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Are Schotty & Sparano weak OC's, or do the Jets just have no talent on offense?


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I think Schottenheimer is completely to blame for Sanchez's struggles, unless he sucks again this season, in which case I'm more than willing to blame Sparano and/or the receivers and offensive line.

I think it was Bill Walsh who said, basically, that you draft a QB, then you host a fire drill to surround that QB with every player, position coach, playbook, and coaching emphasis to get absolutely

Playoff games... Of course. But therein lies the problem. You need to win at least 3 playoff games in a row to win a Super Bowl. As you say later, if you can win playoff games, you can win it all..

Yes.

I mean what reeks first? Who sucks harder?

Is it the chicken, or the egg?

Discuss......

I personally think Shotty is a bad OC.

I think Sparano did well in both Dallas and Miami but he really lacked talent in Miami when they finally signed Marshall they had a QB transition from Henne to Moore and that sealed his fate.

While the Jets did add a little talent this offseason I think they lack talent in the running game. I think this team is a solid RB away from serious contention. If our defense is as good as I think it can be Its time to cut the sh*t and figure out a way to make MJD a Jet

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Yes.

I mean what reeks first? Who sucks harder?

Is it the chicken, or the egg?

Discuss......

Schotty's offense, and Rex Ryan, and Mark Sanchez did not mix, it was like watching someone try to put a square peg in a round hole for 3 years. Schotty's O might work with the right QB, and him as HC, or a HC with his same philosophies.

Sparano has a different approach, and it fits Rex Ryan's philosophy, but it is IMO to conservative to be successful in today's NFL, losers kick FG's, winners score TD's, Sparano, and Rex try to beat you in the ugliest way, and yes with the right D, and the right O personnel you can win in the regular season, and make the playoffs, but your gonna lose every time in the post season tournament if you don't score TD's, and posses the ability to outscore an elite offense in today's NFL.

I could be wrong on Sparano here, but I'm just basing it on what I've seen from his past 4 years at Miami, when a HC fist pumps after a FG in the middle of the game IMO your in trouble with his offensive philosophy.

Just my 2 cents anyway.

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Schotty picked a team with even less talent on offense than the Jets so who knows. Amendola and Brandon Gibson. Yikes.

I disagree, I think Bradford posses the qualities Schotty's QB needs to run his offense, and Danny Amendola is a very underrated player, he would be the best WR on the Jets right now IMO, he can actually get seperation from a DB off the line of scrimmage, Holmes needs time to put that 2nd move on you to get separation, and thrives with QB's who can buy extra time to let him do his thing like Big Ben did.

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I think it was Bill Walsh who said, basically, that you draft a QB, then you host a fire drill to surround that QB with every player, position coach, playbook, and coaching emphasis to get absolutely everything you can out of that QB, and if you don't, you've wasted that draft pick. I think, more than anything, the Jets have no concept of building a team, historically preferring to slap disparate parts together and hoping it works. The Bradway/Tannenbaum Era has been marked by this, most especially on offense. There's no coherent plan because there's no adult in the room--it's an accountant sitting in a room with a silver-spoons billionaire and a defensive coordinator pretending he's a Head Coach.

Giving Baby Schottenheimer autonomy was as stupid then as giving Sparano autonomy is now. Both of them needed to be bailed out by falling backwards into the next Tom Brady, but that will never happen. I think they're all legitimately flummoxed by the fact that Sanchez hasn't become Eli Manning, as if they're the collective victims of some cruel, cosmic hoax.

So, to answer the question, it's Woody's fault.

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Schotty's offense, and Rex Ryan, and Mark Sanchez did not mix, it was like watching someone try to put a square peg in a round hole for 3 years. Schotty's O might work with the right QB, and him as HC, or a HC with his same philosophies.

Sparano has a different approach, and it fits Rex Ryan's philosophy, but it is IMO to conservative to be successful in today's NFL, losers kick FG's, winners score TD's, Sparano, and Rex try to beat you in the ugliest way, and yes with the right D, and the right O personnel you can win in the regular season, and make the playoffs, but your gonna lose every time in the post season tournament if you don't score TD's, and posses the ability to outscore an elite offense in today's NFL.

I could be wrong on Sparano here, but I'm just basing it on what I've seen from his past 4 years at Miami, when a HC fist pumps after a FG in the middle of the game IMO your in trouble with his offensive philosophy.

Just my 2 cents anyway.

This.

Plus I would add...a problem with a low-risk, conservative ground attack...it does not always develop confidence in the offensive players and when they need a drive, a score, a TD to win...doubt creeps in. They lack killer instinct...score, score and want some more. Another limfac...this approach also gives the other team a chance...at least in their mind. Just keep the game close mentality.

It remains to be seen how Sparano's disciplined approach works here...its only pre-season...he kept it pretty vanilla...I'm willing to give him some latitude...hope for best. But right now...I'd be shocked to see us in the top half of points scored.

