Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I generally never acted like a cry baby to coaches when running receiver routes, no. I've ran routes before, it isnt exactly a taxing exercise. I don't know what that has anything to do with it though. The only reason it was a story was because of the player. He quit on the field last year. Called out coaches, called out teammates. He's 27-28 years old now....time to grow the **** up. I didn't ask about you running routes, you brought that up, and you are right it doesn't have anything to do with what we are talking about. LOL The comment about holding yourself to the same standards was regarding what you do now - which is obviously not running routes for a living - do you show up for work every day and have a perfect day at the office? Doubtful. Do you expect yourself to? No. sh*t most people give themselves a license to be an a$$hole if they don't have a cup of coffee... Speaking of growing up... couldn't the case be made that you need to grow up and understand that a tantrum need not be thrown on the internet every time a spoiled, rich athlete doesn't do what you think he should? I mean, it's a relatively childish quality to expect to get what you want, and think the world revolves around your wants and needs... no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 I didn't ask about you running routes, you brought that up, and you are right it doesn't have anything to do with what we are talking about. LOL The comment about holding yourself to the same standards was regarding what you do now - which is obviously not running routes for a living - do you show up for work every day and have a perfect day at the office? Doubtful. Do you expect yourself to? No. sh*t most people give themselves a license to be an a$$hole if they don't have a cup of coffee... Speaking of growing up... couldn't the case be made that you need to grow up and understand that a tantrum need not be thrown on the internet every time a spoiled, rich athlete doesn't do what you think he should? I mean, it's a relatively childish quality to expect to get what you want, and think the world revolves around your wants and needs... no? what the hell are you even talking about. Oh wait, you played sports. You know athletes. Shut the **** up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 TO compare a message board to a guy getting paid 10 mil a year to catch a football is silly and you know it. All we are commenting on is the fact that the team impoded last year. Holmes being the main culprit if not at least one of them. His first practice back, he throws his helmet and yells at the new WR coach in front of the whole team. How you can defend this is beyond me. I will concede that it's only June and it's early, but this speaks volumes as to what we need to get a handle on. This is actually a BIG deal. Much much bigger than how Sporano proposed to his wife. LOL ( that one was just for you) I expect men to act like men. Whether they are on a football field or message board. However, I don't delude myself into thinking that grown men won't act like babies. Which is what most of the guys here do, and what Holmes does. It's not a BIG deal though. It's a joke it's even being discussed actually... the only slant we have on it is the media and agenda-driven fans drawing the immediate conclusion that it's a sign of last year. It's all in how it gets spun. Holmes didn't care last year, this outburst shows passion. = Good. Holmes threw a tantrum, must be a regression to last year. = Bad. I suggest fans stop tying their emotions to the ebb and flow of spin within the news that drops... because it'll never be favorable. See through it. It's all bullsh*t anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 what the hell are you even talking about. Oh wait, you played sports. You know athletes. Shut the **** up. ^^^^ Way to stay within the discussion. Pansy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 ^^^^ Way to stay within the discussion. Pansy. ^^^^ Way to stay within the discussion. Pansy. ok, man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 ok, man. So, in a nutshell, you can't argue your point of view anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 So, in a nutshell, you can't argue your point of view anymore. Once you turned to the "I played sports, I know" act, the conversation was over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GREENBEAN Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I expect men to act like men. Whether they are on a football field or message board. However, I don't delude myself into thinking that grown men won't act like babies. Which is what most of the guys here do, and what Holmes does. It's not a BIG deal though. It's a joke it's even being discussed actually... the only slant we have on it is the media and agenda-driven fans drawing the immediate conclusion that it's a sign of last year. It's all in how it gets spun. Holmes didn't care last year, this outburst shows passion. = Good. Holmes threw a tantrum, must be a regression to last year. = Bad. I suggest fans stop tying their emotions to the ebb and flow of spin within the news that drops... because it'll never be favorable. See through it. It's all bullsh*t anyway. You're reaching man. Throwing your helmet and yelling at the new coach does not show passion. It does not now, nor will it ever. It shows an inability to be a man....which is what you expect from men, yet defend when someone you like doesn't act like one. If this does not get rectified now, it grows. Just like Cancer which is what Holmes is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 You're reaching man. Throwing your helmet and yelling at the new coach does not show passion. It does not now, nor