by the Vikings. This contract to me, means little other than clearing cap space. If anything, its a sign that Sanchez is under more pressure to perform or else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
denden29 Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 I posted this in a different thread, but it probably belongs here. IF Florio's contract break down is correct, 8 million signing bonus (that gets spread out over the 5 years, meaning a cap hit of 1.6 million each year), a .5 mill roster bonus, and a 3.25 mill base salary, if you add that up for 2012 it's a cap hit of 5.35 mill in 2012, and according to Jasons cap page Sanchez had a cap hit of 14.25, so if I'm correct, and Florio's contract info is correct it's a cap saving of 8.9 mill, not 6.4, Florio just took his salary from 2012 before the restructure not accounting for his prorated bonus, and roster bonus that counted towards the cap. His 2013 cap hit will be 10.35 mill, and then if Sanchez continues to suck they can cut him with a dead money charge of 4.8 mill, but still saving 8.3 mill in cap space in 2014. In 2015 they can cut him with a dead money charge of 3.2 mill, and a cap savings of 10.8 mill. In 2016 they can cut him with a dead money charge of 1.6 mill, and a cap savings of 10.65 mill. I could be wrong hopefully Jason will break it down better as soon as he gets the exact details, but I think that's the gist of it, and if it is correct it really is a very low risk, high reward type deal, Mark was gonna be the man in 2012, all this does is guarantee him the job 1 more year, and to be honest as a Jets fan what the hell is one more year of suck if that's what happens with him were used to it. Also these cap numbers could rise a couple million if Sanchez hits his escalator clauses, nut that's really nothing to be concerned about as a Jets fan cause if he does hit them we will be lining the canyon of heroes never worrying about what we pay Mark ever again! I think $6.4 million savings is correct. Sanchez had $14.25 million cap hit in 2012. Now he has $3.25m + $.5m + $1.6m = $5.35m. You have to add in the previous prorated bonus $2.5 million now Sanchez counts $7.85 million so: $14.25 - $7.85 = $6.4 million reduction in 2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Who would make Tommy happy running this team besides you? If I owned the team? I'd go get Bill Parcells, name him Team President, then I'd lose his number and take my chances that he fixes the whole thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonEJet Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 If I owned the team? I'd go get Bill Parcells, name him Team President, then I'd lose his number and take my chances that he fixes the whole thing. I don't understand the love for Parcells besides coaching He can't draft, and that's proven Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lupz27 Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 I think $6.4 million savings is correct. Sanchez had $14.25 million cap hit in 2012. Now he has $3.25m + $.5m + $1.6m = $5.35m. You have to add in the previous prorated bonus $2.5 million now Sanchez counts $7.85 million so: $14.25 - $7.85 = $6.4 million reduction in 2012. You are correct sorry about that, just though it erased his previous contract completely, it also ups his 2013 cap hit to 12.85 mill, which would be high in 2012, but not so much in 2013 with the new tv contract raising the cap next season. I would also think if Sanchez produces like a star QB this year they will restructure to get that cap hit higher in 2013, to get more cap space in 2014, and 2015, by taking some of his 2014, and 2015 salary, and making it a 2013 roster bonus lowering his cap number for those 2 years, but would prob have to guarantee the rest of the money those 2 years to get Sanchez to agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 13 million? PFT has it as 8 million. "In 2013, Sanchez will receive a fully-guaranteed base salary of $8.25 million." Believe me, I dont fully understand this deal right now. But in no way does this guarantee Sanchez is our starter the next 2 years. That's salary. The total cap hit is $1.6M (amortized portion of new bonus) + $2.5M (remaining amortized portion of orig bonus) + $8.25M salary + $500K workout bonus = $12.85M (~$13M). If he gets cut after 2013 then the last 3 years' amortized portion of this new $8M bonus accelerates to 2014 = $4.8M (~$5M) to cut or trade him. Total if he is the backup QB is $13M in 2013 whether we keep or cut him, plus $5M in 2014 to cut loose then = $17M. If we kept him this season and he lost the job and we cut him next year the total hit for Sanchez would be $2.5M in 2013 and nothing further. Those are just the numbers. If this happens we have more than cap issues. We're going to be in the hunt for a new GM and quite possibly a new HC (and if so, then a new OC and new DC). If we'd left it alone then we swung and missed with a high draft pick QB. It happens. You can be more careful with picks but it doesn't necessarily mean a whole team coaching staff blowup like this probably would. Now chances are he wouldn't lose out to Henne because he certainly hasn't shown that he's any better. But if Sanchez has a mid-season meltdown for the 4th consecutive season and they go with Henne or whoever they pick up, the team is in rebuilding mode and has another $17M of Sanchez cap-hits coming on the horizon for him to be the backup for the '13 season. You have to look at the downside of making moves as well as the upside, which is why sometimes the move is to not make the move. Or if it's your turn, sometimes you just call with 2 pair instead of going all in. Like with Holmes. I make that move every single season going forward to get an established player of his level, in a contract year, for 12 games for a 5th round pick. But you don't go all in on him by guaranteeing him dozens of millions of dollars on a $45M deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 I don't understand the love for Parcells besides coaching He can't draft, and that's proven His drafts are spotty at best, but he knows how to clean up a roster and prepare it to win. Granted, he doesn't stick around to finish the job, but he set up the Pats, Jets and Cowboys with pretty solid