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Joe Paterno statue being torn down as we speak.


T0mShane
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...And the NCAA announces it will be announcing unprecedented sanctions tomorrow (monday). I would like to go on record as saying that the NCAA has no business enforcing sanctions here. The students should not be punished for the crime an assistant coach committed, which they played no part of. The man who committed that crime is behind bars for life, and the people involved in the cover up have all been fired and/or are dead. It's not as if they were gaining any sort of competitive advantage on the field with their actions, and the massive negative press, combined with what Im sure must be a lot of lost fans/donors will hurt the program immensely on its own.

What Sandusky did was awful, and the cover up made it even worse. But Sandusky will never see the light of day again, Paterno is 6 feet under, and other people involved in the cover up have been fired and are likely soon going to be sued for every penny they made in the last 15 years. The NCAA has no business sanctioning the program, IMHO.

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...And the NCAA announces it will be announcing unprecedented sanctions tomorrow (monday). I would like to go on record as saying that the NCAA has no business enforcing sanctions here. The students should not be punished for the crime an assistant coach committed, which they played no part of. The man who committed that crime is behind bars for life, and the people involved in the cover up have all been fired and/or are dead. It's not as if they were gaining any sort of competitive advantage on the field with their actions, and the massive negative press, combined with what Im sure must be a lot of lost fans/donors will hurt the program immensely on its own.

What Sandusky did was awful, and the cover up made it even worse. But Sandusky will never see the light of day again, Paterno is 6 feet under, and other people involved in the cover up have been fired and are likely soon going to be sued for every penny they made in the last 15 years. The NCAA has no business sanctioning the program, IMHO.

The program itself was the great enabler. The NCAA version of too big to fail. I think Penn State would've been smart to voluntarily shut it down themselves for a couple years, and then bring in entirely new people from the outside to start it up again somewhere down the road. The school, the community, and, most of all, the victims could all use the time to heal.

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...And the NCAA announces it will be announcing unprecedented sanctions tomorrow (monday). I would like to go on record as saying that the NCAA has no business enforcing sanctions here. The students should not be punished for the crime an assistant coach committed, which they played no part of. The man who committed that crime is behind bars for life, and the people involved in the cover up have all been fired and/or are dead. It's not as if they were gaining any sort of competitive advantage on the field with their actions, and the massive negative press, combined with what Im sure must be a lot of lost fans/donors will hurt the program immensely on its own.

What Sandusky did was awful, and the cover up made it even worse. But Sandusky will never see the light of day again, Paterno is 6 feet under, and other people involved in the cover up have been fired and are likely soon going to be sued for every penny they made in the last 15 years. The NCAA has no business sanctioning the program, IMHO.

I

Isn't that how this works though? Reggie Bush does something stupid, those behind him pay the price?

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I

Isn't that how this works though? Reggie Bush does something stupid, those behind him pay the price?

Thats different. They are punishing the program for twisting the rules (or breaking them) to create a competitive on-field advantage. Now, I'm not at all a fan of how the NCAA sanctions programs, and not the coaches themselves if they take jobs elsewhere, and Im even less of a fan of how they exploit players to get every penny they can, all under the guise of promoting an education. But those are discussions for a different forum.

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What an amazing fall from Grace... 12 months ago the guy was a god out there, now he'll be responsible for killing the program..

I havent' followed this story to closely, how much did Joe Paterno know, and has there been any thoughts around why it was covered up? I just have a hard time believing that anybody would know something like that for certain and not act on it, was he just an old fool who had doubts and trusted Sandusky or was he 100% aware of what was going on and just ignored it?

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The program itself was the great enabler. The NCAA version of too big to fail. I think Penn State would've been smart to voluntarily shut it down themselves for a couple years, and then bring in entirely new people from the outside to start it up again somewhere down the road. The school, the community, and, most of all, the victims could all use the time to heal.

Well, in that case, you can argue that the NCAA itself is the great enabler. Is it just Penn State, or is the whole NCAA too big to fail? The NCAA got into bed with the devil when it came to big advertising and TV contracts. They put so much money, publicity, and power into these programs and coaches that it is near impossible NOT to fail on a moral standard at some point.

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What an amazing fall from Grace... 12 months ago the guy was a god out there, now he'll be responsible for killing the program..

I havent' followed this story to closely, how much did Joe Paterno know, and has there been any thoughts around why it was covered up? I just have a hard time believing that anybody would know something like that for certain and not act on it, was he just an old fool who had doubts and trusted Sandusky or was he 100% aware of what was going on and just ignored it?

Oh, believe it.

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Did the abolish the whole program? I didn't see that. I agree that would be harsh.

They're supposedly going to get a bowl game ban and forfeit some scholarships. It's "unprecedented" because the NCAA is finally doing something that requires a modicum of common sense.

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They're supposedly going to get a bowl game ban and forfeit some scholarships. It's "unprecedented" because the NCAA is finally doing something that requires a modicum of common sense.

If there's anything the NCAA can be justified in sanctioning Penn St. for, its the dreaded "lack of institutional control", which is ironic, because the phrase is a perfect description of what the NCAA is all about. That is the "death penalty" for a program. Any other sanctions would be unnecessary and out of the NCAA's hands IMO.

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If there's anything the NCAA can be justified in sanctioning Penn St. for, its the dreaded "lack of institutional control", which is ironic, because the phrase is a perfect description of what the NCAA is all about. That is the "death penalty" for a program. Any other sanctions would be unnecessary and out of the NCAA's hands IMO.

"The NCAA is ****ed up" is a fine argument, but using it to minimize Penn State's institutional culpability in the Sandusky matter is ridiculous.