will it ever. It shows an inability to be a man....which is what you expect from men, yet defend when someone you like doesn't act like one. If this does not get rectified now, it grows. Just like Cancer which is what Holmes is. It shows he's an uncoachable baby basically. What else is new. It's hard to win with those guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 You're reaching man. Throwing your helmet and yelling at the new coach does not show passion. It does not now, nor will it ever. It shows an inability to be a man....which is what you expect from men, yet defend when someone you like doesn't act like one. If this does not get rectified now, it grows. Just like Cancer which is what Holmes is. On the bold, you've been proven wrong 1000x over... have you ever watched football, baseball? Great players throw tantrums all the time. It happens. This outburst is being leveraged by people who don't care for Holmes to re-surface their dislikes. I don't even care for Holmes, I just think you guys sound absurd pushing this discussion to the point of sky is falling because he threw his helmet. I'm not interested in a "Ape is going to change GB and Matt's minds" crusade here. Matt clearly has no position other than he hates Holmes. I don't think the extrapolation of horribleness in this thread is anything less than silly. Really not much more to say about it... I just don't over-react like some of you do. As for Cancer... Cancer is something that unfairly takes your loved ones form you... Holmes is just a selfish, rich, athlete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 It shows he's an uncoachable baby basically. What else is new. It's hard to win with those guys. Very hard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Very hard lol "He threw his helmet in June!!!! ZOMG!!!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 Very hard LOL. Months later they told him to kick rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustInFudge Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 LOL. Months later they told him to kick rocks. And havent won a SB since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 LOL. Months later they told him to kick rocks. Diverting from the point you were proven wrong on. You said you can't win with those guys, you were wrong... who cares what they did with him AFTER they won. They won with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 Diverting from the point you were proven wrong on. You said you can't win with those guys, you were wrong... who cares what they did with him AFTER they won. They won with him. Feel free to find where I said that, because I didnt. Pairing a young, mentally weak QB, with an uncoachable immature player at WR is a disaster waiting to happen. Especially after giving the a player, who a model franchise wanted no part of, 50 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 He's running routes in shorts and a tshirt. Don't you see, Matt? Holmes got thrown out of Pittsburgh because he's an ultimate competitor who cares too much. Coincidentally, that's why he quit on the team last season. To say otherwise, well, you just don't understand what it is to be a professional athlete. Just think about those suffering GIs on the front lines of Germany who got to look up from their cots and see Ultra-Patriot Santonio Holmes cheering them, leading them to victory over those Krauts and brownshirts. Damn you, Matt39. Damn you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Feel free to find where I said that, because I didnt. Pairing a young, mentally weak QB, with an uncoachable immature player at WR is a disaster waiting to happen. Especially after giving the a player, who a model franchise wanted no part of, 50 million. It shows he's an uncoachable baby basically. What else is new. It's hard to win with those guys. I suppose now is when you'll want to split hairs over you saying "hard to win" and not "can't win"? This conversation has crossed over to absolutely foolish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Once you turned to the "I played sports, I know" act, the conversation was over. I turned to that? Here is the progression... I made a comment about holding yourself to the same standards, it was implied that I meant in the job you do daily. You responded by talking about how you used to run routes - even though it has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with what I was talking about. I generally never acted like a cry baby to coaches when running receiver routes, no. I've ran routes before, it isnt exactly a taxing exercise. I don't know what that has anything to do with it though. The only reason it was a story was because of the player. He quit on the field last year. Called out coaches, called out teammates. He's 27-28 years old now....time to grow the **** up. Then I posted this. To mock you... which went right over your head. Yeah. Better yet, I played sports - and know athletes. This is a big pile of nothing. I'm glad he showed up on D1 and had some fire personally, his problem last year was not giving a sh*t. Dope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Your winner, and STILL Santonio Holmes Debates Champion: The Fallacy of False Dichotomy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashmouth Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 I turned to that? Here is the progression... I made a comment about holding yourself to the same standards, it was implied that I meant in the job you do daily. You responded by talking about how you used to run routes - even though it has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with what I was talking about. Then I posted this. To mock you... which went right over your head. Dope. OP what pisses