rosters. Even the Dolphins have a bunch of good players that he brought in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 His drafts are spotty at best, Parcells trading down in 1997 was far worse than anything Bradway or Tanny ever did. He first makes Peyton uncomfortable enough to stay in school. Then passed on Orlando Pace and Walter Jones for James Farrior and a bunch of crap. Tuna was a great game day coach, a dreadful draft GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Parcells trading down in 1997 was far worse than anything Bradway or Tanny ever did. He first makes Peyton uncomfortable enough to stay in school. Then passed on Orlando Pace and Walter Jones for James Farrior and a bunch of crap. Tuna was a great game day coach, a dreadful draft GM. And yet he fixes the teams he gets in with. Pats, Jets, Cowboys win percentage over the three years before Parcells: 25%. Win percentage three years after Parcells leaves (which leaves his gameday coaching out of the equation) is ~65%. Some people draft Vernon Gholston and Mike Nugent, some people draft DeMarcus Ware and get Cam Wake as a UFA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonEJet Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 His drafts are spotty at best, but he knows how to clean up a roster and prepare it to win. Granted, he doesn't stick around to finish the job, but he set up the Pats, Jets and Cowboys with pretty solid rosters. Even the Dolphins have a bunch of good players that he brought in. Yup, and Jeff Ireland, who is a waste Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 McNabb received a 5yr/78 mill extension from the Redskins during the 2010 season. After he was benched, no less. Never even started a game for the Redskins in 2011. Cut and signed by the Vikings. This contract to me, means little other than clearing cap space. If anything, its a sign that Sanchez is under more pressure to perform or else. Right, but it was constructed such that if McNabb was cut after 2010 he only counted $3.75M. The Jets guaranteed Sanchez more than 4x that amount of cap space after the 2012 season. Totally different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 If I owned the team? I'd go get Bill Parcells, name him Team President, then I'd lose his number and take my chances that he fixes the whole thing. Jeesh, you prove that youre out of your mind every 10th post. Parcells is a horrible GM. He's never built a championship team and left the last 2 teams worse off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barton Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Jeesh, you prove that youre out of your mind every 10th post. Parcells is a horrible GM. He's never built a championship team and left the last 2 teams worse off. He left the Cowboys and Dolphins worse off? lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Well then Sanchez is eating up $13M of our cap in 2013 to be the backup QB, which is twice as much space as was created in this one season by the guarantee. Oh yeah, and he costs another $5M to cut before the 2014 season. So if he got beat out by Henne, in your example, then the Jets just signed on for $18M in cap space from 2013-2014 for Sanchez to be the backup in 2013. This is ONLY a good move is Sanchez suddenly becomes an excellent QB next season. Who did Eli beat out during his early career? The reason Eli got in the games his rookie year was because of where he was drafted. We didn't have a Kurt Warner-type QB for Sanchez to sit behind for a few games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Jeesh, you prove that youre out of your mind every 10th post. Parcells is a horrible GM. He's never built a championship team and left the last 2 teams worse off. You gotta admit--every tenth post is vast improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 Who did Eli beat out during his early career? The reason Eli got in the games his rookie year was because of where he was drafted. We didn't have a Kurt Warner-type QB for Sanchez to sit behind for a few games. So now Sanchez is the same level talent and prospect that Eli Manning was and therefore should be treated the same. Gotcha. And the Giants didn't give Eli an extension beyond his rookie contract until he already had a superbowl ring and superbowl MVP award in his trophy case. Not a subtle difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMC Posted March 10, 2012 Share Posted March 10, 2012 He left the Cowboys and Dolphins worse off? lol How many postseason victories have the Cowboys and Fins had while Tuna ran the teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Parcells trading down in 1997 was far worse than anything Bradway or Tanny ever did. He first makes Peyton uncomfortable enough to stay in school. Then passed on Orlando Pace and Walter Jones for James Farrior and a bunch of crap. Tuna was a great game day coach, a dreadful draft GM. Trading down is always better! Look at all the depth he obtained! Don't forget all those great contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sperm Edwards Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 How many postseason victories have the Cowboys and Fins had while Tuna ran the teams. I don't know that they were necessarily destined to be SB winners or anything, but I can't really fault Tuna for Romo botching a game-winning FG snap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetsupnorth Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 I think people tend to get caught up in this "woe is me" type of mind set far to much. Is Sanchez the best QB in the league? F*** No! Is he the worst starting qb? Pretty Damn close IMO. However; what people are failing to recognize is that this isn't as much of a player operations mismanagement point as it is a economics mismanagement (Read: Cap). Our acute usage of our cap space bought our team a few really good year's. I am very proud of the team as a fan of the two AFC championship games. Especially the 2010/2011 season, A) we boot eff'd NE in their house! and Only narrowly lost to Pittsburgh. This being said we are now going through a "suffering period" where we will have to lay low cap wise for a year to three years. Would I love to sign multiple great free agents every year? Yes. However; this