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"The NCAA is ****ed up" is a fine argument, but using it to minimize Penn State's institutional culpability in the Sandusky matter is ridiculous.

Im not saying that. I am only saying that it is pretty much out of the NCAA's hands to impose competitive sanctions on the program, when there was never any competitive on-field advantage gained by the atrocity that went on there.

Can the NCAA hit them with the "lack of institutional control" sanction and basically shut down their program for years to come? Yes. Is that necessary or right? I don't think so... As I mentioned in a previous post, punishing the students and the community for a crime and cover up they played no part in, and didn't receive a competitive advantage for, is not really fixing the problem or punishing those responsible.

Can the NCAA hit them with less severe, competitive related sanctions? To me, that would be a stretch.

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They're supposedly going to get a bowl game ban and forfeit some scholarships. It's "unprecedented" because the NCAA is finally doing something that requires a modicum of common sense.

No, it's unprecedented because they're not even bothering with their own investigation. Which, considering their history and arrogance, is quite the step.

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They're supposedly going to get a bowl game ban and forfeit some scholarships. It's "unprecedented" because the NCAA is finally doing something that requires a modicum of common sense.

That seems to be more in line with sanctions. That's what I would expect here. I am not sure where thethreshold should be set exactly. But I wouldn't scrap the whole program that doesn't seem fair.

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Heard they are just moving it to the Library to remind people not to talk.

Thats really the disturbing part at the core of all of this, that nobody seems to want to talk about. It is quite sad when college trustees and powerful college alumni feel more strongly about honoring a person's legacy as a football coach/ sports figure than punishing how his lack of moral responsibility allowed a raging pedophile to be protected for over a decade.

Paterno cannot be erased from history at Penn State not only because he gave $5 million or so do build a library, but because of all the money, publicity, and prestige he brought to Penn State in his 60+ years as a coach there. Thats what college sports have become, all $$$$$. This guise of promoting education by giving "student-athletes" a free education is just that, a guise.

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Thats different. They are punishing the program for twisting the rules (or breaking them) to create a competitive on-field advantage. Now, I'm not at all a fan of how the NCAA sanctions programs, and not the coaches themselves if they take jobs elsewhere, and Im even less of a fan of how they exploit players to get every penny they can, all under the guise of promoting an education. But those are discussions for a different forum.

I think I could argue that covering up a 3 decade long child molestation ring the likes of which the country has never seen, is gaining a competitive advantage. Because if they did break it open, these sanctions, would have hit and hurt the reputation of the school making it difficult for them attract and retain top talent from the state and around the country. So, covering it up, in fact, was help them gain a competitive advantage.

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"The NCAA is ****ed up" is a fine argument, but using it to minimize Penn State's institutional culpability in the Sandusky matter is ridiculous.

This. Their ****edupness exist in two different spheres. The NCAA is a corrupt racket while PSU, institutionally, were pedophile enablers.

The NCAA sactions today is unprecedented, but warranted. The NCAA had to do something. They couldn't hide behind the argument that "This did not have to do with competitive advantage" or the like.

What will be interesting is if PSU decides to fight it, but apparanetly they won't. Now JoePa is the 12th winningest HC in NCAA football history.

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No, it's unprecedented because they're not even bothering with their own investigation. Which, considering their history and arrogance, is quite the step.

This too. Why pay someone else when Freeh did it for you. Wondering if PSU should send the NCAA a bill for Freeh's fees considering they used it to base it's sanctions. But, I hate the idea of using "everyone new" argument, but it is true. No one wanted to hire Sandusky as HC at the turn of the century. This was a decorated DC for a storied program and the guy doesn't get any HC interviews? He suddently retires at a young coaching age and no one questions it?

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I think I could argue that covering up a 3 decade long child molestation ring the likes of which the country has never seen, is gaining a competitive advantage. Because if they did break it open, these sanctions, would have hit and hurt the reputation of the school making it difficult for them attract and retain top talent from the state and around the country. So, covering it up, in fact, was help them gain a competitive advantage.

They broke the law. They did not violate any of the NCAA rules or regulations. Sandusky deserves to spend the rest of his life in jail, Paterno would be deserving of the same if he were still alive. The school and program itself are vulnerable to massive lawsuits that could bankrupt the school and force them to end their football program (among other programs). The NCAA does not need to prove anything for putting NCAA sanctions on Penn State when Penn State did not violate any NCAA rules.

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They broke the law. They did not violate any of the NCAA rules or regulations. Sandusky deserves to spend the rest of his life in jail, Paterno would be deserving of the same if he were still alive. The school and program itself are vulnerable to massive lawsuits that could bankrupt the school and force them to end their football program (among other programs). The NCAA does not need to prove anything for putting NCAA sanctions on Penn State when Penn State did not violate any NCAA rules.

You said:

I am only saying that it is pretty much out of the NCAA's hands to impose competitive sanctions on the program, when there was never any competitive on-field advantage gained by the atrocity that went on there.

And I'm saying that there certainly was a competitive advantage to keeping it under wraps. If Joe Pa decided to put a stop to it, there would have been repercussions to the program which in turn, would hinder the success of the program. Therefore, the cover up, was a competitive advantage.

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And I'm saying that there certainly was a competitive advantage to keeping it under wraps. If Joe Pa decided to put a stop to it, there would have been repercussions to the program which in turn, would hinder the success of the program. Therefore, the cover up, was a competitive advantage.

In other words, the cover up occurred for the purposes of competitive advantage. The scandal that would have erupted in 1998 or 2002 may have caused PSU to lose top recruits who wouldve avoided the school and gone elsewhere. So they covered it up to avoid bad press, scrutiny, and avoid alienating recruits and doners.

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