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I think it was Bill Walsh who said, basically, that you draft a QB, then you host a fire drill to surround that QB with every player, position coach, playbook, and coaching emphasis to get absolutely everything you can out of that QB, and if you don't, you've wasted that draft pick. I think, more than anything, the Jets have no concept of building a team, historically preferring to slap disparate parts together and hoping it works. The Bradway/Tannenbaum Era has been marked by this, most especially on offense. There's no coherent plan because there's no adult in the room--it's an accountant sitting in a room with a silver-spoons billionaire and a defensive coordinator pretending he's a Head Coach.

Giving Baby Schottenheimer autonomy was as stupid then as giving Sparano autonomy is now. Both of them needed to be bailed out by falling backwards into the next Tom Brady, but that will never happen. I think they're all legitimately flummoxed by the fact that Sanchez hasn't become Eli Manning, as if they're the collective victims of some cruel, cosmic hoax.

So, to answer the question, it's Woody's fault.

There is some truth here as well.

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It's both, but

Seriously, it took 7 posts to say.

Sanchez sucks.

He's terrible and so is Sparano. That hire was a joke at the time and still is. Double Secret Wildcats? I mean come on, that's the most hilarious sh*t ever. If the Giants were pulling this crap we'd be making fun of them every day in a stickied thread.

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Say what you want about Rex, but he did prove, in his first two seasons as a head coach, that a strong defense, powerful running game, and timely passing works VERY WELL in the NFL these days.

Schotty was a bad OC on the wrong team/wrong coach.

Sparano wasn't that good in Dallas or else they wouldn't have rolled him in one year

What did Miami ever do on offense successfully, besides the Wildcat?

Looks like the Jets are betting on The Wildcat to be their savior. It will help the running game, which looks like it may need the help. So it ties into the overall successful formula, if you can execute it.....

BD

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I think it was Bill Walsh who said, basically, that you draft a QB, then you host a fire drill to surround that QB with every player, position coach, playbook, and coaching emphasis to get absolutely everything you can out of that QB, and if you don't, you've wasted that draft pick. I think, more than anything, the Jets have no concept of building a team, historically preferring to slap disparate parts together and hoping it works. The Bradway/Tannenbaum Era has been marked by this, most especially on offense. There's no coherent plan because there's no adult in the room--it's an accountant sitting in a room with a silver-spoons billionaire and a defensive coordinator pretending he's a Head Coach.

Giving Baby Schottenheimer autonomy was as stupid then as giving Sparano autonomy is now. Both of them needed to be bailed out by falling backwards into the next Tom Brady, but that will never happen. I think they're all legitimately flummoxed by the fact that Sanchez hasn't become Eli Manning, as if they're the collective victims of some cruel, cosmic hoax.

So, to answer the question, it's Woody's fault.

This sums up everything I was arguing about how Sanchez was getting a raw deal during the offseason, the difference is Bill Walsh is very intelligent, and knows how to get a point across, and I am stupid, and can't put together sentences, and/or paragraphs to explain my point in the proper way.

That said Sanchez still has a lot to work on outside of these obstacles.

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I think Schottenheimer is completely to blame for Sanchez's struggles, unless he sucks again this season, in which case I'm more than willing to blame Sparano and/or the receivers and offensive line.

I'm hoping it was schotty, because if it is sanchez were going to be screwed breaking in another qb for the next four years. but if sanchez isn't winning games by himself this year we need to draft another top 5 qb.

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I think it was Bill Walsh who said, basically, that you draft a QB, then you host a fire drill to surround that QB with every player, position coach, playbook, and coaching emphasis to get absolutely everything you can out of that QB, and if you don't, you've wasted that draft pick. I think, more than anything, the Jets have no concept of building a team, historically preferring to slap disparate parts together and hoping it works. The Bradway/Tannenbaum Era has been marked by this, most especially on offense. There's no coherent plan because there's no adult in the room--it's an accountant sitting in a room with a silver-spoons billionaire and a defensive coordinator pretending he's a Head Coach.

Giving Baby Schottenheimer autonomy was as stupid then as giving Sparano autonomy is now. Both of them needed to be bailed out by falling backwards into the next Tom Brady, but that will never happen. I think they're all legitimately flummoxed by the fact that Sanchez hasn't become Eli Manning, as if they're the collective victims of some cruel, cosmic hoax.

So, to answer the question, it's Woody's fault.

best post you ever made

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I think it was Bill Walsh who said, basically, that you draft a QB, then you host a fire drill to surround that QB with every player, position coach, playbook, and coaching emphasis to get absolutely everything you can out of that QB, and if you don't, you've wasted that draft pick.