isn't Madden. When I heard this news last night I was pretty upset when I first saw the numbers and hammered a few beer. Looking at the numbers today in a new light makes me feel a bit better. I dont view this contract as a full endorsement of Sanchez. It is a dice roll really. They know they would have to pay him a little extra money, but in the long term we are saving money if he does realize his potential, if not well that does suck but I still think we need to remain faithful. This does show me that hopefully the management has learned from the past 5 years that spending frivolously does not bring sustainable gains/a happy fan base. The same old Jets? God I hope not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#27TheDominator Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 With the new rules what is to prevent the Jets from drafting a viable replacement that might take some time to develop? PIcks won't cost as much. Also, with the alleged likelihood of the cap growing a great deal in the next years isn't cap $$ this year worth way more than next? Sort of like a #3 draft pick this year being worth a #2 in 2013. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KSJets Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 So now Sanchez is the same level talent and prospect that Eli Manning was and therefore should be treated the same. Gotcha. And the Giants didn't give Eli an extension beyond his rookie contract until he already had a superbowl ring and superbowl MVP award in his trophy case. Not a subtle difference. What veteran did he beat out in his first couple of seasons after having atrocious stats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason423 Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Here is my take on the deal: The Jets basically shifted money from 2012 into 2013 for cap purposes and reduced the overall cap charge of keeping Sanchez here for 2 seasons. Hell carry the same dead money charge in 2014 as he does now which is why those final 3 years were simply put in for saving face on Sanchez' side to make it look like he got some insane deal. The biggest negative of the deal is that there is now 0 chance of a backup QB this season. I would not be stunned if Brunell is back now. 2013 is a different story. Despite the big cap charge the Jets wont hesitate to bring in someone at that point because the coach and GM will have their jobs on the line if they dont win in these two seasons. http://nyjetscap.com/2012_Articles/sanchezextension.php Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HessStation Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 I WILL NEVER GIVE TANNENBAUM CREDIT EVEN THOUGH HE DESERVES IT FOR THIS MOVE. NEVEEEEEER. ARGGGG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jets62 Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 I still don't get it. Why not wait till after this year? If he sucks again then cut him,trade him&move on. What he did to deserve this I don't know. He has no leverage at all,he was still under contract till 2013.Makes no sense.And who are they bidding against? No one.Jets should have made it clear to go out this year&kick a$$,then we'll give you another contract.But you must earn it first.Now were stuck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted March 11, 2012 Author Share Posted March 11, 2012 The biggest negative of the deal is that there is now 0 chance of a backup QB this season. I would not be stunned if Brunell is back now. 2013 is a different story. Makes me wonder if they'll spend a mid-round pick on a QB with the thought of developing him as a just-in-case starter for 2013. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bergen Jet Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Watch us re-sign Brunell. Chad Pennington is going to be the new Mark Brunell, the clipboard hand holder who will never see the field. I think the Jets give Brunell some sort of coaching gig because he seems well liked and is in dire need of cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bergen Jet Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 I still don't get it. Why not wait till after this year? If he sucks again then cut him,trade him&move on. What he did to deserve this I don't know. He has no leverage at all,he was still under contract till 2013.Makes no sense.And who are they bidding against? No one.Jets should have made it clear to go out this year&kick a$$,then we'll give you another contract.But you must earn it first.Now were stuck. They substantially lowered his cap numbers for two years, gave themselves major protection if he pans out, and can cut him for dirt cheap if he doesn't after year 2. His cap numbers do not necessarily prevent the Jets from acquiring another QB despite what most think. Sadly I do not see them bringing in real competition however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason423 Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Makes me wonder if they'll spend a mid-round pick on a QB with the thought of developing him as a just-in-case starter for 2013. Im sure they will draft someone. Since Tannnbaum took over its been a search seemingly every season. In 2006 they drafted Clemens in round 2 and traded a 6 for Pat Ramsey In 2008 they spent a 5 on Ainge In 2009 they spent a 1 and 2 on Sanchez plus a bunch of players In 2011 they spent a 7 on McElroy plus owed a 7th on the trade for O'Connell So 7 picks in 6 years with more or less nothing to show for it at the position. Maybe the Jets should start thinking the free agent route... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted March 11, 2012 Share Posted March 11, 2012 Im sure they will draft someone. Since Tannnbaum took over its been a search seemingly every season. In 2006 they drafted Clemens in round 2 and traded a 6 for Pat Ramsey In 2008 they spent a 5 on Ainge In 2009 they spent a 1 and 2 on Sanchez plus a bunch of players In 2011 they spent a 7 on McElroy plus owed a 7th on the trade for O'Connell So 7 picks in 6 years with more or less nothing to show for it at the position. Maybe the Jets should start thinking the free agent route... Or the new GM route? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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