people off goes well beyond one incident. If it was just one time I would agree with you whole heartedly. This guy has been an a$$hole his entire career so everytime he does something stupid like this its blown up, debated and discussed. The only real fact here is Santonio Holmes is a ******* Moron and if this team gets in a position to contend once again its guys like this, that do seriously dumb things on a regular basis, that causes most fans including myself to worry about when it will happen next.... a playoff game ? . Remember this is the same a$$hole who was celebrating in the endzone during the SB while his team was in Hurry Up mode trying to get lined up to spike the footbal and stop the clock. A lot lof people noticed that stupidity as did the Steeler organization and Im sure that was one of the cumulative reasons they let him go for a song because contrary to what JIF might say the Steeler team won that SB not just Santonio Holmes. The guy was non existent for most of the game and thats probably the biggest reason he was targeted in the final drive since the Cards were probably all over Hines Ward. If you ask me this guy is a waste of talent and a disruption to the football team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Integrity28 Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 OP what pisses people off goes well beyond one incident. If it was just one time I would agree with you whole heartedly. This guy has been an a$$hole his entire career so everytime he does something stupid like this its blown up, debated and discussed. The only real fact here is Santonio Holmes is a ******* Moron and if this team gets in a position to contend once again its guys like this, that do seriously dumb things on a regular basis, that causes most fans including myself to worry about when it will happen next.... a playoff game ? . Remember this is the same a$$hole who was celebrating in the endzone during the SB while his team was in Hurry Up mode trying to get lined up to spike the footbal and stop the clock. A lot lof people noticed that stupidity as did the Steeler organization and Im sure that was one of the cumulative reasons they let him go for a song because contrary to what JIF might say the Steeler team won that SB not just Santonio Holmes. The guy was non existent for most of the game and thats probably the biggest reason he was targeted in the final drive since the Cards were probably all over Hines Ward. If you ask me this guy is a waste of talent and a disruption to the football team. Like I said, I'm not defending him. I'm simply saying people here are either over-reacting or manipulating an inconsequential incident to fit their argumentative agenda. It's really not a big deal that he threw his helmet and had a fit at practice. Which is why people keep drudging out every other negative thing he's ever done, in order to make the helmet throw look like more than what it is. It's just not a big deal. We've all seen Tom Brady throw tantrums too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 TO compare a message board to a guy getting paid 10 mil a year to catch a football is silly and you know it. All we are commenting on is the fact that the team impoded last year. Holmes being the main culprit if not at least one of them. His first practice back, he throws his helmet and yells at the new WR coach in front of the whole team. How you can defend this is beyond me. Perfect example of Jet Fan magical thinking. The team "imploded" because they weren't that good, which resulted in the Holmes outbursts. Not the other way around. Thing is, it's easier to say it's because one player's a big baby than it is because the team actually is pretty average. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 Perfect example of Jet Fan magical thinking. The team "imploded" because they weren't that good, which resulted in the Holmes outbursts. Not the other way around. Thing is, it's easier to say it's because one player's a big baby than it is because the team actually is pretty average. Give me a break. Anyone who's ever played a team sport before at any level would tell you differently. Holmes is about Holmes. He's uncoachable, which is his biggest problem. If the talent matched his attitude, it'd be easier to deal, but it doesn't If the Jets won 12 games last year and Holmes had the same production, Im positive the same type of bitching would be happening. He produced in Pittsburgh and they still had no issues dumping him for nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Give me a break. Anyone who's ever played a team sport before at any level would tell you differently. Holmes is about Holmes. He's uncoachable, which is his biggest problem. If the talent matched his attitude, it'd be easier to deal, but it doesn't If the Jets won 12 games last year and Holmes had the same production, Im positive the same type of bitching would be happening. He produced in Pittsburgh and they still had no issues dumping him for nothing. Wholly irrelevant, angry guy. Holmes is a big ******* baby. Everyone knows that. Even people who like him. You know what? There's a lot of big ******* babies in this league. The outcome of the Jets season hinged on them being not very good at winning football games. Not on Holmes being a big baby. All this talk is just a way of sweeping that fact under the rug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Holmes was dumped in part because it was the same offseason Big Ben bathroom raped a chick and they needed to dump somebody. If the steelers were serious about not employing jerks they wouldn't have kept Big Ben either. As for Santonio I'm sure you guys would be much happier if Holmes blew his leg out giving 110% in OTA. the guy knows his body if it's too much it's too much... and you or I have no information that is more accurate. You want coachable guys the Jets could start Scotty McKnight and Patrick Turner. See how far that gets em. Look around the league all the good WR are diva. All of em. Jerry Rice was a diva. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott Dierking Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Giving a player a "C" doesn't make him Captain-worthy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt39 Posted June 8, 2012 Author Share Posted June 8, 2012 Wholly irrelevant, angry guy. Holmes is a big ******* baby. Everyone knows that. Even people who like him. You know what? There's a lot of big ******* babies in this league. The outcome of the Jets season hinged on them being not very good at winning football games. Not on Holmes being a big baby. All this talk is just a way of sweeping that fact under the rug. Where did anyone ever say it was. All I said was its harder to win, especially with a struggling QB, with a uncoachable distraction at WR....and many of us thought we had moved past that after last seasons Miami meltdown. It's just annoying that we clearly havent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Perfect example of Jet Fan magical thinking. The team "imploded" because they weren't that good, which resulted in the Holmes outbursts. Not the other way around. Thing is, it's easier to say it's because one player's a big baby than it is because the team actually is pretty average. IMO, the only way to buffer the Holmes criticism is to say that because Sanchez hasn't been good, no one really knows how good Holmes is/could be. I think what this thread is arguing is not whether Holmes is a huge a$$hole (we all agree he is), but whether or not what Holmes brings to the table is worth dealing with his assholeness. Pittsburgh didn't think so. Hard to see why Jets fans should give him much benefit of the doubt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitonti Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Hard to see why Jets fans should give him much benefit of the doubt. cause the Jets don't have a Mike Wallace to replace him with. They have a Stephen Hill who barely knows how to play the position. In a few years yes they can get rid of Holmes. But not now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbatesman Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Pittsburgh didn't think so. Come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Where did anyone ever say it was. All I said was its harder to win, especially with a struggling QB, with a uncoachable distraction at WR....and many of us thought we had moved past that after last seasons Miami meltdown. It's just annoying that we clearly havent. The moment anyone started blaming Holmes for anything but being a baby was the moment people said this. He's literally the only skill position player on offense worth a damn. Regardless of his attitude. Ape is right. This is a non-issue being trumpeted by people with an agenda. It's June 8th. It's his first day back. The fact that we have two awful QBs and no good RB's is more cause for concern. Not a guy who's angry at himself for where he's at right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 and many of us thought we had moved past that after last seasons Miami meltdown. It's just annoying that we clearly havent. This is a dude who proudly stated that he wasn't going to change anything regarding his behavior after Pittsburgh threw him out the door. He's a ****nut. It would have been nice if he showed some contrition after last season's debacle, but all he's done so far is 1. Say he felt "no need" to reach out to Sanchez or Rex in the off-season: 2. Conveniently miss OTA's to go with Tommie Harris (who dogged his way out of Chicago) and Matt Forte (who's holding out) to go to Germany; and, 3. Emasculate his entire coaching staff (including alleged no-nonsense tough guy Tony Sparano) by throwing his helmet down and storming off the practice field, then telling the media that he "let the coaches understand" that he didn't want to run any more routes. Honestly, the disappointing part is not that Holmes is a total sh*tbird. The disappointing part is that Rex, again, falls on his sword for a player that continues to defy and humiliate him and his coaches. The "he's a competitor" excuse is almost comical at this point. If Rex, who spent all offseason talking about how he's going to get the locker room "fixed," is going to let Holmes be Holmes from Day F'ing One, then the team is already doomed. Tom Coughlin would have disemboweled Holmes yesterday. Rex pats him on the a$$. Go Jets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZachEY Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 IMO, the only way to buffer the Holmes criticism is to say that because Sanchez hasn't been good, no one really knows how good Holmes is/could be. I think what this thread is arguing is not whether Holmes is a huge a$$hole (we all agree he is), but whether or not what Holmes brings to the table is worth dealing with his assholeness. Pittsburgh didn't think so. Hard to see why Jets fans should give him much benefit of the doubt. 2 years ago, Holmes just about single-handedly won us a few games. And, of course no one knows how good Holmes could be right now. He has one of the worst QB's in the league (not) throwing him the ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
T0mShane Posted June 8, 2012 Share Posted June 8, 2012 Come on. Extenuating circumstances* aside, he still put together enough transgressions to be 1b. on Rooney's list of disposable sociopaths. *Rapey quarterback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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