Yeah, one thing that you can argue in Sanchez's favorite is that he got a raw deal with the Jets. I mean ONLY the best running game, defense, and OL in the league as a rookie? They couldn't get him elite WRs too? ONLY Santonio Holmes and Braylon Edwards when they go out and get a WR after his rookie year? What QB could win with that? They couldn't get Sanchez a proven QB coach like Sam Wyche for Montana (Montana was Wyche's first QB in the NFL)?

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Mr T is starting to run out of room to run.

Rex has only had great things to say about Braylon Edwards. You say Braylon Edwards to Mr T., and he's ready to file an injunction against you. Not sure what his problem was with Edwards.

He could have gotten a billion guys better than Jason Smith to replace Hunter with 6 months ago, but dropped the ball on that one.

He could have made a call to the Jags to get MJD (I guess he still could), but they've already squashed that as too good of an idea.

And hiring Sparano of all the coordinators in the world, that's who you come up with?

Playoffs of bust for Tanny

BD

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Yeah, one thing that you can argue in Sanchez's favorite is that he got a raw deal with the Jets. I mean ONLY the best running game, defense, and OL in the league as a rookie? They couldn't get him elite WRs too? ONLY Santonio Holmes and Braylon Edwards when they go out and get a WR after his rookie year? What QB could win with that? They couldn't get Sanchez a proven QB coach like Sam Wyche for Montana (Montana was Wyche's first QB in the NFL)?

Awkward-boner-punch.gif

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If Sparano had Brady,Welker,Gronkowski,Herandez etc. would he be a good OC? Ask yourself this: If Sanchez were to be traded,what would he be worth? I personally dont think one team in the NFL would want him for a starting QB. Or Tebow for that matter and we have both! When are the Jets ever gonna get a top-tier QB? Sticking with Sanchez&Tebow looks like the only way. What a shame, the defense looks very good.

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Yes.

I mean what reeks first? Who sucks harder?

Is it the chicken, or the egg?

Discuss......

Who can call it? Sparano hasnt even had a regular season game under his belt for us let alone 6 depressing years like what shotty had.

I cant base performance on 3 preseason games in which none was actually game planned for and offensives schemes being held back until the regular season.

Jet fans seriously cant be jumping out the window this early lol.

I didnt like the Sparano pick up at first, but I cant say its because of Sparano's history, it was because I felt we could get someone "proven". That doesnt mean that Sparano cant get get it done. So far this preseason he's found our RT, so it aint all bad given that these games dont count.

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Yeah, one thing that you can argue in Sanchez's favorite is that he got a raw deal with the Jets. I mean ONLY the best running game, defense, and OL in the league as a rookie? They couldn't get him elite WRs too? ONLY Santonio Holmes and Braylon Edwards when they go out and get a WR after his rookie year? What QB could win with that? They couldn't get Sanchez a proven QB coach like Sam Wyche for Montana (Montana was Wyche's first QB in the NFL)?

And didnt Sanchez go to consecutive championship games as a rookie and first year starter, since your statement is in his favor?

Cuz you know, Matt Cassel had an even raw deal out in NE and couldnt even make the playoffs. Too bad for Matt as well I'd suppose.

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best post you ever made

Lmao.. Im always amused when two people with completely different agendas reach the conclusion in a thread.. TomShane wants to vilify tanny/woody so he blames them for sanchex struggles whereas smash wants to protect Sanchez at all costs, so he blames management as well

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Mr T is starting to run out of room to run.

Rex has only had great things to say about Braylon Edwards. You say Braylon Edwards to Mr T., and he's ready to file an injunction against you. Not sure what his problem was with Edwards.

He could have gotten a billion guys better than Jason Smith to replace Hunter with 6 months ago, but dropped the ball on that one.

He could have made a call to the Jags to get MJD (I guess he still could), but they've already squashed that as too good of an idea.

And hiring Sparano of all the coordinators in the world, that's who you come up with?

Playoffs of bust for Tanny

BD

So your complaints against Tanny, and justifications for putting him on the hot seat are....

1. He didn't re-sign Braylon to a long term deal. Braylon is on his 2nd one year contract since he left the Jets...And was injured and out of shape most of last year.

2. He couldn't find anyone better then Jason Smith to replace Hunter? Well, lets hope he did. Would suck to see Austin Howard go down that path.

3. He could have made a call to the Jags to get MJD. Which, by the way, none of the other 31 GMs in the league seem anxious to do either. If Tanny decided to pull the trigger, he'd be criticized by people like you and Shane who would claim that he hasn't learned how to build a team, and keeps wasting draft picks blah blah. What gives?

4. I know its not always a popular idea around here, but Im pretty sure Tanny and Woody let their head coach, Rex Ryan, have a large say in who he wanted to work with in order to right the ship.

Playoffs or bust for Tanny? I hope not. As imperfect as he has been at times, his six years at the helm have made up what is, for better or worse, a period of long-term success that has far passed any other consecutive six year period in the history of this franchise. Its easy to complain about the GM... But if we let him go, it would be tough finding someone better.

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